What is "anti-American" ?

[kentuck]

A caller to C-SPAn this morning questioned Howard Zinn's patriotism and said he was "anti-American". As usual, Mr Zinn explained rationally to him and other viewers that there is a difference in being "anti-government" and "anti-American". In fact, the "government" itself, may be "anti-American", if they do not pursue policies in the interests of the people, Mr Zinn noted.

It is not "anti-American" to be against illegal invasions of other countries. It is not anti-American to support healthcare for our people. It is not anti-American to be against "tax cuts" that give our wealth to the top 1%.

In fact, it is those that support such policies that might be "anti-American". Simply supporting George W Bush does not make one pro-American. Simply supporting the war in Iraq does not make one more pro-American. In fact, it is probably the exact opposite.

[GreenPartyVoter]

1. "Anti-American" = "Not just like meeee!"

Whiny so-n-sos

------------------------------------------------------
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[OneMoreDemocrat]

2. At the great risk of being a 'Ditto-Head'....................

I simply couldn't agree more.

[nadinbrzezinski]

3. Zinn may tell you the same, but

read about the events of the 1950s, because this is exactly the same play book. You paint those who question the strict father as anti american... and that will help your cause. Authoritarians always use this.

Problem is Howard will not make any headway with this speaker until he changes the language and asks the hard questions. What is more American? Improving the country for current and future generations, or skirting on those dues needed to maintain the commons? (Taxes and how corporations refuse to pay their fair share, but use all the infrastructure)

[bobweaver]

4. The right thinks that they are America, and that if you aren't one of them

or you don't support them and what they want, then you're anti-American. This is total BS. They are not the real America.

[Goathead]

5. Anti-American

Anybody on the planet who is not in the Republican party and not a Christian fundamentalist. You are doubly doomed if you are not the latter as not only are you anti-American but you are also going to Hell.

[Anakin Skywalker]

6. To the Wingnuts

if you don't like Bush, you are anti-American. It's such a B & W world with these jingoistic morons!

[jonnyblitz]

7. of course it wasn't anti-american to be against Clinton.

:eyes:

[Anakin Skywalker]

9. Good Catch.

"A Preznit must be respected" only applies if the Preznit is a Rethug.

[HeeBGBz]

8. USA is Anti-American

Great bumper sticker

[Donald Ian Rankin]

10. If you believe,

as many conservatives do, that America is a state of mind first and a collection of people or a geographical entity only second, and that that state of mind is a conservative christian one, then it makles perfect sense.

If you use the word "America" in its more... prosaic... sense, then it doesn't.

[kodi]

11. easy, for many americans its one who denies the adoration of the state.

today, america seems to stand unique in elevating state patriotism to the level of religion.

i watched zinn at 9 am this morning, he was great.

when's chomsky on c-span call in?

[seaj11]

12. I'm reading his book

for my History class. Very smart guy.

[Karenina]

13. Anti-American

is a knee-jerk catchphrase glommed onto by ill-educated 'MuriKans who don't grok how they themselves are:

Anti-rotw-democracy-humanrights-selfdetermination-anythingwithinthatisnot ofEuropeanextraction-poor-SELF!INTEREST!-anythingthatsmacksofthecommonsense dalawdgaveabillygoat- :eyes: - :eyes: - :eyes: :SIGH:

[moggie12]

14. Hate to get heavy on you but....

The "anti-American" tag was slapped on Dems during the Nixon administration. It started as a knee-jerk reaction to the war protesters. Unfortunately, I think it took hold when the protesters played right into the label, becoming vociferously anti-military and villianizing soldiers.

I personally think it's an effective tool against us. I've got a lot of conservative-type relatives who "hate" the Dems for this reason. My father-in-law is always giving me old copies of the National Review and other RW stuff in the hopes of "converting" me.
From reading them, the RW slant on this seems to be that today's "liberals" wouldn't have thought it necessary to fight WWII, that they always see America as wrong in any foreign policy matter with another country, and that they sympathize with socialist countries and the always equivocating and wimpy French. (I retaliated over the holidays by giving him my old copy of "Rush Limbaugh is a Big Fat Idiot". He turned pale.)

[Debs]

15. The right wing

Is always trying to blur the distinction between who we are and what our government sometimes does. If anything is unamerican its those who would attack the very tradition of dissent that runs deep in our country. I tell those who accuse me of being unamerican, and they are legion. Who are YOU to decide what is an American thing to say or do? Who made you the arbiter of this crucial distinction? Did God himself whisper into your ear that he needed YOU up on a pedastal looking down on us ordinary people and make such a judgement? What great attributes do you bring to this awesome responsibility? Some great intellectual acuity I have seen no indication of? Or is it some great moral purity I have also seen no indication of.

[TexasLawyer]

16. Fascism

The sharp criticism of Howard Zinn, and other leftist scholars looks a lot like "basic characteristics" 1,7 and 11 of fascism, as per the article below.

Fascism Anyone?
Laurence W. Britt

http://www.secularhumanism.org/library/fi/britt_23_2.htm

<snip>
I will consider the following regimes: Nazi Germany, Fascist Italy, Franco’s Spain, Salazar’s Portugal, Papadopoulos’s Greece, Pinochet’s Chile, and Suharto’s Indonesia. To be sure, they constitute a mixed bag of national identities, cultures, developmental levels, and history. But they all followed the fascist or protofascist model in obtaining, expanding, and maintaining power. Further, all these regimes have been overthrown, so a more or less complete picture of their basic characteristics and abuses is possible.


1. Powerful and continuing expressions of nationalism. From the prominent displays of flags and bunting to the ubiquitous lapel pins, the fervor to show patriotic nationalism, both on the part of the regime itself and of citizens caught up in its frenzy, was always obvious. Catchy slogans, pride in the military, and demands for unity were common themes in expressing this nationalism. It was usually coupled with a suspicion of things foreign that often bordered on xenophobia.
<snip>

7. Obsession with national security. Inevitably, a national security apparatus was under direct control of the ruling elite. It was usually an instrument of oppression, operating in secret and beyond any constraints. Its actions were justified under the rubric of protecting “national security,” and questioning its activities was portrayed as unpatriotic or even treasonous.

<snip>
11. Disdain and suppression of intellectuals and the arts. Intellectuals and the inherent freedom of ideas and expression associated with them were anathema to these regimes. Intellectual and academic freedom were considered subversive to national security and the patriotic ideal. Universities were tightly controlled; politically unreliable faculty harassed or eliminated. Unorthodox ideas or expressions of dissent were strongly attacked, silenced, or crushed. To these regimes, art and literature should serve the national interest or they had no right to exist.

<snip>


Check the whole list out (there are 14 primary characteristics, as analyzed by the author of the article). It is very scary. Characteristic 14?-- Fraudulent elections.

[FrenchieCat]

17. This......

is anti-American and anti-democracy!