being a school libriarian is NOT teaching

[greenbriar]

they kick out any disruptive students and put books on a shelf and check out books.



if she wants to claim to be a teacher, then she can come to my classroom.

I am in a battle zone day in and day out. I actually got hit friday during a fight, there was a fight outside my door 7th block today.


she ain't got nuttin

[Iris]

1. "I am in a battle zone day in and day out. "

Sounds like your not teaching either.

[greenbriar]

2. unfortunately that is probably more true than not

but once inside my door, they are mine and all the bullshit stops. OUt side my door, I can't control............

[Iris]

6. Yeah. I know what you mean.

I've been there.

Interestingly enough, I'm getting my master's in library & info science, but that's not the degree you need to have the job Laura had. That requires a teaching certificate. I'll be qualified to work in public libraries and college libraries.

But we all KNOW Laura never worked in a school like the one you are describing.

[RummyTheDummy]

37. Yeah what a wonderful endorsement for public schools

Sounds like you love your job. Not.

[greenbriar]

38. actually I love teaching

I hate babysitting!


before you knock me/it

come fill my shoes.

[Liberal Veteran]

40. Hear! Hear!

I think the BIGGEST problem facing our schools today is the fact that too many parents have decided that schools are there to rear AND educate their children and washed their hands of the responsibility of being an active participant in their child's socialization, behavioral training, and education.

[greenbriar]

43. exactly

and my school is the roughest in our city.


multiple gangs and divisions of each.


I have never witnessed anything like it

[RummyTheDummy]

41. My dad taught in public schools for 35 years

Ive been around teachers all my life inside and outside of the classroom. My wife is a teacher. I know what your shoes are like.

[ulysses]

51. trust me,

it's possible to love a very difficult, frustrating and occasionally dangerous job.

[Blue_Roses]

57. Obviously, you have no idea what

it's like to actually teach inside a school, nevertheless, kids in general. The best teachers are the ones who know when the system isn't working and work anyway 'cause they know it CAN work and DOES. Think about it. Those are the teachers that make public schools a success--not the system.

[politicaholic]

3. Hey, those Sunday school kids can be a hand full.

I wish she would just lose her voice in a cookie baking related accident.

How that happens I have no idea, but anything's possible.

[proud2BlibKansan]

4. You are so right

I teach too.

Most of the librarians I know were teachers who didn't like teaching or weren't very good at it.

[greenbriar]

5. or could not control their classroom

could you imagine her in today's classroom.


first time someone popped off a fuck you nigga she would stroke out

[proud2BlibKansan]

14. Now that is a funny thought

thanks for the laugh.

[loathesomeshrub]

7. Amen

[phish420]

8. Yeah, it really is...Plus, she was a teacher too

for 9 years...we're barking up the wrong tree with this one guys. Trust me.

[greenbriar]

9. bull shit

she was in a school system for 300 days.

that is two years



your colors are showing???

[phish420]

15. Ooohhh...here we go with the....

'rightly defend a republican, you must be becoming one' bullshit.

Ive been through this with lesser people than you many times before.

She was a teacher for 9 years man. Math teacher.

I will slam the hell out of any * at any time AS LONG AS IT IS CORRECT. What you are saying simply is not true, and I will not stoop to the level of the repukes and lie about my opponent. They have enough of a verifiable record to slam them on that I dont have to make shit up. Thank you.


8edit substituted 'verifiable' for 'truthful' - realized that was definately wrong word to use. lol

[greenbriar]

21. prove to me she was a MATH teacher

I don't buy that at all

[senseandsensibility]

23. Math teacher

I have never heard that before. Do you have the link for that and the nine years claim? I am honestly confused about the length of time she taught, but my understanding is that it was two years.

[phish420]

35. Ok...

exactly what kind (I heard math, but all I can find is 'elementary school teacher' in my searches), but every search consistantly says "librarian and elementary school teacher '68-'77"...so its 9 yrs total, not as a teacher...but most accounts put her at 4-5 yrs as a librarian, which leaves 4-5 as an elementary teacher. Then she had 2 rambuncious daughters. All I'm saying is you are all going after the wrong damn person. Going after Laura can only be bad news for us and Kerry. Other than that accident she had in the 70's, which there is no verifiable proof to really hold against her (only circumstantial and heresay), she is pretty spotless, and most of all, very well liked. Don't start a fight with her, its the wrong road to go down right now. Do I personally like her? No. I think she is a phony. I wouldnt be suprised to find out that her entire 'education resume' is bullshit....but I cant prove it...so screw it...leave it alone. Even Theresa said she was wrong. Let it go.

[Eye and Monkey]

29. I'm not sure you're quite correct there.

from the WH bio:

http://www.whitehouse.gov/firstlady/flbio.html

"she earned a bachelor of science degree in education from Southern Methodist University in 1968. She then taught in public schools in Dallas and Houston. In 1973 she earned a master of library science degree from the University of Texas at Austin and worked as a public school librarian in Austin"

Maybe she taught math for a couple years, but clearly not for 9. Maybe she taught and went to grad school at the same time, maybe not.

[Barney Rocks]

19. 364 days is a year--

300 days is not even a year.

