My analysis: "Undecided" voters are full of crap!!

[Coventina]

Every so-called undecided or "swing" voter I have personally talked with are really Bush supporters. The only reason they SAY they are "undecided" is because they admit that Bush hasn't been perfect.
They really WANT to vote for Bush, but have enough of a brain to be embarrassed about it.

Last weekend I talke to a guy who started out by saying he was undecided, but less than a minute into the conversation said, "Well, I supported the Iraq war, so I really don't think it is right for me to turn on Bush NOW, just because the intelligence was bad!"

"Undecideds" are either idiots or lying, or possibly lying idiots. I also think they are using their "undecided" status to get attention and use it to talk about how they really do support Bush.

I know it's a bad attitude, but I'm sick of trying to talk to people who SAY they are undecided, just to hear them eventually say that they REALLY intend to vote for Bush, and tell me "Kerry is scary".

[BlueEyedSon]

1. They are Lying or Stupid

[Mizmoon]

3. You avatar is freaking me out

once again! STOP STARING AT ME, DAMMIT! :scared:

[BlueEyedSon]

15. Relax, its just the Blue Eyed Son

[Goldmund]

2. I hope you're wrong

And history would suggest you are.

[Coventina]

4. Well, I hope I'm wrong also

All I'm saying is what my experience has been.
And it's extremely frustrating!!!

[demokatgurrl]

36. Maybe they'll be so embarassed that when they get

in the voting booth they won't be able to do it, and they'll vote for Kerry.

[Catfight]

5. I say the same thing, they are ashamed they support Bush because

they are supporting an idiot. Bush is embarrassing to support so supporting him means you are among the bigots, the religious zealots and none thinking violent people. For example, I used to tune into hate AM radio on my way home to hear the taking points and get a laugh sometimes, but I always rolled my windows up or turned the channel in fear someone would hear it on my radio. I didn't want to be identified as an idiot listening to hate radio. Like people who watch Jerry Springer, they were embarrassed they liked listening to peoples dirty laundry. Same thing with Bush, it's shameful to be for him.

[LuminousX]

6. "Undecideds" are full of crap

But not in that they are all Bush supporters, but in that they are impossible to convince. They keep saying that they need to know more about each candidate, as if the candidate will stop by their house one day for a chit-chat. These people seem to refuse to read newspapers and news magazines.

Quite honestly, I think they will choose how to vote based on how they are feeling that day. A little dispeptic over the corned beef hash breakfast while reading an article on Bush means the voter will vote for Kerry. Driving to the polls and getting cut-off by a car with a Kerry bumpersticker means a vote for Bush.

[2Design]

13. yes I have students like this - say they are confused but never

opened the book

[JI7]

7. i know a lot of "independents" who only bash liberals and democrats

they claim to be independent but they only bash liberals and democrats. by claiming to be independent they don't have to defend republicans. when we make an argument against the republicans they just respond with "i'm an independent".

[calmblueocean]

8. What state do you live in?

That makes a difference.

[Coventina]

17. Arizona

but the guy I referred to in my first post lives in Pennsylvania.

[rcw]

9. Bush Aside, Why Kerry?

Other than the fact that Kerry is running against Bush,
why should I vote for him?

[2Design]

12. research and enjoy your stay

[Goldmund]

14. I'll answer that in one post, if you answer my question in one post...

What's the meaning of life?

[rcw]

16. Meaning of Life...

John 17:3

"And this is eternal life, that they may know Thee, the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom Thou hast sent."

[Goldmund]

18. I meant, an aswer that actually has substance

[rcw]

20. I did...

If I am made by God, then knowing Him would be my purpose.

If I am something that came about by chance, why would I even wrestle with the question?

[Goldmund]

22. I made a cake last night

But the purpose of the cake isn't knowing me. There is no relation between the two.

Also, "chance" isn't the only alternative to "god" -- unless you can so (substantively) prove.

And third, even if you did come about by chance, I don't see how that possibly impies that wrestling with the question is pointless.

So, your answer is, no offense, just a set of dogmatic talking points. It means nothing.

If you want similar dogmatic points on why to vote for Kerry, here you go:

because he's for Stronger America.

