OHIO STOLEN--------NEGATIVE 25,000 votes

[AnIndependentTexan]

http://www.gnn.tv/users/user.php?id=46

looking over the edge

OHIO STOLEN
2004-11-03 16:26:30

Greg Palast and Randi Rhodes reported today that the state of Ohio was stolen by the Republicans in election 2004. Ohio was the critical state that tipped the balance, giving the presidency to Bush.

Turns out one county in Ohio, equipped with electronic voting machines, reported NEGATIVE 25,000 votes.

[sub.theory]

1. Oh. Wow.

We gotta get this verified. If this is true...........oh, man.

[leftofthedial]

2. whaddya think?

I think this election was far more crooked than 2000.

I think the systematic fraud approaches 20%

[shelley806]

9. "systematic fraud approaches 20%" Agree. n/t

[pabloseb]

3. I don't think this is serious...

Fraud it may be, but reporting -25,000 in a county? Not realistic.

[Robeson]

4. If this is true...

...then this is exactly why Kerry should have fought the outcome. By fighting the outcome, it would have bought him TIME to uncover irregularities in the voting system. It was my assumption, he would have known that. Guess I was wrong.

[Awsi Dooger]

5. But who were those negative 25,000 votes for?

In this case, we hope they're all for Bush

[AnIndependentTexan]

6. Gee who do you think they are for Kerry of course

That’s what at least one election official in Ohio said. The votes from that County are lost. Not counted. GONE!

[Heath.Hunnicutt]

7. CNN shows all Ohio counties accounted for, reporting 100%

No -25k, nothing that looks totally crazy like that.

[dbt]

26. Of COURSE CNN reports that way.

They have had their lips firmly planted on bu$h's ass for better than four years now, doing their best to ignore anything that could possibly, remotely be negative about Fearless Leader.

Why are there so many conspiracy theories? Because there are so many conspiracies.

:argh:
dbt
(Kill your TV before it kills you.)

[ComerPerro]

8. Even if it were true, I can hear the right wing talking points now

"So what if 25 thousand negative votes were reported. It doesn't matter. Bush won Ohio by much more that that, so it doesn't matter anyway!"

[m berst]

23. no

Evidence of fraud anywhere raises questions everywhere.

[AnIndependentTexan]

10. Remember this picture that people have forgot

http://americablog.blogspot.com/archives/2004_10_31_americablog_archive.html#109946880458828314

by John in DC - 11/3/2004 02:56:47 AM

I just received a photo a Cincinnati poll manager took this evening, and it seems to be proof of some fishy actions with ballots in Ohio. Bottom line: Note the already-voted-with ballots in the back of the truck with the Bush-Cheney sticker in the back window. Does this prove fraud? Well, it certainly doesn't look good in a state that's already had lots of problems this election.

[Awsi Dooger]

18. I can't believe they allow one person to supervise ballots or machines

Or registrations or anything election related. There should be a law that someone from each party is present when machines or ballots are transported.

[shelley806]

11. This is how Rove wins; by systematic fraud; a few counties here a few

there; in this case, it's the whole United States of America. Diebold Cheating machines...they have been working on it for years...

People did not turn out in record numbers to support a liar and criminal...No Way...We have been screwed again!!!

[leftofthedial]

13. they have a 30-year head start on us

in this cold civil war

this was a devastating loss

we just lost the supreme court for a generation

thousands, even hundreds of thousands more people will die in the next 4 years of permanent war

[Joefess]

12. Let's say..

Let's say this is true. By Kerry conceding it doesn't totally stop all investigations/litigation does it? I thought it just put up a big fucking road block to make the investigations into fraud a little harder.

[leftofthedial]

14. hard to say what a federal judge would rule in any particular case

with Kerry's concession, he no longer would have standing in a lawsuit, or at least it would be more complicated.

[Roland99]

15. Concessions are not legally binding.

[leftofthedial]

32. it can't change the official outcome, but

it could have a bearing on any outcome that ends up challenged in court. Kerry's standing in any resulting lawsuit could be at question, depending on the circumstances of the lawsuit.

[LTRS]

16. Did anyone actually hear her show? I did!

She was talking about a county in Florida in the 2002 election. The first year the electronic machines were used. At least that is what it sounded like to me. She gets a bit wound up at times, ya know (which I actually love).

Don't believe everything you read on the internet.

[Swamp Rat]

17. This is not over

[freedomburn]

19. Must see video on electronic voting

http://www.archive.org/stream/VotergateTheMovie/votergatethemovie_256kb.mp4


Votergate the Movie



freedomburns

[lockdown]

20. Races where Kerry had 0 votes and third parties had thousands

I can't find the threads, but there were posts here with links to early tallies that showed a healthy percentage of the total counted, yet Kerry had ZERO votes and various third party candidates had thousands of votes! They quickly changed but some people had grabbed screenshots I'm sure, also sure that at least one of them was in Ohio. Anyone?

There are other irregularities cited in this article, not least in Florida:

A non-partisan coalition monitoring problems at polling sites has reported failures of electronic voting machines around the United States - some of which recorded touch screen votes for candidates voters had not selected. While errors were resolved in the cases brought to the attention of poll watchers, many voters remain uncertain whether their proper vote was cast in a bitterly contested election in which President George Bush has claimed victory.

