U of Wisc. Prof Slammed for Presenting 911 MIHOP Theory

[wordpix2]

This on Tucker Carlson tonight. Fucker says prof should be fired---just for presenting a theory? Huh? :wtf:

If this prof is fired, he should go to court and be defended with all the incongruent facts surrounding 911. I for one think LIHOP more likely than MIHOP but there are certainly enough strange lies and coincidences surrounding 911 to allow either LIHOP or MIHOP to stand up in court as theories that can be presented in an academic institution.

How about "intelligent design?" That's a theory that shouldn't be taught in schools, IMO, but it is.

BTW, Tucker was actually slamming Bush tonight for the the Iraq War and said we should leave! I couldn't believe my ears. :eyes:

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

1. Eh.

I guess Tucker knows all about getting fired.

[Hissyspit]

5. Fucker needs to be fired again.

And of course he is jumping on the 'Iraq War sucks' bandwagon. He is a complete ass.

[murray hill farm]

18. I watched it until i could not stand it..and shut it off.

Tucker was his MOST obnoxious self.

[Uncle Joe]

21. He should be fired, then rehired,

only to be fired again just so they can do it twice.

[wildbilln864]

22. He will not...

be fired IMO because that may bring more attention to his questioning than they really want.
I hope he gets major publicity but I doubt it will evn be in CNM(corporate news machine).

[Uncle Joe]

23. I believe you are correct. n/t

[wildbilln864]

24. as a matter of fact...

I hope everyone here who sees this thread will read and learn about Muhammed Atta and "Able Danger" and related material.

[Hissyspit]

29. I was talking about TUCKER CARLSON being fired, not the teacher.

"Fucker" is his nickname.

[Amy6627]

2. What is MIHOP or LIHOP? Thanks

[wordpix2]

3. MIHOP=made it happen on purpose. LIHOP=let it happen on purpose

[LiberalVoice]

4. LIHOP/MIHOP

Let It Happen On Purpose/Made It Happen On Purpose. With regard to our govt and 9/11.

[alcibiades_mystery]

19. Two idiocies

Stated in the manner of a two-year old ("on purpose").

[longship]

36. I love it.

Thanks for this. You've got it right.

[mirandapriestly]

48. You've got it "right" alright..nt

[PADemD]

25. There is an interesting LIHOP theory

for the first Gulf War, described on page 120 of The Demonic Comedy.

[Cha]

6. I'd like to hear

or read the Prof's theory..see if jives with what I already have gleaned from DU.

Course, a lot of us have thought it was a LIHOP but with those savage drooling monsters you Never know?

[Zynx]

11. Most of these theories are utter garbage.

Believe me, I would love it in an odd way if they were true because it would be something to get rid of the Republicans forever. However, the factual basis is lacking considerably, and no I don't have to disprove wacky theories. The burden of proof is on them. If this proof is so convincing that any idiot could see it, take it to court and sue the government. If you can get a court to believe it, I will listen. I have wasted dozens of hours of my life on this subject and there is little to nothing to any of this. 9/11 was the result of gross government mismanagement of our national security.

[wildbilln864]

20. I take it you haven't read...

about Muhammad Atta and Able Danger then? I believe the truth could come out if that investigation were to be persued by independent parties. Also, do you suppose David Hopsicker is lying?
and 3rd, I'm surprised this hasn't been moved yet as is standard procedure?

[petgoat]

34. "The burden of proof is on them" Right. Can't they subpoena

Dick Cheney and Donald Rusmsfeld and make them tell the truth? Can't they just FOIA
for the Pentagon videotapes and the WTC blueprints and the black boxes from the WTC
planes? And read the NTSB reports on the plane crashes and look at the steel samples
from the WTC? What, no NTSB reports? No steel samples? No blueprints, no photos,
no black boxes no videos?

Scholars for 9/11 Truth has a petition calling for the release of suppressed evidence,
including nearly 7000 videos and 7000 photos of the WTC.

