"Is David Ray Griffin a New World Order Shill?"

[greyl]

Buried at the end of a pretty good article on the Presbyterian publishing house which published Griffin's latest novel on 9-11:

Griffin's ultimate goal? He wants Christians to try to supplant America's "demonic" regime with a system of "global government."
http://www.kansas.com/mld/kansas/living/religion/15420450.htm?source=rss&channel=kansas_religion

http://screwloosechange.blogspot.com/

[spooked911]

1. Do you think the AP gave an honest assessment of Griffin's goal?

They would never try to mislead anyone about conspiracy theorist, would they?

And I'm sure you're smart enough to know to not take every news accoun at face value.

[greyl]

2. Hey, it's just a theory. nt

[FoxOnTheRun]

3. Is the Whitehouse and their strategy a new world order strategy?

The battle of ideas helps to define the strategic intent of our National Strategy for Combating Terrorism. The United States will continue to lead an expansive international effort in pursuit of a two-pronged vision:

* The defeat of violent extremism as a threat to our way of life as a free and open society; and
* The creation of a global environment inhospitable to violent extremists and all who support them.

http://www.whitehouse.gov/nsc/nsct/2006/sectionIV.html

[greyl]

4. Of course. Why do you ask? nt

[petgoat]

5. The dream of World Federalism was very influential among

people of his generation. Meaning the UN, not Bush's NWO.

[greyl]

6. So what? It's an ignorant and arrogant point of view.

I see zero reason to accept people's horrible ideas just because the ideas permeated their generation.
Nor do most other progressives.

[petgoat]

7. I'm not endorsing World Federalism. I'm disputing your

proposition that Griffin is allied with the NWO Bushcists.

[greyl]

8. So, you're saying he's a "World Federalist"?

Also, on what grounds do you assert that his heart isn't with the NWO?

[MissWaverly]

14. did you read his book?

Christian Faith & the Truth behind 9-11, you will have to pardon me if I don't explain this
correctly because I am not a fundie, he is trying to talk to the fundamentalists who have
been core supporters of the neocon "Bush" base. What he call "demonic" - actually is the
tendency towards violence, nation destruction, torture, subjugation of people vs
a world that tries to follow Christian precepts: support peace, shared resources, concept
of do unto others as you would have them do unto you, care of the planet as our home as
opposed to demonic (greed and waste of natural resources). He basically says that chaos
is a part of the universe and that if we act like violent, greedy, suck-ups, Jesus is
not going to come down and rapture us. We will be left with the job of fixing the planet
we broke. This book included many details I did not know about 9-11 but goes into a lot of Christian philosophy which is above my head. I do, however, get the idea about being greedy pigs though.

:-)

[greyl]

20. "a world that tries to follow Christian precepts"?

Yes, that's very opposed to the bushadmin's cover.

I wouldn't doubt I'm in a minority by saying this, but we're living in a small part of the world that "tries to follow Christian precepts" and it's lousy.
Being aware of the billions of dollars that are stolen each year from faithful people by others who take advantage of their trusting nature/gullibility, red flags go up when I see someone targeting a particularly rich market of a specific faith.

"A world that tries to follow Christian precepts?"
No thanks. I give humanity more credit than that.

[MissWaverly]

23. what he is trying to do is to use the Christian lobby for good

he is a minister, but he says to use your critical judgment, too often the greedy, the
selfish are held up today as role models, look at our corporate ceos.

[greyl]

29. " use the Christian lobby for good " - paradoxical oxymoron anyone?

A few posts earlier, you said his target audience is right-wing, correct?
edit: for accuracy, you said this: "he is trying to talk to the fundamentalists who have been core supporters of the neocon "Bush" base." /edit

When you call yourself an Indian or a Muslim or a Christian or a European, or anything else, you are being violent. Do you see why it is violent? Because you are separating yourself from the rest of mankind. When you separate yourself by belief, by nationality, by tradition, it breeds violence. So a man who is seeking to understand violence does not belong to any country, to any religion, to any political party or partial system; he is concerned with the total understanding of mankind.
--J. Krishnamurti, Freedom from the Known, pp.51-52

[MissWaverly]

30. well, I believe in Christian precepts

I just don't believe in what passes for government policy nowadays, our country was created
by Christians who believed in a clear seperation of Church and State and that is what
we should have. No church should be used as a campaign headquarters and by allowing people
to funnel their donations through churches allows them to write them off to get a tax
break. It's wrong and has done much harm in this country.

[TAM]

11. Of course not...

Taking every newspaper at face value...that is nuts. Only if it is an article by the AFP or the Guardian, or Prisonplanet.com...now those sources are ROCK SOLID!!! :)

[Nozebro]

9. No more so than disparagers of 9/11 Truth Seekers are shills for Bushco

Hey, it's an opinion.

[salvorhardin]

10. You can't prove he isn't!

Why is everybody defending the New World Order? I think it's time every 9-11 Truther condemn Griffin for his support of the New World Order. Only shills would remain silent on this issue.

[Nozebro]

12. Based on YOUR own words, then there must be a LOT of shills here.

Do you have some insight into that subject you'd like to share?

[salvorhardin]

13. Why do you stay silent on Griffin's complicity in the New World Order

What have you got to hide?

[Nozebro]

22. I'm more concerned about Bush's complicity. Thanks for asking, though.

Griffin is a very credible, valuable person in the efforts to help more people understand that the Bush 9/11 Conspiracy Theory is a lie that has resulted in too many lost lives, destroyed property, dashed hopes, the robbery of needed Gov't funds for social programs, lost liberties, a dramatic decline in U.S. stature around the world, and on and on.

If Griffin has ideas about a New World Order, I'm sure they're better than the Bush family's idea of a New World Order.

[Klimmer]

15. Hey, do you think Greyl is a NWO BCF Shill? nt

[FoxOnTheRun]

16. No, he is a useless eater like all of us

[petgoat]

17. Have you noticed that the OCT shills around here seem to be

in melt-down mode? We're winning. Murder will out.

[MissWaverly]

18. you are right

:-), people are not going to accept the impossible, remember unsolved mysteries, when things
didn't jibe, people never stop talking about them, even if years went by.

[FoxOnTheRun]

21. I haven't seen many OCT's down here

Could it be that it started when some people put them on the ignore list?

[hpot]

25. Yup

It is amusing.

[greyl]

19. Rather than trying to be clever, I'll ask the simple question:

How would you be able to tell one way or the other?

[mhatrw]

24. Always attacking the messenger. Who else constantly argues this way?

hmmmm

[Nozebro]

26. Other people who are unable to refute an argument. It's nearly always

done by partisans who support ideas and arguments that are illogical or plain crazy.

[greyl]

28. What's your opinion of posts 15 and 17? nt

[zforce]

27. Maybe he is a NWO shill.

For the fact is, the war in Iraq and 911 are tools designed by the Globalist elite to delibertly destroy first the credibility then the soverneigty of the United States and other western nationalistic countries (Brittain, Australia, etc.....

Basically it is my position that, the US is playing the role of "Bad Cop" while the Globalists are playing the role of "Good Cop", when America Steps its bounds and becomes a Pariah Cop vis a vis the deception unearthed around 911, the Good Cop will come to the rescue saving the world from such a "corrupt pariah".

The Globalists will then "attain" all that America had gained in the world (Middle East bases)through its Bad Cop Role, but the difference is the globalists will be received with open arms.