[greenbriar]

25. teachers work off of a 186 day contract

librarians get an adendum contract for about 20 extra days

[Barney Rocks]

27. OK---I did

not realize that a year was different.

Thanks for clearing that up.

[CMO]

10. hey now...

My aunt is a public school librarian and she has a degree in elementary education and a masters in education. She is a teacher who works until 5:00 or 6:00 every day and for more of the summer than the regular teachers at her school. She became a librarian because she likes to read and she wanted to share that with the kids. She taught 5th grade for years and was unhappy.

[greenbriar]

11. Just because teachers are not at school working

doesn't mean they aren't working. I was grading tests until 1 am last night.

I don't give multi choice tests. Colleges prefer essay so I do to.
US History...Government


and we DO NOT take summers off contrary to popular rethug belief.

[CMO]

49. Let me expand...

she goes home and works until she goes to bed. I know teachers work hard. I have a family full of them. I think they are under paid and over worked!

[DemFromMem]

13. Now we're attacking school librarians?

Please people.

My mom is an elementary school librarian AND a teacher and I can tell you she's dedicated as can be.

How dumb is this discussion? Teresa apologized for a dumb comment. Laura accepted. Why are we still discussing this? Because Karen Hughes wants to keep spinning. Let's kick her off the dance floor and move on to more important things.

[phish420]

16. No doubt.

[proud2BlibKansan]

18. Your aunt sounds like an exception

I have taught for 25 years and trust me, librarians are the slackers in our business.

[CMO]

22. I assure you

my aunt is not a slacker. I know because when I was growing up and I would visit her during the summer, she would always put me to work helping prepare for something. I don't know about other librarians.

[spooked]

55. School librarians ARE NOT slackers

far from it.

[ant]

12. please

I remember my high school librarian as being one of the few adults I could talk to. She always had good books to recommend, and she was especially good about recommending books that made the outcasts feel a little better about themselves. In fact, it was the teachers who seemed to push the "conform or you'll never amount to anything" sort of thinking.

I'm sure there are lousy librarians out there, just as there are probably lousy teachers, but attacking Laura for being a librarian is absurd. Yeah, she's not a big powerhouse professional woman, and to be perfectly blunt I am the type of person who does not look kindly on stay at home wives and women like that, but your post strikes me as a cheap shot.

After all, you're only a teacher. Low wage woman's work, if I remember correctly. If you're going to judge Laura for being "only" a librarian, I think that I, as a physicist, can certainly judge you for being "only" a teacher. By your own description it sounds like nothing more than babysitting.

(To be clear, I'm NOT judging you that way - just pointing out where your own logic takes us.)

[greenbriar]

17. I am NOT downgrading their intelligence and there are awesome

librarians out there.

I am merely saying that ;...


being a librarian is not teaching. IE lesson plans, classroom control, tests, standards AYP, ect...

[proud2BlibKansan]

24. You are right

I teach special ed elementary and our librarians have to write lesson plans and teach a few classes. But no testing and lots less pressure.

In many high schools, librarians don't even teach classes. No lesson plans, and they don't have to deal with disruptive kids - most of them aren't even allowed in the library!!

It really is a cushy job in a school.

[greenbriar]

28. exactly...that is all I

meant

[ant]

48. exactly

A "cushy" job, it's not nearly as difficult as what I do, she wouldn't last a day in my job, blah, blah, blah.

You can claim the technicality of "it's just not strictly teaching" all you want, but you are very much "downgrading" the work of librarians. I would even take issue with the "not teaching" part in that, as I said, you can reach kids through more than just lesson plans. Just because you write "teacher" in the occupation space doesn't mean you're actually teaching anyone anything. In fact, given what a snob you're being here I kind of worry about what it is you're teaching your students.

The worst part is that you're being a snob and you yourself are just a teacher. It's like working class looking down on the poor. Get over yourself.

Edited to add again, just to be extra clear: I do not personally believe in ranking professions/jobs as the original poster does, I'm merely evaluating him/her according to the standards s/he is setting.

[Longhorn]

20. From her biography

Laura Bush was born on November 4, 1946, in Midland, Texas, to Harold and Jenna Welch. Inspired by her second grade teacher, she earned a bachelor of science degree in education from Southern Methodist University in 1968. She then taught in public schools in Dallas and Houston. In 1973 she earned a master of library science degree from the University of Texas at Austin and worked as a public school librarian in Austin. In 1977 she met and married George Walker Bush.

http://www.whitehouse.gov/firstlady/flbio.html

More:

Laura earned a Bachelor of Science degree in education in 1968 from Southern Methodist University in Dallas. After graduating, she became a schoolteacher at Longfellow Elementary School in Dallas Independent School District until 1969. She then taught at John F. Kennedy Elementary School, a Houston Independent School District school in Houston, until 1972.

