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idontwantaname Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-10-05 12:18 PM
Original message
Abbas has not been elected as the "leader of the Palestinian people,"...
From: ALAQSA INTIFADA . org

The official results of the election are out, and Mahmoud Abbas has been declared the President of the Palestinian Authority.  This is the candidate preferred by the U.S., Israel, and the Arab leaders - none of these being friends of the Palestinian people.  And he is the candidate who will go along with their wishes and compromise Palestinian rights.

It is important to note that Abbas has not been elected as the "leader of the Palestinian people," but only the leader of the Palestinian Authority.  The distinction is important because the Authority is limited to governing the West Bank and Gaza (mostly municipality type tasks), and not to representing the Palestinian diaspora, which comprises of most of the Palestinian people.  He has no mandate or right to make any concessions on behalf of the diaspora, foremost amongst these the right of return.  Although Abbas has abandoned the right of return in previous talks with Israeli officials, his campaign for this election included assertions that he would never give up the right of return.  But ofcourse he will, as this is what his American and Israeli masters require, and it will be interesting to eventually watch him explain to his people that he meant he would defend their right to return only to whatever area is finally allotted to the Palestinian so-called state (if any), but not to their original homes in what is now Israel.

<snip>

The following press release by Media Review Network, and article by Electronic Intifada's Ali Abunimah shed more light on the the issue.

- Alaqsaintifada.org

MEDIA REVIEW NETWORK Press Statement

January 10, 2005

Palestinian Elections - An exercise in futility

<snip>

It must be clear that this sham election is no different then that recently held in Afghanistan, or that will be held in Iraq at the end of this month. The primary objective of the Americans and Israelis is to select a quisling that can be effectively manipulated to lead the Palestinians into perpetual servitude.

<snip>

In Jerusalem only 5,000 of the 120,000 voters were allowed to cast their votes. The remaining were forced to travel outside through a myriad checkpoints in a vain attempt to cast their vote. Of course, the Palestinians in the refugee camps in Lebanon, Syria and Jordan and the rest of the diaspora did not vote.

<snip>

So in the long-running Palestine soap opera, Abbas, the understudy who has been hired to replace the deceased lead actor Arafat, is being offered the choice of two roles by the Israeli-American scriptwriters. He can play the obedient native administrator of a defeated people who gets to wear a suit and call himself president of a fictional state, or he can don Arafat's kaffiyeh and assume the role of the Palestinians' unreformed "terrorist" leader. If he chooses the former role, he may get the political equivalent of an Oscar -- the Nobel Peace Prize.

But like in all soap operas, repetiveness and increasingly absurd plot twists eventually wear out even the most faithful audience. And when this episode is over, the Palestinian people will still be there, steadfastly, patiently, determined to regain their usurped rights and see justice done, come what may.

This article on the web at http://electronicintifada.net/v2/article3499.shtml
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4dsc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-10-05 12:24 PM
Response to Original message
1. Thanks for the information
Its something we will never hear from the corporate owned news media we have in the US!!
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papau Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-10-05 12:37 PM
Response to Original message
2. absurd plot twists= resettled Palestinians wanting more blood so they get
Edited on Mon Jan-10-05 12:38 PM by papau
a few dollars of compensation.

Anyone who's family has lived in the area for a few hundred years has a "right of return" to a dozen homes that were lost in all the wars.

Like the Palestinian folks that are outside the area have rights the rest of us that come from their do not have.

Yes I know about the UN resolution.

And compensation - which is a first - the WW2 end had folks just walking 200 to 500 miles to a new home - makes sense if someone can come up with the money.

But the game plan of the writer is to destroy any chance of peace with a state that is Jewish. The writer only wants the end to any state in the mid-east that has a Jewish Government.

And that is not going to happen.

So the writer is asking other people to die so his political goal is attained.
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idontwantaname Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-10-05 12:45 PM
Response to Reply #2
3. what are you yammering on about?
do you know anything on the 2nd place candidate?
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papau Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-10-05 01:27 PM
Response to Reply #3
6. yammering on about peace - and yes I "know about" the race.
:toast:

peace
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idontwantaname Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-10-05 01:42 PM
Response to Reply #6
9. please be honest in this forum...
this text says nothing about "peace"

----------------------------------------
Posted by papau

a few dollars of compensation.

