Question for Southern Democrats

[Mike L]

Should Southern Democrats nominate culturally conservative candidates? Or should we simply continue to capitulate on those Congressional seats? No amount of "education" or wordsmithing on the issues will change the way deep-red state voters vote. Dems from other parts of the country can live in denial about the South if they like, but they are only fooling themselves. I live in the deep South, so I know how those voters think. Some of those voters vote the way they do because of the culture in which they were raised, but most do so for religious reasons. I doubt the populous will ever change the way they think. If they do, it will take 40- 50 years.

However, I do think that we can win with candidates who are populist on economic issues and conservative on social issues. To win, deep-red state Dems will have to run candidates who are pro-life, anti-gay marriage, pro-gun, pro-God, and pro-strong military defense. Isn't it better to take half a loaf than to concede these seats?

[RubyDuby in GA]

1. No

And if they do, this Southern Democrat who was born and raised here will NOT vote for them.

It's not so much about who you run, it's about how your phrase your message and this year they failed miserably.

[Mike L]

18. So, you think Dem US House and Senate candidates can win in GA who are

pro-choice, pro-gay marriage, anti-gun, strict separation of C&S, and anti-strong military defense?

[BamaLefty]

85. Hell NO they Can't

And don't let her tell you different. I live in a blood red state... they will not vote for a liberal. Point blank.

It is sickening I might add...

[w4rma]

51. Out gun the Republicans by supporting even less gun control, aimed at

specifically rural voters.

ALLOW Democratic politicians to talk more about religion and how liberals values are Jesus Christ's values. I think they want to but are held back by a few loud people who are mostly in the Democratic base. Anytime they try to talk about religion these knee-jerk anti-religious folk shout them down. You have to remember that Jesus Christ's message is a good one and its not a bad thing to be evangelistic about Jesus Christ's message. Its bad when the message is twisted into (a Satanic message?) one of hate toward folks of other religions, cultures, ethnicities, social standing, etc.

Forget about gay marraige, alltogether. Don't let big media and Republican appointed judges suck you into that argument again. But, fight hard for getting civil unions into law.

Be tough on illegal immigrents. Remember that they are breaking the law by being here. Forget about pandering to Hispanics with stupid things like supporting drivers licenses for illegals. Illegals don't vote. Pander to the hispanics who are American citizens, not hispanics who are not supposed to be here.

Never ever support *anything* that sends the jobs of Americans overseas. And you must be very very clear about that to southern Americans, because they know who passed NAFTA: Bill Clinton. And they blame Democrats for NAFTA and they think that Republicans are basically the same. You MUST defeat this fallacy. And anytime big media makes hay about some Democrat who opposes "protectionism" and supports NAFTA as written hurts Dems in the South, regardless of what the DLC may tell you.

This is basically jettisonning just about as much extra policy, that helps Republicans drive a wedge between Americans, as ethically possible.

Would you support a Democrat like this?

[Geek_Girl]

64. Yes

and that's exactly what we need to win in the red states again. An immensely strong populous message with a socially conservative leaning candidate.

[Clark2008]

86. Is it the phrasing of the message or the absolute

lock on the South by the conservative media?

Honestly, there aren't very many 'liberal' alternatives for rural voters to listen to on the radio while driving into the cities for their jobs. Yes, we have some alternative weeklies and dailies in the cities, but commuters don't read those.

I don't think there's anything much wrong with the message - maybe chill a bit on homosexual marriage - but on economics, Dems have it correct. It's just Southerners only hear "tax and spend liberal" repeated 50 times a day.

[Nicholas D Wolfwood]

2. For House races? Sure. Presidency? Absolutely not.

[Mike L]

19. House and Senate races, yes.

I agree that the presidential candidate should be moderate-- pro-choice (but with late-term restrictions), pro-civil unions, pro-gun, pro-God in pledge of allegiance, and strong military defense.

[Nicholas D Wolfwood]

97. I disagree with the presidential candidate being a moderate.

He should be a true, unquestionable Democrat. We've lost by trying to play their game better than they do. We need to win by playing our own game and by being unafraid and steadfast in doing it.

[Catfight]

3. so dems have to be bigots and intolerant to win? NO thanks, I'd rather

just sit home and watch the repugs go down that road. Listen, in Florida for the Governor race of 2002, a black man from Broward county, Daryl Jones ran against Bill McBride and Janet Reno for the democratic run-off against Jeb Bush. Daryl Jones would have been a GREAT governor of Florida and I believe would have beaten Jeb Bush without any contest, except, the Democratic party would not fund him or vote him in, they just wanted to replace a white man with another white man. When democrats start looking at representation as a true reflection of representing more than white overweight men, then we will have some change in the party. Howard Dean had it right...Kerry was just Bush Light what we need is people who inspire not conspire, people who motivate not motive-hate, people who encourage not discourage, and people who stand for what is just not what is profitable.

[Mike L]

23. Wow, you really live in fantasy land.

And I don't consider FL part of "the South" anyway.

[tsuki]

54. No, it is worse. BaptistaLand.

[Catfight]

62. Yeah, probably I do live in a fantasy land, or it could be the anti-

depressants talking that I've been taking since Nov. 3rd. :)

[KnowerOfLogic]

119. Right, forget principle. Then we'll win for sure. NOT.

The "triangulation" crowd is on its way out, Mike, face it.

[fujiyama]

147. You may be right

that Kerry failed to inspire ENOUGH people to win, but he's not Bush Lite. What a stupid phrase.

People knew the differences between the candidates and there were HUGE differences between the candidates.

[quaoar]

4. Question

If a potential congressional candidate is "pro-life, anti-gay marriage, pro-gun, pro-God, and pro-strong military defense," why wouldn't he just run as a Republican? Why saddle his candidacy with the obstacle of explaining that even though he is a Democrat, he is not one of those Democrats?

[RubyDuby in GA]

6. Or they can just do like they do in South Georgia

and run as a Democrat, win then immediately switch parties.

I swear to god, you ought to be able to run these assholes down in your car without any penalties.

[lgardengate]

40. Wow! Not that's what i call bitter

and hateful.We will have to stop calling reps hateful if we make these kinds of statements.

[Mike L]

8. "explain.....he is not one of those Democrats"

Uhhh.....to get half a loaf? Or maybe because that's how he/she really feels. There are many Southern Dems (although they may not be in politics yet) who are conservative, yet feel that the Repug Party is out to screw the working and middle class. That in itself is a reason not to be a Repug.

[quaoar]

14. You live in the South

So do I. You know what happens.
The Republican candidate runs ads comparing his opponent to Ted Kennedy and Jane Fonda and the Democrat has to come out and explain how he isn't one of those Democrats.

