The Apologists here

[BeFree]

Aren't they getting just a bit tired of apologizing for 9/11?

Instead of making attempts to get to the bottom of the story, they spend their time here trying out the same old lame excuses, excuses which let the miserable failures of this administration off the hook for what happened that day.

Instead of demanding that someone be held responsible for the failures, they defend to the hilt the theory that says Cavemen from the other side of the world outsmarted the Pentagon, the CIA, the FBI, the FAA and the Whitehouse.

With friends like these, who needs enemies?

[Mikimouse]

1. Maybe I have been unconscious (wouldn't surprise me a bit!)...

but I haven't read many posts that have not advocated a more thorough investigation of the 9/11 attacks. I personally would love to see a complete and unabridged report on all of the events that lead up to the attacks. One that would allow us to decide for ourselves what steps could have been taken, and were not, and the things that were done by the previous and present administrations to avoid these types of attacks.
I know, in my heart of hearts, that there is a great deal more to this than we will ever know from the * administration, and I do follow some of the 'conspiracy theories'. The first thing that must be done, however, is to ensure, legally, that no one who has information and is willing to come forward will be harmed in any way, and secondly, no one who had the power to do something about the attacks and did not act can be pardoned under any circumstances, including those at the very top. An example must be made for future generations of politicians who would manipulate the American people for their own personal agenda!

[MercutioATC]

2. Hmmm. I haven't seen any "apologists".

I don't know of anybody here who hasn't advocated learning all we can about 9/11 and making the results public. I don't know anybody who doesn't have questions about at least some of the "official explanation".

...maybe I'm just missing the threads you're talking about.

[Abe Linkman]

3. You haven't ? See Message #2

.

[MercutioATC]

4. Oh, you mean anybody with a different opinion...I see.

Have you noticed that I've never advocated kicking the CTists off of the board or questioned their motives for posting? Neither have most of the posters I'm betting you're putting in that "apologist" category.

I have, on the other hand, seen that behavior from the CT crowd...all because somebody holds a different opinion of what went on on 9/11.

You claim to want to "get to the bottom of the story" and yet you don't want to deal with alternative arguments. Funny, that wasn't the method I was taught. Sitting in a forum with all like-thinkers doing nothing but agreeing with each other isn't truth-seeking, it's mental masturbation.

I don't agree with your theories, but I HAVE been exposed to more of the events and theories of 9/11 since first posting here. Most of YOU have learned a couple of things from US, too (whether you like to admit it or not). We certainly don't have to agree, but isn't it just a little silly to arbitrarily assign motives to people you don't even know and disregard whatever they say based on those supposed motives?

If you'd let go of the "apologist" and "PR flack" labels, we might actually get to some productive dialog...

[Abe Linkman]

5. Why are you disparaging Hillary Clinton, merc?

Hillary Clinton made the word "conspiracy" a commonlplace in the American vocabulary. Have you forgotten? "Vast Right Wing Conspiracy".



If you would let go of the mask that you are merely an objective seeker of truth, totally free of any motivation to promote the Official Conspiracy Theory ("Wacky Cavemen Did It"), and stop trying to distract and undermine the efforts of those who know that the BS you're selling is baloney, we might actually get to an even better understanding of the
inside job that 9/11 was.

[MercutioATC]

6. "disparaging Hillary Clinton" because she used the word "conspiracy"?

Oh, please...

Abe, you work MUCH harder to promote your theories (with less proof) than I ever have...to the point of making personal attacks and refusing to directly answer questions. If anybody is guilty of pushing a theory to the detriment of meaningful dialog, it's you.

I'm sorry that my posts are distracting to the half-dozen of you who refuse to openly view differing viewpoints. Please realize that your quote "If you would let go of the mask that you are merely an objective seeker of truth, totally free of any motivation to promote the Official Conspiracy Theory ("Wacky Cavemen Did It"), and stop trying to distract and undermine the efforts of those who know that the BS you're selling is baloney, we might actually get to an even better understanding of the inside job that 9/11 was." clearly shows that you consider anything other than an "inside job" scenario to be "baloney". You're not advocating seeking the truth, you're looking for agreement. There's a difference.

