OK--I have something I want to ask the Clark supprters here

[edzontar]

This may be the kind of thing best discussed in PM, but i just have to know

I hope it is not over line and does not get locked or deleted.


So here goes:

I have noticed that many Clark supporters on this board have chosen to include the general's name and/or slogans in their DU forum names.

"Clark4This," Wes4That," etc..

I have not noticed anything like this among the supporters of other candidates.

My question is: What gives?

Am I right to assume--as I have tended to privately--that most of these folks came to DU only after Gen. Clark announced his candidacy?

Or did some, inflamed with passion for their canddiate, decide to change their names to proclaim their new commitment?

Finally: Is it OK to say that I have been a little put-off by this trend?

When I read a post by a person called, say, "ClarkisWinning," I find it hard to think of anyone BUT Clark, and i wonder if the person in question has any deeper or more diverse politcal interests than extend beyond their devotion to this one candidate.

Please, no flame-bait (OK, I can dream, can't I?).

Could you just tell me what I am supposed to make of this unique and unprecedented phenomenon?

Do you think it is an effective communcations tactic for this board?

What will you do if the general does not get the nomination?

Will you stay at DU?

Will you continue to work for the nominee be it Kerry, Edwards, Dean?

If so, will you change your name to reflect your new standard-bearer?

Inquiring minds want to know.

[Frederic Bastiat]

1. Clark supporters are pragmatic

They will support whomever wins the nomination. Personally I would rather it be Clark, Kerry or Edwards that wins the nomination, I cringe at a Dean candidacy but I will support him too.

Been here since 2001

[Qutzupalotl]

2. I've been here awhile

and formerly supported Dean. I like our current field of candidates, and will get behind whoever is nominated.

As for those with Clark in their names, I guess they're ardent supporters. That's a good thing. But from what I understand, most are really ABBers when you get right down to it. They've chosen to support Clark because if nominated, he'll kick Bush's ass all the way back to Texas.

[funky_bug]

6. Oh yes

I'm definitely ABB, but I'll always love Clark, no matter where he goes, and I'll always be married to a freak that feels the same way.

But yeah... ABB!

[funky_bug]

3. Thank you for an open and honest question

I can only speak for myself, but my husband (one of your peeved Clark4 guys) had been a lurker at DU for awhile... actually back when Edwards announced and we were first leaning toward him... then for awhile after we went toward Wesley Clark. He didn't actually sign up for DU until the flame wars began. I think (bless his heart) he thought that he had some new insight to share, some positive words of encouragement for other supporters... whatever it may be. When he chose his name, he went for his affiliation.

Likewise, I signed on (and became a DU donor) in December. My reason was to become involved in some political debate and to get to know the process better. I too went with a candidate-based moniker.

I suppose, from your point of view, it would have been less offensive to choose a name that reflected party values, or even personal hobbies, but alas, the spur of the moment won over.

I respect your feelings, and appreciate your candor.

Robin

[edzontar]

10. Thanks for the candid answer.....

This time, for once, i meant no flame bait.

[funky_bug]

15. You're welcome

And I could see that from your post. In the end, my friend, I believe we will all be friends again.

Races and allegiences are ugly things. They do bring out the worst in many of us.

[in_cog_ni_to]

4. Question.

Why do you care when they chose that name, or why they chose that name, or when they came to DU or how long they have been on DU? The important thing is.....they are here. They are Democrats and they support Clark. I see "Kerry" names, "Edwards" names..."Kucinich" names, why have you singled out "Clark" supporters?

[Name removed]

5. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[edzontar]

13. Possibly so--but I am trying to communicate this time--not to bash...

This is something that been discussed off the screen.

I thought it might be elucidating to bring it up, just to see what people have to say.

[edzontar]

46. I did not alert this.

nt

[West Coast Democrat]

50. I hope not

because I have noticed that you Do post about Clark an awful lot!

[Democrats unite]

7. check out my name...

doesn't doesn't even come close does it? I am here for the long haul, whether it's Clark or not. DU is my home on the forum boards. this may shock you, but I do not post on the official Clark web site, I like to hear different opinions. And where I stand on ABB I know you saw this thread.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=146857&mesg_id=146878&page=

As for supporting another candidate other than your own (after reading posts here this morning) That question should be asked of another candidates supporters.

[tishaLA]

8. Well, I don't have a Clark in my name

and I am first and foremost a supporter of Dems--I first found DU not because of Clark, but because of the CA recall (I think) and because of leftie blogs, which I began devouring before the war.

It's OK to be put off by the naming trend. No worries from me.