[Mike L]

24. Right. "I'm not a Northern Democrat" or, "I'm not a National Democrat."

Someone earlier said we should think about breaking the Dem Party down to regional levels. I think that's a good idea. Either that or run a 50 individual state strategy. I think it would be better to use a regional strategy, at least for the South, Midwest and Southwest. That would allow the individual states to feel like they are part of a larger coalition.

This is the only way to retake majority status in the House and Senate. The Northeastern and West Coast Dems won't like it, but the realistic Southern Dems know that it's true.

[American Tragedy]

35. Didn't we already try the regional thing

until the Civil Rights acts passed?

[IStriker]

112. If he ran as a Democrat....

why would anybody vote for him except maybe some Republicans?

[damntexdem]

5. Why should I 'cultivate' candidates whose positions ...

are inimical to mine? What good is half a loaf of shit?

[Mike L]

10. What good?

You would get the "shit" half anyway. You could at least eat the good half. Wouldn't you be better off?

[leyton]

7. Well, the South is going to elect social conservatives either way.

The question is, do you want them voting for Reid/Pelosi or Frist/DeLay? I'll take the latter.

I also think we serve ourselves by having voices from the South in the party, because they keep our party leadership in touch with Southern voters. (Let the DLC-bashing begin.) Conversely, the GOP only hurts itself by trying to purge itself of moderates like Arlen Specter.

[Mike L]

25. I hope you meant to say "the former."

[leyton]

44. Oops, you're right.

It'll be a chilly day in hell before I support Tom DeLay.

[lgardengate]

45. The party is Not "in touch" with southern voters now

the south gets more Red all the time.One reason is we DON"T talk to southern voters except to tell them not to vote on "God,guns and gays".I don't think there exactaly listening.

[IStriker]

113. If these social conservatives get elected...

and we take back the House or Senate, what happens when they get to Washington? If they vote with the Republicans, they are no use to the Democrats, and if they vote like they're told to vote once they get there, it will be for one term only. They will all be John Edwards - can't be re-elected once the people who sent them realize how they're voting.

[KnowerOfLogic]

121. Exactly; this short term "positioning" is not a solution. n/t

[fujiyama]

148. I feel the same way

The situation really seems hopeless...a real Catch 22.

[Cheswick2.0]

9. no way

no social conservatives.

[Mike L]

And you live in which Southern state?

[Cheswick2.0]

133. silly question

I don't live in a southern state but I do live in a swing state. I am not willing to throw women, gays, minorities or separation of church and state overboad because you think your neighbors are too stupid to learn.
Saying that it will take 50 years to change them is ridiculous. They voted for Clinton didn't they? The right has been chipping away and brainwashing people and they are moving to the right. There is no reason that they can not be moved back towards the left if we make a convincing case.

You socially conservative senator and congresscritter votes on the law which we ALL have to live under. If you don't like how I live them you don't have to be like me. The problem with social conservatives is, that is not enough for them. They want laws that forced people to live by their beliefs.

If the party goes right women and minorities will leave and you will be the very tiny white mens party.

[Mike L]

141. My question was posed to "Southern Democrats".

"They voted for Clinton didn't they?"

A few, but he had Perot's help and the fundies weren't as organized then. Look at how few Senate and House seats we hold in the South now.

"If the party goes right women and minorities will leave and you will be the very tiny white mens party."

We're talking about the Southern part of the Party going right on cultural issues. There will be no reason for minorities to leave. I think that Southern liberal women will still vote Dem for the overall good of the party. I don't think they will be selfish.

Anyway, we can't win in the South with our current Party platform.

[Bridget Burke]

11. Bullshit.

I truly believe the economic issues need to be emphasized--even to an extent that might upset some of the more "conservative" Democrats. I remember Kerry speaking of his religious faith; his military background speaks for itself. The whorish media & voting "problems" had more to do with the result than anything he actually said.

Why bother to call yourself a Democrat if you oppose women's rights, gay rights, separation of Church & State, and sane gun control?

My representative is Sheila Jackson Lee; she ran unopposed.

[Mike L]

26. Sheila Jackson Lee; she ran unopposed.

I guess she did-- considering her district.

[Cheswick2.0]

135. closet racism?

You just made a racist remark. Do you even realize that?

[Name removed]

136. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Mike L]

140. You are mistaken.

[Bridget Burke]

150. Why, yes, there are blacks in our district!

My state senator, Mario Gallegos, was only opposed by a Libertarian; state rep, Jessica Cristina Farrar, was also unopposed.

And I'm white--but a lifelong Democrat.

All kinds of people live in the South. Learn to deal with it.

[Mutley]

12. no...

many of those issues are the most important issues to democrats and nominating a dem who is pro-life, anti-gay marriage, etc is only nominating a republican-lite.

[Mike L]

13. Alabama's "Song of the South"

Song, song of the south
Sweet potato pie and I shut my mouth
Gone, gone with the wind
There ain't nobody looking back again

Cotton on the roadside, cotton in the ditch
We all picked the cotton but we never got rich
Daddy was a veteran, a Southern Democrat
They oughta get a rich man to vote like that

Sing it...

Song, song of the south
Sweet potato pie and I shut my mouth
Gone, gone with the wind
There ain't nobody looking back again

Well somebody told us Wall Street fell
But we were so poor that we couldn't tell
Cotton was short and the weeds were tall
But Mr. Roosevelt's a gonna save us all

Well momma got sick and daddy got down
The county got the farm and they moved to town
Pappa got a job with the TVA
He bought a washing machine and then a Chevrolet

Sing it...

Song, song of the south
Sweet potato pie and I shut my mouth
Gone, gone with the wind
There ain't nobody looking back again

[quaoar]

17. Another lyrical reminder of the Democratic South

Kingfish
Artist: Randy Newman
Album: Good Old Boys


There's a hundred thousand Frenchmen in New Orleans
In New Orleans there are Frenchmen everywhere
But your house could fall down
Your baby could drown
Wouldn't none of those Frenchmen care

Everybody gather 'round
Loosen up your suspenders
Hunker down on the ground
I'm a cracker
And you are too
But don't I take good care of you

Who built the highway to Baton Rouge?
Who put up the hospital and built you schools?
Who looks after shit-kickers like you?
The Kingfish do

Who gave a party at the Roosevelt Hotel?
And invited the whole north half of the state down there for free
The people in the city
Had their eyes bugging out
Cause everyone of you
Looked just like me

Kingfish, Kingfish
Everybody sing
Kingfish, Kingfish
Every man a king

Who took on the Standard Oil men
And whipped their ass
Just like he promised he'd do?
Ain't no Standard Oil men gonna run this state
Gonna be run by little folks like me and you

Kingfish, Kingfish
Friend of the working man
Kingfish, Kingfish
The Kingfish gonna save this land

[David Zephyr]

20. H.P. Long!

Thanks for Randy's lyrics.