[rcw]

23. so much for my answer...

You have put yourself on the same level as a cake. - ?

I will let you prove my point if you choose to answer...
Please provide any other alternatives that don't come down to chance.

It goes back to you original request ... the meaning of life.
If it is chance, there is no meaning, and you find yourself on a downward spiral struggling with a question to which there is no answer.

by the way ... I don't know of anyone in this country who isn't for a STRONGER AMERICA - no matter who they select in November.

anybody got a better answer to my orignal post?

[Goldmund]

25. Oh, really?

And is there anybody in this country who thinks that their lives are meaningless?

Then how come not everybody believes in a god?

If your dychotomy between god and meaninglessness is correct, that is.

Anyway, what I meant by my original answer is that it's just kinda... I dunno, naive or dorky or something, to post a question like "why should I vote for Kerry" in the middle of a thread. The question is just too huge, and your post implies that you don't appreciate the vastness of the question; but your answer to my "meaning of life" question kinda sheds light on your thinking. Everything is just a simple, binary thing, according to you (OK, OK, I'm extrapolating -- but based on what you've written so far). The meaning of life is answerable in one sentence, which is incidentally, a quote of something somebody else wrote.

Asking such an absurdly broad question is just meaningless. Nobody can possibly give a good answer to such a question in the space of a typical post. Also, if you really wanted a short-ish answer to that question, why don't you look at one of the dozens of endorsements that Kerry received from newspaper editorial boards. If you ask me, they are equally hollow, since you can't really answer such a question in anything less than a book -- but they're, you know, catchy.

Since you haven't done that, I suspect that your question is less than honest. I think you're more after watching how "these wackos on DU" are going to react to your stimulus, than you're really looking for an answer. I'm not calling you a troll or a freeper, but I just can't see how a sincere desire for knowledge can be served by asking what you did.

[LuminousX]

21. Process

Bush has failed. The process has provided us with an alternative in Kerry, who for all his warts and foibles, does have a clear plan, agenda, and skill set which will allow him to enact his plan and agenda.

I trust his resolve against terror. I appreciate his plan on increasing the number of special forces in the military as specialops are the best way to combat terror and insurgencies. I trust Kerry to work with other nations and be able to build alliances that are meaningful with other powerful countries that will be able to bring global power against al qaeda. I am convinced Kerry will close the Central America avenue that brings drugs and potential hostiles into the U.S. (I just found out about this on NPR this morning, and Bush has done nothing to resolve it, in fact has made it worse.)

Why Kerry? The process of the primaries has designated him as the one to oppose Bush. The process has worked for at least a century (not sure when the first primaries were). I know Bush has failed. Time to try someone else. Someone who has gone through the crucible of the primaries.

[rcw]

24. but what about Kerry would make me want to vote for him

he has a plan, but does he have the stuff to carry it through. He seems to be a pretty good orator from what I saw in the debates. But what else does he have to offer. If any of the stuff the other side is saying is true (vietnam stuff, taxes, back and forth on issues, etc.) then I don't know that we would be any better off.

What kind of character does he have?
Do you really think he can do all he's saying he is going to do?

You can discount the undecided all you want, but these questions are not unvalid.

[LuminousX]

29. It is your choice

I can lead the horse to water but I can't make him drink.

I believe Kerry can fulfill his plans. He has been a significant administrative force when he carried out the BCCI investigation and brought Iran-Contra to the forefront of this country's attention.

[texas1928]

34. The Flip-Flop on issues, Vietnam, and the taxes...

The republicans use these because they can not run on their record. They can not say see we have a balanced budget, see we have a stable and clear platform on the economy, they can not say this. They can not say they have caught Osama, and they can not say that Iraq was a success. They have to use untrue digs on the other candidate because if they try to stand on their record, they will fold like a house of cards.

You saw this if you watched the debates. Everytime Kerry hit Bush with facts of what his administration has done, bush* hit him with one of their smear tactics. He can not answer to his record.

On Kerry as a person. He is Catholic, and a christian man, he goes to church every sunday. He is a devoted father and husband. Yes, he is divorced but that does not stop him from being a good president. He is a Harley lover, and an avid hunter.

