NYT: Bush had higher IQ than Kerry

[quaoar]

What the reporter obviously missed is that the person with the high IQ is the person that Bush paid to take the SAT for him.

http://www.nytimes.com/2004/10/24/politics/campaign/24points.html?oref=login&oref=login&oref=login

Secret Weapon for Bush?
By JOHN TIERNEY

Published: October 24, 2004

To Bush-bashers, it may be the most infuriating revelation yet from the military records of the two presidential candidates: the young George W. Bush probably had a higher I.Q. than did the young John Kerry.

That, at least, is the conclusion of Steve Sailer, a conservative columnist at the Web magazine Vdare.com and a veteran student of presidential I.Q.'s. During the last presidential campaign Mr. Sailer estimated from Mr. Bush's SAT score (1206) that his I.Q. was in the mid-120's, about 10 points lower than Al Gore's.

Mr. Kerry's SAT score is not known, but now Mr. Sailer has done a comparison of the intelligence tests in the candidates' military records. They are not formal I.Q. tests, but Mr. Sailer says they are similar enough to make reasonable extrapolations.

Mr. Bush's score on the Air Force Officer Qualifying Test at age 22 again suggests that his I.Q was the mid-120's, putting Mr. Bush in about the 95th percentile of the population, according to Mr. Sailer. Mr. Kerry's I.Q. was about 120, in the 91st percentile, according to Mr. Sailer's extrapolation of his score at age 22 on the Navy Officer Qualification Test.

[JuniorPlankton]

1. How scientific and unbiased!

Idiot

:mad:

[elehhhhna]

30. Correction: Bush Higher IQ Than Mariah Carey. Sorry.

[Nederland]

37. Hey!

Don't insult Mariah Carey like that.

[geek tragedy]

Vdare.com is banned at THE FREE REPUBLIC

It is a bunch of "gentleman" racists who make Pat Buchanan look like Maya Angelou.

[quaoar]

5. That's interesting

I've never heard of Vdare. I wonder if the NYT reporter is aware of that. Maybe he got suckered by them.

The NYT reporter also quoted this supposed expert:

"Linda Gottfredson, an I.Q. expert at the University of Delaware, called it a creditable analysis said she was not surprised at the results or that so many people had assumed that Mr. Kerry was smarter. "People will often be misled into thinking someone is brighter if he says something complicated they can't understand," Professor Gottfredson said."

Don't know if she is any more credible.

[progdonkey]

42. holy shit! check this out...

http://interversity.org/lists/arn-l/archives/Oct2001/msg00615.html

The Pioneer Fund has been involved in the history of race science since its establishment in 1937. One of
its founders, Harry Laughlin wrote a model sterilization law widely used in both the United States and
Europe. Many of the key academic racists in both Right Now! and American Renaissance have been
funded by the Pioneer and the Pioneer was directly involved in funding the parent organization of American Renaissance, the New Century Foundation. Indeed, most of the leading Anglo-American
academic race-scientists of the last several decades have been funded by the Pioneer, including William Shockley, Hans J. Eysenck, Arthur Jensen, Roger Pearson, Richard Lynn, J. Philippe Rushton, R. Travis Osborne, Linda Gottfredson, Robert A. Gordon, Daniel R. Vining, Jr., Michael Levin, and Seymour Itzkoff - all cited in The Bell Curve.

[quaoar]

24. Wow. Sailer is really out there

I just googled it and found this at the Southern Poverty Law Center site:

http://www.splcenter.org/intel/intelreport/article.jsp?sid=96

"It's radically unfashionable to call homosexuality a disease," Sailer noted this August on VDARE.com (see Keeping America White). But that doesn't stop Sailer, who fashions himself a bold thinker willing to confront taboo subjects.

The personal Web site maintained by the man behind the Human Biodiversity Institute, www.isteve.com, provides a different window into Sailer's way of thinking.

The site is dominated by crude racial and gender stereotypes as Sailer mocks professional golfer Annika Sorenstam for her muscles, claims that Asian men have a hard time finding dates because they look "less masculine" than other men.