[retread]

15. I say let's nominate more African-American and minority candidates.

*

[GarySeven]

16. NO - populism has always been a winner in U.S. politics ...

What is needed is a candidate who can get the liberal northern establishment to accept the fact that rural values are acceptable. The best way to do that is to find the most popular Southern Democrat and run him for president; the overwhelming support such a candidate would receive from Southern and other Red State liberals and moderates should shut those damn yankees up for at least one election cycle.

[Ian David]

27. Fuck it. Just secede

[angrydemocrat]

36. Bullshit

Why don't you just bend over a little more and make it easier for republicans to shove it up your A$$. Not all southern democrats are willing to straddle the fence and give up values just to get votes. And therefor you not only would have to shut up them damn yankee's as you so rudely put it would also have some damn southern democrats to worry about. I don't give a damn if a canidate is from the north or the south if he doesn't represent me I will not vote for him/her. Hell before I voted for them I would stay home and there are many many others that feel the same way. The shit about they have to come from the south to win is total f**king garbage.

[Mike L]

41. I get the feeling that you aren't from the South anyway.

Therefore, your opinion is moot.

[sonicx]

42. profile says Tennessee

[angrydemocrat]

88. Not From South?

If you would have checked my profile you would see it say's Tennessee. So your feeling is like your brain - DEAD.

[GarySeven]

95. Tennessee isn't "the south"

Not only did half your state not want to secede, when the yankee invader came you people rolled over for them faster than a New Orleans whore lifts her skirt. The Tennessee star on the Stars and Bars was honorary only. Get bent you damned yankee.

*Tennessee descendants of Confederate regimental soldiers are exceptions to this post.

[angrydemocrat]

107. Tennesse is

part of the south. And you can tell it to because of all the dumba$$es like you. It is heavily populated with KKK just like other parts of the south. Next you can go read some of my other posts and you will find out yes I currently live in Tennessee and have lived here for several years now. But I was born and raised in Orlando Fla. My parents moved back to this shitty state when I was almost 15. So no I'm not a yankee although I must say they are a hell of alot more friendly and have more sense than people like you. Fortunatly all southerns don't have a attitude problem such as yourself. By the way I don't mind being called a yankee because I know I would be alot better off if I was. It is only dumbA$$es such as yourself that resent someone because they are a yankee.

[quaoar]

109. Pulaski, Tennessee is the birthplace of the Klan

Our very own homegrown terrorist organization. Tennessee is also the capital of country music and has its own NASCAR track. Any state that has a NASCAR track is either a Southern state or an honorary Southern state -- New Hampshire and California excluded.

[KnowerOfLogic]

123. So now *not* being a member of the Confederacy is a BAD thing?

Or were you kidding?

[Bridget Burke]

152. And where's your home state?

Not in your profile. Ashamed?

[KnowerOfLogic]

122. Give it up. As long as we're talking about *democrats,* everyone's

opinion on this board counts. And i lived in Florida for 20+ years and have traveled all over the deep south, and if the democratic party has to become more "southern" to win, then i say screw it. Let southern "democrats" lay in the bed they made, and the northen states can secede and live happily ever after.

[Cheswick2.0]

134. so the south refuses to vote for Yankees but we are supposed to

vote for their crappy conservative candidates? Enjoy your 50 state electoral loss.

[sonicx]

21. it won't do any good

They probably won't win. Why vote for a lite repuke when you can get the real thing.

And if they win, they won't vote YES on gay rights, reproductive rights, etc. What good would they be?

It will be Zell Miller all over again.

[Mike L]

29. Oh contraire.

They will vote for a Southern Dem who reflects their cultural values AND their economic interests. What the Dems get is support for their original (and what should be their primary) special interest-- the working man/woman.

Unless the national Party leaders wise up and realize that most Southern voters aren't liberal (duh!), the Dem Party will never take back majority status in Congress.

[KnowerOfLogic]

120. You will be sabotoging the democratic party at the same time.

If you run "culturally conservative" dems in the south it undermines other dems on these issues, which undermines the whole party, and weakens its ability to fight for the working man/woman. I am all in favor of greatly upping our efforts to offer working people a reason to vote dem, but going redneck on cultural issues is not going to work. For one thing, anybody who cares about those issues is going to be highly suspicious about a dem candidate saying they're anti-gay, anti-abortion, anti-woman, etc., and at the same time most voters just don't know the details of economic policy well enough to make that fine of a discrimination between the two parties. The potential gain is not as big as the potential loss.

[Mike L]

127. "going redneck on cultural issues"

Unfortunately, other than anti-abortion, this is the culture of middle America rather than rednecks. I don't know what you mean about being "anti-woman". I'm not familiar with any Southern politician who runs on an anti-woman platform.

It's true that Dem candidates in the South will have to be convincing on these cultural issues, including abortion. The challenge is finding candidates who are really conservative on these issues while being pro-working class at the same time. I doubt there are many in the political process at this time. New faces will have to emerge.

"The potential gain is not as big as the potential loss."

I disagree. Everyone knows that the South is different. I think the South is pretty much isolated from other parts of the country politically, so I doubt there will be any weakening of Dems in liberal areas. Right now, Dems do a pathetic job of protecting the working class. I think that Southern leadership in this area can only help the Party. In addition, taking back majority status in Congress will allow the moderate and liberal Dems to control the committees and the agenda.

[KnowerOfLogic]

143. Here in SD, repukes ran ads showing Daschle w/ Hillary, Ted, Kerry

etc. They constantly repeated "Tom's following the liberal national democratic agenda." As you may know, SD's a dirt poor state, especially out here in the western part, and i have had several people i know, who live *below the poverty line* telling me that a) they oppose a minimum wage increase, b) the best way to benefit the poor is to benefit the super rich (i.e. trickle down) and c) they are going to be super-rich some day, and when they are, they don't want to pay any taxes either.

The fact is that right now, the social issues are *all there is;* these people will not hear anything else. The minute they hear that national dems are "anti-war, pro-gay, pro welfare, pro-feminists" etc. etc., they will not listen to one word any dem says about economic issues. This means one of two things; either all dems nation-wide must dump these issues (and even then, they probably wil *not* be able to dump the republican lies about these issues), or they must find another way to win, while staying true to their principles.