And of course I intend to help the Democratic candidate, even though I don't like loyalty oaths. I really like Kerry, too, and I think Dean has been valuable to the party during the primary and he provides us with a good rallying point.

[funky_bug]

12. Oh yes, loyalty oaths

I don't participate in them either. I thought, being that this is DEMOCRATIC underground, that it was given.

[mmonk]

9. ardent supporters I guess

I'll vote for the nominee even if it's not Clark. Can't speak for why those that have Clark in their name do so. I don't think it's any kind of plot.

[BeyondGeography]

11. Don't worry, we're transferable

Our candidate never has/will claim otherwise.

And check out my name.

BTW, you are vociferously anti-Clark. You might have included that in your post.

[edzontar]

17. I know I have been very anti-Clark lately...I admit it.

My ABC posts and the like.

But much of this had been me being reactioanry and pissy.

I am actually trying to communicate today...and why not?

[funky_bug]

19. Bravo!

Hey, we've ALL been reactionary and pissy! Good for you for being open-minded and honest. If you are ABC, that's cool (I mean, it hurts ME, 'cause I love him and all, but I respect opposing opinions, if they're done with honesty, integrity, and respect).

[edzontar]

27. We shall see. I am letting it rest till NH is over.

Then things will become a little clearer.

[Clark Can WIN]

39. I have seen other candidate names too but since you asked

I once considered supporting Dean and was sent here by a Dean person (who already know I had switced, btw). I was involved with the Draft Clark movement and chose my moniker before my guy was even in the race. Will I keep it? Only time will tell. If Clark doesn't win the nomination it doesn't really change my conviction that he's the guy that CAN win. Hopefully I'll not have any reason to consider changing it.

If not, I'm packing up that crystal ball and sending it back to the great Zantoobi. Hasta pronto.

[Leilani]

51. I Lurked here really long

I was so upset at the Bush cabal.

This is the 1st & only place I have ever posted.

I'm supporting Clark because of him, but mostly because I what I think is his electability vs Bush. Beacuse I am desperate to get rid of this administration; they are dangerous.

I have tried to be positive towards other campaigns; last nite posted to Kerry, Dean, Edwards supporters.

And Regardless of who wins, I am ABB.

[Rowdyboy]

14. How people choose to identify themselves is personal

I really don't care much unless they're funny which is great!

[edzontar]

18. Just curious--it is a unique phenomenon...

And has provoked much backstage discussion.

[maddezmom]

16. interesting question

didn't you say this am, that you couldn't support Clark?

[edzontar]

22. Yeah, I was pissed about last night's bashing threads

About Dean beinginsane, etc., which included many self-identified clark supporters.

I am trying to calm down and thought this was an interesting, if somewhat "taboo" question.

[maddezmom]

26. well, I think you'll find that most Clark supporters are ABB

and it's a new day for your guy, don't lose hope.:)

[edzontar]

28. Yes, I have noticed that.

nt

[SEAburb]

37. I don't blame you for being pissed

It was tasteless and uncalled for. That kind of crap is counterproductive and only serves to alienate potential Dem voters. We shouldn't be creating riffs between candidate supporters that can't be mended.

[edzontar]

20. I'm going to confess I've been very negative about Clark,,,but

Please, this is my stupid attempt to re-open communication with the "good guys" on your side.

I have been battered and offended by the "Stop Dean"/Clark is the only hope threads, but I did notice that several of your candidate;s supprters took the time to be garcious last night.

[mmonk]

23. I do hope we all take the high road at some point

Everyone needs to envision GW's face and that might do it.

[West Coast Democrat]

24. I am a Clark-Supporter, and I don't even use his photo

nor do I have a Clarkie screen name. Furthermore, I was happy with Kerry's win yesterday---I was a Kerry-Supporter before Clark entered the race, and I don't see a nasty rivalry between the two, although some will try to create one. I don't even understand why Dean-Supporters seem to be so anti-Clark.

The bottom line---I will support whomever the nominee is.

[BeyondGeography]

34. Fair enough, Edzontar

Look, we're not all going through a toy soldier obsession on the Clark side. None of us are, in fact. We're sick of getting hammered by the Pubbies on God and Country, especially when most Americans agree with us on social issues. The media focuses on the former, and the Democratic Party finds itself locked in a box. It's bogus, but we're successfully painted as a bunch of whiny freaks. We see Clark as our get-out-of-jail-free card. Is he perfect? No. Does he add much to our party? We strongly believe he does.