Salier also invokes the spirit of his friend Bailey when he claims to have found the real reason Al Gore lost the 2000 presidential election. He chalks it all up to a lisp that makes the former vice president "sound prim, even homosexual."


Why would the NYT quote this guy on anything, much less base a story on his information? This is just incredible.

[charlyvi]

2. Was this before or after

alcohol and drugs fried his little gray cells?

LOL

[auburngrad82]

3. What a total crock of shit

No one can tell me that Bush is even in the top 50 percentile as far as intelligence. I cannot think of a president that was as stupid as this man.

[noonwitch]

19. A person can have a high IQ and absolutely no common sense

IQ tests don't really tell you as much as you might think. They help determine strengths and weaknesses, determine special education needs, and determine exceptional aptitudes.

In this case, both candidates scored in the 120s, which is high-average. I scored in the same range. I am willing to say that I would not be a good president, but I would never base that statement on the results of a test I took over 20 years ago when I was in high school.

[nickinSTL]

4. b/s

n/t

[HFishbine]

6. It's as if reality no longer exists

"Mr. Bush's score on the Air Force Officer Qualifying Test at age 22 again suggests that his I.Q was the mid-120's..." (from above)

Really? Then most of those taking the test must have been freakin' Einsteins...

"Bush took the Air Force officer and pilot qualification tests on January 17, 1968. He scored 25%, the lowest possible passing grade on the pilot aptitude portion."

http://democrats.com/display.cfm?id=154

[Wickerman]

15. Most USAF air crew have IQ's around 120

If Bush* scored in the 25th percentile he most likely fell in the 100-105 range.

I did a lot of IQ testing in the military and later worked on IQ test development - Bush* in no way resembles a man with an IQ exceeding 120.

[Carni]

31. Yes exactly!

The 25th percentile doesn't translate into an IQ in the mid 120's range--this guy is full of crap.

[GoSolar]

7. This is crap.

* is a joke.

[Philostopher]

8. It ain't the size of the boat you float ...

it's the motion of the ocean.

IQ tests are only a measure of your raw ability to take the test, and your comparison against (what some say are culturally-biased or racist) measures of knowledge.

[rogerashton]

9. "Stupid is as stupid does."

"Buttocks, sir."

[JusticeForAll]

10. 1206? Is that a valid score?!?

Not when I took the test...scores were in increments of ten. Did ETS have a different scoring system when * cheated on his exam?

[quaoar]

12. I'm wondering now

if someone pulled a con job on the New York Times.

[JusticeForAll]

16. I took the test 20 years after * supposedly did

Their standards, scoring and other stuff may have changed...I'll keep an open mind.

[quaoar]

18. But the story also claims

that Bush was probably smarter than Kerry and the only source for that is this RW Vdare columnist.

Has anyone ever seen any test scores for Kerry?

[aden_nak]

29. SATs are graded in incriments of 10. That's correct.

I don't know for certain that it's ALWAYS been that way, though. I would also like to point out that the SAT has a very specific purpose, as stated by ETS (the company that administers it). They claim that it is an indicator of which students will perform the best during their first semester of college. Now for some facts:

1) Students that score highest on the SATs: Older Males

2) Students that perform best in their first semester of college: Younger Females

[w13rd0]

11. I respect Al Gore a great deal...

...but this is a crock of shit. I'm supposed to be more intelligent than all of them, but I live in a small apartment and scrape by in the Bush economy. Pffft... Ability to "take a test" does not make for wisdom. ON EDIT: My respect for Al Gore has little or nothing to do with the rest of the statement. See, point demonstrated ;)

[EmperorHasNoClothes]

13. I got 1280 - does that mean I can be president?

Woo-hoo! I'm smarter than the most powerful man in the world!

[WI_DEM]

14. I generally don't trust IQ tests anyway

and this gives me further reason not to.

