New meme: Bush may leave ticket for health reasons.

[MikeG]

http://www.dailykos.com/comments/2004/10/14/1194/1032/234#234

[WI_DEM]

1. It's not likely

[Proud2BAmurkin]

2. bells palsy not debilitating

but a good enough excuse for Bush to get out before he loses in a LANDSLIDE

[Selwynn]

5. My dad had bell's palsy. I dont think thats what Bush has.

Bell's Palsy is not something you can "sorta" hide.

[SidDithers]

23. Jean Chretien has Bell's Palsy...

certainly, it wasn't hidden, but it didn't affect his ability to lead Canada either.

I agree, no Bell's Palsy for Bush. I think he's just stupid.

Sid

[ellie]

32. What a great photo Sid!

I love Gordie Howe!

[SidDithers]

50. Thanks, :)

Was searching for Kerry playing hockey, and this popped up. Kerry with Howe and Orr, two of my hockey heroes.

:toast:

Sid

[Carni]

37. Who is that in the blue shirt next to Kerry?

Is that Dennis Leary?

[hippiechick]

42. Yes ... link here ...

http://learyfirefightersfoundation.org/

Some awesome hockey pics from last year's game that Senator Kerry was part of.




:hippie: <--- LOVES hockey !!

[Carni]

43. Good!

I have always thought he was funny...but I was afraid he was a right winger! I am glad to see that he's probably not!

[clydefrand]

8. Why did you say bells palsy? Is that mentioned in the link?

[shanti]

25. i just googled bell's palsy

and it sure sounds like this could be it! but i'm not a physician, so i'll just shut up :)

[Selwynn]

29. I'm telling you, seeing BP first hand, I think its unlikely bush has it.

Bell's palsy effectively paralyzes one side of your face. It is VERY noticable - by that I mean something that would be impossible to hide and mainstream news would pick up, not just something we die hards conjecture about in our lil corner of the world.

Maybe I'm wrong, and maybe my father's bout with this was more severe or something.

[Richardo]

40. The Bell's Palsy sufferer I knew had very severe manifestion

Paralyzed 1/2 his face, lower eyelid pulled down, mouth frozen. Very noticeable.

[CAcyclist]

56. Not Bell's Palsy , but even if it was:

Bell's palsy is an inconvenience not a disability - it paralyzes motor nerves(the facial nerve) to the muscles of the face on that side, but it's often a temporary syndrome and it doesn't stop a person from doing anything that they normally could do before. It's very common.

[grace0418]

54. neither is sociopathic behavior

Bush will be just fine.

[Selwynn]

3. No way.

[TexasSissy]

4. No way. * is in this game for the power. Power people don't give uppower

Never. Esp the Bushes.

[Free2BMe]

6. and we would be left with "who"???????

aka "whom"

[PCIntern]

7. what makes you think it's

necessarily Bell's palsy?

I do this for a living, the differential diagnosis for the symptoms which presented yesterday includes Bell's Palsy but there are quite a few other entities on the list.

Do recall that Bell's is often acute nerve damage due to trauma, which may be mild to moderate, including tooth exdtraction, but it is also possibly indicative of underlying disease states both local and systemic.

I wouldn't however make a presumptive dx of Bell's without a lot of other info.

[amazona]

9. thought Nader was the one with Bell's palsy? NT

.

[PCIntern]

13. It is a BIG MISTAKE

to attempt to dx someone by visual clues alone. Do not try this at home!

I think those people saying something's wrong are on to something, but you must be very careful.

[progressivebydesign]

18. I agree. Trying to diagnose on the tv is really bad.

I think many people's point is that something IS wrong with Bush. It's obvious. He seems confused, out of touch, and just totally differen than he was even 4 years ago. I think the postponing of the physical is also a really telling sign.. what are they hiding?

[PCIntern]

27. I am a clinician,

so I know wherefrom I speak. I think there's something wrong - the constellation of impairment possibly from EtOH and other substances, the somewhat rapid degeneration of various motor skills including speech, balance, and gait, along wiht other clues, might begin to allow some presumptive diagnoses but quite honestly, we have absolutely no idea what's going on without a fulol examination and laboratory findings. You just can't do it

Do not think for one minute that this is the equivalent of Reagan's early Alzheimer's diagnosis. That is different and quite honestly, was easy to make for those of us who knew, in 1980, that jellybeans were very very important to President-elect Reagan.

[yardwork]

48. I'm not a clinician but I know someone with frontal lobe dementia

and W's behavior reminds me of that person's. Then again, his behavior also reminds me of people with wet brain from alcohol abuse.

I agree with you and I've posted many many times - something very serious is wrong with W and we aren't being given enough information to know what it is. That alone is not right.

W will not leave the ticket. He's all they've got. For some reason a lot of people think he's likeable. Nobody likes cheney. I worry that W might be re-selected and THEN he'll step down, leaving us with President cheney.