Anyone who's family has lived in the area for a few hundred years has a "right of return" to a dozen homes that were lost in all the wars.

Like the Palestinian folks that are outside the area have rights the rest of us that come from their do not have.

Yes I know about the UN resolution.

And compensation - which is a first - the WW2 end had folks just walking 200 to 500 miles to a new home - makes sense if someone can come up with the money.

But the game plan of the writer is to destroy any chance of peace with a state that is Jewish. The writer only wants the end to any state in the mid-east that has a Jewish Government.

And that is not going to happen.

So the writer is asking other people to die so his political goal is attained.
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papau Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-10-05 02:29 PM
Response to Reply #9
12. I know your heart is in the right place - but let it go as to this Abbas
not being the leader and having no right to sign a peace treaty that does something less than drive the Jews our of power in Israel.

For me, I am letting this go

peace

:-)
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papau Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-11-05 10:03 AM
Response to Reply #9
14. Abu Mazen 62.3%, Mustafa Barghouti 19.8%
Abu Mazen, received 62.3% of the vote, more than three times the 19.8% garnered by his nearest rival, Mustafa Barghouti
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idontwantaname Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-11-05 11:02 AM
Response to Reply #14
15. the % recieved was not my question to you...
i asked if you knew anyhting about the candidate?
do you know who he is?
what he is saying?

please try educating yourself on Dr. Mustafa Barghouti.
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papau Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-11-05 01:46 PM
Response to Reply #15
16. You are correct I do not know of him - and indeed thought he was
Edited on Tue Jan-11-05 01:50 PM by papau
someone else.

Dr. Mustafa Barghouthi (MD, MSc.) is an active participant in the building of a democratic Palestinian civil society and is one of the most prominent leaders of the Palestinian struggle.
He is the Secretary of the Palestinian National Initiative, or Mubadara, a recently established democratic opposition movement in the realm of Palestinian domestic politics, co-founded along with Dr. Haidar Abdel-Shafi, Mr. Ibrahim Dakak and Dr. Edward Said.

The Palestinian National Initiative is a movement that came as a response to popular demands from men and women calling for increased participation by Palestinian citizens in the process of nation building and for the opportunity to participate in the just struggle for the realization of an independent, viable, democratic and prosperous state which guarantees security, justice, equality before the law, and a dignified existence for its citizens. The initiative also calls for an unequivocal end to the Israeli occupation, removal of illegal Israeli settlements and a just solution to the right of Palestinian refugees. Additionally it calls for immediate international protection to allow democratic elections at all levels of the political system, and reform of political, administrative, and other institutional structures in order to meet the needs of the Palestinian people.

Dr. Barghouthi was one of the delegates involved in the Madrid Peace negotiations initiated in 1991, and a member of the Steering Committee of the technical committee that prepared the establishment of various Palestinian ministries. He has been recognized as the most active grassroots leader in Palestine and remains a leading figure in Palestinian civil society, working extensively in the field of Democratization. He has successfully contributed to the implementation of various laws in the Palestinian Legislative Council.

As a medical doctor trained in the former Soviet Union, with post-graduate training in Jerusalem, and a MSc. in business administration and management from Stanford University in the US, Dr. Barghouthi was a key actor in the in the introduction of modern concepts and models of health care in Palestine. He has lectured at universities such as Harvard, John Hopkins, Stanford and think thanks such as Institute of Strategic Studies in London, Chatham House, the Brookings Institute and the Sydney Institute. In 1979 Dr. Barghouthi and a number of like-minded doctors and health professionals established the Union Palestinian Medical Relief Committees (UPMRC) of which he is president. UPMRC today is one of the largest and the leading Palestinian non-governmental organizations providing health and community services to more than 1 million people (1/3 of total population) yearly, throughout 435 Palestinian communities.

Aside from this, Dr. Barghouthi is also a founder and director of the Health, Development, Information and Policy Institute (HDIP), in Ramallah. HDIP is a policy think-tank and a leader in the field of health and public policy research. In addition to its other functions, HDIP houses the Palestine Monitor, an information clearinghouse on behalf of the Palestinian NGO Network, a cluster of 93 Palestinian NGOs. The Palestine Monitor was launched at the beginning of the current intifada (uprising) in order to convey unified responses from Palestinian civil society about local developments and to provide objective and accurate information to the press and international community. Its website is now one of the most popular Palestinian websites worldwide (more than 1.5 million hits per month). Along with 700 local and international organizations, Dr. Barghouthi is also one of the founders of the GIPP (Grassroots International Protection for the Palestinian People) a program that aims to protect the Palestinian people through the presence of international civilians by deterring Israeli army and settler aggression.

Dr. Barghouthi has written extensively on civil society, democracy issues and the political situation in Palestine, as well as co-authoring books and research on health development. As a board member of many institutions in Palestine, he is well known to the local population, and through his high profile on the international scene, being frequently interviewed on CNN, BBC, ABC and other international news agencies and by Arabic Satellite stations, he is becoming increasingly familiar to international audiences.
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Nicholas D Wolfwood Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-10-05 12:46 PM
Response to Reply #2
4. How do you feel about Israel's right to the land?
You imply that Palestinians shouldn't have the right to land that was left 60 or fewer years ago (you incorrectly stated "a few hundred"). Yet Jews had a more legitimate claim because it was stated to be theirs several thousand years earlier in the Bible?
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papau Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-10-05 01:32 PM
Response to Reply #4
7. A few hundred is my own family history - it was not incorrect - speed
reading screws you up sometimes.

The world - this moment - is not about right and wrong and sticking the other fellows nose in his shit so he will know he was bad

Do we want peace - or not?

I am amazed at the folks that love to either die for God by killing children, and their friends that urge them to die in the name of peace and justice.

Most of the time one is lucky to get peace. And Taba was as close to justice as it is going to get.

I hope the PA come back to the Taba agreements - and leave the screamers for right of return/end of any Jewish State at home.
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King Mongo Donating Member (564 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-10-05 01:11 PM
Response to Reply #2
5. Blaming Arafat, Abbas and the rest
Abbas will achieve nothing for the same reason that Arafat achieved nothing. The simple fact is that neither Arafat nor Abbas can remove illegal settlements or stop their growth. Abbas will be blamed for their growth just like how Arafat was blamed for it.
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papau Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-10-05 01:34 PM
Response to Reply #5
8. Labor is now part of the unity government and peace is possible
Abbas will have the same moment that Arafat had at Taba

I hope he takes it.
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King Mongo Donating Member (564 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-10-05 02:26 PM
Response to Reply #8
11. Taba died because of Sharon
Edited on Mon Jan-10-05 02:27 PM by King Mongo
Well, the problem with Taba was Sharon and Sharon is still in power. The Labor party was also behind illegal settlement construction. A Labor/Likud union simply means expansion. For instance, East Jerusalem. :)

Forget peace. Sharon is still in charge.
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sabbat hunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-12-05 01:41 PM
Response to Reply #11
17. peace can be had
peace can be had with sharon in charge. lets face it the same was said about Begin back in the 70's and he reached an agreement with Egypt which lead israel to pull out of the sinai. too bad the agreement didnt include israel giving gaza back to egypt as well (Since they were the last ruling power there)

i always wonder what the outcry would be like from the arab world for the palestinians if israel returned gaza to egypt and most of the west bank to jordan


david
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eyl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-12-05 03:22 PM
Response to Reply #17
18. Neither Egypt nor Jordan
want that land back.
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drdon326 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-12-05 04:03 PM
Response to Reply #18
19. Maybe...
its more than that....

Funny how egypt and Jordan LOCK the borders on a regular basis...preventing palestinians free access.
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sabbat hunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-13-05 03:50 PM
Response to Reply #18
20. riddle me this
why didnt jordan and egypt allow a palestian state to be formed between 1948 and 1967?

david
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drdon326 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-13-05 05:31 PM
Response to Reply #20
21. Apparently......
they didnt want one.

And after Black September, I'm sure they weren't jumping up and down.
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pelsar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-10-05 02:08 PM
Response to Original message
10. looking for trouble...
the article is nothing more than an attempt to keep stirring things up (in a bad sense)...A bit of reality is that the PA represents the palestenian people for better or worse more than any other group. It is they, until there is a "coup" that the world recognizes as the leadership, it is they that the UN/israelis/Europeans deal with with the political decisions....and they now have a new leader
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papau Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-10-05 02:31 PM
Response to Reply #10
13. Amen
peace

:-)
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