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What part of the debate did Bush meltdown? What question was it?

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Tweed Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-09-04 02:34 AM
Original message
What part of the debate did Bush meltdown? What question was it?
Everyone keeps on talking about, but I didn't get to see the debate. No one is being specific. I'm trying to find the section where it happened. Can anyone help?
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Tweed Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-09-04 02:38 AM
Response to Original message
1. Can anyone please help me out here?
It can't be that hard to say what section it was in.
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Carolab Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-09-04 02:39 AM
Response to Original message
2. clip
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Tweed Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-09-04 02:41 AM
Response to Reply #2
5. Thank you and I've been trying to load that from time to time...
but it never works. Thank you for replying though.
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clover Donating Member (445 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-09-04 02:39 AM
Response to Original message
3. good examples here
The Scary Little Man
    By William Rivers Pitt
    t r u t h o u t | Perspective

    Friday 08 October 2004

"He had a feeling that the answer was quite different and that he ought to know it, but he could not think of it. He began to get frightened, and that is bad for thinking."

- J.R.R. Tolkien

    George W. Bush, still smarting from his embarrassing performance in the Florida debate, decided on Friday night in St. Louis that volume was a good substitute for strength, that yelling would be mistaken for gravitas. The result was an ugly, disturbing, genuinely frightening show.

    In my report on the first debate, I described Bush as, "Shrill. Defensive. Muddled. Angry, very angry. Repetitive. Uninformed. Outmatched. Unprepared. Hesitant." As bad as that display was, it honestly paled in comparison to the frenzied hectoring Bush sprayed at 140 Missouri citizens who had the ill fortune of watching the man come unglued before their eyes.

    John Kerry, by comparison, was every inch the controlled prosecutor pressing his case to the jury. It was, perhaps, that calm delineation of Bush's myriad errors which caused the Republican candidate to blow his stack. Exactly 30 minutes into the debate, Bush became so agitated by Kerry's description of the "back-door draft," which is literally bleeding the life out of our National Guard and Reserve forces, that he lunged out of his chair and shrieked over moderator Charles Gibson, who was trying to maintain some semblance of decorum.

    "You tell Tony Blair we're going alone," Bush roared. "Tell Tony Blair we're going alone!" The disturbed murmur from the crowd was audible. Bush, simply, frightened them.

    More unsettling than Bush's demonstrable agitation was his almost uncanny disconnect from reality.

    The voluminous report released by Charles Duelfer and the Iraq Survey Group, compiled by 1,625 U.N. and U.S. weapons inspectors after two years of searching some 1,700 sites in Iraq at a cost of more than $1 billion, stated flatly that no weapons of mass destruction exist in that nation, that no weapons of mass destruction have existed in that nation for years, and that any capacity to develop weapons of mass destruction within that nation has been crumbling for the same amount of years.

    "My opponent said that America must pass a global test before we used force to protect ourselves," said Bush during the Iraq phase of the debate. "That's the kind of mindset that says sanctions were working. That's the kind of mindset that said, 'Let's keep it at the United Nations and hope things go well.' Saddam Hussein was a threat because he could have given weapons of mass destruction to terrorist enemies. Sanctions were not working."

    What? First of all, the Duelfer Report proves beyond any question that sanctions had worked incredibly well. The stuff wasn't there, because Scott Ritter and the UNSCOM inspectors destroyed it all during the 1990s, along with any and all equipment and facilities to make it. The stuff wasn't there because the sanctions put into place against Hussein prevented him from getting any material to develop weapons. The stuff wasn't there because Hussein stopped making it years ago, because the sanctions were breaking his back. The sanctions worked.

    When Bush made the statement about Hussein giving weapons of mass destruction to "terrorist enemies," the needle edged over from 'Dumb' to 'Deranged.' How many different ways must one say "The stuff wasn't there" before George picks up the clue phone? How does someone give away something he doesn't have?

    Bush continued in this appalling vein when he said, "He keeps talking about, 'Let the inspectors do their job.' It's naive and dangerous to say that. That's what the Duelfer report showed." Welcome to Bush World, where everything is upside down and two plus two equals a bag of hammers. It is naive and dangerous to point out that the inspectors got the job done in the 1990s, that Iraq had no weapons of mass destruction whatsoever? No, George. It is simply the truth.

    The mental disconnect reared its shouting head repeatedly throughout the evening. Bush somehow lost track of where he was at one point and called his opponent, "Senator Kennedy." He told one questioner that he would control the deficit by stopping Congress from spending, only a few minutes after defending the fact that he had never, not once, vetoed a spending bill from Congress.

    He made an accountant crack about "Battling green eyeshades," a statement that immediately became a first-ballot nominee for the Gibberish Hall of Fame. When asked what kind of Supreme Court Justice he would nominate if given an opportunity, he wandered off along a free-association rant about Dred Scott. Clearly, this President will make sure to nominate people to the bench who are opposed to chattel slavery.

    Perhaps the most telling moment came when questioner Linda Grabel asked Bush, "Please give three instances in which you came to realize you had made a wrong decision, and what you did to correct it."

    As with his April prime time press conference, in which he was asked a very similar question, Bush absolutely refused to admit to any errors in judgment, beyond a cryptic quip about mistakes in personnel appointments which he would not elaborate upon. He opened himself up to the judgment of history, a sad straddle given the simple fact that no President can avoid such a judgment. That was all he was willing to offer. Ms. Grabel did not hear about three mistakes. She did not even hear about one.