And sure, nobody ever *says* they're anti-woman, what they say is that they "respect and support woman's traditonal role." What this means of course is that they want women to stay barefoot, pregnant, and under the authority of her man.

[juslikagrzly]

22. No. As a red state southern democate

I say we need to quit waffling and trying to appear to be more like repugs. We need to take a stand and firmly state what OUR values are rather than arguing, trying to convince these rightwingnuts that they're barking up the wrong tree.

It's been discussed over and over here on DU; framing the issue, moving to the center, etc.

I'm advocating reclaiming OUR moral values of anti-poverty, equal rights for all, separation of church and state, peace and justice, freedom of choice, etc. etc.

Repug-lite doesn't work anyway. Look at Brad Carson here in Oklahoma. He actually ran ads touting his voting history as being "with *". :puke:

[Mike L]

30. Then the Repugs will keep on winning in the South and we'll get nothing.

Brad Carson was pro-choice. Someone posted an article here a few days ago in which Carson recounted that he first knew his campaign was in real trouble when he was invited to a church to debate the abortion issue with Coburn. He said it hit him when he looked at the bulletin for the service and it said, "Abortion Debate: Pro-Life vs. Pro-Death."

Nuff said.

[missouri dem 2]

92. Brad Carson ran to the right of most of the republican party and still

lost. His opponent was an obvious nut job. I agree with you, we

need to reframe the issues and focus on what the Democratic party

stands for. The republicans constantly move the debate to the right

and we have not been successful by following them. At what point

does the Democratic Party stop being a party that we want to belong

to if they continue to abandon their core beliefs.

I do think that we need to nominate candidates that can relate to

the middle and working classes and can put forward a believable

platform of Progressive Populism.

[Hippo_Tron]

114. Brad Carson lost because it was a presidential election year...

Oklahoma is about as dark red as they come. When there's an open seat, people have a tendancy to just punch for the Republican guy if they're going to vote Republican for president.

[The Flaming Red Head]

28. Why would I vote at all for someone like that?

Those are my issues. There is no half a loaf for me in that only for them. What would be the difference in that and a conservative Republican.


I will not vote for people who believe that life begins at conception.

[Mike L]

32. Then I hope you don't live in the South.

Because if you do, you're gonna be unhappy for a long time, one way or the other.

If you ever do have the chance to vote for a Dem like this, I hope you decide to help the Dems on the national level. Having a majority of Dems in the House and Senate will enable the Dems to control all the committees. Since the liberal and moderate Dems will outnumber the conservative Dems, issues such as restrictions on abortions and gay marriage bans shouldn't make it out of committees.

Look at it this way-- you aren't losing anything by voting for a conservative Dem in the South. Liberal Dems can't win there anyway.

[The Flaming Red Head]

33. You're right I am very unhappy here and have been for years.

Please quit feeding the rednecks.

[Mike L]

46. "rednecks" is a racist term.

They're already well fed. I want to get some use out of them.

[retread]

47. If you live in the south and think "redneck" is a rascist term

you aren't paying attention.

[Mike L]

53. Maybe I paid TOO much attention:

The SC Sup Ct ruled as follows in:

Edgar Payton, Respondent, v. Tina L. Kearse, Petitioner.

Opinion No. 24740

SUPREME COURT OF SOUTH CAROLINA

329 S.C. 51; 495 S.E.2d 205

October 2, 1996, Heard
January 12, 1998, Filed


"The term "redneck" is a racially derogatory term applied <*56> exclusively to members of the white race. n1 The use of the term "redneck" is not a valid race-neutral reason to strike a potential juror, and therefore, the strike is facially discriminatory and violates Batson. See Wilkerson v. Texas, 493 U.S. 924, 110 S. Ct. 292, 107 L. Ed. 2d 272 (1989) (dissent from denial of petition for certiorari) (an explanation tainted by an impermissible factor is not neutral).

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - Footnotes - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -


n1 The term "redneck" is defined as "a member of the white rural laboring class . . . offensive slang." THE AMERICAN HERITAGE DICTIONARY 1037 (2d college ed. 1985). In Webster's New World Dictionary, "redneck" is defined as "a poor, white rural resident of the South: often a somewhat derogatory term." WEBSTER'S NEW WORLD DICTIONARY 1190 (2d college ed. 1976)."

[Blue_Roses]

59. Any "redneck" who thinks the word redneck is racial slur

isn't a true redneck. Many take great pride in being called this. Why do you think Jeff Foxworthy and the "redneck greeting cards" make millions off of this...

When I see a guy who has deer antlers firmly planted on the hood of his trunk, and a gun rack in the back window, I don't exactly think "Rhodes Scholar"...

[Clark2008]

89. This is true

and the South has been becoming more and more redneck just in my lifetime. I was a teenager in the 80s and no one I knew would DREAM of owning a truck unless they lived on a farm! Now, that's what all the teenaged boys want.

Also, I was forced to listen to a country music station on my drive home (had a friend that wanted me to listen to a message from the D.J.) and, while I was listening, that Gretchen-whats-her-doogie song came on about Redneck Women. I was sickened. I came into work the next day and rattled on about how awful that was and two women I work with took offense! I told them they really needed to get out of the South more often if they thought the rest of the country thought a "redneck" was "cool." I don't think they ever got it - they were trying to make some statement that Southerners "taking back" the word, "redneck" was akin to black people taking back the "N" word.

Seriously - that's how fucked up it's become.

And, it's all advertising, marketing and politicizing... nothing more.

[retread]

108. Does the term "white privilege" ring a bell?

*

[The Flaming Red Head]

63. Redneck is the name of the people who make my life miserable

If you guys want em you can have em but count me out of your Grand Democratic Old Party.

[Mike L]

67. For every Southern liberal ideologue we lose with this strategy, we'll

pick up three Independents and one registered Dem who now vote Repug.

[The Flaming Red Head]

103. You'll win another racist, gun toting, homophobic, lunatic for the Dems

Misery isn't just the name of the state above the one I live in, it's a way of life for a lot people who have to deal with this unique little minority (KKK and John Birch society members) that ya'll are courting in the south.

[Clark2008]

87. He could be from Memphis

They have lots of Democrats over there.
Heck, I even have a Democrat for a state representative and I live in Republican East Tennessee.

[Zynx]

56. You don't care about economic justice at all?

You're a Democrat only because of cultural issues?

[The Flaming Red Head]

99. If they waffle on social issues they waffle even more on economic issues

Those southern Democrats you're talking about in the south HATE poor people, especially women and children; black, white or Hispanic. I've listened to them and watched them for years.