It's an old American story. Even when we find ourselves misled into war, the sheeple stand by their President. If not Clark, then Kerry. We can't run a military and foreign policy novice this year and expect to win. Just one man's view. But, let it be clear, WE WANT TO WIN.

[PatrioticOhioLiberal]

21. People choose screen names

for a number of different reasons would be my guess. Some want to show their support for a candidate in that name, some don't.

You have to admit, Wes Clark is a nice short name that can be "worked into" a number of interesting "handles".

My question would be...why does it matter and why does it bother you? I guess I just don't understand your seeming objection to the practice.

It's like asking folks, "why did you name your kid (fill in the blank)." Something most of us would never think of doing, unless we really liked the name that is. LOL

[edzontar]

25. I am honestly curious...really....

I mean, if I decide to switch candidates, or my guy loses, I can just keep on as old crabby petulant edzontar.


If a Wes-name person faces the same dilemma, there is still this whle name-issue.

Seemed odd to me, so I asked.

[West Coast Democrat]

30. I was on DU long before any candidates declared!!

So choosing a Clark screen name just wouldn't have been a possibility for me!

[edzontar]

32. Yeah--that is why i asked..maybe the name-names folks are just more recent

Not geezers like myself.

Do some of the names come direcrly from Clark blogs, perhaps?

[tishaLA]

38. Maybe they do. I've never been to it

but even if they do, I don't think it's a problem.

[Leilani]

53. I've never been to the Clark blog

I didn't even put Clark's name up until last week.

[PatrioticOhioLiberal]

56. Fair enough

curiosity is a good thing. And you've posed a good question about the name change thing.

I guess time will tell the answer to that one. :-)

[Mattforclark]

29. I first tried to get my 'standard' handle, but it was taken

by one of the ~30,000 other DU members. So I figured I would be Mattforclark. I found DU a little before Clark announced, but lurked for a while. I am ABB. Yes, I will most likely stay.

[Eurobabe]

31. honest question, honest answer

okay, i was on here for awhile before under a different name. followed clark during the summer, and changed my handle after he officially announced.

i think WC is the one to beat bush, that's why i did not throw my energies behind anyone until he decided to run. he is my first, my only, but I will vote ABB. we need to win in november. i believe wes is the one to kick W's ass back to texas.

[copithorne]

35. I've been here a while

I like using the Clark graphic because supporting Wesley Clark for the nomination is my identity as a Democrat right now. I used to support Howard Dean.

Of course I'll support the nominee. They are all great guys.

I think Wesley Clark is the best candidate. He'll make the best president. He will be the strongest to defeat George Bush. He's a gift to the Democratic party and if we can accept the gift, we'll change a lot in this country.

[jmaier]

33. Edzontar

I can't speak for other Wes Clark supporters because I actually use my real name but I have noticed the phenom as well. I can only assume that most of these folks are Du'ers post 9/17/03, as am I for that matter because I wasn't aware of the forum until a Kerry supporter at Kos pointed it out to me.

From what I have seen here loyalty thread after loyalty thread, it appears to me that Clark supporters are ABB -- even many of those sporting 'Clark' in their usernames. I think it would be more prudent not to advertise your candidate in your username but it really shouldn't matter too much. What is annoying is that so few posters (on all sides of the candidate spectrum) should be so impolitic to spout off on anti-candidate threads OR just as bad, imo, is to deposit lovely little negative messages on other pro-candidate threads in drive-by comments.

In the big picture, what happens here isn't going to have any measurable outcome on primaries or the GE but it would be nice if we could have mostly semi-rational discussions of issues, candidates, etc. without some visceral need to get mean-spirited. I, for one, never launch an attack thread, I won't even post a negative article of another candidate (a less overt form of negative thread posting) from either a reputable or irreputable source. I will, however, try to defend Wes Clark against unwarranted attacks or misleading posts.

If Iowa told us one thing (from a voter's perspective), they want to beat Bush and prefer positive messages to negative messages. You'd hope that we can learn lessons here!

[BootinUp]

36. I guess the reason I picked this

username is that I really felt he was that good of a candidate that I wouldn't have to change the name. Was that naive? yes. I would hope it is not offensive. I mean...Can't we all just get along regardless of usernames. :)

I had never heard of DU until late September on a grassroots Clark blog. I lurked for a while and registered in October.

Will I remain a DU'er should he loose? yes. Will I change my username in that event? probably yes.

[WoodrowFan]

40. Not Just Clark

It's NOT unique with Clark supporters. I looked under "Profiles" and found more than 20 nicks starting with "Dean" (not counting the negative ones). It's not just Clark supporters who are doing it, but those who joined the DU in the past few months who feel strongly about a candidate.

