New poll finds that 'large percentages of Bush supporters' are ignorant

[unfrigginreal]

How Americans view Bush and Kerry on foreign policy

New poll of attitudes shows people feel the election is not about the UN vs. 'go it alone,' but whether voters have faith in US actions globally.

By Howard LaFranchi | Staff writer of The Christian Science Monitor

WASHINGTON – Women are from Venus, and men are from Mars - we all know that.

But here's a bit of comforting news: It turns out that Bush and Kerry supporters are not from different planets. Indeed, a new survey of Bush and Kerry supporters finds that both sides support an America that is engaged in world affairs. But the survey also finds that it's perceptions of reality that differ.

It's not so much freedom fries versus French fries or the United Nations versus "go it alone," as it has sometimes seemed. It is more akin to: I have faith in what America is doing in the world under President Bush versus I do not.

"You can almost say that live in separate realities," says Steven Kull of the Program on International Policy Attitudes (PIPA) at the University of Maryland, which carried out the survey.

The most striking differences that the poll finds are on Iraq. Large percentages of Bush supporters continue to believe that Iraq had weapons of mass destruction before the war, and that Iraq was providing substantial support to Al Qaeda. Large percentages of Kerry supporters hold the opposite view. And most Bush supporters believe experts back their views, even after a string of high-profile reports that concluded the contrary.

http://www.csmonitor.com/2004/1022/p03s01-uspo.html

[dave123williams]

1. Ha! Like Bush voters actually read on matters of public record...

They just do as they're told...lockstep.

[Nicholas_J]

27. Yup. they are basically ,mindless zombies

I will actually even state that not only was Saddam no threat to the U.S. that we were safer with Saddam in Iraq than we are now. Irqq was one of the few states in the middle east that had absolutely NO terrorist presence while Hussein was in power.

Also, many of the so called mass graves being presented as evidence of Saddams brutal regime actually predate Saddams reign in Iraq. Some go back as far as the turn of the century during the Ottoman empire. We are being terribly misled in order to try to give some sort of moral imperative for overthrowing Husseins regime.

Every time a Republican administration is in charge of the U.S. there has been enormous effprt to mislead the citizens. Starting with Richard Nixon and Watergate, Rpnald Reagan and Iran Contra as well as BCCI, The first George Bush and their efforts to support the Kuwaitis in their efforts to steal oil from the Iraqi oil fields though slant drilling, and then the political chicanery in which they indicated to Hussein that they would not interfere in anything Hussein did in order to rectify the situation, leading to the first Gulf War, and then finally this administrations doctoring of intelligence in order to justify the current war in Iraq are the clearest indications that Republicans cannot be trusted with control of the Government.

Conservatives, particularly always are found in situations in which they manipulate the fact in order to take whatever actions they have already pre determined they are going to engage in.

One of the first things that is necessary is that the intelligence agencies of the U.S. must be taken out of the control of the executive branch and be placed under the control of Congress, or even be created as an Agency separate from the government entirely, as is the Federal Reserve, so that they can give advice and make decisions independent of the poltics of the White House.

Just as I was typing that, Carl Levin just made a similar statement about the intelligence community operating more like the Federal Reserve.

Anyway, as it was pointed oit on the BBC last night, Bush were running for office in any other nation in the industrialized worldm he could not win, as the U.S and its citizens by and large do not make their political choices on rationality. In essence, the BBC was, in an extremely dry manner was stating that the average American voter, particullarly those supporting Bush, have the intellectual capacity of turnips. Unfortunately it is true. The average Bush supporter can be hustled by talk, that is not backed up by fact.

[dennis4868]

2. Bush supporters' are ignorant

No shit sherlock!

[sandnsea]

3. It's the "R", stupid

They've been trained to hate liberals and worship the "R", so that's what they do. It's that simple.

[NAO]

4. Paper Explains Why Bush Supporters Deny the Obvious

Why Do Bush Supporters Deny the Obvious?
http://www.awakeninthedream.com/bushsupporters.html

[Demit]

5. wow. that's quite a piece!

[NAO]

19. More articles like that one at www.awakeninthedream.com

THE MADNESS OF GEORGE W. BUSH: A REFLECTION OF OUR COLLECTIVE PSYCHOSIS
(long version)
http://www.awakeninthedream.com/georgew.html

THE MADNESS OF GEORGE W. BUSH: A REFLECTION OF OUR COLLECTIVE PSYCHOSIS
(short version)
http://www.awakeninthedream.com/georgews.html

GEORGE BUSH IS A MALIGNANT NARCISSIST
http://www.awakeninthedream.com/bushnarc.html

WHY DO BUSH SUPPORTERS DENY THE OBVIOUS?
http://www.awakeninthedream.com/bushsupporters.html

GEORGE BUSH AND THE DARK FATHER
http://www.awakeninthedream.com/bushfather.html

GEORGE BUSH IS A PALE CRIMINAL
http://www.awakeninthedream.com/palecrim.html

THE BUSH CULT
http://www.awakeninthedream.com/bushcult.html

THE CURRENT WORLD CRISIS, 2004: NIGHTMARE OR WAKING DREAM?
http://www.awakeninthedream.com/wariniraq.html

**********************

All articles can be found at Awaken In the Dream
http://www.awakeninthedream.com/indexx.html

[rullery]

6. Yes, ignorant people identify with Bush

because they recognize him as one of their own! However not all Bush supporters are ignorant. Some are just greedy, and they love his tax cuts for the rich. Then there are those who are like sheep, doing the bidding of their religious leaders. These folks dislike uncertainty, and they prefer a world where all issues are settled by religious doctrine. That way they don't have to bother to think.

