How much did the Mary Cheney flap hurt?

[liberalpragmatist]

I find it absurd that this statement was so controversial, and at the time I didn't think it would have a major effect. But I wonder now.

First of all, the media latched onto it. It became the story for 2 or 3 days afterward and killed Kerry's momentum coming out of the 3rd debate. I've talked to people who said that many conservative swing voters were (illogically) turned off by the comment. The fact that it called attention to gay rights and Kerry and the fact that to some it seemed insensitive may have played a role in mobilizing evangelicals.

Now, to be honest, I don't think it was decisive. But I think it's possible it was. This was a close race. Either side could've won; they beat us in turnout. So it's not inconceivable that something like this hurt.

[Azure]

1. It hurt.

And for exactly the reasons you stated.

The comment shouldn't have mattered, but I think we all knew it would.

[davepc]

2. The campaign realized what was happening too late

That statement was a band-aid on a severed leg.

[NewYorkerfromMass]

3. They (KE) should have gone full bore and ran it to the max.

Once it became apparent they (BC) were going to try to use it against them, they should have screwed them to the wall with it and highlighted their hypocrisy. The whole Coors gay liason thing was just ridiculous. And Cheney himself had mentioned Mary at one time or another.

They did lose that spin war, as minor as it seemed, but it could have been used to cut into their fundie base turnout.

[gauguin57]

14. AND made the point Lynne Cheney was willing to make money off lesbian

soft-core romance novel she wrote in 1981, but then gets on her high horse about a comment, sensitively made, but pointing out the Bush admin's hypocrisy about the gay issue.

Why wasn't "Sisters" splashed all over the media? I found one mention of it ... in Frank Rich's column. We all knew about it. I wrote to CNN and MSNBC about it ... nobody touched it!

[liberalpragmatist]

4. kicking this

:kick:

[devilgrrl]

5. It didn't hurt anybody but Mary Cheney - now she can't marry in 11 states.

Guess she likes being treated like a second class citizen.

On edit:

A clarification is in order. What I'm saying is that the comment didn't hurt Kerry. However, the Rovian anti-gay measures that passed in 11 states sure hurt Mary Cheney. Irony.

[2Design]

6. kerry was kind - her parents weren't kind to their daughter

to ignore the fact that cheney has a gay daughter would have been ridiculous and with the question - it was a perfect answer -
are you born gay?
or do you choose gay?

cheney family didn't like that kerry accept she was born gay

that is rw bs and I for one am glad kerry was willing to step up to the plate on that one

so many times people felt kerry didn't fight or stand for anything - yet when he did and does - he is chopped up too

the rw didn't like it because it did not fit their notion of choice in being gay versus born that way

the cheney's and the right are the ones who acted unchristian like in not accepting god's gift of this women to the world as she was

[liberalpragmatist]

7. I'm not debating the truth of what Kerry said

Kerry, in my opinion, said nothing offensive. My question is, was it politically smart? I'm leaning towards no. Kerry was totally right, but it galvanized the right and became a media sensation. I think it blunted his momentum out of the last debate, and pushed the gay marriage and gay rights issue even more, galvanising opponents.

[LisaL]

10. There was no point of saying Mary Cheney is gay.

But I don't think that is what cost us the election.

[2Design]

11. kerry's ability to be truthful is what appeal to me - just like teresa

I liked her and her outspoken ways -

the rw would not vote for kerry even if he was the only one on the ballot - accept that -

[Democat]

8. The media picked up a right wing radio talking point and ran with it

We need our own alternative to Fox that reaches all of America.

[LynnTheDem]

9. It helped.

That's why the bush cartel panicked the way they did. Rove had already planned long before then to use gay marriage as the winning ticket.

Kerry reminding the USA that the VPs own daughter is gay could really have fcked up rover's plans.

And that's why the Cartel went nuts with their fake HOW DARE YOU HOW COULD YOU USE OUR DAUGHTER FOR PARTISAN POLITICS, especially mummy cheney. Who then went on to USE HER GRANDDAUGHTER for partisan politics.

Kerry should have pushed it further, but like most Dems, he was polite and considerate about it, and gave rightwingnuts credit for attributes they DON'T HAVE.

[andym]

16. There was right wing panic

They were probably afraid it would cut into their carefully cultivated anti=gay marriage support. So they used the flap to convince their supporters how embarassed the Cheneys' were about their daughter and at the same time made Kerry seem less a gentleman, which would hurt him with many traditional voters.

[milkyway]

12. It hurt a lot. One reason Dean lost Iowa was that he was seen as not

being a "nice" man. He had gotten snippy with the media for a moment, and people started turning against him.

The Mary Cheney remark did the same to Kerry. A lot of middle Americans thought it was a mean thing to do, and they turned on Kerry. Don't ask me why repugs can be the nastiest, most vulgar pigs in the world and not be held accountable by these same people that turned against Kerry. I suppose it's because as long as you're seen as one of "them," they will have blind faith that you're just being persecuted by the media.

[chimp chump]

13. I don't think it changed more than a handful of votes.

You might notice that following Kerry's remark and the minor media flap over it, Bush responded to Kerry about a week later by saying he thought that the gay marriage issue belonged largely to the states.

I'm not sure how so many people seem to have missed that. Bush essentially told his voters that he didn't really care to press for defense of marriage legislation or a constitutional amendment. So the GOP is not going to go whole-hog on the anti-gay marriage thing and there is considerable infighting even after all these years over the pro-life faction within the GOP.

So despite the media flap, Kerry's strategy actually moved Bush toward Kerry's position on the issue. Notably, it was one of the few instances where Kerry succeeded to this extent.

Call it a bit clumsy if you will but as a strategy, it's not clear that it was a failure.

[pk_du]

15. The only folks who played on this were the Librul media + FAUX

such a non-fucking issue - got a full 5-6 days of coverage while guys are dying in Iraq....just like the "te-rah-sa/Lau-rah real job shit"....fuck me , I expect it from FAUX but the rest of the pack followed to the point of Phsyofancy (sp)