Donna Brazile spread the Kerry finance story and is good friends with Rove

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

"They're doing this now because they're being forced to, not because they want to," said Democratic consultant Donna Brazile, the most vocal critic of Kerry's spending. "They still don't have a defense for why they hung on to the money."


Donna Brazile..who is about the MOST ineffective talking head on cable news and who also HAPPENS to be good friends with KKKarl Rove turns out to be the mouthpiece behind the "Kerry surplus campaign funds" story. Is that NOT cause for alarm?

I don't recall her raising a fuss when Al Gore had a surplus after HER failed management of HIS campaign.

I find this rather interesting.....

[DoveTurnedHawk]

1. I Can't Stand Brazile

I cannot believe some were seriously advocating for her to become DNC Chair.

That said, I do have a big problem with the leftover money.

DTH

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

3. well apparent;ly she's advocating herself by taking a chunk out of Kerry

[blondeatlast]

9. Perhaps she can take Alan Colmes's place?

She's sunk to that level.

[David Zephyr]

27. I Agree.

I've defended Donna here a lot, but this statement is really beyond the pale.

But since I am not a spokesperson for the Party, I must admit that we should have blown the $15 Million. Every dime.

[genius]

59. I always knew she was one of THEM

[poppet]

60. On NPR in Louisiana this morning ...

I heard Donna Brazile talking about the election. Being new to all this, I had never heard of her before today. She was on a local call-in talk show (Jim Inkster show - not sure about the spelling - Edited: The Jim Engster Show) on the NPR station in Baton Rouge. Apparently she is from Louisiana but now teaches at Georgetown U. On this local show, she kept saying things like, I am from a blue state but have red state values (???). She was also asked what her thoughts were on Rice and Gonzales. She responded that she couldn't be happier with *'s selections.

[janx]

2. Source, please?

Sometimes I think that she gets criticized unfairly through the media gossip machine.

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

5. here ya go - sorry

http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=694&u=/ap/20041118/ap_on_el_pr/democrats_kerry&printer=1

[unfrigginreal]

16. Christ, you zero in on Brazille in this article while ignoring this

explosive tidbit?

One member of Kerry's inner circle of campaign aides said Thursday that the failure to spend the money cost the senator victory in a close election.

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

19. Yeah..I don't quote unnamed sources...besides....they give no specifics

[janx]

25. Thanks--but this article is about Kerry and the campaign

cash.

Donna seems like a watchdog in this situation, and I don't necessarily see that as a bad thing.

The "friend of Karl Rove" aspect is not in the article; it was a tidbit of media gossip some time ago.

[Roxy66]

11. No...I saw her talking in her bit on CNN w/ Buchanan and she sounded

like she was really bashing Kerry. I think that stinks. Why doesnt she speak with him personally and find out what happened, instead of back-stabbing him on national television

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

17. Because you can't serve two masters..pretty obvious who her master is now

[AP]

24. I think you only get the TV money if you show a willingness to hurt Dems

meanwhile the only Republicans they talk to regularly play team ball.

[Walt Starr]

4. I despise Brazille

she's the worst person to EVER put on a talking head show. She couldn't fight her way out of a wet paper sack!

[ElectroPrincess]

6. I've done a 180 with Brazille ... I now have NO respect for her.

[blondeatlast]

13. Ditto that.

What a comedown.

[Miami Liberal]

26. She's a beeyotch!

[blondeatlast]

7. Hell, yes, it's cause for alarm.

I've had my suspicions about the story from the beginning.

I used to mildly defend Brazile, but she seems willing to sabotage the Dems now; I suspect because she's not a player anymore.

[unfrigginreal]

8. So when does Kerry issue the denial

or is the only problem the fact that she let the cat out of the bag?

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

15. Read the article..Kerry also GAVE the party RECORD amounts of cash

BTW...again..GORE was left with a rather large stash too...I don't think it's unreasonable at all that he had not spent the money two weeks out...I also don't have a problem with him not dumping money into other failed campaigns..my only regret and I have stated it is that he should have spent a bit more in the south party building.

[mzmolly]

10. She's irresponsible. I hate the fact that our Democratic Leaders

perpetuate this divisive bullshit, then expect people to fall in line during an election.

