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Home » Discuss » Topic Forums » September 11 Donate to DU
 
kerry_s Donating Member (101 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-26-06 02:08 AM
Original message
Killtown's Timeline is better than P. Thompson
I think that Killtown's Timeline ("Oddities Page") is in some ways even more expanded than Paul's and also bases on mass media information. It is at least a big suplement and they both complement each other in different areas. Just check it!:

http://killtown.911review.org/oddities.html

For example:

• 9/11 - Five Raytheon employees are on three of the four hijacked planes.

Flight 11: "Peter Gay, 54, Tewksbury, Massachusetts - Raytheon Co. vice president of operations for electronic systems based in Andover, Massachusetts. He had worked for Raytheon for more than 28 years." - September11Victims.com

"While most of the children stayed in the area when they grew up, the second oldest, Peter, moved north of Boston to become a plant manager for Raytheon. But he stayed close to his family, spending summers with them on Cape Cod. And he never forgot the attention to spit and polish, in his work or play. "It doesn't shine itself," he'd reply when people admired the condition of his vintage car.
Mr. Gay, who would have turned 55 this month, was commuting to California, where he'd been asked to increase production at a Raytheon plant producing a new military radar system. The plant had been producing five systems a day and the goal was nine; when Mr. Gay boarded Flight 11 for his weekly commute on Sept. 11, production was up to 14." - legacy.com

"David P. Kovalcin, 42, Hudson, New Hampshire - Raytheon Co. senior mechanical engineer for electronic systems in Tewksbury, Massachusetts. He had worked for Raytheon for 15 years." - September11Victims.com

"Mr. Kovalcin, 42, was a passenger on Flight 11, on a business trip for Raytheon, where he was a senior mechanical engineer. Mrs. Kovalcin said they had carved out a "Father Knows Best" kind of life, with him coming home at six every evening, choosing to know his family well rather than to work longer hours for more money.
She remembers that her husband had trouble sleeping two nights before his departure. "He woke me up at 3 a.m., and said 'I'm pacing the house. I can't sleep,' " she said.
"I rubbed his head and tried to calm him down. He was very distressed, but had no idea what it was. Then three days later I remembered, and thought, 'Holy cow, I wonder what that was about.' "
The morning he left home he had written a note for his family: "Rebecca, Marina and Mommy, I will miss everybody very much. See you Friday night." At the end he added, "I fed the dogs but not the fish." - legacy.com

"Kenneth Waldie, 46, Methuen, Massachusetts - Raytheon Co. senior quality control engineer for electronic systems in Tewksbury, Massachusetts. He had worked for Raytheon for 17 years." - September11Victims.com

"Mr. Waldie, who lived in Methuen, Mass., had two other children: Andrew, 24, and Jeff, 21. A senior quality control engineer at Raytheon, he was headed to California on a business trip.
Around work, his colleagues referred to him as "911," because of his generosity whenever someone needed help. His favorite number happened to be 11, and he was on Flight 11 when it crashed on the 11th." - legacy.com

Flight 175: "Herbert W. Homer, 48, Milford, Mass. - Corporate executive, Raytheon Co." - September11Victims.com

"Herb W. Homer of Milford, an official with the US Department of Defense, was killed Tuesday when United Airlines Flight 175 crashed in New York. He was 48.
Mr. Homer served as a US official coordinating government work by Raytheon Co. in Burlington. He began his 27-year federal career at the Defense Contract Management Agency's Raytheon office in 1974.