Here's the text (eiyh very scholarly footnotes)

http://www.thepetitionsite.com/takeaction/929981172?ltl=1141667399#body

http://www.st911.org/

[CantGetFooledAgain]

40. Thank you very much for this

I get tired of seeing the same old "debunkers" every time this topic comes up. No thinking person can reasonably assert that we've been told the truth about what happened on that day.

Scholars for 9/11 Truth: :yourock:

[eridani]

37. Why is the factual basis lacking?

Could it be because our overlords are hiding relevant data? Odd theories are what you get when our government lies and withholds information that ought to be public. I blame the government for that, not people without scientific training who, like anybody else, have an unalterable human need for their information surround to make sense.

[Zynx]

50. Rather than speculation and strange extrapolations of odd little events

I would like to see hard and fast evidence.

[slaveplanet]

45. six little words

"of course the order still stands."

Why would anyone think there could possibly be government collusion? :shrug:

[OneBlueSky]

49. I, too, am tired of wasting time on this subject . . .

but I believe it's imperative that the truth of what happened on 9/11 be discovered and told . . . MIHOP, LIHOP, or Bunny Hop, it doesn't matter . . . suffice to say that virtually nothing about the "official" story holds water, and the evidence completely ignored by the Commission would fill several volumes . . .

what I find most amazing is that anyone who's been paying even a little attention during the past five years would believe that BushCo is NOT lying about the attacks . . .

[Zynx]

51. Show me how "nothing" of the official story holds water.

I've seen it all from the gold in the WTC vaults, to the "missiles" fired at the WTC, Pentagon, etc, Marvin Bush, the supposed demolition of WTC 1 and 2, etc etc. I've heard it all. Most of it has no factual basis and those that have some are completely misinterpreted.

[OneBlueSky]

52. sorry . . . not interested . . . I'm all discussed out . . .

and I know that nothing I say is going to change your opinion . . .

just know that nothing you say is going to change mine . . . or millions and millions of others who do not believe that "most of it has no factual basis" . . .

if that's the case, it's only because they're hiding the facts . . .

[burythehatchet]

41. Yeah...I've been a HIHOP believer

Help it happen

[tom_paine]

44. Nice acronym. Deserves it's own thread.

It is a seperate and distinct theory from MIHOP and LIHOP. It more closely than either describes my own beliefs and I would bet the beliefs of thousands of others.

HIHOP. It sounds goofy but damned if it doesn't occupy it's own unfilled niche, as it were.

[flordehinojos]

7. tucker carlson is damn ......ass fascist.

[Wonk]

8. Instructor likes attention for 9/11 view

Kevin Barrett under fire for saying U.S. orchestrated attacks BY RYAN J. FOLEY
Associated Press

MADISON — A University of Wisconsin instructor under fire for his view that the U.S. government orchestrated the Sept. 11, 2001 attacks said Thursday he was confident he would keep his job.

Kevin Barrett also told the Associated Press he was elated the controversy has given his cause long-sought publicity.

"If these idiots had just kept their mouths shut, nobody would have ever heard of me," Barrett said of his critics. "I've been trying to get publicity for years."

Barrett, active in a group called Scholars for 9/11 Truth, is among a small group that believes the attacks were carried out by U.S. government officials, not al-Qaida terrorists. He came under fire after he spoke on a Wisconsin talk show last week and acknowledged he presented the theory to his students in the past.

(snip)

Republican gubernatorial candidate Mark Green demanded on Thursday that Barrett be fired for his views before he speaks Sunday at a forum on social justice at UW-Milwaukee.

MORE
http://www.twincities.com/mld/twincities/news/local/14982936.htm

[Cha]

27. Thanks! I'd like to take his

Course..I like what I read so far.