[Czolgosz]

31. Southern Democrats should nominate Democrats. We lost the South

over civil rights during the Johnson administration. It was the right thing to do notwithstanding the political cost. We will get the South again without pandering to hatred just as Carter and Clinton won parts of the South without pandering. Being pro-life doesn't mean being anti-Democrat.

Much of the pro-life community is also against unnecessary war (and opposed the Iraq war), against the death penalty (and Bush has the bloodiest hands of any politician in America), and against abortion but values the mother's life as well as the fetus's potential life and also understands that there are ways to minimize the number of abortions without intertwining our laws with their religious beliefs (the abortion rate fell during Clinton's pro-choice presidency and rose in Bush's pro-poverty presidency).

Much of the pro-gun community favors reasonable laws such as the limit on assault weaponry and waiting periods for background checks (the NRA does not speak for all gun owners).

The Democratic party is not anti-God and I resent the suggestion that it is. Neither is the Democratic party anti-military.

Finally, many Christians do not oppose civil unions and even the anti-gay elements of the South are largely a demographic anomaly that will diminish over time (young Southerners are not nearly as opposed to equal rights as their bigoted parents).

There are hundreds of Democrats holding elected office in the South. You don't have to be a dick to get elected in the South; that only gives you a head start and a built-in constituency.

[Mike L]

37. I will speculate that you don't live in the South, since

you obviously don't understand its culture or politics (except for what happened during the Johnson administration).

"even the anti-gay elements of the South are largely a demographic anomaly that will diminish over time"

How long will it take for those "anti-gay elements" to diminish in the Northern, Midwestern and Western states where the gay marriage bans passed? "Demographic anomaly"?

[retread]

48. "anti-gay elements of the South" will never diminish as long

as people go to church and hear their preachers rail against the "sin". I can't speak for Northern, Midwestern or Western states at this time, only my corner down here. I'm telling you, bigots are everywhere and they have been emboldened.

[KnowerOfLogic]

124. Actually, they will, as a result of the example of the other states.

Conservatives are very emotion-based people, and they tend to irrationally accept whatever they're "comfortable" with. The more gay rights advance in other states and become part of the popular culture, the more the south will be exposed to it, whether they like it or not, and their ideas will gradually change. Surveys always show the young are more open to gay rights. It's more important to advance the rest of the nation first; the south will follow sooner or later.

[Mike L]

130. "other states"?

What other states, Massachusetts? 75% of the population of the "other states" voted against gay rights.

[KnowerOfLogic]

145. Uh, i'm talking about in the future. Which way do you think this

issue is going to go in the long term? I'll tell you. Just as surely as the sun is going to shine, it is going to go the blue way, like every other social issue. Sure, there are always last ditch efforts by social conservatives to forestall the inevitable; it is none the less inevitable that equality will come for gays. I ask you, why were there no anti-gay marriage ammendments 50 years ago? Because no one would have ever dreamed that gay marriage had the tiniest possibility of ever happening at that time. Social conservatives see the writing on the wall, and they're trying to prevent the hands on the clock from going forward. they will fail, of course.

[Mike L]

154. You mean loooooooong-term.

I don't think we can afford to be the minority party in Congress for 50 years.

[Perky]

34. Howard Dean was right

We should go after Bubbas with dixie decals on their Pick-up trucks.

How many laid off textile workers in NC voted for Kerry?


In the culture of the SOuth...the Stars and Bars are not about Slavery...they are about liberty and about being a rebel.., It about no yankee liberals gonna tell me how to run my life.

It is not all that different the state motto of NH "live Free or die"

It would have been a fascinating discusion to have. But the liberals were aghast that Howard could even attempt to approach peoplelike that. They pretty much forced Howard to apolgize.

[quaoar]

38. Amen to that

In the culture of the SOuth...the Stars and Bars are not about Slavery...they are about liberty and about being a rebel

Precisely.

I wish more people understood that.

[charlie]

39. You mean these guys?

Howard Dean has shown exactly the wrong way to restore a Southern Democratic majority, with statements about "guys with Confederate flags in their pickup trucks" that managed to offend everybody, from millions of Americans of every race and region who view the Confederate flag as a symbol of racial oppression to southerners who resent being inaccurately and condescendingly stereotyped. The modern South is not The Dukes of Hazzard.

http://www.ndol.org/ndol_ci.cfm?kaid=131&subid=192&contentid=252174

"Governor Dean ought to be more careful about what he says," Lieberman said. "It is irresponsible and reckless to loosely talk about one of the most divisive, hurtful symbols in American history."

It wasn't just "liberals" who deep-sixed Dean's tentative opening to the Southern voter, moderates were happy to pile on too.

[Mike L]

49. "The modern South is not The Dukes of Hazzard."

Wanna bet?

[charlie]

65. Missing the point

Your contention that it was "the liberals" who made Dean apologize was wrong. Everyone got in on the pile-on, including those centrist "we must win in the South" stalwarts, the DLC.

[Perky]

81. Yeah I will bet

They are conservative and they like to hunt but I lived In GA for 20 years.. In small towns like Montezuma and Dublin but also Atlanta and I can tell you that it is not nearly as redneck as you may think.

To insist that they are ony bears up the reasons the Southerners are hostile to northern Liberals. Arrogant, snoooty and superior.

[quaoar]

57. What does Joe Lieberman know

about the South or the Confederate battle flag?

Not a damn thing apparently.

[KnowerOfLogic]

125. Dean NEVER said or implied that fundamental civil rights issues

should be abandoned in the name of winning republicans over to our side. I think i know exactly what dean meant and i'm in complete agreement; he meant we need to be a lot more clear about what we have to offer in terms of quality of life issues, because a lot of southern repugs don't even know there *is* a difference between us, except possibly that they think we're communists.

[Radical Activist]

129. Dean was right when he said that but

he isn't the right candidate to go after those voters. How is a New England Ivy league millionaire who signed civil unions into law and supported NAFTA when it sent their jobs to Mexico supposed to make that kind of appeal? Dean represents every Republican stereotype about New England liberal elitists. Dean was right about the strategy but Edwards is the right candidate to carry it out. Maybe the south has another economic populist who can do that well, but I don't know who.

[Cheswick2.0]

138. Is that what your Black neighbors think?

I doubt it...but who gives a shit about them right?

[American Tragedy]

43. Not for me

Personally, civil liberties is the single most important issue to me. Everything else is secondary. Thus, what you call half a loaf is a slice to me. Economic justice is almost meaningless to me without personal freedom.

I am unlikely to vote for anybody who supports moral authoritarianism, because I feel that such a vote implies that I find it remotely acceptable. Even though I despise their naive and wildly unrealistic view of economics, I may sooner vote Libertarian in such a situation.