[Zuni]

55. Very interesting

when reading about Reagan, even in the early 1980s, I was struck by the symptoms of Alzheimers he displayed. Not just confusion and forgetfulness, but also stubborness even in the face of overwhelming evidence and a tendency to drift off, as well as inserting non-sequitirs into conversations

[CAcyclist]

57. So, what you're saying is

he's fallen off the wagon? ;)

[Dogmudgeon]

10. I had Bell's Palsy once

I got it from an ear infection.

It wasn't very pleasant, but the ear infection was what was painful. And after the infection was cleared up, so did the Bell's Palsy.

Been there, done that. Can I be the Preznit now?

--bkl

[leftynyc]

46. I got Bells from shingles in my ear

It's called Ramsey Hunt syndrome. *'s mouth looked like Bells but if it was that his eye on that side would also be affected (I couldn't blink).

[clydefrand]

11. What symptoms? I saw none in the President's face last

night. I got BP in '67! I have residual nerve damage to this day. But it certainly doesn't keep one from doing his/her job.

[Maiden England]

12. Its not bells palsy

but it might be MS. That fits with the facial palsy like symptoms, demetia and psyhosis although uncommon are recognized features early in presentation. Also fits with extended vacations from the White House, with a relapsing/remitting course of disease, it would make sense to keep him away from the press during a relapse. I think his face in particular looks puffy, and he's putting on weight, that is consistent with treatment with high dose steroids.

[PCIntern]

16. MS

is possible but there are many other entities, especially at his age, which it may be.

As I said, careful - you dont' want to go off half-cocked here.

If we are studious and watchful and listen carefully to what insiders say, we may discern the true story here...

[clydefrand]

17. Did his face look puffy or did it just appear that way

because the camera had closer shots of him than Kerry to make them look equal in height?

I thought our guy Kerry looked tired last night and very thin in the face. Maybe it was because Bush was so in our faces that he looked thinner to me.

[LiberalEsto]

22. It was the lighting.

I used to do stage lighting in college, and when I saw the side-by-side shots of the candidates on C-Span, it sure looked like there was some pink lighting on B*sh that made him look healthy, and possibly some light blue on Kerry which made him look haggard. All it takes is a little bit of subtle change in lighting -- it can make a big difference.

[Paxdora]

31. Nah - it was the disease...

Gollumism

[LiberalEsto]

44. I was saying they used lighting to make CHIMPY look healthy

And to make John Kerry look haggard. Pink lighting for B*sh; blue to make Kerry look poor.

[requiem99]

14. And you think Dick Cheney could beat Kerry?I don't even think McCain could

The only chance McCain has to beat Kerry is in THIS campaign. If Kerry wins this year nobody will be able to touch him in 2008, no way in hell. He's got far too much integrity and character to make a bad president, so he's in it for 8 years if he wins on Nov 2. However, in THIS campaign Bush has effectively smeared Kerry's integrity and name, so McCain could have a chance if Bush dropped out and they nominated McCain, however I do not think people are willing to put their trust in him so fast, plus all the people who saw the debates know what Kerry is about and what Bush is about, not everyone knows exactly what McCain is about. They might like him, but they aren't sold on his presidency.

[LTR]

28. Whether the GOP likes it or not, they're stuck with Dumbya

He's the only one with even the remotest chance of uniting what's going to be a seriously fractured party once the election is over. It'll be a civil war between the fiscal conservatives, the fundies and the warheads. They'll never unite behind anyone as much as they can Dumbya.

And the GOP has done a terrible job of building for the future, There are no fresh faces around to take command of the party. Santorum? Hell no! Frist? No way! Hagel seems to be the least offensive choice, but he's a nobody. McCain's getting too old.

[progressivebydesign]

15. Can someone start a initiative to FORCE Bush to take the physical?

I mean.. isn't THAT part of the duties of the President? To make SURE he's healthy enough to run the country? Why isn't the media pushing this? If it were Clinton or Gore, they'd ask... WHAT ARE THEY HIDING? Bush? WHAT ARE YOU HIDING??? THey said he was "too busy" to take the physical, yet he's been on vacation several times since August, when he NORMALLY takes his physical as Prez.

I think the American public DESERVES to know the truth about Bush's health!!!!! THIS IS A MAJOR ISSUE IN THE ELECTION!!! Why is the media giving him a free pass? If he's ill, then we HAVE to know, because people will be stuck with his replacement, whether they want him or not... Could be John Ashcroft, who knows?

[shelley806]

34. The media has given this criminal administration a free pass on everything

[Moonbeam_Starlight]

38. The media even asked

Clinton's press secretary in 1996, when issuing his physical results, if he had an STD, for crying out loud.

But the media isn't asking a THING about why a sitting president is putting off a physical for three or four months.....has a date been given as to when he will take it?

Has a reason been given as to why it's been postponed?