[DianaForRussFeingold]

9. Does anyone think we will ever know the truth.

Was there really war games going on that horrendous day? :blush: :yoiks:

[Wonk]

12. re: war games, yes. Here's a link with many more links and sources.

http://www.cooperativeresearch.org/timeline.jsp?timeline=complete_911_timeline&before_9/11=militaryExercises

Scroll down the page about half way to see which war games were active on and around 9/11/01.

[MrSlayer]

14. No, we'll never know what really happened.

I do know that what they said happened is not the truth.

[Dancing_Dave]

16. IT ONLY TAKES TIME AND RESEARCH TO FIND THE TRUTH

The truth about the Reichstag Fire, which Hitler staged and blamed on communists in order to seize power in Germany, is now widely known.

There's been a lot of recent progress towards understanding the Kennedy Assasination. We still don't know for sure who's bullet actually killed President Kennedy, but once you learn how CIA operatives set up the multiple shooter plot, it doesn't matter so much which of their bullets actually killed Kennedy. They all were involved in a conspiracy to commit murder, they are all guilty.

Likewise the remaining uncertainties about 9/11, don't keep us from realizing the clear guilt of the neo-cons who set up the plot.

http://st911.org is a good place to start.

[DianaForRussFeingold]

17. I was looking for that site.Thank You! Another good one 911.org

I really hope our own government wasn't involved. :cry:

[chefgirl]

10. Tucker's an asshole from way back.

The REAL problem is that no one has ever been permitted to get anywhere close to the truth, hence the conspiracy theories.
LIHOP, MIHOP, doesn't matter until we know the ONE true story of what happened.

In my gut, I've gone from LIHOP to MIHOP and back again, and the truth is almost surely somewhere in between, but as long as the RWers can obscure the truth, it works in thier favor. So they will continue to preemptively attack and villify anyone who even attempts to shed light on any of the theories.

Tucker, being an asshole from way back, is just playing his role.
This professor is simply bringing one of many ideas to the table, and that's what teaching is supposed to be about.

Then again, we know how the RWers feel about educating people too. :eyes:

-chef-

[DianaForRussFeingold]

13. I totally agree with you. If they want to hide the truth or keep secret

they should be studying North korean government. A true patriot will question and want to investigate. I wish 1930s Germany would have questioned authority. Come to think of it, I wish Washington would have,there wouldn't have been a war with Iraq.

[Jackpine Radical]

15. Some amplification & correction:

First, the teacher, Kevin Barrett, is an instructor, which makes him academic staff rather than faculty. Academic staff are non tenure-track, limited-term employees hired to teach specific courses. Their academic freedom is generally and traditionally far more limited than that of faculty. Unlike faculty, they serve pretty much at the pleasure of the administrators who hire them, and can be dismissed pertty much at will. They generally don't even have written contracts--at least I never did when I was in that role.

Second, Barrett went out of his way to be insulting and demeaning to a lot of people, including the Governor. I wouldn't necessarily argue that he was wrong in what he said, but surely he was unwise in his choice of venues for expressing himself.

Here is a bit of the story as reported by Inside Higher Education:

http://insidehighered.com/news/2006/07/03/madison

Investigation Over 9/11 Teachings
Two months before the start of the fall semester, one syllabus at the University of Wisconsin at Madison is getting a very thorough review.

Patrick Farrell, Wisconsin’s provost, announced last week that he would review everything about the course “Islam: Religion and Culture,” in light of comments made on a radio show by the instructor, Kevin Barrett. In his remarks, Barrett said that the United States planned the 9/11 attacks as a way to start a war in the Middle East. Barrett also indicated that he planned to share his views during the course this fall.

Barrett, a temporary instructor, received his Ph.D. from Madison in 2004 in African languages, literature and folklore. He has taught one other course at Madison, but it was not about Islam. Barrett is a founder of a group called the Muslim-Jewish-Christian Alliance for 9/11 Truth. On that group’s Web site, he elaborates on the views that he discussed on the radio, writing, for example, about the “big lie” of 9/11 and of the “compelling evidence” that the attacks were “an inside job.”