I will only compromise so far - I need a little bit more from a candidate than "I'm really not quite as reactionary as the other guy on some issues".

[Mike L]

50. I like your picture.

Did you know Elvis was a Narc?

[American Tragedy]

100. I did indeed.

I believe that was the purpose of his visit to Tricky Dick. Ironic, considering his own proclivities.

[Mike L]

105. I think he was actually bestowed with an honorary general

"law enforcement" commission. But there was a song about Elvis being a Narc.......

"Elvis was a narc
In rhinestones after dark
He did his best to keep Memphis drug-free
He knew every pill he'd eat
Would be one less on the street
Elvis took 'em all for you and me!"
-Pinkard and Bowden

[Geek_Girl]

52. It's a give and take thing in my opinion

In the deep south we should run a pro-gun rights, pro-strong military. As far as abortion issue run a candidate that supports a ban on partial birth abortions as long as long as the law takes into account of the woman's life. Th position on Gay Marriage should be a state issue. As far as pro-God a guess we should run candidates who are religious but can articulate their position that religion should not be forced upon the general public by the government.

[Mike L]

58. We have this now. It isn't good enough for the deep South.

"As far as abortion issue run a candidate that supports a ban on partial birth abortions as long as long as the law takes into account of the woman's life."

[Geek_Girl]

60. Yes it is

We are talking about Senate and Congressional races right. We need a strong populous message. Keeping jobs from going over seas, cutting health care cost and allowing state funded programs to buy drugs from Canada to cut costs, Education, and cutting off Corporate Welfare. If we do it right we can have the South Blue again. But we will have to have a more social conservative stance on issues and a stronger populous stance on economic issues. As far as foreign policy, we need to remind those in rural communities who is fighting this war and who is being sent off to be slaughtered for a reason that is unknown to the American people. People must be made to realize that Saddam Hussein did not have WMD's and posed no threat to them in Middle America, eventually it will sink in.

As far as a presidential candidate we need to mitigate the liberal demonizing as much as possible. Yes that means we run a Wes Clark or Bob Kerry. Someone that would be very difficult for the opposition to demonize and inspires Americans across the country.

[Geek_Girl]

61. Yes it is

We are talking about Senate and Congressional races right. We need a strong populous message. Keeping jobs from going over seas, cutting health care cost and allowing state funded programs to buy drugs from Canada to cut costs, Education, and cutting off Corporate Welfare. If we do it right we can have the South Blue again. But we will have to have a more social conservative stance on issues and a stronger populous stance on economic issues. As far as foreign policy, we need to remind those in rural communities who is fighting this war and who is being sent off to be slaughtered for a reason that is unknown to the American people. People must be made to realize that Saddam Hussein did not have WMD's and posed no threat to them in Middle America, eventually it will sink in.

As far as a presidential candidate we need to mitigate the liberal demonizing as much as possible. Yes that means we run a Wes Clark or Bob Kerry. Someone that would be very difficult for the opposition to demonize and inspires Americans across the country.

[Cheswick2.0]

139. Oh well too bad

I guess we have to keep losing

[Zynx]

55. We need to win those seats.

Try winning the Congress without those seats. We need a huge tent that includes cultural conservatives. We are a party that unites on economic issues and has trouble when cultural issues are front and center. This is an irrefutable fact. Let me tell you something, if you ran extremely culturally liberal candidates here in Wisconsin and all they were voting on was cultural issues, you would get only 40% of the vote here.

[fujiyama]

149. How does Fiengold do it?

He's liberal on cultural issues as well as economic issues - and he kicked his opponent's ass and won the race by 10 points while Kerry won it by only 1.

[ulysses]

66. "I doubt the populous will ever change the way they think."

This against all evidence that people do, over time, change. Hey, you be you.

[Mike L]

70. Where do you live?

[ulysses]

72. Atlanta.

:)

[Mike L]

74. Atlanta? OK, I knew you didn't live in the South.

Move out to Stone Mtn or somewhere like that to see what it's like.

[ulysses]

75. I was waiting for that.

I have lived in Stone Mountain...and Chamblee...and Fairburn. I've taught in a private school in Lawrenceville. I've worked on my mother-in-law's rental house in Griffin. My wife's family has a lake house on Lake Sinclair, and there's family in Millegeville, Eatonton, Macon, Columbus. Spare me the bullshit.

[Mike L]

77. How long do you think it will take you to "educate" those homophobic,

God fearing, anti-choice, gun nut, rednecks in GA?

[ulysses]

78. I never said I knew how long it would take,

but make it a thousand years and it still beats the hell out of agreeing with them.

[Mike L]

79. I disagree. I'd rather have the benefit of the economic votes on trade

and workers' rights, and the benefits of majority status in Congress NOW.

We won't be giving up anything in the South for 40- 50 years. At that time, we can switch back.

[ulysses]

83. huh?

Dixiecrats are falling over themselves to support workers' rights?

[Mike L]

96. They would be if they had candidates who also supported their

cultural views. As it is, they vote culture over their own economic interests.

[ulysses]

118. what are you basing that on?

Ban gay marriage and what, unions spring to life in the "right to work" south? Sure.

[Mike L]

131. Common sense and a lifetime of experience gained by being born and

raised in the most conservative state in the Confederacy.

[ulysses]

144. your "common sense" tells you

that our abandoning social issues will suddenly make the "right to work" south all hot for workers' rights? What are you smoking and can I have some?

[Cheswick2.0]

137. and those are the idiots we should cater to?

Come on Mike, statistics show that people do change and it can be in as few as a couple of years. You have swing voters in the south too you know.

[Geek_Girl]

68. I think we have to stop and think

What does the party want to stand for? If it's just pro-choice, gun control, gay rights, and separation of church and state we will never win again and we mine as well pack our bags and move to another country. The republicans will beat us black and blue with their wedge issues. Our message our party needs to speak to the necessities of those living in middle America.

Fiscal Responsibility
Stopping Corporate Welfare
Preventing the offshoreing of jobs
Protecting Constitutional Rights and Civil Liberties
Affordable Health care
Strengthening the SEC
Protecting Social Security
Quality Education to all Americans
Protecting the Environment

These issues should be our focus not just for middle America but all of America.

[BeFree]

69. Nice work, Mike

Read the whole thread.... ya done good.

What everyone seems to forget is the fact that a representative is just that: a represenatative of the people in that district. If the district is X, then it makes sense the rep is gonna be X.

The problem we have to face in the south is negative campaign attacks not being responded too. Seems our guys are afraid to fight back when attacked and southerners dislike yellow dogs, so.