Bush earned a Master of Science degree in Library Science in 1973 from the University Texas in Austin. She is the second First Lady (after Hillary Clinton) to hold a post graduate degree. After that, she worked at the Kashmere Gardens Branch at the Houston Public Library, until 1974, when she moved back to Austin. She was a librarian at an Austin Independent School District school, Dawson Elementary School, until 1977.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laura_Bush

[Blue Moon]

26. Bullshit

Bullshit. My wife has a Master's and PhD. She has been an adjunct professor and is now a Librarian for a k-8 institution. She probably knows more about teaching than many of you will ever know. Her current job is a form of teaching at it's very core: helping students to help themselves. Bullshit to your comment.

[greenbriar]

32. all I meant to say was

being a librarian is not teaching. IE lesson plans, classroom control, tests, standards AYP, ect...

I know librarians are valuable WE have a great one at our school


that being said. Being a librarian is DIFFERENT than all the mess teachers have to contend with in the class.


Hell in our battle zone the library is the calmest place

[Nana]

46. Call me crazy..

..but where did we come up with a universal definition of teaching? I'm a middle-school teacher and I don't believe teaching is only defined by gradebooks and lesson plans. It is different, I agree, but it is teaching, none the less. I watched my daughter, who is not a teacher or a librarian, teach my grandson about the candidates today. She was teaching. He made an "informed" decision to vote for Kerry on Channel One.

Today, the librarian at our school, among many other thingsbroke up a fight in the back by the biographies, managed the two while she handled the discipline end of things, and helped one of my guys to find an interesting book to help him challenge his fraction phobia. While she was helping him, she taught him a fraction song to help with division and shared that she struggled with fractions once, too. Then, she helped me order books for a project we were doing and advised me on some great videos to help with motivation for the proejct.

It was a minor comment blown out of proportion by a frenzied media. I don't think it needs to be justified as anything more..and I don't think librarians should get knocked over it or their jobs diminished over it..

[Atman]

30. SHHHHHHHHHH!

.

[omnithrope]

31. pure horseshit.

Sorry.

I learned just as much from librarians than I did from my teachers. I teach at a university, I know it's hard work, but it's hard work for the librarians too. They're just as dedicated as you are.

[omnithrope]

33. Haha. I said "hard work". =)

It made me laugh when I read it.

[TheWebHead]

34. this isn't something we should try to parse

just let it die. Teresa made a mistake, she apologized, and there's no good in throwing gasoline on this nearly extinguished fire.

[iconoclastic cat]

36. Although they have saved my ass on several occasions this quarter.

And please, stpam, do not step into fights to stop them! It's not worth it!

[mediaman007]

39. Perhaps we don't work in the same building/city/state...

as a Media Specialist (aka librarian) I hope that there isn't a broad generalization here.

Media science has come a long way since the 70's. Media specialists in Minnesota are responsible for reference skills, technology and literature, plus integration with the classroom teacher.

As an elementary librarian I provide 75 minutes of prep time to each teacher in my building during the weekly student contact time.

For twenty seven years I was in an elementary classroom. I know that my current job doesn't compare with the intensity of classroom instruction. But knowing that, I support the classroom teachers as much as I can. I am more than happy to co-teach, to edit writing projects and take students that are disruptive in class.

While the Bush* family teacher may have had an easy time of it in her day, I can tell you that the media instructional programs in most colleges are challenging. So the public should know that media personnel in schools do provide a needed service.

In fact, it was librarians who had the courage to stand up to Ashcroft and the Patriot Act. If nothing else, we do defend the Bill of Rights everyday!

[greenbriar]

44. that you do!!!

And again, I in NO way mean to diminish the current librarians of today.


it is just not the same.

Laura bush doesn't face what we face today! NEVER has.


she has bigger rose colored glasses than chimpy does


and I am willing to bet she has had a nanny or two or four to help with those" rowdy" twins

[mediaman007]

47. or a prescription :)

[SammyWinstonJack]

42. Sorry you are in a battle zone day in and day out

Sounds rough. Hats off to you and hang in there! We need good teachers!

[BamaGirl]

45. Hey now, my fave person in my kid's school is the librarian lol

If you saw my "mad as hell" post, I'm sure you understand why. I am not a teacher or a librarian, but I am a parent. Our school librarian is very involved with the kids and the reading programs. She has done more to encourage my daughters' love of books than their teachers as far as I can determine. She is ALWAYS available to kids and parents. I've gone in several times to get recomendations and comments on what my girls are reading. She IS teaching, just not in a conventional way or setting. Since we live in the back of beyond, I am sure she is not an exception! Her husband is the head of the English Dept at the local uni, and she told my kid Clinton was a good president. :D So let's not knock librarians please. There are plenty of other things to criticize Laura on.

[jn2375]

50. Please drop this subject we only feed into the media hype of it

[GoldenOldie]

52. Laura spent more time going to school than she did teaching

Teachers/Librarian whatever she wants to call herself could not have become as accomplished as Rove/Hughes would like all to believe due to the very short time she spent in the actual classroom.

[phish420]

53. Who cares?!?

Thats all that will become of this issue: "Who Cares?!?"
Idiotic point of attack.

[baltodemvet]

54. Please! Let's stay focused on OUR issues--not Rove's! n/t

[spooked]

56. A School Librarian IS A TEACHER

who else teaches students information problem-solving, research skills, technology skills, and a love for books and literature BETTER THAN A SCHOOL LIBRARIAN??