[stray cat]

17. Talk about not living up to your potential

If he didn't pay someone to take the test, Bush is a perfect example of someone who wasted his potential by not bothering to apply himself to anything productive. A high IQ doesn't mean you can't be an aimless, drunken, fratboy.

[seabeyond]

22. the best of schools, he didnt take advantage of them

higher iq (on assumptions) and he refuses to think, with pride. to avoid being a fancy pant elitist

[Inland]

20. Pre-drunk, pre-coke abuse scores don't count anyway.

[maine_raptor]

21. Old Saying: Use it or Loose it............It Applies to Bush

[AnnInLa]

23. Hmmm, let's see...he tried to get into law school,

but his college grades were so poor, they turned him down....even with poppy's influence. Stupid is and stupid does.

[CBHagman]

25. Would John Tierney jump off the George Washington Bridge...

...if Vdare.com told him too? Talk about gullible!

[EndElectoral]

26. Wow..it was so evident in the First Debate...NOT!!!

[spanone]

27. The closer the elections, the deeper the shit.

Bwhahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha.............

[ekwhite]

28. re: NYT " Bush had a higher IQ than Kerry"

Of course that was BEFORE Bush fried his brain with alcohol and cocaine. Also, keep in mind that you can be a fanatic and still have a high IQ. Trust me, I've met more than a few jerks at Mensa meetings...

[quaoar]

32. I just sent an email to the NYT public editor

Dear Mr. Okrent,

I am writing regarding this story that appeared Sunday on the NYT website:
http://www.nytimes.com/2004/10/24/politics/campaign/24points.html?oref=login&oref=login&oref=login

The lead item about Bush probably having a higher IQ than John Kerry bases this comment on an analysis by Steve Sailer of Vdare.com, whom Mr. Tierney identifies as a conservative columnist.

Well, it seems that Mr. Sailer is more than that. I direct your attention to the Southern Poverty Law Center's findings that Vdare is a radical and racist organization:
http://www.splcenter.org/intel/intelreport/article.jsp?sid=96

The article makes the claim that Bush's IQ was probably higher than Kerry's but offers nothing to back that up other than Mr. Sailer's assertion. No test scores for Kerry are ever quoted.

At the very least, Mr. Tierney should have identified Sailer better than as a "conservative columnist." His radical views should have been noted so that readers can better judge his credibility.

Thank you for your time.

[opstachuck]

33. i don't even think republicans would believe that n/t

[mcg]

34. Yea, right, don't believe your eyes and ears.

[Bad Thoughts]

35. OK, Let's submit both men to psych tests ...

In order to see who has the mental capacity to lead. I have no fear that * will be considered damaged goods, his high IQ lost in a blast of cocaine, his reason clouded by dimentia.

[Homerr]

36. Bush IQ after years of cocaine abuse? 95.....90......?

[gauguin57]

38. They brought up the SATs in the 2000 election.

Newspaper reports at the time said Bush's were slightly higher than Gore's -- and I do remember hearing that Bush's were in the 1200s somewhere -- because I remember being stunned and skeptical.

But now I've been looking at old tapes of interviews with Bush, long before he ran for president, and he didn't seem nearly as stupid then as he is now. I do think something has gone amiss in his brain wiring (booze and drugs?) since he was younger. He may have had some basic smarts at one time, but squandered them on partying and not studying.

He may have taken the tests more than once, too ... I improved my score more than 100 points by taking the SATs again.

[real democrat]

39. Must be another GWB somwehere

If you are referring to "little tree 43".. No way....

[baldguy]

40. Its not the capacity that matters, its the software.

If this is true (I don't think so) the Bush is playing Pong on a Cray X1.

[Mr_Spock]

41. Souldn't have even posted this crap - some rightwingers extrapolation?

Gimme a fucking break.

[quaoar]

44. Well, it's already made it halway around the world

So ignore it if you like, but it's getting picked up:

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/articleshow/898432.cms

[Mayberry Machiavelli]

43. If this is true, it is the most conclusive proof that cocaine is the great

equalizer...