Republicans say "Democrats eat their own." I agree. Dumbasses! :grr:

[Roxy66]

18. Thats the problem with our talking heads..they will bash one of our

own..then run off with their tails between their legs with confrunted with an argument

[Skip Intro]

12. I don't like that one bit

And I don't think I like her on our team.

The election was just two weeks ago, sheesh.

Recounts gearing up in NH and OH - this is just bad judgement on her part all the way around - the betrayal, the timing .

Who needs her.

[merh]

14. Your name is my response!

Nothing shocks me any more!

What pisses me off is how many DUer's bought into the story. How many believed the MSM on this point, believed their slant, despite their months of damning the MSM for their bias. :argh:

Damn it just pisses me off! We have to stop eating our own! We have to stop falling for Roves tricks!

[DoveTurnedHawk]

20. Uhh, the Story Is True

There was a lot of leftover money, which could have been used to help Mongiardo, Knowles, Daschle, and other close races. No one's disputing that.

I just don't like Brazile and her bullshit comments.

DTH

[merh]

21. Duh, go back and f*ckin' research how much money Gore had

left over in his campaign coffers that was donated to the 2004 election efforts. IT IS NOT UNCOMMON and the Kerry campaign did donate money to many elections.

And guess what, he is giving to the 2005 and 2006 candidates. Most members of party do not attack their own this early after the election about the campaign coffer contents. If it was mid 2005 and no monies were donated, then that would be a f*ckin' issue. Attacking the candidate for this type of thing is usually left up to the other side and the media. Brazile has an agenda.

[DoveTurnedHawk]

22. Lots of Frayed Tempers Here, Apparently

Gore had $6 MM leftover. Not $15 MM + another $7 MM for voting issues.

$1 MM would have made a huge difference for Mongiardo, or Knowles, or Daschle. I sure wish we'd spent it.

DTH

[merh]

29. Frayed nerves because I am tired of the attacks on Kerry

How do you know he did not donate to the other campaigns?

[DoveTurnedHawk]

30. He Did. But More Is Always Needed.

$15MM is a huge cushion. Either there was REALLY bad mismanagement of funds (which is unfortunate, but forgiveable), or he was hedging his bets for 2008 (which is despicable, and not forgiveable).

I honestly hope it's the former. It still kills me that we had that much money leftover. I wish we'd spent it all, on 2004 races.

And I say this as a Kerry volunteer leader who donated lots of time and money to his campaign.

DTH

[merh]

31. No, you just don't get it do you?

No matter how much money the democratic candidates had, they could not win. The repukes interferred with the vote (Daschle) and probably stole them from the others you referenced. I am not familiar with them, but I would surmise that they those elections were not on the up and up either.

[DoveTurnedHawk]

32. I Am Reserving Judgment on the Voting Issues

Nothing I've seen so far has been a slam-dunk either way, for me.

Which still doesn't change the fact that more money to close races could have made the difference. Or taken them above the point where they could have been stolen, if you prefer.

DTH

[sangh0]

36. But not reserving judgement on Kerry

even though no one can properly interpret Kerry's action if they don't know whether or not the vote was stolen. Without knowing if the vote was stolen, something you reserve judgement on, you can not know if the money would have made the difference, but on that you won't reserve judgement.

And Kerry raised more than Gore, and spent more than Gore, and so he needed a bigger cushion because he had higher expenses.

But go ahead and believe what the media tells you, all of a sudden.

[DoveTurnedHawk]

38. Back the Fuck Off

No one was a bigger supporter of Kerry's than me. If you want to compare notes, even though I have no idea what your contributions were in time or money, I'd still wager a significant sum that I worked harder than you did, and that's just based on what I know of what *I* did.

No one is contesting the basic facts. From those basic facts, I am positing some possible conclusions. We'll see what comes out, if anything. And I am reserving judgment. I'm just not going to be shy about speculating, because that's kind of what we do here.

DTH

[sangh0]

40. No, I'm staying right here, and you will do nothing to stop me

amd you've done more than just "positing some possible conclusions", and your so-called "facts" ARE being contested.

[DoveTurnedHawk]

42. The Fact that a Ton of Money Was Left Over Is Uncontested

And I'm not going to toe your line, or have you insinuating that I'm not a good Democrat, just because I (gasp) dare to be critical -- AFTER-the-election -- of vast surplusage in a close race.

You know what? Fuck that. I'll go a step further. Kerry should've spent or transferred the entire fucking wad and then some, he has the money, and he was already repaid for his $6MM loan.