As far as how a candidate should state an opinion on anything that can be used as an attack later, he should not try to explain, rather just make a remark such as: Abortion? Don't like it, who does? Guns? Any law abiding someone who wants one oughtta get him one or two. God? God bless each and everyone of us. Gays? I'm not gay, and never will be.

That's it. Say nothing more about those divisive subjects, and prepare yourself to fire back at attacks that will come your way. Actually, shoot first is an understandable southern position, eh?

[quaoar]

71. You forgot one....

Gun Control? Sure, I believe in it. It's important to hit what you're aiming at.

[Mike L]

76. You guys will think I'm joking if I tell you that right now I have a bible

AND a deer rifle in my truck. Actually, that would be a lie. I have two bibles there. My son left his in my truck after church on Sunday.

[sonicx]

82. i have several bibles in my house right now...

and a rifle in my mom's closet (hasn't been used in a long time tho)

what's your point?

[KnowerOfLogic]

126. Whatever; i've got a bible on my desk right now. I keep it handy

in case i need some quotes to show people what "Christian morality" is all about.

Oh, and on edit, i've got a gun in my dresser drawer just in case my pitbull doesn't stop the next self-righteous, christian conservative moralist who tries to control what i do in my own home.

[Mike L]

73. "shoot first"

That's always a good strategy for a political campaign. That was something that bothered me about Kerry's campaign. He was always reactive, rather than proactive. He acted like he had it won and just needed to avoid a major F-up. I could tell he has never watched much pro football. "Pre-vent defense" only prevents you from winning the game.

[frustrated_lefty]

80. No.

Let them reap what they have sewn.

Some lessons are hard learned.

From the deep south,

FL

[vetwife]

84. I am a Georgia Gal...gotta tell ya something !

There is something missing in all of this talk. I was born a southern gal and the people down south for the most part are poor and uneducated. But that is only half of the problem. See, in the early 70's. there was a boom of industry that relocated to the South and they were from the North. I know I worked for Corporate America.
Some of the rich Corporations infiltrated the south and this was good for growth and hopeful to end poverty but the southern people continued to be set in that old way of thinking of Yankee vs. Rebel.
They never got over the Civil War. I was fortunate to have traveled all over the United States and even more fortunate to marry someon who thought like I did. (After 2 attempts at marriage), Now here is my take on the problem. To begin with, the old churches did not buy into that tv evangelistic junk. They didn't. Then we have churches getting larger from big money coming in from probably the GOP, the Falwells, BIG NEW CORPORATIONS, you know the ones. Then the preachers starting talking and spoon feeding the ignorant the same koolaid that the Cable TV Evangelists were doing. Its all Big Corporation.

The Corporations like Coca Cola who has always been BIG ! started using their influence to bring in the Falcons, Nascar, Hockey teams,
and make the little guy with the guns who still holds his bigoted views into the fold. The churches team up with Big Corporations, and play on people's ignorance. There was enough there already but when you add a little change in someone's pocket and tell them they are the MAJORITY.....then they have won the Civil War. Sound crazy?
Well, I have seen people who voted Bush who didn't have a pot to pee in, a job to hold, no food, and loved their guns but these same people's parents voted democrat for years and years. They needed to feel important and Faux and Big Corporations and the takeover of fanatical churches made a way to fit in. Dirt poor. Tonight a black man, and a disabled lady came over to give comfort to my family for our recent loss and he said he was a REPUBLICAN ! I could not believe what I was hearing. This man had been in prison,had lost everything, did not have a job, but said he was a republican because of Pro Life issues and HE had started to church and listen to the TV evangelists. I shook my head and said, Well I am a democrat and if a man who has been treated as badly as you could fall for that shill game, we are in real trouble. Your people are abused, especially by the system, you are out of work and George bush don't care about you. He said, But Pro Life. I asked, "Do you believe in war" and he said yes and I said, Talk to me about pro life then? Then he said that the Big Corporations were going to give him a chance at a good job. I was at a loss for words. I think the majority of southern people are gullible and ignorant but have pride. Pride comes before a Fall. They need educating but as long as big money and the churches are defrauding, I don't know. I still say all the blue states should move South and change the voting ways and educate folks. FIRST MAKE THE VOTES COUNT ! Seriously, I can't get through and many other liberals can't. So I say PLEASE TAKE OVER THE SOUTH ! For the good of the country. It will all go red just like the South if something isn't done. Grass roots, not big corporations, that is where a lot of this started. All that tithing to the churches for a GOP vote ! My take and I have worked and lived in the south 54 years.

[Mike L]

102. There is a lot of wisdom in your post.

The men who really run the GOP (corporate America) don't give a damn about "family values", abortion, gay marriage, etc. They only care about increasing their profits and reducing their taxes. But they are smart enough to use these cultural issues as window-dressing to bring in votes for Repug candidates.

Dems must get off their ideological 'high-horse' and forget about being purists in the South before it's too late. Principles are worthless when you lose all the time.

[vetwife]

106. Thanks MikeL You said it shorter than me but you now have the picture !

I really think that is what is happening here.

[marions ghost]

116. Vetwife speaks Truth

I've read all these posts here. Good dialogue. I think vetwife speaks well to what's at the core of the Right's appeal to the poor and ignorant in the South.

Yes "economic solutions" are key. But as she points out, the Right has provided a sense of belonging and empowerment to large segments of downtrodden people--without even bothering to give them real benefits. Sure these folks are buying a myth, but often myths will sustain us in hard times.
----------------------

My thoughts after many years in the South:

1. Democrats in the trenches of the South need to be very strong now, and call these Republican tactics what they are. Do not try to appeal by wormy Repub-lite tactics. Be real.

2. If elections could really be made less open to corruption, I think you might find a different story going on in the South, as well as other parts of the country. As vetwife says, MAKE THE VOTES COUNT. Priority #1.

3. I suggest to all--to look for clues to these Q in the "Red Areas" of your own state--north or south, east or west. This is really a national phenomenon. Let's not get too hung up with the civil war analogy. The future is truly purple, y'all.
--------------
Study the TRUE election maps at:
http://www-personal.umich.edu/~mejn/election/

You will be surprized how much blue there is where you didn't think it could be....and this is in an election where we KNOW that Democratic voting was suppressed.

[fujiyama]

151. Interesting post

Especially about the unholy alliance between the Church and corporate America.

Another poster from SD made a point how many poor people vote not on their own economic situation, but on how they WOULD vote, if they had more money - and many believe that someday they'll be rich.