A member of First Congregational Church of Milford, he worked on several church committees and volunteered in the church nursery." - legacy.com

"The Department of Defense announced today that Herbert W. Homer, a civilian employee of the Defense Contract Management Agency, was among the passengers aboard United Airlines Flight # 175, which crashed into the World Trade Center. He was previously listed in error as unaccounted at the Pentagon." - DoD (09/15/01)

Flight 77: "Stanley Hall, 68, Rancho Palos Verdes, Calif. - director of program management, Raytheon Co." - September11Victims.com

"Stan Hall, 68, was on board the American Airlines Flight 77, Tuesday, September 11, that crashed into the Pentagon. He was born in Arlington, Virginia, and attended Washington Lee High School. In 1953, Stan was drafted into the Army and served for two years during the Korean War. He graduated from George Washington University with a Bacheolor in Engineering in 1959 and a Masters from Drexell University in 1963.
Stan was an active member of the South Bay Church of God for 11½ years. He was a Sunday School teacher and on the Board of Trustees.
He left his home in Rancho Palos Verdes six years ago to work at Raytheon's Washington DC facility, where he was director of program management. He was on his way to the company's operations in Goleta.
Stan, a 17 year veteran of the company formerly known as Hughes, helped develop and build anti-radar technology.
"He was our 'dean' of electronic warfare, and his objective was always to the protection of the American servicemen," colleaques remembered.
On November 13, 5001 Army Brigadier General Edward M. Harrington, Director of the Defense Contract Management Agency, on the behalf of President Bush awarded the Defense of Freedom Medal to Stan Hall as well as 3 other Raytheon employees. The medal was to recognize civilian Deparment of Defense employees killed Sepember 11, 2001. It is the equalivant to the Purple Heart for civilains." - legacy.com

Raytheon Employees Lost to the Sept. 11 Tragedy Awarded Defense of Freedom Medal
"Army Brigadier General Edward M. Harrington, director of the Defense Contract Management Agency, awarded the Defense of Freedom Medal, the civilian equivalent of the Purple Heart, to the families of the Raytheon employees who died in the Sept. 11 tragedy: Peter Gay of Tewksbury, Mass., Stanley Hall of Clifton, Va., David Kovalcin of Hudson, N.H., and Kenneth Waldie of Methuen, Mass., in a ceremony held at Raytheon's Andover, Mass., facility.

Herb Homer, a Defense Contract Management Agency defense corporate executive assigned to Raytheon, was also awarded the Defense of Freedom Medal. The medal, created to recognize and honor civilian employees of the Department of Defense who were killed or wounded during the terrorist attacks, can be awarded to non-Defense employees based on their involvement in DoD activities at the discretion of the Secretary of Defense." - Raytheon; PRNewswire (10/13/01)

September 11 Remembrance
"I will always remember what it felt like when I learned that we had four people on those planes: Peter Gay, Stan Hall, Dave Kovalcin, and Ken Waldie. We lost other colleagues as well: Herb Homer of the Defense Contract Management Agency, who was assigned to Raytheon and worked side-by-side with us for many years, and three PricewaterhouseCoopers associates working on the Raytheon account." - Raytheon

(See also: September 6, 2001 - Raytheon and the U.S. Air Force demonstrate new technology aircraft precision approach and landing system; September 10, 2001 - Wife of David Kovalcin said her husband woke her up in the middle of the night complaining he couldn't sleep and that he seemed "very distressed" but she didn't know why; Killtown's: Flight 77 unusual passengers)

___________
P. THOMPSON:

September 25, 2001: Several 9/11 Passengers Have Possible Connections to Pilotless Aircraft Program

As details of the passengers on the four hijacked flights emerge, some are shown to have curious connections to the defense company Raytheon, and possibly its Global Hawk pilotless aircraft program. Stanley Hall (Flight 77) was director of program management for Raytheon Electronics Warfare. One Raytheon colleague calls him “our dean of electronic warfare.” Peter Gay (Flight 11) was Raytheon’s vice president of operations for Electronic Systems and had been on special assignment to a company office in El Segundo, California. Raytheon’s El Segundo’s Electronic Systems division is one of two divisions making the Global Hawk. Kenneth Waldie (Flight 11) was a senior quality control engineer for Raytheon’s electronic systems. David Kovalcin (Flight 11) was a senior mechanical engineer for Raytheon’s electronic systems. Herbert Homer (Flight 175) was a corporate executive working with the Department of Defense. A surprising number of passengers, especially on Flight 77, have military connections. For instance, William E. Caswell was a Navy scientist whose work was so classified that his family knew very little about what he did each day. Says his mother, “You just learn not to ask questions.”