So stick that in your pipe and smoke it, pal.

DTH

[sangh0]

48. Here is what you said

$15MM is a huge cushion. Either there was REALLY bad mismanagement of funds (which is unfortunate, but forgiveable), or he was hedging his bets for 2008 (which is despicable, and not forgiveable).

1) Given that Kerry had operational expenses far higher than Gore's, it is not a huge cushion. That is your OPINION, not a fact.

2) There are more choices. It's not either one or the other. As the discussion in this thread shows, there are other possible explanations, such as the Hillary connection.

3) Kerry CANNOT hoard that money. If he does, the other Dems will resent it, and he can't run in 2008 without their support.

Kerry should've spent or transferred the entire fucking wad and then some, he has the money, and he already repaid his $6MM loan.

That is obviously motivated by your desire to inflame, and I won't bite because even you don't believe it.

[merh]

37. If you don't mind, could you provide me the states that the

candidates you listed were running in. I am curious and would like to do some research.

[DoveTurnedHawk]

39. Knowles - AK Senate; Mongiardo - KY Senate; Daschle - SD Senate

And a bunch of House reps.

DTH

[merh]

44. Thanks, I do appreciate it.

I also appreciate the discourse. :toast:

[DoveTurnedHawk]

46. Any Time

Polite discourse is always welcome. :-)

DTH

[ohioan]

57. Kerry could not give money to their campaigns . . . FEC violation

He could have, however, given the money to the DNC for them to use on their coordinated campaigns.

However, the DNC had more than enough money to spend on these campaigns and Kerry's money, while giving them a nice warchest, would have done not have resulted in more money to these various state races.

This "Why didn't Kerry give his last $15 million away" is already old and tiresome. The only thing worse than enduring a disappointing loss is having to put up with a non-stop flood of Monday morning quarterbacking bashing of the candidate who gave his all from a bunch of armchair experts who don't know squat about political strategy or campaign finance but insist that if ONLY Kerry had done this or not done that, he would not have let THEM down.

[DoveTurnedHawk]

65. State Campaigns

This "armchair quarterback" -- who quarterbacked a lot of volunteers and cash for Kerry -- recommends you learn about them.

DTH

[ElectroPrincess]

23. What the hell is wrong with these people?

You'd think Woolsey is the ONLY CIA expert who's invested up to his eyeballs in the war machine? Why is Brazille the ONLY woman who goes against Bay Buchanan? Nancy Skinner is quality and there are a number of other women who'll give ole' Bay a run for her money.

The USA media have not ever been THIS "compromised."

[Tom Rinaldo]

28. If the story is true I agree with Brazile

This specific stuff will make no difference in whether or not somehow Fraud is proved in time for Kerry to become President. At most it is an insiders Cat Fight. If you are following the story as reported:

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&ncid=703&e=1&u=/ap/20041118/ap_on_el_pr/democrats_kerry

you will note this paragraph: "WASHINGTON - Under friendly fire, Sen. John Kerry (news - web sites) likely will donate a substantial portion of his excess presidential campaign cash to help elect Democratic candidates in 2005 and 2006, advisers said Thursday"

However Kerry came to have that left over money, that is exactly where it should be going. Very few if any people were donating money to a Kerry exploratory committee for 2008. Without the friendly fire Kerry might have hoarded more of it. I think Donna is on the right side of this one. It will blow over soon enough either way, but this way maybe those funds will get freed up.

[sangh0]

41. Kerry HAS TO give the money to other Dems, even if he wants to run 2008

If he doesn't, he's not going to get their support in 2008. This entire story about HOARDING money is 100% BULLSHIT, completely invented out of thin air by a political professional whose agenda is unknown.

[Tom Rinaldo]

49. Again, I doubt this dust up matters much beyond the inner circles

though I am sure that it does matter there. To be frank, your read may be right, but I am not sure of that. Of course Kerry would have distributed favors in either case. That's how politics works. How much, when, and to whom is of course the devil in the details. If no one made a stink it is conceivable Kerry might have back loaded more of the donations he will make so that favors could be distributed closer to when he hopes to run again. It is conceivable that Kerry would have had greater freedom to hand pick where that money went, for example giving more to candidates of his choice rather than to the Democratic Congressional Committee or whatever, if no fuss was made about it now. Maybe Kerry would have held onto one or two million more for himself than he will still now reserve as a result of this brief controversy. Or maybe not. Maybe this issue was "completely invented out of thin air by a political professional whose agenda is unknown" as you put it. That too is conceivable to me.

