Is now the time to change the two party system? Conserv/Republicrats/Libs

[4_Legs_Good]

I was thinking, with Arlen Specter bending over for the conservatives and increasing disillusionment on both sides, the time has to have come to ditch the current partisan system in favor of a more ideological one:

We will now have 3 parties

1/3 of the government as stands now will become the Conservative Party: this will be the Trent Lotts, Bill Frists, Tom Delays, George Bush Jr.'s, Scalias, etc.

1/2 would be the Republicrats - The Clintons, the Kerrys, the McCains, the Specters, Snows, Feinsteins, etc.

1/6 would be the Liberals - the Kennedy's, the Kuciniches, The Boxers

This way each party could stick by its guns and not have to bend over to impress the middle. The middle will usually be in charge but will have to compromise with the liberals or the conservatives to get certain bills passed.

I don't think the 2 party system works anymore.

How 'bout it?

david

[elepet]

1. What about the other 1/3?

Sounds absolutely logical. Practically speaking, how could that come about?
Might be room for still another one.

[4_Legs_Good]

5. I think 1/3 + 1/2 + 1/6 = 1... :)

I think the Conservatives have double the numbers of the real liberals right now, but I also think that the centrists have a slight majority, however partisanship skews this toward the conservatives.

Anyway, I have no idea how this could actually come about. It would basically require that the centrists from both parties understand that they're being squeezed by the conservatives, and decide to gang up. Chances the only real chance for this to happen would be for Republicans to defect to the Democratic party in large numbers, however, I don't think they would do because they'd be lumped in with Liberals, which they are not. So an agreement would have to be made for the liberals to depart the Dems, so we'd end up with

Republicans = Conservatives
Democrats = Centrists
Liberals = (you guessed it!) Liberals

The Republicans could be the party of moral/social conservatism, greater influence of religion in government, imperialism, free market economy without regulation

The Democrats could be the party of social reform, fiscal conservancy, environmental protection, jobs and economic growth, free market economy with regulation, military strength (where most Americans really are)

The Liberals could be the party of strong environmental action, social responsibility, multilateralism, non-militarism, fair-trade, workers rights.

I'd be in the Liberal camp and it'd be fun to love all my party's politicians, but understanding that they can make comprimises for the greater good with the Democrats.

[BurgherHoldtheLies]

2. Dangerous times require strength in numbers

I guess I would qualify as a "Republicrat" but I am more than open to ideas from Senator Kennedy et al and have found some intelligent, interesting ideas presented by the group you term "liberal".

That being said, I believe that compromise for the greater good of rejecting the far-right agenda is the primary goal.

[4_Legs_Good]

6. Yup!

But the far right loses its power if the centrists get together. This, I believe, is what has to happen. It can occur with the current setup if an agreement is reached between the Democrats and the centrist republicans, or a party split-up, which I prefer.

At this point, though, I agree with you - I'm willing to comprimise to halt the radical right until we can work things out.

I really don't think things are as polarized in the real world as our politicians represent. I think the problem is that Americans are only given 2 choices, and as long as the "liberals" are lumped in with the "centrists" the "righties" will win. The Democrats have not been the liberal party (sad to say, IMO) since at least 1980.

david

[Cornus]

3. We discussed...

...something similar to this idea at our meeton.org meeting this past Sunday night. The consensus was that we should work to re-vitalize the Democratic party. From our notes..."transform the party...push for a more progressive, populist, confrontational politics so that the Party offers more vigorous opposition on key issues and ultimately offers a more viable and inspiring alternative to the Republicans."

Some people thought that joining the Greens or forming yet another party was the way to go. Most thought it best to re-vamp the Democratic party to make it more progressive and less centrist...at least in my group.

[4_Legs_Good]

8. I'd love a progressive Democratic Party, and the 3 party system wouldn't

work, I don't think, unless there was a centrist party, that declared itself centrist, and took seats from both sides of the aisle. The problem with the Democratic party right now is that it's trying to sit in the center without the Republicans, and when that happens, the people are given the choice between the Republicans and the party that's trying to be like the Republicans while not offending the liberals.

That's where the problem is. If a true centrist party was created, then the conservatives and liberals could better develop themselves.

Anyway, I agree with your MeetOn group - baring a creation of a declared centrist party, let's push the Democrats to the populist front and win on real issues. I think people are going to get sick of the radical right very quickly.

david

[BlueEyedSon]

4. More than 2 parties will be great after IRV.

http://www.instantrunoff.com/

[Protagoras]

7. Still unclear on the "centrist" position

I still see it pretty much either neocon in Dem clothing OR simply a label to cover an inability to articulate concrete principles.

But yes...it may be the case that the DLC needs to give itself a new party and run on their own. We LIBERALS can keep the title Democrat...we earned it. They didn't.

[4_Legs_Good]

10. I think most Americans are in the center

There are the evangelicals who are really on the right, and there are us liberals who are really on the left.

So the centrists would be the party that most people agree with -

fiscal responsibility
military strength
environmental protection (sans spotted owls)
jobs and economic growth
free market economy with regulation
modest gun control (no assault rifles or bazookas)
Modest voucher programs (*I shudder just thinking of it)
Social security reform

I think these ideals are were the majority of Americans are. Now I think they're wrong, but I'd rather have them in charge than the radical right, which the current 2 party system allows to happen.

When was the last time a real liberal was in power? Carter? Kennedy? FDR? Hard to say.

david

[DemocratSinceBirth]

9. It Would Be Electoral Death For Liberals...

http://www.cnn.com/ELECTION/2004/pages/results/states/US/P/00/epolls.0.html

Liberal (21%)
Moderate (45%)
Conservative (34%)

[4_Legs_Good]

11. I think we're electorally dead anyway...

It would mean active activism. It would mean dealing with the center. It would mean using the tools we have to create change.

Thanks for the statistics, btw! They're about what I expected.

david