People and organizations involved: Peter Gay, William E. Caswell, David Kovalcin, Herbert Homer, Kenneth Waldie, Stanley Hall
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mirandapriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-26-06 03:08 AM
Response to Original message
1. Killtown has done some incredible work, I must say
As far as Raytheon goes, I get the feeling that those men were murdered because of what they might have known. No proof of course, just a feeling. What is so strange is that Raytheon was also a wtc tenant, now how odd is that? I've been sort of lightly looking as some of the wtc tenants and several of the companies had big lawsuits for fraud and anti trust, these are companies that were up above the impact level, had a lot of people die. Marsh and another one, can't remember right now. Also that risk management meeeting on the 105th floor where everyone died involved some of these companies, too, just an overactive imagine probably, but I bet there is something going on with Raytheon.
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file83 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-26-06 03:41 AM
Response to Original message
2. Wow - that's like a week's worth of reading right there!
What a body of work - I'll have to start chomping away at it.
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rman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-26-06 04:49 AM
Response to Original message
3. which is it?
"better" or "in some ways more expanded", "big suplement", "complement each other"?
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paulthompson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-26-06 04:54 AM
Response to Original message
4. Yes
Killtown's work is very good. I actually need to pilfer it one of these days to fill in some gaps I've missed, if Killtown doesn't mind. :)

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sabbat hunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-26-06 06:47 AM
Response to Reply #4
5. do we really
want to be quoting and linking to someone who has been banned from DU?

just asking.

peace
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quickesst Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-26-06 07:52 AM
Response to Reply #5
6. Why exactly....
was he banned? New here, and just curious. Thanks.
quickesst
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KJF Donating Member (792 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-26-06 08:16 AM
Response to Reply #6
7. No idea
I'd like to know too, but I don't think we'll get an answer. AFAIK there's no way to even definitively determine he was banned - maybe he just left to spend more time with his family.

The rules say (just click on Help at the top):

"Why was another member banned?"
"We generally do not discuss why particular members are banned."

Apparently, "The four most common reasons people are banned are: 1) They are conservative, 2) They are uncivil or disruptive, 3) They repeatedly break the rules, or 3) They have been previously banned under a different username."

Generally, discussing DU on DU is frowned upon by the mods.
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sabbat hunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-26-06 08:29 AM
Response to Reply #7
8. not a voluntary leave
he was tombstoned.

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KJF Donating Member (792 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-26-06 08:41 AM
Response to Reply #8
9. I don't know what tombstoned means
Could you explain it?
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SidDithers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-26-06 08:49 AM
Response to Reply #9
10. Here's his profile...
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KJF Donating Member (792 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-26-06 08:54 AM
Response to Reply #10
11. Thanks
Does it always say that - "Here lies a disruptor. He disrupted... poorly"?
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sabbat hunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-26-06 09:20 AM
Response to Reply #11
12. yes it does
anytime someone is banned they get the "Tombstone" and the tombstone always reads the same.
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KJF Donating Member (792 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-26-06 09:39 AM
Response to Reply #12
13. Thanks for the explanation
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mirandapriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-27-06 05:21 AM
Response to Reply #6
14. IMO he was provoked until he fought back
Edited on Thu Apr-27-06 05:22 AM by mirandapriestly
then he was tombstoned, but of course the provokers are still here. That's happened a couple of times.
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rman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-27-06 06:32 AM
Response to Reply #5
15. We'd be quoting MSM sources, not killtown
Moreover, being banned from DU is hardly conclusive cause for being discredited, except maybe for those who firmly belief in guilt by association.
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