I do not know more than what I have read. But if Kerry had a bigger war chest left over than is typical he will get understandable heat over it. If the Dems had retaken the Senate and Kerry Edwards had prevailed no one would be talking about this. That too is politics.

[sangh0]

51. I assume Kerry will have a say in where the money goes

but I also it's a fairly collegial affair. As you pointed out, there are favors that have been made in all directions, and there are more to be made and returned, and I"m sure that will play a role in disbursing the cash, along with considerations of what might be in 2008. And I'm sure Kerry will hold onto some of the money. My understanding is that this is how it's normally done.

And the part that's "invented" is that Kerry is hoarding it, and that it's because of mismanagement. I'm sure there will be some heat over this. There's always the finger-pointing that comes after a defeat. Even the repukes do it. But if we were smart about it, we wouldn't take these reports from the media at their word. That's also politics.

[Tom Rinaldo]

54. Kerry deserves a say in where the money goes

The only question is how big of a say in what proportion of it? I don't disagree with what you just wrote. If I was an insider I would know a hell of a lot more than I do but I'm not and I don't. I guess I was moved to write because many on this thread jumped to the worst possible assumptions about Brazille which is everyone's right of course, but I haven't jumped to those assumptions. I suppose I took the underdog's spin in this one since I didn't see it being said.

But mostly I don't think there's much cause for outrage here unless the absolute worst assumptions about either Kerry or Brazille turn out to be true. Hard ball is played at the top level of any large undertaking, and the Democratic Party qualifies. Egos might get bruised over this, and someone may or may not temporarilly get taken down a notch, but no significant blood is being shed. There are no career killers on the table. 2008 is a very long time away though it comes as no surprise that jockeying for position has already begun. Kerry is not at risk of losing many potential votes over this. Brazille will remain a greater or lesser force within the Party regardless. Voters will have other things on their mind.

[sangh0]

56. I don't think Brazille is the devil incarnate

but like you said, there's gonna be some hardball played, and I assume Donna can play as good as anyone else. Who knows why she's saying it and how much truth there is to it. Odds are, we'll never know, or as you said:

Egos might get bruised over this, and someone may or may not temporarilly get taken down a notch, but no significant blood is being shed. There are no career killers on the table. 2008 is a very long time away though it comes as no surprise that jockeying for position has already begun. Kerry is not at risk of losing many potential votes over this. Brazille will remain a greater or lesser force within the Party regardless. Voters will have other things on their mind.

It's "Move along. Nothing to see here"

[kodi]

33. brazile attacking kerry helps hillary clinton.

that stupid woman is as transparent as a plate glass window.

[DoveTurnedHawk]

34. That Is Actually an Interesting Point

Hmm.

DTH

[zulchzulu]

35. I've been calling out Brazile for days now...

She is a charlatan...reverse racist even...

[Teaser]

43. Brazile backs Dean for DNC chair.

according to Jerome Armstrong at Mydd.com

[zulchzulu]

47. ...with a knife behind his back

You forgot that part.

[Mist]

45. I've never like Brazile

and never trusted her. She smiles too much at inappropriate times, and that always gets my shit detector going. I didn't like her back when she was working for Gore.

[dogman]

50. Well it's a good thing none of you listen to Ed Schultz.

He hammered this hard on his radio show. This story has been out without mention of DB. When it first broke they were reporting the figures from mid-October of $45M. Earlier this week CNN said he would be distributing this money to earn favors later. If a fight develops over the vote fraud and the money is used for that, all will be forgiven, I'm sure. That's what $7M was raised for specifically. That's why many were upset by the concession. If this money is used for 2008 it will hurt him, IMO.

[janx]

53. I listen to Ed!

And notice my posts, above (though they have nothing to do with him).

[dogman]

58. I thought Ed was going off a little prematurely.

But he's got a show to do. I already knew his numbers were old but it is agitating to think more might have been done to win. Time will tell if there is a story here. I'd hate to see more GOP misinformation be taken as truth.

[AmerDem]

52. I can't take Brazille

she is everything we as a party need to get away from.