[Bread and Circus]

41. Because it sounds good, trust me, there is no conspiracy

[youngred]

42. some of those came before Clark entered the race

some afterwards, but it is an interesting question

[democratreformed]

43. Don't have Clark in my DU name

but I am a Clark supporter. I would like to answer some of you questions that are not about the name.

First off, I did come to DU after Wes announced (September). That's only b/c "Leadership for America" - Wes' discussion board was decommisioned. In a search for other places where I could participate in discussion, one of the ones I found was DU.

I will not flame you for being put off by the names b/c I can understand your point. My name is pretty stupid too. I am absolutely no good with names. I tried to copy my sister's "ladyreformed" but put in the wrong e-mail and had to make up another one.

If Wes Clark does not get the nomination, I will stay at DU if I have time. After all, we have many local, state, and other national elections that we have to work on for Democrats. I've also become actively involved in my local Democratic club and am hoping to do lots of good work to rebuild my county into the Democratic majority it once was. Then, it's on to the state level. And, reelection for my Congressman Vic Snyder.

I will continue to work for the Democratic nominee - no matter who it is. I want to win. I want a trustworthy leader. I want to be free from the stupid fear that the Bush admin. perpetuates every single day. I want to quit worrying that the next Great Depression can begin at any moment and that I or my newlywed daughter will be without a place to live and food to eat. I want to quit worrying about all the people around me who keep losing their jobs. I don't want to have to worry that my son-in-law may be drafted. I know that NO candidate can fix everything right away. But, I do believe that only a Democrat has the necessary values to even care enough to try.

[TacticalPeek]

44. "What will you do if the general does not get the nomination?"

Maybe change my name to ShouldaBeenClark? :)

Seriously tho, I'm gungho ABB, as is almost every Clark supporter I've seen comment on it here.

And there are several other 'candidatenames' posters, and I believe they predate the Clarknames. Obviously there has been a flux of many in the last months for Clark, which is cool with me. Open forum for dems, etc.

I do appreciate your wonder and worry about commitment to the ticket. I don't believe many if any are here window-shopping, only to float over to Bush or (shudder) Nader, etc. I think a lot of Clark supporters are very strongly ABB, and that is the reason they have gravitated to Clark, thinking him to be both palatable and the best opponent to shred aWol and recapture Congress.

[edzontar]

47. Thanks to my colleagues for being civil and forthcoming

On a very tough day for many of us.

ed

[LTR]

45. About my moniker

I was going to vote for my dog, but being only two years old (or 14 in dog years) he did not qualify for president.

So I guess I had to choose between the 10 people running. I agree with Clark on more of the issues, and also think he can beat Bush.

Hell, my dog could probably beat Bush.

I switched my avatar and my sig to Clark to show my support during the primaries.

[theboss]

48. They are probably recent members.

I joined here in June and still feel some resentment for not being an oldtimer. My one complaint about this site is how unfriendly it can be to newcomers. I understand there is a lot of paranoir about Freepers and the like, but it really makes it difficult to get comfortable here if you haven't been a member for years.

Anyway, election season always brings new people to the party. And this people are often drawn by one candidate. As a Dean person, you should see this phenomenom everyday as so many of Dean's supporters are new to politics. This is a very good thing. New blood is needed.

Once the election is over, a lot of these newcomers will go more than likely. But some of them will stay.

"And so it goes, this thing of ours." - Paulie Walnuts

[DancingBear]

49. I went with the tried and true Captain Kangaroo character

It was either that or Banana Man, and I would have been explaining that one for years.

As for the Clark monikers, I think it may have something to do with the whole concept of us ASKING him to run. We really feel a bond with him - perhaps that reflects on some of the names.

I do know that we will stand behind whomever is chosen, although it's no secret we feel the General can best take it to the phony.

Thanks for the efforts at civility - I'm sure last night was a bitter pill, and for you to take the high road today speaks well.

Threads like these are kinda nice every once in a while. :)

[wyldwolf]

52. There are many here with "Dean" in their name...

check the profiles...

Dean
Dean Button
Dean Liberal
DEAN1
Dean1960
Dean2Dean
dean4america
dean4president
Deananita
deanbeers
deandem215
deandream8
deandream9
deane
Deaner1971
deanhead87

... many more.

How active are they? I dunno!