As you said, it's all about pride. It's the same reason we as a nation have such a high credit card debt. It's all about keeping up with the Joneses and that's because of this faux pride.

[LimpingLib]

90. We nominate candidates that the corperations and DLC say we should.

End of discussion.

[okieinpain]

91. oklahoma gov. oklahoma gov. oklahoma gov. oklahoma gov.

yes, we can take seats, and not be a total repuq clone.

[juslikagrzly]

93. I agree with you to some extent, BUT

he's pretty invisible most of the time and even he was surprised he got elected over Largent. I held my nose and voted for Carson because we needed the seat in the Senate, but damn it was hard. His commercials were enough to make you scream. "Look at me, I'm not a liberal, Bush likes me".

I somewhat agree with some of these posts about trying to appeal to enough people in order to get elected, but isn't that part of what's wrong with our system. Why don't we at least try to run someone who speaks the truth of what they believe instead of telling us what they think we want to hear?

We need to BE democrats, not just say we are.

[LimpingLib]

94. 43% of the vote.3rd party taking from GOP.Plus a right wing nut opponent.

And he won that race by supporting cock fighting.Even his Republican opponent supported those minor rights for animals.

Disgusting.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

98. Bob Graham Was Largely Correct On The Issues You Cited And He Won

Consistently...

We can put FL, VA, and AR in play without emulating the Pugs...

[charlie]

101. Eggs-zackley

Old Bob's a screaming liberal measured on the Southern scale. And he's beloved as all get-out down there. AAAND he's got a hard-on for Bush and doesn't let that support-the-prez guff deter him.

I expect Mike will be along shortly to remind us again that Florida isn't part of the south.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

104. I Live In Orlando...

Florida is a gray state...

It's more like Cali than Mississippi but it's more like Virginia than New York...


It really is a centrist state that tilts ever so slightly Republican but the right Dem can put in play...

As I said the right Dem can put FL, VA, and possibly AR in play...


We hold most or all the red states and that's the ballgame....

[WI_DEM]

110. I thought most of our candidates from the south are "culturally

conservative"?

[Done]

111. The democrats have given up on the south

It's hard to win if you don't campaign. I realize that moderates and liberals are outnumbered, but the real problem the democrats have had is a declining turnout in the black community. There are moberates and liberals in the south, and there is a large black community - enough for the democrats to win. The democrats have got to stop taking the black community for granted. I would have loved to see John Kerry put an African-American on the ticket. Would it have cost Kerry votes in the south? Only among those who were not going to vote for Kerry anyway.

[Hippo_Tron]

115. We USED to do that

We controlled the congress for 50 years because we had a complete lock on the south. Remember that Strom Thurmond used to be a democrat, as did Richard Shelby. Do Strom Thurmond or Richard Shelby favor the ideals of the democratic party in any way? Although we managed to pass SOME good liberal policy in those 50 years, we never passed the big one, which was Truman's promise of health insurance for all Americans.

[MNBiker]

117. Stop pandering to us with a shotgun.

We Southern Dems (Florida)don't want to own single shot shotguns. We own pistols and rifles too. Whenever I see a candidate with a shotgun I say you idiot "You just lost some more votes". Better not to be seen with a gun at all then to be seen with a shotgun. Don't bother to argue with me, go to a gun club and find out for yourself.

[Radical Activist]

128. Yes, we need economic populists

but what we've been doing is running economic moderates who won't speak out on corporate and economic issues. There's no way we can win if we act like Republicans on both economic and social issues.

We can win by making the elections about something other than social morality issues. I don't think that means we have to run social conservatives. It just means we need someone who knows how to shift the debate to economic issues. When Republicans set the agenda on social issues we lose.

[democratreformed]

132. Vic Snyder.

Congressman from Arkansas. I heard rumors that his race was gonna be close and his seat was in danger b/c of his vote against DOMA. He spoke out against it openly. He voted against IWR. He is very liberal.

He won easily.

I'm not sure what he has that maybe some others don't. I've thought about it some, but not enough to figure anything out.

Oh, except he IS married to a minister.

[Catt03]

142. All politics is local

ask John Breaux or Mary Laundrieu or Bob Graham or Harold Ford

[Bouncy Ball]

146. Lemme tell you about the

bush voting robots in my red state.

They are fuckers. They don't care about you or you or you. And it wouldn't even matter if you were a bush voter, too. They still wouldn't give a shit about you.

They have an extremely limited circle of caring. It involves them and their family. Thassit. If THEY are doing ok, then nothing else matters.

People could be starving in the streets, they really--wouldn't---give--a---shit.

Kids with no health insurance? WHO cares!

Innocent Iraqis being killed? JUST a media lie!

Deficits farther than the eye can see? DOESN'T matter, don't bother me with that, ha ha ha, didja catch that game Monday night?

Air hard to breathe? Water dirty? ANOTHER media lie! If I'M fine, that must mean EVERYTHING'S fine.

It's very ME-centric. The nickname Me-publicans has a very strong basis in truth.

Also, if it's not happening right in front of their fucking noses, it must not be true. Unless it benefits bush, then how dare you question it, you traitorous bastard?

They are, to put it mildly, insufferable. And the Me-publican lawmakers are even worse: flat-out evil.

They take and take and take and take and giving doesn't occur to them. Everyone else is here on earth to serve them. They are mostly emotionally unhealthy and unbalanced and dysfunctional. Not all Me-publicans are total assholes, but I promise you all total assholes are Me-publicans. Not every Me-publican is a huge fucking idiot, but I promise you EVER huge fucking idiot in this country who cast a vote on November 2 was a Me-publican and voted for the Huge Fucking Idiot King.

I've seen all this very up close and personal. From the Me-publican who thinks it's great fun to make fun of black women's names and jokes about "getting the KKK more active" to Me-publicans who are ALL about nothing but making the almighty dollar and you better not get in their way to that almighty dollar or they will fucking mow your ass down in their Hummer. Nothing matters more in life to them than making more money than they do now. If they have to screw someone to get it, well that's too fucking bad. No skin off their nose.

They have no sense of humanity.

How do I know this about all of them? Look what they voted for. All I have to do is look at the policies of the people they vote for to know how they are and how they feel. I don't even have to know any in person, but unfortunately I do. They voted for the person that represents them best. Therefore those are their "values" which are completely screwed up all to hell.

IF there are any Me-publicans with a true sense of compassion, as evidenced by their actions more than their words, if there ARE any Me-publicans that actually care about others, they need to start voting for different people and fast. Because the ones they have make them look like a bunch of assholes.

[Bridget Burke]

153. Yes, concentrate on economic issues.

But aren't you really tossing the other things overboard because you don't care about them, either?