What I find appalling is that these groups together make up half of the electorate! This would indicate a major failure of our educational system IMO. We dearly need teachers who will teach our young people to think for themselves! (End of rant)

[arewenotdemo]

7. Flat-Earth faith in the face of all data

to the contrary. Ignoramuses.

[greenman3610]

9. I guess my problem

is that I'm "reality based".

[arewenotdemo]

26. then you might like this, greenman

http://www.churchofreality.org/

[Cocoa]

8. not "separate realities"

dems live in reality, republicans are separate from reality.

[AP]

10. Which is why Repubs won't fund No Child Left Behind and want fewer people

going to college.

[elperromagico]

11. Just like their boy Bush, they live in a fantasy land.

Hard to believe they needed to spend money on a poll to prove that.

[Cha]

12. I could have told them that!

b/c signs on lawns advertise that the people within are ignorant, stupid or greedy.. OR.. all three!

[unfrigginreal]

13. Wow, I just found this article with the actual percentages - Scary

PIPA Study: Bush Supporters Still Believe Iraq Had WMD or Major Program, Supported al Qaeda; Agree with Kerry Supporters Admin. Still Saying this is

Thu Oct 21, 9:09 AM ET




To: National Desk, Political Correspondent

Contact: Steven Kull of Program on International Policy Attitudes, 202-232-7500

COLLEGE PARK, Md., Oct. 21 /U.S. Newswire/ -- Despite Duelfer's report saying Iraq (news - web sites) did not have a significant WMD program, 72 percent of Bush supporters continue to believe that Iraq had actual WMD (47 percent) or a major program (25 percent). Similarly, Bush supporters believe that Iraq was supporting al Qaeda (75 percent), and believe clear evidence of this support has been found (63 percent). Most Kerry supporters have exactly opposite perceptions.

These are the findings of a new study conducted by the Program on International Policy Attitudes and Knowledge Networks, based on polls conducted October 12-18 and September 3-7 and 8-12 of 968, 798 and 959 respondents, respectively.

Steven Kull, PIPA director, comments, "One reason Bush supporters have these beliefs is that they perceive the Bush administration confirming them. Interestingly, this is a point on which Bush and Kerry supporters agree." Eighty-two percent of Bush supporters perceive the administration as saying that Iraq had WMD (63 percent) or a major WMD program (19 percent). Likewise, 75 percent say that the Bush administration is saying Iraq was providing substantial support to al Qaeda. Equal majorities of Kerry supporters hear the same.

Kull adds, "Another reason that Bush supporters may hold to these beliefs is that they have not accepted the idea that it does not matter whether Iraq had WMD or supported al Qaeda." Asked whether the US should have gone to war with Iraq if US intelligence had concluded that Iraq was not making WMD or providing support to al Qaeda, 58 percent of Bush supporters said the US should not have.

Bush supporters ignore dissonant information in other political realms. Only 31 percent of Bush supporters recognize that the majority of people in the world oppose the US war with Iraq. Among Kerry supporters, 74 percent believe the majority of the world is opposed.

http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/usnw/20041021/pl_usnw/pipa_study__bush_supporters_still_believe_iraq_had_wmd_or_major_program__supported_al_qaeda__agree_with_kerry_supporters_admin_

[doubleplusgood]

14. rate this a 5 on Yahoo

n/t

[gcomeau]

17. Just did...

...and put in comment #2 as well. :)

-Grant

[Nicholas_J]

15. Yes, I find myself very embarassed at being an American when I note

how incredibly misinformed the supporters of George Bush are.
Listening to them talk about things like the women in IRAQ can now get an education and dont have to wear veils and be covered up is another indications of how totally ignorant these fools are. In Iraq, there was a true no child left behind, as all children, male or female were entitled to free education through whatever university level they wanted to get through. Also larger percentages of women were doctors,lawyers, scientists, engineers, and other educations requiring higher education. CLose to 50 percent of the people ikin these positions were women.
And Iraq was the most technologically advanced nation in the middle east and the most cokpletely secular. The idea that Hussein was financing Al Qaeda is the most laughable, as Iraq was in the top five middle eastern governments targetted to to be overthrown by Al Qaeda, to establish a fundamentalist government to replace the Baathist government of Hussein. In fact, Hussein was considered even worse than Bush and hiscrimes considered worsse than Bush's. Bus is merely considered and infidel, and an ignorant infidel, but in many speeches, bin Laden referred to Hussein as an apostate and demanded that all good Muslims must attempt to apply Islamic punishment for apostasy to Hussein. That punishment is death, by the most unmerciful methods possible.