I like looked at all the candidates that ran for the Democratic nomination, and out of all the ones I saw and read about I liked John Kerry's stand on ADA, and stem cell research and his plan for the economy. He out of all of them did not just tell they were a problem but said how he was going to fix them.

I worry about terrorists too, but I also worry about my parents and the fact that they are reaching retirement soon, and I worry about my life as well (I am a paraplegic.) The war on terror is fine, but it does not take care of my parents retirement and Social security, and it does not guarentee that tomorrow I am going to wake up with a job, and if I do not, will I be able to find one. Protecting us from terror is not the only job the president has to do. There are a lot more important things out there than that. This countries finacial security, and prosperity are to really big ones. Bush has not focused on that one enough in my opinion.

Vote how you feel, but if you are coming on DU for answers, ask them and you will find out your answers.

What I have typed here is WHY I am voting for Kerry.

[Thrill]

10. There are no UNDECIDEDS

They're just people who attention. Forget that crap. Rally the base

[2Design]

11. you are right they are bush supporters - faking it to get on news

and elsewhere - it is just another marketing ploy and news media again are being and in cohoots with being 'hoodwinked'

that is why the polls are bs

they don't do real polls

reminds me of corporate director who want opinion polls of our customers to see how we were doing

then turned around and said he would use those as evaluation of US - so I said then - you don't want real information -

he didn't get it

if I am to make up the questions and you are going ot rate me on thme - I am going to make up questions that will get me the results I need

now if you ask me to find out real information and no one takes a hit - I can do that tooo

[WI_DEM]

19. If that is the case we are in trouble

because traditionally undecideds break 3-1 for the challenger.

[Name removed]

26. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[mad_hatter]

27. That may be true but...

I actually work with a couple of undecideds and, as you stated, they were actually leaning towards Bush. One of them a relentless Kerry basher, the other I could usually find surfing the Repug websites.

When the subject of politics came up recently both, somewhat reluctantly admitted that they were probably going to vote for Kerry. Both said the debates and F911, which has been heavily distributed here at work, turned them. There's still hope.

[Seabiscuit]

28. You nailed it!

[Catherine Vincent]

30. I know. I don't trust undecideds either.

If people are undecided at this point in time in the election, they are idiots.

[info being]

31. Hmm, are they just avoiding discussion? Are they cowards?

I tend to agree with you that most of them aren't being sincere.

[info being]

32. Or maybe they are just procratinators

[sampsonblk]

33. I vote for stupid

Too stupid to lie, in my opinion.

There is no way they can still be considering Bush unless they have bought at least SOME of his garbage.

Such as:

they just hate our freedoms.
EVERYONE thought Saddam had weapons.
The economy would have been worse if not for Bush's tax cuts.

How can Kerry even TALK to these people? What can you say to a person who believes that shit?

[Czolgosz]

35. I know some undecideds. They are all basically Bush 2000

voters who are so disappointed in Bush's performance over the last 3 1/2 years (except they all want to ive him points for 9/11/01) that they will stay home on Nov. 2 or vote Kerry.

Don't hate the undecided voters. Mostly, they are people who have been Republicans their whole lives, growing up in Republican households, working at Republican companies, and they cannot bring themselves to vote *. They are shrugging off years of misinformation to do the right thing on Nov. 2.

[sampsonblk]

37. They should admit they were wrong

Like all those dummies in West Virginia! WTF??!

[bloom]

38. I was listening to some people

who have been surveying voters and their various opinions on issues.

And it made me think about all of the people in the middle. After Iraq - the main issues, according to one person, are "family values". However that is defined by a person - are the values of society working for you?

It could mean do you feel valued for what you do - and does society seem just and reasonable. Is there a community where you fit in and are comfortable. Does the role you play in life make sense to you - do the limits or lack thereof on personal freedoms make sense. Do (or should?) women have choices when it comes to abortion, careers and flextime and the like.

The Bush* propaganda has promoted the "machoness" (and even infallibility) of Bush* - and the passiveness of Laura. Many here a problem with these glorified role models. I wonder how many people - esp. in the middle- are responding to things like that on an emotional level and can't make up their mind where they fall.