How do I respond to my repuke friend?

[pnutchuck]

I often forward DU articles to my friends and have yet to separate my Dem friends from the repukes. I received this email today from a close friend of mine and wonder if maybe he has a point because the evidence of fraud has yet to be conclusively proven.

"How come liberals are so sure that anything that they don't like is fraud?
Isn't it possible that Berkeley is amongst the fringe and not representative of
the majority of Americans?

It blows my mind, the arrogance and certainty that only there ideas have
validity. That may be why they can't ever seem to accept a reality that does
not land squarely in the narrow boundaries of their nirvana."

[bullimiami]

1. I would tell him I dont care what he thinks about it.

If he cant see the election was funny its not surprising considering he cant see that this administration is twisted.

[Abelman]

2. I have no respect

for people who use the term "liberals" like that. Using it as a label as opposed as an adverb. This may be the meme, but I'm not putting up with it.

[pnutchuck]

What gets me is he is one of the many Americans who have

not benefited from Bush's economic policies. Working temporarily, he receives not health coverage and is often unemployed for weeks at a time. He even supports the war!

[cincinnati_liberal]

3. HAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHA

How do I disect this, let me count the ways. Well, first off, idiots like this shouldn't be your friend, but alas, we all keep one around. This is a can of worms I would love to rant on for years, howeve I'll be brief. Ask him first if he can define the fundamental difference between a conservative and liberal. Then ask him if he knows what a FACT is. I've learned not to deal in opinion with these haughty shits. Show him cold, hard facts. Then, after you do that, remind him the repukes are the CHRISTIAN FUNDAMENTALISTS. WTF does he think is!? 'Arrogance and certainty' are on their goddamn business cards! For a REPUKE to say that to you is grounds for a severe beating. Slip him a ruphie and shave his nuts then glue his pubes to his cheeks to remind him he is a DICK HEAD. Accepting reality is not on the neo-con christian menu, my friend. The fact I share DNA with people like this ass is what blows my mind. Thank him for his 'faith based initiatives' and for his fiscally responsible assholes blowing that 1.4 TRILLION DOLLARS on war when it was for saving health care. Show him US gov't stats off their website and then ask the jackass if that's conspiracy theory.

[Is It Fascism Yet]

15. LOLOLOLOLOLOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I like the share DNA part! LOL.. I know how you feel, but remember, on a molecular level, we are only a couple of molecules away from alge. Lifestuff on the planet is pretty much made of the same stuff as all other lifestuff on the planet. Some lifestuff is just not endowed with intellect. Usually we eat that stuff, but in this case we allow them to run the country.

[Is It Fascism Yet]

4. what are you talking about? of course it's conclusively proven

ask your friend why a computer progammer for florida claims he developed cheating software at the request of repuklikin feeney, and why so many ohio counties had thousands more votes than voters, why my son in maine was denied an absentee ballot in the hospital, so had to sneak out to the polls in a wheel chair, and why a county in south carolina announced they found out their machines counted backward for kerry, and why people never had to wait 6 and 7 hours at polling places before in our entire history. Ask him why the CEO of Diebold swore he'd deliver the vote to Bush, why 80 percent of all american voting machines are made either by Diebold or EES, which, incidently, has Diebold's CEO's brother for a CEO. There are mountains of proof, its overwhelming. Tell your buddy Diebold can't count, and fruad is The Son of A Bush's middle name.

[pnutchuck]

6. If all this is FACT, WTF is the problem?

I'm still having problems wrapping my mind around all of thes 'facts' of voter fraud and no msm reports, everyone claiming non conclusive. I feel like we're fighting a losing battle and I'm in such despair over it.

[Is It Fascism Yet]

14. the problem, of course, is fascist tolatarianism, and OWNED media whores

of course, what else? It's all propaganda, that's the problem.

[drdon326]

5. You dont need friends like that....

tell him to *&($@Y&$%&

[Bridget Burke]

7. Send him this list ....

www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=201&topic_id=5188

Posted by you, compiled by another of your friends.

Perhaps you should bring your friends together for a discussion?

[pnutchuck]

11. that's what I sent him to get that response.

I'm not sure that facts even matter to the repukes that's why I don't know how to talk to them. I actually have several repuke friends and we have a strict no politics rule when hanging out, but me and my big mouth and outrage still tries to turn them back to the "force". Unfortunately, the dark side is very powerful and I get blindly written emails from those who refuse to see the truth. It's gotten to the point that I'm starting to believe that I AM a tinfoil hatter. It won't change my thinking though, I just want to know how do you respond to a friend who thinks you're crazy?