It is the obligation of all Muslims to put anyone who is guilty of apostasy to death.
Saddam was not very likely to finance his own execution.

One of the reason that America is losing jobs yo outsourcing is that many of its citizens are too stupid to be tolerated by most employers.

[donco6]

20. They get Iraq confused with Afghanistan

And the Taliban confused with Al Qaeda. They just have no fricking clue about how the rest of the world lives.

[liberal N proud]

16. We did not need a poll to figure that one out!

Any one who claims to be a bush supporter wears their ignorance on their face!

[gcomeau]

18. But we DID need a poll...

...to hold in front of the media and say "See!?!?!? Look how miserably you're failing to educate people on the reality of the situation! Now do your job!"

I just sent e-mails to about 60 or 70 people on the National media list (in far more polite and respectful terms than that) pointing out the results of this study and suggesting that they might want to use it to begin correcting some widespread misconceptions... as is their responsibility as journalists after all.

And I've been TRYING to get other people to do the same.

Nudge... nudge...

-Grant

[tom_paine]

21. No duh. Next thing you know you'll be telling me Hitler supporters were

ignorant.

:dunce:

[Czolgosz]

22. Here's another report of the same story

Bush Supporters Believe (1) Iraq Had WMD or Major Program, (2)
Iraq Supported al Qaeda, (3) the World Public is Not Opposed to Iraq War

See The Program on International Policy Analysis at University of Maryland

http://www.pipa.org/OnlineReports/Pres_Election_04/html/new_10_21_04.html#1

. . . 72% of Bush supporters continue to believe that Iraq had actual WMD (47%) or a major program for developing them (25%). Fifty-six percent assume that most experts believe Iraq had actual WMD and 57% also assume, incorrectly, that Duelfer concluded Iraq had at least a major WMD program. . . . 75% of Bush supporters continue to believe that Iraq was providing substantial support to al Qaeda, and 63% believe that clear evidence of this support has been found. Sixty percent of Bush supporters assume that this is also the conclusion of most experts, and 55% assume, incorrectly, that this was the conclusion of the 9/11 Commission. . . . Eighty-two percent of Bush supporters perceive the Bush administration as saying that Iraq had WMD (63%) or that Iraq had a major WMD program (19%). Likewise, 75% say that the Bush administration is saying Iraq was providing substantial support to al Qaeda. Equally large majorities of Kerry supporters hear the Bush administration expressing these views--73% say the Bush administration is saying Iraq had WMD (11% a major program) and 74% that Iraq was substantially supporting al Qaeda. . . . Asked whether the US should have gone to war with Iraq if US intelligence had concluded that Iraq was not making WMD or providing support to al Qaeda, 58% of Bush supporters said the US should not have, and 61% assume that in this case the President would not have. Kull continues, "To support the president and to accept that he took the US to war based on mistaken assumptions likely creates substantial cognitive dissonance, and leads Bush supporters to suppress awareness of unsettling information about prewar Iraq."

This tendency of Bush supporters to ignore dissonant information extends to other realms as well. Despite an abundance of evidence--including polls conducted by Gallup International in 38 countries, and more recently by a consortium of leading newspapers in 10 major countries--only 31% of Bush supporters recognize that the majority of people in the world oppose the US having gone to war with Iraq. Forty-two percent assume that views are evenly divided, and 26% assume that the majority approves. . . . 57% of Bush supporters assume that the majority of people in the world would favor Bush's reelection; 33% assumed that views are evenly divided and only 9% assumed that Kerry would be preferred. A recent poll by GlobeScan and PIPA of 35 of the major countries around the world found that in 30, a majority or plurality favored Kerry, while in just 3 Bush was favored. On average, Kerry was preferred more than two to one.

Bush supporters also have numerous misperceptions about Bush's international policy positions. Majorities incorrectly assume that Bush supports multilateral approaches to various international issues--the Comprehensive Test Ban Treaty (69%), the treaty banning land mines (72%)--and for addressing the problem of global warming: 51% incorrectly assume he favors US participation in the Kyoto treaty. After he denounced the International Criminal Court in the debates, the perception that he favored it dropped from 66%, but still 53% continue to believe that he favors it. An overwhelming 74% incorrectly assumes that he favors including labor and environmental standards in trade agreements. In all these cases, majorities of Bush supporters favor the positions they impute to Bush. Kerry supporters are much more accurate in their perceptions of his positions on these issues.

. . .

For more information on the PIPA poll see:
Report of Findings http://www.pipa.org/OnlineReports/Pres_Election_04/Report10_21_04.pdf

[Nordic]

24. I'm telling you, it's a form of mental illness

that they have.

They are living in their own fantasy land.

[LVdem]

23. Boy, that's surprising...nt

[MrSlayer]

25. It's willful ignorance.

They simply do not want to see reality because it ruins their image of Chimperooni as some kind of macho man hero. No one likes to admit they've been duped.