"A number of people who thought they were voting for Kerry, when the screen came up it showed they were voting for Bush," said Cindy Cohn, legal director for the Electronic Frontier Foundation (EFF) which is a member of the coalition. "We've seen it across several voting systems, not just one machine."

snip

Because of the 2000 election meltdown in Florida, election watchers closely monitored polling places in that state. Matt Zimmerman, an EFF voting attorney in Miami, Florida said there have been multiple reports of voting machine problems in Florida where incorrect candidates had been selected by e-voting machines and voters had problems going back and changing their votes. He said most of these malfunctions occurred with the Sequoia Edge machine in Palm Beach County were voters were presented with preselected choices on the entire electronic ballot which were often skewed away from Democratic candidates.

http://www.counterpunch.org/harrison11032004.html

[highplainsdem]

31. Lucas and Hamilton County in Ohio

This happened when the results were appearing on the Ohio state website. I saw it happen (though someone else spotted it first), and posted in that thread.

Lucas County showed 0 votes for Kerry, but several thousand votes for the Green Party candidate, who was getting 0 votes in other counties EXCEPT Hamilton County, where he mysteriously had exactly as many votes as Kerry.

That was a long thread, with the words "Lucas County" in the subject line. I don't know if anyone will be able to find it by searching, though. I think the archives failed to save a lot of threads on Election Night, because the next day when the "My Posts" feature returned, my posts from early on Election Day and the next morning were there, but none of the Election Night posts (and I read a message somewhere else suggesting a lot of those threads disappeared).

That thread contained screen saves of the website, too, showing those results.

Which were only temporary. After a lot of messages were posted here about this outrage, with some people saying they were contacting the media and the DNC, suddenly those counties were corrected. All the votes for the Green candidate were reassigned to Kerry in Lucas County. And in Hamilton County, all the votes for the Green candidate simply disappeared -- more than 30,000 of them -- without being reassigned to Kerry.

I don't know what happened, but it looked very suspicious, and I didn't see any similar "glitches" with Bush's votes. It reminded me entirely too much of what I'd read about obscure third-party candidates with no chance of winning getting bizarrely high numbers of votes when Schwarzenegger ran for governor of CA.

[brettdale]

21. Mass mail the media

Should we mass email the media with this story?????

[Ladyhawk]

22. Kick it!

:kick:

[LiberalPersona]

24. Even if they stole it

That's sadly irrelevant now, since Kerry conceded.
Now why did they urge him to concede, hmmm.... Oh right, because they wanted him to do so before we caught them red-handed.

[Roland99]

25. The concession is not binding...if the votes turn up, Kerry would be Pres

[OneTwentyoNine]

27. Ok,so which Ohio county is it??

Just saying "A county in Ohio" doesn't mean shit,it could be a county that goes mostly Republican...meaning what,they screwed themselves??

I'd like to know which county and how the vote usually swings,I think Palast should have included that in his article. Last I heard about 70% of all votes in Ohio were on paper,not BBV. Correct me if I'm wrong and also find out which county the 25K votes disappeared in.

David

[edhopper]

28. How they stole it

I've posted this elsewhere, but this is my take;
I figured out how Karl Rove & Co. took the election. I realize this is paranoid speculation, but it is also not outside the realm of possibility. Take a state like Ohio. You have a very close race, the Democrats out register the Republicans by 10 to 1 and the early exit polling showed a lead for Kerry. But Bush won. How? In Ohio you have a Republican Secretary of State and Governor who seem willing to do whatever it takes to effect the vote. You also have generous voter residency and registration requirements. And you have Deibold voting machines that don't use paper ballots and can be manipulated.
So if your Karl Rove, you do a few things. First you register a bunch of bogus new voters. But you register them as Democrats. This way no one questions the names. (Why would the Democrats question new Democratic registration?) You do this in very Republican counties where you can find good, God fearing election officials to help. And you use the new Deibold machines that don't need actual people to cast a vote. (ballot box stuffing by software) Come election day you have these "new Democratic voters" cast their vote for Bush. But to pull it off you have to keep it hidden. You use slight-of-hand distraction to keep everyone looking elsewhere. So you hire thousands of poll watchers and lawyers to go into the heavily Democratic urban precincts to suppress the vote. This takes all the resources of the Democrats, and leaves your ballot stuffing activities free from scrutiny. And if you stop some Kerry voters along the way, so much the better.
I have nothing to back this up but my sense that the voting in Ohio just didn't add up. I don't have a good enough knowledge of Ohio or the statistical resources and data to check this out. But it can be done. If some one would to look at some of those "red" counties that had a very heavy voter turnout and went mostly for Bush, and also had larger new voter registration. It would not have taken much to tip the scales. And let's face it, not beyond what Rove is capable of. This is also a scenario that could work equally well in Florida, where you have the same criteria and where the "red" counties overcame the voting in the "blue" counties. Even though the early voting had given Kerry an 8 to 10 % lead.
If I can come up with this plan, the "Boy Genius" would certainly be able to.

[theboss]

29. Naming the county would help

The article reads this way, "Some guy told someone that someone in the State told him that some county had negative votes."

That's three hearsay statements of a vague accusation.

[Amaya]

30. Not Surprised

one fucking bit. Of course they were gonna steal it.