[Crunchy Frog]

54. My user name is

a Monty Python reference, and I have no intention of changing it regardless of primary or election outcome.:)

I did only register recently, and after I had become a totally committed Clark supporter, but I first found and started lurking on this site last March. At that time my main preoccupation was the war in Iraq, and this seemed like the best site for getting accurate information, and discussion by people who felt the same way I did.

I also learned all kinds of new things about the nature of the current regime that I hadn't known about before, such as PNAC.

If I had registered in the spring or early summer, I would have registered as a Dean supporter. I learned about Clark, and the draft Clark movement from reading this site, and through links from this site. I have gone through a gradual progression in my evaluation of the candidates and I now think that Dean is a weaker candidate than I believed previously. He has therefore gone from my 2nd choice to my 4th, after Kerry and Edwards. This reevaluation hasn't been easy or comfortable for me. I don't engage in any bashing of other candidates unless I've become very defensive from the bashing of my own. Even then, I don't go out of my way to post negatively, and I think you can see that if you look at my past posts.

Sometimes I am embarrassed by the behavior of some of the other Clark supporters, as I am sure you must be by some of Dean's supporters.

Although he is now my 4th out of what I consider to be the viable candidates, I will strongly support Dean if he gets the nomination, and hope for the best.

I have no intention of leaving, I would have eventually registered on this site even if I had never heard of Clark. My avatar and sig line, as well as my postings reflect the fact that my current preoccupation is with the Clark candidacy, but that will change, whether or not he gets the nomination, and does or doesn't win the presidency.

I find myself somewhat put off with the "there goes the neigborhood" type of posts concerning new members who are Clark supporters. I have noticed that new members who support other candidates don't get the same type of scrutiny and that kind of bothers me. However, I know that this will pass and I will eventually be seen as a regular member of this board.

I have realized that you need a thick skin to be here, especially during primary season if you feel strongly about a particular candidate.

That is my long and rambling answer to your question.

[MoonRiver]

55. I've been on DU long before Clark announced.

Check me out if you doubt this. I was initially a Dean supporter, then a Clark supporter with Dean #2. Then, Kerry became my #2 and Clark is still my #1 choice. I wish like heck that Clark had gotten in earlier cause I don't think anybody would have had a chance against him if he had. I believe he's the most perfect in terms of values and positions, as well as 'viable', candidate. Clark is the person I would choose in an ideal world to be my President and Commander in Chief. I'm a liberal who has a dad who fought in WWII and a mom who was a WAVE in WWII. Maybe that gives me a fondness for military guys and gals, although before Clark I would not have said so. Anywho, that's my story. Clark's my guy, but Kerry will do just fine also!

:bounce:

[Bundbuster]

57. I was at DU long before Clark's candicacy

and have no aviatar or name to signify my support for Wesley Clark. As my name implies, my overwhelming priority is the removal of the current Junta/bund/reich, and I have pragmatically decided that Clark has not only the best chance of doing that, but also carrying Conressional coat tails as well.

If I did have an avitar or insert, it would be the one below.

[NV1962]

58. I'd say...

Edzontar, thanks for the opportunity to communicate and exchange ideas and opinion. I appreciate that very much.

> My question is: What gives?
No idea - registered this to identify state of residence and year of birth...

>Am I right to assume--as I have tended to privately--that most of these folks came to DU only after Gen. Clark announced his candidacy?
Don't think so, some perhaps, others simply wearing support on their sleeve.

>Or did some, inflamed with passion for their canddiate, decide to change their names to proclaim their new commitment?
Some perhaps. Don't know...

>Finally: Is it OK to say that I have been a little put-off by this trend?
Why not: if that's how you feel, then by all means. We're all human, and ignoring that would make this place uninteresting.

>Could you just tell me what I am supposed to make of this unique and unprecedented phenomenon?
I thought you said "Finally" earlier! Hehehe. My take is that it's a minority phenomenon, which became visible during a phase of the elections where a very broad group of Democratic contenders at least have decent papers. Spurred by the moment. Watch the primaries evolve past the nomination, and it'll be back to "normal" - whatever that is supposed to mean.


>Do you think it is an effective communcations tactic for this board?
Effective only in that it clearly flags the "die-hard" supporters. For the rest, about as "useful" as wearing a campaign badge as avatar (cough, cough)

>What will you do if the general does not get the nomination?
Get over my major disappointment, and move on to back the nominee to get Bush ejected.

>Will you stay at DU?
Probably. I think I'm liking this place.

>Will you continue to work for the nominee be it Kerry, Edwards, Dean?
Yep. But no more allegiance polls / questions!!! Arrrggggghhh...

>If so, will you change your name to reflect your new standard-bearer?
Nope.