Surely he's not too busy campaigning to spend 2 hours and 45 minutes in Maryland for a physical (that's how long they take, based on his 2001 official report and the 2003 casual report from McClellan).

[MidwestTransplant]

19. Photo from this debate

http://www.washingtondispatch.com/spectrum/archives/000652.html

He looks to be wearing a back brace perhaps?

[Dogmudgeon]

20. That's one hell of a thread!

Did anyone read through it?

A big chunk was about how Bush had an air of resignation. The "feel" I got from some of it was that Bush actually admires John Kerry! (Which would make him smarter than we've been giving him credit for :) )

But if Bush loses, now that the seeds of the idea of illness have been planted, the Official Story will be that he lost because John Kerry whupped a sick man who bravely soldiered on for his Party, his Country, and his God.

It certainly is getting interesting.

--bkl

[seabeyond]

51. being lied to and peoples lives

there may be sympathy for illness he may experience that is who we are as human beings, but i guarentee you a lie this big, there will be anger too

[medeak]

21. Bush asked Kerry to talk to him later last night?

You guys are missing it. Deaf person read Bush's lips asking Kerry if he could talk to him...

what the heck is that all about?

[endnote]

24. He'll yell at him for talking about Cheney's LESBIAN daughter

[MetaTrope]

41. He had to give Kerry the key to the operations room

containing the controls to the Tesla weather weaponry satellite and the direct phone line to Osama bin Laden.

[dubyaD40web]

26. Maybe it's the side-effects

from drinking and cocaine use.

[ronnykmarshall]

30. Interesting .... but I don't buy it.

I can't see Bush stepping down for any reason.

[Moonbeam_Starlight]

33. We're talking about this over here

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x1069744

Now I don't believe for a SECOND that they are going to take him off the ticket. In fact, I believe it is quite the opposite--I have a theory that he hasn't actually had a physical since 2001 (here is the official White House report on that one: http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2001/08/20010804-2.html

There is NO other official White House report since that 2001 physical. We only have second hand reports in newspapers or Scott McClellan holding a press gaggle talking about them (here he is talking about it in 2003: http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2003/08/20030802-1.html#2

Now. The working theory I have now is that he is suffering from some fairly serious medical condition that can and will worsen (and probably HAS). They are furiously trying to keep it under wraps.

The debates have been VERY bad for this. We have seen such strange behavior. Add to that the link someone had around here with bush in the TX governor debates 10 years ago compared to him in the first debate. MARKED difference in his speech patterns, awareness, the speed at which he spoke, everything.

Some think he is in the midst of substance abuse. That may be true, too, but for some reason my gut feeling is serious medical problem.

At his rallies, he is able to keep up his energy, read from a script and the audience is COMPLETELY forgiving so that makes it easier.

This also raises the question of the back bulge. Is it something medical or is it, indeed, a transmitter? Who knows?

All I know is, something is stinking, BAD.

[demokatgurrl]

35. Wishful thinking. Actually let's keep him there-

Kerry is kicking his ass.

[archineas]

36. a thought...

isn't this meme the equivalent of a whisper campaign?

it resulted in the media actually asking if bush was wired. could this result in the media asking about his health as well?

j

[Moonbeam_Starlight]

39. I really now think

upon looking very closely at ALL the bulge pics, that it is a back brace.

I really do. And I don't normally go in for conspiracy theories and such, but I think it is a back brace. 99% sure.

If so, what is it for? And is it connected to his postponing his physical?


On edit: any doctors in the house? Can anyone list all the reasons a person would wear a back brace almost all the time? (He would have to REALLY need it to risk wearing it to the debates and having it noticed through the jacket.)

[TrogL]

45. Spodyliosis

Degenerative condition of the spine. My partner has it. You're basically walking around with a broken back. Very painful and you need to be on Oxycontin or something.

That could explain his debate performance. He's stoned.

[Moonbeam_Starlight]

47. This is from his 2001 physical findings

- Musculoskeletal low back pain secondary to lifting; fully evaluated in 1990, currently asymptomatic
- Left medial meniscal injury, 1997, with subsequent surgical repair


What does the second thing mean?

[Dogmudgeon]

49. He probably hurt his knee while running

It's a common complaint among runners.

--bkl

[jeningermany]

52. Lets put on our critical thinking caps

This line of argument isn't very logical and makes DU look silly. Bush looks/sounds like shit because he is throwing every ounce of energy he has behind winning this race because golldarnit, it's hard work.

Wild speculation about his physical health/strokes/bells palsie/dementia, etc. just look like desparation on our part.

[Moonbeam_Starlight]

58. Wild speculation huh?

Makes "US" look silly huh?

Sniff sniff. Something smells funny. And not funny ha ha.

[newyawker99]

59. Hi jeningermany!!

Welcome to DU!! :toast:

[Mayberry Machiavelli]

53. Here's a medical pic of a dude with Bell's Palsy: