Don't Leave the Party

[Geek_Girl]

I see allot of talk about folks wanting to leave the party. It's pretty clear the DLC is attacking the grass roots and trying to purge the base. Unfortunately I have the feeling many of the democratic politician are following the advise of the DLC to become more republican. Well the party doesn't belong to the politicians or the DLC. It belongs to us! I have made the decision to stay and fight and if I have to I will fight every DLC candidate they throw my way including writing nasty LTE's to local newspapers calling the DLC's candidates "FLIP FLOPPING Frauds" that don't know where they stand on the issue. There's nothing more nasty to a political campaign than to have outspoken members of your own party calling you a fraud and a fake. I'm asking you all to stay and fight. If it means the demise of the democratic party so be it.

[proud patriot]

1. bush made me a Democrat I was green before

I'm not going anywhere .

[autorank]

2. No intention to leave the Democratic Party. Period.

I feel the same way about the party as I do my country. I'll stick around, rattle some cages, and make those who operate in the style of Quisling wish that I were somewhere else...and then, eventually, my views will prevail to some degree. There are a ton of great people in the party and we need to find and use our voices.

[Pirate Smile]

3. Stay and Fight. Sounds like a good motto.

[The Traveler]

4. We don't "purge" that easy, eh?

I was never one to miss a good fight.

[VioletLake]

5. I'm not sure that calling them "FLIP FLOPPING Frauds"

in public forums is a good idea. A tactful approach is preferable. Again, perception is everything.

Add: Save the inflamatory accusations for the Republicans.

[Geek_Girl]

11. I'm not Playing Patty Cakes with the DLC

They are worse than the republicans and deserve nothing but nasty.

[VioletLake]

12. So you're going to join with the republicans in publicly attacking

the Clintons, etc? I'm sure the Republican spin machine will have no trouble putting your "nasty" to use.

[Geek_Girl]

15. If Clinton gets the Nomination in 08

I won't have to say a word. The party will be dead and Karl Rove's wet dream will come true. But as far as the republicans putting my "nasty to use that's what I'm planning on. Like I said I'm not playing patty cake and I'm not leaving the party. Either the DLC backs off or the Dems can kiss their hopes and dreams for '06 good bye!

[VioletLake]

17. Good luck with that approach. n/t

[FightinNewDem]

37. Good riddance with that approach

[Geek_Girl]

41. I'm not going anywhere!

:evilgrin:

[greenohio]

46. Thank God you made this post. There was a total lack of DLC bashing...

for a period there. I was begining wonder if I was on the right board. Now, lets getting back to destroying our own, shall we?

[AgadorSparticus]

56. oh hell why get our hands dirty when we've got the DLC to do it for us?

and it will be done all in the name of party unity. yaaaay! if we are going to self destruct, atleast do it with a pretty face stuck to the front of it. "find my happy place" "find my happy place".....(repeat over and over until you are blissfully numb)

[shraby]

20. They can kiss '06 and '08 goodbye

the machines belong to **

[zulchzulu]

6. By 2008, most of those complaining about Dems will be voting for Dems

Nationally at least...people will be tired of the rRepugs that there will be a political bloodbath.

I tend to have an interest in growing a third party locally...usually Green...but like most Independents, there usually isn't a choice nationally.

Gtassroots political organizing is where it's at anyway...party boundaries get pretty blurred in most cases.

[whistle]

7. Uhmm, democrats becoming republican is like having...

...a sex change operation, what is on the inside can never match what appears on the outside. If that is what members of the DLC are advising the party do, then the democratic party is doomed and I want no part of it.

[Geek_Girl]

10. Why turn tail and Run

Stay and fight and take down the idiots.

[madfloridian]

8. We will work with DFA as we have been doing.

But most likely we will switch out voter registration. We may change our minds if things change here locally. We have seen some signs of it now and then.

Before anyone says stay so you can choose the nominee and decide the issues.....think about it. Our candidate was out of the race way before our primary, and the DNC/DLC does not want to hear our views.

They keep asking for them, but they do not listen.

[Geek_Girl]

9. I'm not sayin we ask the DLC/DNC to hear our views

They won't. I'm saying take them down from the inside!

[Old and In the Way]

13. I'm not a Democrat because of Al Fromm or Peter Beinart.

I'm a Democrat because of people like Franklin Roosevelt, John Kennedy, George McGovern, Fred Harris, Gary Hart, Hubert Humprey, Walter Mondale, Jimmy Carter, Bill Clinton, Al Gore, John Kerry, John Edwards, Dennis Kucinich, Richard Gephardt, Ted and Bobby Kennedy, Tom Daschle, Paul Wellstone, Barney Frank, Mike Dukkakis.....and many, many more whose collective vision stands in stark contrast to those that define winning in terms of shadowing Republicans.

Winning an election without standing for anything is what Republicans do.

[SW FL Dem]

14. I'm not going anywhere

Been a life long Dem. I don't agree with the DLC on much, disagree with the DNC on several issues, but I realize that, right now, there isn't another choice. I am in a state where every vote matters. I have a kid so I can't afford to waste my vote to make a point.

[whistle]

16. So what has the DLC's record been like...

<snip>

The Democratic Leadership Council is an organization of moderate leaders of the United States Democratic Party which works toward moving the Party toward moderate centrist positions. It was called the "Democratic Leisure Council" by the Reverend Jesse Jackson and Mario Cuomo. It is their position that left-wing positions are not politically viable, citing the failed candidacies of George McGovern and Walter Mondale. Bill Clinton, a successful candidate, was active in the organization and is sometimes cited as evidence of the success of their policies. However, then-DLC chairman Joe Lieberman was among the first Democrats to criticize Clinton over the Monica Lewinsky scandal.

Critics cite DLC-supported measures, such as the Welfare Reform Act, as having the effect of alienating the traditional constituencies of the Democratic Party such as labor and minorities, causing an overall reduction in voter turnout. Some contend that 2000 presidential campaign deadlocked because voters could discern no significant policy difference between George W. Bush and DLC activist Al Gore.

Around the start of primaries in the 2004 presidential campaign, the organization voiced concern that the Democratic contenders might be taking positions too far left of the mainstream. Howard Dean, an early front-runner, was specifically attacked by DLC founder and CEO Al From.

<link> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Democratic_Leadership_Council

Stay and fight that? Convince me why any of us liberal minded democrats should play along with this, please.

[Geek_Girl]

18. Fight them! The DLC

From the inside. They've hijacked the party and forcing it more to the right. So take them on any democratic candidate that picks up the DLC "moral values pro-war mantra" sack em write LTE's ect.. and fight them tooth and nail and do so as democrat, it's more effective.

[whistle]

19. I've been doing some research and it is very interesting that...

...the DLC receives a major portion of its funding from:

<snip>

Funding

The DLC and its close associate, the Progressive Policy Institute, are the recipients of grants from many Fortune 500 companies and such right-wing foundations as the Bradley Foundation. Corporate contributors to the Progressive Policy Institute include AT&T Foundation, Eastman Kodak Charitable Trust, Prudential Foundation, Georgia-Pacific Foundation, Chevron, and Amoco Foundation. (17) The Third Way Foundation, an umbrella group of the New Democrats in the DLC, receives funding from the Lynde & Harry Bradley Foundation, Howard Gilman Foundation, Ameritech Foundation, and General Mills Foundation. According to one magazine report, the DLC enjoys funding from Bank One, Citigroup, Dow Chemical, DuPont, General Electric, Health Insurance Corporation, Merrill Lynch, Microsoft, Morgan Stanley, Occidental Petroleum, and Raytheon. (9)

Also, those who reflect the DLC position and those who oppose it from the democratic party are:

<snip>

The DLC comprises three main clusters of New Democrats. The largest is a group of nearly four-hundred national, state, and local legislators and government officials. This contingent includes a wide range of centrist and conservative Democrats, including the following senators who sought the party’s presidential nomination: John Kerry, John Edwards, Bob Graham, and Joe Lieberman.(6) Perhaps the boundaries of the DLC’s political thrust are more precisely demarcated by mentioning prominent Democrats who have not lent their names to the DLC, including such figures as Ted Kennedy, Howard Dean, and Dennis Kucinich.

<link> http://rightweb.irc-online.org/org/demleadcoun.php

You suggest dismantlying that when there is hardly a lick of difference in the democratic party and the republican party? I think it is time for a change, but not the party that has become so infiltrated and corrupted by the evil that is the neo-conservatives of this country. It is time to cultivate a fresh field and plant new seed into fertile ground.

[w4rma]

29. DLC is not the same as DNC. DLC is a group much like the DFA.

Except the DLC is beholden to big buisness interests while the DFA is beholden to individual Democratic interests.

[Geek_Girl]

30. I see what you are saying

But I think that in order for a new party to take hold we need to shut this one down. I'm talking about being a spoiler. Not just voting against their candidates but actively working against them even if it means stooping to GOP levels of dirty politics and name calling. The DLC sabotages your candidates why not sabotage theirs?

[FightinNewDem]

38. Who is the traitor?

Hmmm...sabotage Democratic candidates?

Just how lucrative is it serving on the GOP payroll, GeekGirl?

I guess GeekGirl would have voted for Pete Coors over Ken Salazar.

For Craig Benson over John Lynch.

For Jim Holt over Blanche Lincoln.

For Bush/Cheney over Kerry Edwards and Gore/Lieberman.

I guess she'd like to find some Grover Norquist acolytes who can unseat the ideologiacally impure Janet Napolitano, Kathleen Sebelius, Jennifer Granholm and Mark Warner, the filthy likes of Dianne Feinstein, Blanche Lincoln, and Mary Landrieu.

I am left with two possible conclusions. Either GeekGirl is so naive and uneducated as to the realities of politics that she doesn't realize the lunacy of what she is saying, or she is indeed a Republican plant trying to foment trouble.

[Geek_Girl]

40. Yep

I'm stirring up trouble and Yes I admit it I will be voting for a republican candidate before I vote for another DLC toad. As far as being a republican plant all I can say as I've voted Democrat all my life but I have come to the conclusion that the DLC is taking the party to the hard right. After hearing a certain DLC candidate in my home town that will be running in 06 for Senate seat spout of a bunch of republican talking points and reading about how the DLC is demonizing progressives like myself, I feel that this is what it has come to.

As far as being naive all I can say is this. I live in a very conservative state many of my friends, co-workers and family members voted for Bush and are Christian fundamentalist and the reason why they voted for Bush over John Kerry was for one simple reason. They believed Bush was a man of conviction and they felt they knew were he stood and they saw John Kerry as indecisive flip flopper.

So what is the DLC remedy for this become republicans. Now we'll become the pro-life and anti gay marriage party and flip flop even more on the issues. You think middle America is going to buy that. Who's being naive now!

[FightinNewDem]

35. Glass Houses, Stones, etc.

Since the DLC apparently is to bevillified for accepting corporate money, then maybe it is time to turn the righteous indignation towards some not-particularly-New Democrats...

Eastman-Kodak:

Rep. Bill Jefferson
Rep. Charlie Rangel
Rep. Louise Slaughter
Rep. Eddie Bernice Johnson
Rep. Ben Cardin


General Electric:

Rep. Mark Udall
Rep. Anna Eshoo
Rep. Lois Capps
Rep. Hilda Solis
Rep. Corrine Brown
Rep. John Lewis
Rep. Leonard Boswell
Rep. Julia Carson
Rep. Mike Capuano
Rep. Elijah Cummings
Sen. Barbara Mikulski
Sen. Paul Sarbannes
Sen. Carl Levin
Rep. Charlie Rangel
Rep. Nydia Vasquez
Rep. James Clyburn
Rep. Chris Bell
Sen. Patty Murray


Prudential:

Rep. Donald Payne
Rep. Barney Frank
Sen. Charles Schumer

Ernst & Young:

Rep. Bob Matsui
Rep. Barney Frank
Rep. Bob Menendez
Rep. Frank Pallone
Rep. Edolphus Towns
Rep. Jim Moran

Coca-Cola:

Rep. Ed Pastor
Rep. Xavier Becerra
Sen. Chris Dodd
Rep. David Wu
Rep. Stephanie Tubbs Jones
Rep. Bennie Thompson

FedEx:

Rep. Kendrick Meeks
Rep. Danny Davis
Rep. David Obey
Rep. Tim Ryan
Rep. Albert Wynn

Verizon:

Rep. Vic Snyder
Rep. Juanita Millender-MacDonald
Del. Eleanor Holmes-Norton
Rep. Luis Guitierrez
Rep. Jim McGovern
Rep. John Olver
Rep. Sander Levin
Rep. William Lacy Clay
Rep. Nita Lowey
Rep. Tammy Baldwin

[Geek_Girl]

36. This isn't about accepting corporate money

It's about the DLC's new strategy to attack the grass roots and move the party to the far right on issues like gay marriage and abortion while pretty much keeping in step with republicans on economic issues. When I start hearing DLC politicians start talking like democrats instead of republicans then maybe I'll change my mind. But it's pretty clear where they are taking the party and thats a hard right, meanwhile belittling progressive along the way. So as far as I am considered they have got to go and if that means joining ranks with republicans I will till every last DLC politician is purged.

[FightinNewDem]

48. Evidence?

Please show me a concrete example of the DLC, its leaders, or its spokespersons urging the party to "move to the far right on issues like gay marriage and abortion". Just one example with a verified quote.

Since this is yet another false statement, I will continue to assume that you are nothing more than a Republican troll.

[Yuugal]

51. check out Al From on c-span a week ago

I saw and heard all I needed to from that republican turd. He linked Iraq to 9/11, insulted everyone to the left of Zell Miller, and generally was a belligerent ass. When he said that the gay issue hurt the dems this time he showed his hand. How can fighting for equal rights hurt us.......unless we are trying to be repug-lite?

[eridani]

21. Ignore the national party, then.

Work with your local Dems, with PDA and DFA.

[lojasmo]

22. We would ignore the party at our peril

They will co-opt the grassroots fundraising technique of DFA (remember how john kerry made more money than Bush-guess how!) and groups like DFA will wither and die. Then we will be shut out from the party entirely.

[eridani]

23. So if the grassroots members are pissed off at the national party--

--how do you figure that grassroots based fundraising is going to get anything for DNC? Unless Dean is made chair, they certainly aren't getting any more from me.

[lojasmo]

32. Nor from me....and...

I didn't give a dime to kerry, but he sure ripped grassroots fundraising from the pages of Dean's and Trippi's books. Plenty of democrats will continue to do so as a knee-jerk reaction, and a huge block of grassroots funds that would otherwise go to true progressives will be wasted on DLC stooges.

[sampsonblk]

55. Can't be done

If the national party continues to disrespect the grassroots, who will vote for them?

[Nightwing]

24. Not about to change, EVER

My family and I will never leave the Democratic Party no matter what the future holds. We refuse to move to the dark side filled with hatred, greed, corruption, corporate welfare and a general disdain for anyone or any organization that dares think differently than they.

Besides, Republicans always make me want to :puke:

[Slit Skirt]

25. hey, I am in for fighting

but if they don't start standing up for traditional democratic values we may have to find us a different party! I will never concede to the advice of or become a republican...NEVER....

DLC better get their act together...the people have the power!

[The Flaming Red Head]

26. When the party goes totally over to the pro-lifers and war profiteers

It's not my party anymore. I may never vote Democrat, again and I will educate others in my life not to as well. And I know that they don't need me or my family or friends and could give a fuck about any of US. They're showing their appreciation right now by putting people like me out on the curb.

And I was a yellow dog. Lifetime Democrat who never voted Republican in my life.

[Iris]

27. Ok. I get the spirit of this post, but if the party starts changing

its platform to attract the "right element" or whatever they want to call it, then and I to vote against my own best interests? I have to say I 'd seriously have to start looking at 3rd party candidates or simply do write-ins. I'm not going to give my vote to a party who wants to "purge" me.

[robbedvoter]

28. W made me a democrat, the democrats made me an independent

I know I'll never vote Republican. The rest - is on a one day at a time basis.
meanwhile, the party that rejected it's best candidate for "not pure bloded enough" then put on the ticket two people that shat on my voting rights in 2001, and ignored 2 more stolen elections since, can kiss my ass. They are the middle class party anyway - I don't qualify anymore 9as more and more in this country also won't)

[The Flaming Red Head]

33. The Dems are making me more radical every day

Which is odd because I still view myself as something of a moderate.

[janx]

43. What on earth are you talking about?

?

[robbedvoter]

57. Slower this time: purity tests, party of the middle class BS

I know you missed all the speeches about the middle class thingy, but you seem to be the only one.
And, as others have said, my beliefs never changed, but with the dems pushing the "cemter" to the right, yesterday's moderate is today's radical. Just by standing still.

[Larkspur]

31. I plan on supporting DFA, not the meadhead Dem leaders who are pulling the

Party to the right. I support Howard Dean and his vision for the Dem Party. I will not support the DLC or a DNC run by Repuke-wannabes.

[janx]

44. The DNC called my household at one point,

and I told them that I had supported DFA and would in the future.

[jesusq]

45. Amen! Dean is the man

Howard Dean's greatest fault is that he says these supposedly "outrageous" things that turn out to be our mainstream conventional wisdom 6 months to 1 year later. He is a direct, straight talking man with vision and a commitment to return the government to us unwashed masses. Is it any wonder democratic leaders despise and fear him?

[Tippy]

34. Im not going anywhere....

We can't win by running away I want my Country back...

[greenohio]

39. Uhhh, you mean the left is trying to purge the DLC.

The DLC is Satan on this board and supporters are totally unwelcome....calling them traitors and trojan republicans. I never really thought of Ed Rendell, Diane Finstein, and Chris Dodd as traitors.

[kamqute]

50. The DLC deserves purging

[Pushed To The Left]

42. We need to band together..

Moderates, liberals, disgruntled conservatives, and left-libertarians....anybody who opposes the far right needs to BAND TOGETHER as one anti-right-wing block! The Democratic Party is in the best position to knock out the Republicans, so it is a good place for all of us to be. If you think the Democratic Party is too far to the right, then change it from within! Vote for liberal candidates in the primaries! If all of us who are anti-right-wing stick together, the hardcore conservatives in power won't stand a chance! "The enemy of my enemy is my friend." Let's team up with our friends and destroy our common enemy!

[greenohio]

47. That logic doesn't fly here. Think small tent.

Then they'll like you. Whenever I talk about banding together, getting along, or you know, uniting to win....well... they hate that.

[Forkboy]

54. When have you talked about banding together?

[freelight]

49. We tread a fine line.

I'm not leaving the Democratic Party, for the same reason I'm not leaving the United States: good things are worth fighting for.
We have to be careful who we fight, however, and more importantly, how we fight. In the words of Freidrich Nietzsche, "If you gaze for long into an abyss, the abyss gazes also into you." We can't allow ourselves to use Republican/Rovian tactics.
Sliming our own candidates because they're too moderate (or rather, not Left enough) for us? Isn't that what they did to McCain? Working with Republicans to slime DLC candidates? VOTING for Republicans, even though they're further to the right of the DLC? Are we identical to our opponents? I'd like to think not. I'd like to think that what separates us is our compassion, tolerance, respect for the truth, and a much lesser degree of greed and selfishness (because saying that we're not greedy or selfish at all would be delusional).
DLC members are misguided at best and traitors to the Progressive base at wort. We have to decrease their influence. The difference between the Democratic and Republican parties? They're the ones who are right-wing, not us. They're the ones who believe in having an elite few in power, not us. The Anarchist in me is furious about all this bickering about politics. This isn't about politics anymore, this isn't about political parties or who's "in charge". The DLC has no authority over us. How do we win against them? We are grass-roots. We don't give them our money or our support. We support Progressive candidates. We make sure, on a grass-roots level, that the turnouts at Democratic Primaries and minor elections are significant, and that our fellow Democrats are educated about our candidates and why they should be chosen over the right-leaning DLC candidates. Mind you, this should be easier than convincing Republicans to vote for Kerry, and we've done that too. Look at how much we've bitten into the deep South in this past election. If we can do that, we can sure as hell influence our own party members to vote for our candidates. No smear campaigns, just the truth, and some simple logic. We don't do smear campaigns or at least we shouldn't. Change comes from within: if we're so against Democrats who vote like Republicans, let us first discard all Republican tactics from our playbook.
It's time for a different kind of revolution, and the Left has always been at the head of revolutions. Let's dig up our old playbook and give power back to the people.

[eridani]

52. Dang, that's good!

Nice to have articulate, principled newbies here.

[Geek_Girl]

53. Your Right

I was wrong. I was Just mad I guess and I feel betrayed as well. But I don't think I can bring myself to vote for a democratic candidate who is against my core principles. But thank you for the reality check.

[in_cog_ni_to]

58. IF evoting machines are dumped in the nearest rivers, oceans, lakes and

ponds, THEN I will stay and fight. IF NOT, I will never vote again. I will never donate to a candidate. I will never work on a campaign. EVER. It would all be a waste of money, time and effort. We all know the 2000, 2002 and 2004 elections were stolen. We would be fools to throw our money away, waste our time and efforts. With evoting machines we will have a 100% repuke government FOREVER. If the machines go, I stay. If they stay, I go.