This is a forum for discussing 9/11. As far as I know, all viewpoints are permitted and are subject to the same scrutiny by the people who post here. Those of us who don't believe some of the wilder scenarios will continue to post here (as I'm sure you will) for some time to come. Assigning false motives to us and making personal attacks won't change that (except, possibly, in your case).

People who come here are free to read ALL of out viewpoints. Hopefully, that will help them to come to their own conclusions. I'm comfortable with that.

[BeFree]

7. "Yee shall know them by their works"

Got ya a new nickname Merc, henceforth yee shall be known as Murky. You could cloud up a clear sky. <grin>

I for one am glad you post here. Sorry that you are an apologist, but hey, nobody is perfect.

I especially like your "nothing unusual" comments about the twists and turns in the ATC centers that day. You have yet to convince me that planes being lost from the controller's screens are not unusual. Especially when transponders go off, and other flights are known to have been hi-jacked.

Going along with the Official Theory gets you the Apologist label. Now it is well known that on occasion you have expressed an interest in getting deeper into the withheld information, but it's interesting to note that you pretty much accept scanty details as 'Facts' and don't seem willing or able to venture beyond that comfort zone. That's fine. Don't venture. But admit it, and except the Apologist label you so proudly have earned.

'Tis the brave who venture beyond the handed down theory and look boldly for the answers which may lie deep within the truth of the occurrences of that awful day.

[MercutioATC]

8. I've invited you to ask questions...

...and I've offered to attempt to make my answers easier to understand. If you don't ask the questions, things tend to be "murky".

I DO find the need for some of the CT crowd to assign nicknames cute, though.

[vincent_vega_lives]

9. Please

So now if you think the size of the compressor disk found in the Pentagon is consistant with a jet engine found in a 757 you are a "Bush Administration apologist".

If you don't think the airliner that hit the WTC carried a missile pod you are a "apologist".

Starting to sound like Stalinist Russia around here where science, engineering, and all thought was politicized to the point where what you belived determined if you were favored or ended up in the gulag.

Last I heard science and engineering are NOT political.

[Abe Linkman]

10. So, if you think the Official Conspiracy Theory is correct --- go away.

This forum is for people who are more interested in facts than beliefs. Most people here KNOW that the Official Conspiracy Theory is a total like. Most people here KNOW that there's no evidence FL 77 crashed. Most people here KNOW that the WTC was brought down by controlled demolition. Most people here KNOW that Larry "Pull it" Siverstein meant exactly what he said.

Most people here KNOW that 9/11 was an inside job, and OUR reason for being here is to find out as much as possible what really happened.

BELIEVE what you will, but that compressor disk wasn't from a 757.

[MercutioATC]

11. Sorry, Abe. You're wrong.

According to Skinner:

"This forum is dedicated to discussion of the events surrounding 9/11, and America's response."


You can stop playing room monitor any time you like.

[Abe Linkman]

12. You don't do that, Murky. You don't "discuss" anything. You SPIN.

You just spin different theories every time someone points out how you are contradicting yourself.

You aren't here to DISCUSS anything. You're only here as an apologist for the bogus Official "Wacky Cavemen Did It" Conspiracy Theory.

You can stop pretending otherwise. Preferably, TNT (Today, Not Tomorrow).

[MercutioATC]

13. I'd suggest you review my posts, Abe.

I've answered every question put to me. I've clarified issues that nobody else here did (Remember when you thought ground stops were uncommon...until I informed you otherwise?).

That's discussion. Spouting theories and suggesting that those who don't agree either shut up or leave and refusing to address questions put to you is the true definition of "spin".

[LARED]

14. So what's stopping you?

Most people here KNOW that 9/11 was an inside job, and OUR reason for being here is to find out as much as possible what really happened.

Are you whining that a few poster that have different views are somehow stopping anyone from finding out what really happened?

You think that's true? You think we have that much power?

[Lithos]

15. Locking

This is a bit too accusatory and falls into the inflammatory category.

Lithos
FA/NS Moderator