BTW, how did you find my other post? It's a neat trick to throw that back in someone's face, unfortunately that's the cause of the whole thing.

[quiet.american]

8. Surprised

-- you had trouble separating this friend out given his terminology and the referring to liberals as "they." Seems obvious that sending this person something from Berkeley would elicit such a response.

[cincinnati_liberal]

9. UNIX and LSD...

are the only two things to come out of Berkeley and that's not a coincidence.

[AmerDem]

10. your very first problem is

having a repuke as a friend. Why the hell would you call someone who supports voting fraud and invading another country killing at least 100,000 innocent citizens a friend?

Actually, I don't want an answer. This is your lack of judgement.

[pnutchuck]

12. we were very good friends prior to Bush

he even supported Clinton, I don't know where the hell the mind wash came in, but I've been trying to turn him back to the light. I just can't fathom dropping a friend for political reasons, I keep hoping I can bring them to the left point of view.

[seabeyond]

13. the reality fact is

bush stole election in 2000 with brother jeb and was put into office by supreme court regardless of every observations says gore won.

fact is bush has lied continually thru out the last 4 years

fact is the repug as a whole has lied and been crooks

facts are that they suppressed vote, even went to crt in ohio prior to election to legally intimidate voter

fact after fact from long ten hour lines, to reg thrown away, to error after error favoring bush in ohio and across the nation

so as your friend suggest dems are the one that ignore fact, present nothing to suggest there wasnt voter intimidation or theft

when your friend can present some fact on what makes bush honest, walks the christian talk, has morality, without just putting it out and tell me i have to believe this story when i can share fact after fact why i say he cant be trusted, he is incompetent, he does not behave like the christian i am suppose to value, he does not have a ounce of morality

[Bouncy Ball]

16. Tell him to fuck off.

But if you want to be nicer, ask him why he has a problem with every vote being counted and why he hates democracy?

[ailsagirl]

17. Taking it apart...

The first sentence:

How come liberals are so sure that anything that they don't like is fraud?

Who said anything we don't like is fraud (fraudulent?)?
This person is making a spurious assumption and hence it cannot be addressed.

Next sentence:

Isn't it possible that Berkeley is amongst the fringe and not representative of the majority of Americans?

Who said Berkeley was representative of the majority of Americans?
Again, it's a spurious statement/question and, again, cannot be addressed.

Next sentence:

... the arrogance and certainty that only there (ahem... THEIR) ideas have validity.

The thing about liberals is that we accept (at least, we allow for) lots of opinions-- we're free thinkers-- we accept diversity and even dissent. We're PRO free speech. Hence, how can this person say we're arrogant and dismiss others' ideas?? I hate to say it but, frankly, that's more a repug mindset.

Last sentence:

That may be why they can't ever seem to accept a reality that does
not land squarely in the narrow boundaries of their nirvana.

Said the pot to the kettle!! If you want to talk about NARROW BOUNDARIES!!!

As far as "reality" goes, his brings to mind Ron Suskind's in-depth article about this administration published in the New York Times a few months ago.

The aide said that guys like me were ''in what we call the reality-based community,'' which he defined as people who ''believe that solutions emerge from your judicious study of discernible reality.'' I nodded and murmured something about enlightenment principles and empiricism. He cut me off. ''That's not the way the world really works anymore,'' he continued. ''We're an empire now, and when we act, we create our own reality. And while you're studying that reality -- judiciously, as you will -- we'll act again, creating other new realities, which you can study too, and that's how things will sort out. We're history's actors . . . and you, all of you, will be left to just study what we do.''

So, frankly, I think your friend's statements and arguments are spurious and empty and have little, if any, validity.

IMO

[ailsagirl]

18. But there are documented incidents of fraud--

all sorts!! Rampant voter suppression for one. I don't
want to run down the list but there's all sorts of evidence
to show that voter suppression was heavily utilized.

That taints the election-- that makes it fraudulent.

[skippythwndrdog]

19. Take it as an opportunity.

Use it as an opportunity to have an open and honest discussion with him. You'll both probably learn something. Don't make it a debate, and don't try to convert him. Over time, he'll probably come around just by talking to you about his views and your views.