[Just Me]

28. Muslim-Jewish-Christian Alliance for 9/11 Truth.

I'd imagine,...that's a good thing. Wouldn't you? :shrug:

[Jackpine Radical]

33. Who knows? I know nothing about the group, but

it's pretty hard to guess what a group is all about on the basis of its title.

Anyway, I probably agree with Barrett on a lot of things and run somewhere between LIHOP & MIHOP myself, but I can also see how the university might respond to political pressure to shut him down in a way that would not be so easy if he were an established, tenured faculty person. That's just reality.

[wildbilln864]

26. and what does...

n/t mean?

also K&R!

[Hissyspit]

31. n/t is no text (beyond the subject line) and K & R means

that you are responding to kick the post up in the discussion forum and that you are recommending it for the Greatest Page.

Belated welcome to DU!

[wildbilln864]

32. Thank you,

Hissyspit, for the welcome and the answer. :)

[reprehensor]

30. Video of Kevin Barrett...

From last night on FOX;
http://www.911blogger.com/2006/07/kevin-barrett-on-hannity-and-colmes.html

Barrett wasn't the first teacher to be persecuted for speaking out;
http://reprehensor.gnn.tv/blogs/15270/9_11_Opinion_Lands_Teacher_in_Hot_Water

Tom Mustric's case is almost unknown, but it happened.

[longship]

35. Here we go again.

:popcorn: :popcorn:

[samdogmom]

38. He's not getting fired! It was on the front page of the Milw. Jnl. today.

Link: http://www.jsonline.com/story/index.aspx?id=460062

"The University of Wisconsin-Madison announced Monday that it would keep Kevin Barrett as a part-time lecturer and allow him to teach a controversial theory on the Sept. 11, 2001, terrorist attacks in spite of political pressure to dismiss him.

Barrett has come under fire in recent weeks for teaching that the Sept. 11 attacks were an inside job and for advocating the theory outside the classroom. Gov. Jim Doyle, U.S. Rep. Mark Green (R-Wis.) and several state legislators have called for his dismissal.

But after conducting a 10-day review of Barrett's past teaching and his plans for a fall class on Islam, Provost Patrick Farrell determined that Barrett was fit to teach and that the alternative theory on 9-11 had a place in the classroom when taught along with other viewpoints."


Its a great day for academic freedom and freedom of speech!

[wordpix2]

39. it's great U of WI won't fire him but when media asses like Fucker Carlson

get on their high horses, you never know what will happen next. Carlson believes the guy doesn't have a right to present MIHOP theory in a college class but I'm sure he thinks it's Ok to teach intelligent design to high school kids. I'm assuming this because he's generally a RWnut. :crazy:

[LARED]

54. alternative theory on 9-11 had a place in the classroom

when taught along with other viewpoints.

:rofl:

This could be a precedent setting decision. It won't be long before Santa Claus, pots of gold at the end of the rainbow, and the Easter bunny will be alternative theories in the classroom.

[Doctor_J]

42. The fascists are on the attack everywhere

we're eventually going to need help liberating this country again.

[AnnieBW]

43. He's Going To Be On Faux News

tonight. My F-I-L was going apesh*t about it on the phone.

[Shadoobie]

46. Based on more facts than ID.

At least this theory is grounded more in fact than intelligent design. I would emphasize that and see what people say.

Greg

[mirandapriestly]

47. Tucker sounds like the people who come here to post

and don't post anywhere else on DU. As for the Iraq statement, Zbignew Brezinski (I'm too lazy to look up spelling) said he was talking to an "official in the Bush administration" who told him that they plan on doing exactly what Murtha demands - only they're going to call it "victory". That was on Tom Hartmann today. So maybe the RW propagandists are all going to start calling for an exit.

[BuddyYoung]

53. You're right. Tucker DOES sound like them. As jazz says: heehee. nt

nt