    Bush was every inch the angry man on Friday night, which is dangerous enough. But to witness anger combined with belligerent ignorance, with a willful denial of basic facts, to witness a man utterly incapable of admitting to any mistakes while his clear errors in judgment are costing his country in blood, to see that combination roiling within the man who is in charge of the most awesome military arsenal in the history of the planet, is more than dangerous.

    It is flatly terrifying.

------------------------------------------------------------------------
    William Rivers Pitt is a New York Times and international bestseller of two books - 'War on Iraq: What Team Bush Doesn't Want You to Know' and 'The Greatest Sedition is Silence.'



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Tweed Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-09-04 02:42 AM
Response to Reply #3
6. HUGE help, thank you very much!
Can't wait to see it online.
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clover Donating Member (445 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-09-04 02:47 AM
Response to Reply #6
8. hey
you are welcome, my friend
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punpirate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-09-04 02:40 AM
Response to Original message
4. He did quite a bit of shouting...
... off and on, but I think you're referring to his response to Kerry's assertion that we went into Iraq alone. He charges Charles Gibson, then stalks around the platform, talking at length about Silvio Berlusconi, Poland, and says, especially, something like "what do you think Tony Blair thinks of that?," two or three times.
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A-Schwarzenegger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-09-04 02:42 AM
Response to Original message
7. From the transcript...
(not the same as hearing & seeing it...
Bush's freak-out is in the middle of the following...)


KERRY: Daniel, I don't support a draft.

But let me tell you where the president's policies have put us.

The president -- and this is one of the reasons why I am very proud in this race to have the support of Gen. John Shalikashvili, former chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff; Adm. William Crowe, former chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff; Gen. Tony McPeak, who ran the air war for the president's father and did a brilliant job, supporting me; Gen. Wes Clark, who won the war in Kosovo, supporting me; because they all -- and Gen. Baca, who was the head of the National Guard, supporting me. Why? Because they understand that our military is overextended under the president.

Our Guard and Reserves have been turned into almost active duty. You've got people doing two and three rotations. You've got stop-loss policies, so people can't get out when they were supposed to. You've got a back-door draft right now.

And a lot of our military are underpaid. These are families that get hurt. It hurts the middle class. It hurts communities, because these are our first responders. And they're called up. And they're over there, not over here.

Now, I'm going to add 40,000 active duty forces to the military, and I'm going to make people feel good about being safe in our military, and not overextended, because I'm going to run a foreign policy that actually does what President Reagan did, President Eisenhower did, and others.

We're going to build alliances. We're not going to go unilaterally. We're not going to go alone like this president did.

GIBSON: Mr. President, let's extend for a minute...

BUSH: Let me just -- I've got to answer this.

GIBSON: Exactly. And with Reservists being held on duty...

(CROSSTALK)

BUSH: Let me answer what he just said, about around the world.

GIBSON: Well, I want to get into the issue of the back-door draft...

BUSH: You tell Tony Blair we're going alone. Tell Tony Blair we're going alone. Tell Silvio Berlusconi we're going alone. Tell Aleksander Kwasniewski of Poland we're going alone.

There are 30 countries there. It denigrates an alliance to say we're going alone, to discount their sacrifices. You cannot lead an alliance if you say, you know, you're going alone. And people listen. They're sacrificing with us.

GIBSON: Senator?

KERRY: Mr. President, countries are leaving the coalition, not joining. Eight countries have left it.

If Missouri, just given the number of people from Missouri who are in the military over there today, were a country, it would be the third largest country in the coalition, behind Great Britain and the United States. That's not a grand coalition.

Ninety percent of the casualties are American. Ninety percent of the costs are coming out of your pockets.

I could do a better job. My plan does a better job. And that's why I'll be a better commander in chief.
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jmowreader Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-09-04 07:34 AM
Response to Reply #7
11. OMG, did this idiot really say that?
Aleksandr Kwasniewski sent 300 troops to Iraq in the initial deployment. That is one Polish Special Purpose Forces company.

Poland sent ONE FUCKING COMPANY and we're supposed to think we're not going it alone.

Later they sent 4000 support troops. That's a brigade.

Poland has sent one brigade of support troops and one company of Spetsnaz guys, and we're supposed to think Poland is as deep into this shit as we are. I think Alaska sent more people to this war than Poland did. I think Maine did. I know Idaho did.

And guess what: The Poles are leaving. The Alaskans, Mainers and Idahoans are not.
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Nomad559 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-09-04 03:26 AM
Response to Original message
9. Bush Meltdown - Video
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booksenkatz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-09-04 07:05 AM
Response to Original message
10. I think it was "Good evening and welcome to the 2nd presidential debate"
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soothsayer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-09-04 07:49 AM
Response to Original message
12. It was quite early in the debate. The question was about the draft.
Very "you want a piece of me??" posture. It's hilarious to rewatch!
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donkeyotay Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-09-04 08:11 AM
Response to Original message
13. This was the worst, but not the only
It was right here when he talked over the moderator and started marching around stabbing his finger in the air. He looked insane.


GIBSON: Exactly. And with Reservists being held on duty...

(CROSSTALK)

BUSH: Let me answer what he just said, about around the world.

GIBSON: Well, I want to get into the issue of the back-door draft...

BUSH: You tell Tony Blair we're going alone. Tell Tony Blair we're going alone. Tell Silvio Berlusconi we're going alone. Tell Aleksander Kwasniewski of Poland we're going alone.

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