[robbedvoter]

55. True, but what's Kerry's excuse?

[LittleClarkie]

61. I went looking for articles about the Gore campaign and Donna's part

Haven't found too much yet, but this article is interesting:
http://www.bostonphoenix.com/archive/features/99/12/16/TALKING_POLITICS.html

Talks about spending strategies back then, and since it's a Boston publlication, we get alittle John in there too. Sounds like there used to be a touch of friction between the two camps. And there was a spending problem in the campaign early on. Have a look.

[LittleClarkie]

62. And this little tidbit from TNR

"1984: Remember when leftists fretted that they didn't have a standard-bearer in this year's Democratic primary? Well, lefties, fret no more. The Democratic race is fast deteriorating into a pander-fest of Mondale-esque proportions. Days after Bill Bradley secured the backing of Robert Reich, once the Clinton administration's resident liberal, Al Gore did him one better, nailing down the man who made "liberal" a naughty word in the first place: Michael Dukakis. We fear Gore's willingness to trot out the Duke means the vice president is taking the bad advice of his campaign manager, Donna Brazile. Brazile has been encouraging Gore to take a "constituency group" approach to the nomination, which means telling labor activists, feminists, minorities, environmentalists, gays, and the disabled only what they want to hear. Sure enough, Gore has pandered to women's groups--by objecting to the administration's deal on U.N. dues because of its abortion language. Following Bradley's lead, he's met with the demagogic Al Sharpton in New York. And last week Gore made it a hat trick--pandering to environmentalists by promising billions more for conservation. The centrist Democratic Leadership Council, the ideological architects of Clinton's victory, rightly argues in a recent newsletter that Gore's interest-group campaign smacks of Mondale and Dukakis. "His policies are reasonably New Democrat, but his campaign strategy is decidedly Old Democrat," DLC chief Al From grumbles to us. Let's hope his grumbles are heard. (12.03.99)"

[LittleClarkie]

64. From a review of her autobio in the Wash. Post

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A33159-2004Jun10.html (registration required)

Here is an portion of the text, describing her role. Rove is mentioned in passing.

And so a counter-theme begins to run through this political autobiography: Be careful what you wish for. Because for all her competence in registering black voters and rounding up black demonstrators, Brazile became, of course, the token black. Susan Estrich, manager of the Dukakis campaign, was, according to Brazile's account, "insulting, condescending and patronizing" to her. "I was so embarrassed," she says, "by the arrogance of the Dukakis folks." Still (and to an outsider, inexplicably), Brazile continued to work as an organizer in national politics -- for little or no money, usually and again, by her own account, inhabiting the very worst office in the building.

She's there (wherever "there" is) to bring in the black vote. After she does that, she can cordially get lost, thank you very much. (But what did she expect? Kindness from these people? As my old Texan dad used to say, when you lie down with dogs, you get up with fleas.) Brazile ended up in the Gore campaign, and things began to get rough. On the one hand, it was wonderful to be on the coveted inside of things. On the other hand, for all her efforts to turn out the black vote, on Election Day she discovered that hundreds, maybe thousands of blacks and other minorities had been turned away at the polls. As the Gore campaign alternately celebrated and mourned in the coming days, she felt more and more excluded and disillusioned. (As if those death threats weren't enough!) She still gives speeches now, about getting out the vote. But what's the point if your vote doesn't count?

"Soon after President Bush's inaugural in 2001, I called Karl Rove," she writes. "I can report that Karl is always gracious and has always returned my calls or responded to my letters." Every man to his own taste, the old woman said, as she kissed the cow. All I can say is, I'm glad I live on the West Coast, about as far from the seat of power as it's possible to be. Let someone else sit at that dratted table. I'm going to the beach."

[Northwestmom4Kerry]

63. Donna Brazille should be run out of the democratic party!

She is a disgrace and I have yet to hear one positive thing out of her big mouth about John Kerry throughout the campaign! She is a self-serving loser, and the only place she is wanted is whoring for the pundit shows. She is constantly pandering to the other side, and she had plenty of opportunities to defend Kerry for months now, because she is constantly invited onto those shows, but she has never once done so. She is ignorant and clueless and has never done anything or said anything to help him, so for her to come out today in the way she did is an outrage.

[Andromeda]

66. Brazille is one of the talking heads on CNN...

They love to put her on with Bay Buchanan for their little political one on ones.

She's a big disappointment. Friend of KKKarl Rove??? Geeeeesh!