The Democrats will rise again.

[spotbird]

The reason there hasn’t been real resistance by the Democrats is their white knuckled fear of the Republican polling numbers. The Dems in power actually believe that the Republican approval has something to do with Republican positions, but the day of reckoning will come. Soon interest rates will increase, some sort of military conscription will be necessary, and there will be a huge pothole on the highway that doesn’t get repaired. People will ask why the parks are dirty, the infrastructure is deteriorating, and why they afford go out to dinner anymore.

There will be another terrorist attack to rally the troops and justify the draft, but it won’t work again. People who have avoided learning about the world will ask why we haven’t been able to prevent terror, why their loved one could be lost, and they'll learn for the first time responsibility is necessary. By then there will be a long line of Democrats demanding accountability, moderate Republicans will join them, the neocon/conservatives will explain how they individually weren’t responsible, they opposed this, that or the other.

The beginning of the end will come when Bush’s polling numbers drop below 40, that won't be this January because the coronation dominates the press. It maybe in late winter when his constituency is flat broke from their outrageous heating bills. The middle of the end will be identified when Democrats challenge despicable legislative initiatives just because they are bad policy. The end of the end will come when Republican’s start switching sides.

The winner on the Democratic side will be the few who catch on early enough to look courageous.

[clovis29]

1. That is what Ted Kennedy was trying to say...

We can't be prisoners to our fears -- especially when we have right and numbers on our side!

[spotbird]

4. Welcome to DU!

50%approval isn't low enough for the Democrats to find their courage. IMO they'll start screaming bloody murder around 45, latest at 41.

It would be nice if it happened sooner, but it won't.

[brainshrub]

8. Welcome to DU.

To bad Kennedy played prisoner to his own fear and did not support Senator Boxer last week.

[clovis29]

10. good point n/t

[bush_is_wacko]

40. Yeah his speech was great, but does it really take another

disastrous situation for America to realize this? Everybody I know can CLEARLY see the writing on the wall. Quite frankly, I'm not sure 911 EVEN was an outside job. I haven't made up my mind yet on that one. If there was NEVER a terrorist threat to begin with how will these ignorant **** supporters ever think anything but that he is a hero who has stopped terror on our soil?

I am hopeful at this point that at least some of our leaders are on to the corporate takeover of this country, but it's going to take every one of us and them to keep our eyes on this administration. They are attacking the structure of this country from EVERY angle!

[Nitrogenica]

2. I'm with you 100%! The pendulum is swinging our way!

Repugs know it. Increase pell grants? * regrets his language? What next?!

[BillZBubb]

3. You, my friend, are dreaming.

The only thing that will shake this country out of it's apathetic rightward drift is a major economic disaster.

Bush's polling numbers may drop, as will the Repugs in general. But when an election rolls around the sheeple will vote Repug again and again. Not until a majority of Americans are personally hurt by the Repug's policies will that change. Then the Repug spinmeisters and corporate media won't be able to shift the blame.

As for a terrorist attack, recent history shows your analysis to be totally wrong. Look at Israel: Sharon got elected because he would "stop the terrorism". Instead attacks on Israeli's increased exponentially. Has that hurt Sharon at all? No, his heavy handed response to attacks has made him more popular in spite of the death tolls and the failing Israeli economy. The reaction in the US will be just the same.

[Warpy]

5. I'm afraid you might be correct

Pendulums are irrelevant. Even if the DLC led Democrats get back into power, the working class will still find themselves dead last in the list of national priorities, far behind corporations and the wealthy.

The Democrats aren't ready to do better. It may well take a major disaster to shake the party up and get rid of the Repuglicans in Dem drag that are leading it now.

[spotbird]

9. The concerns of the powerless are at the bottom of all lists,

no doubt about it. Before the Great Depression the plight of the poor was blamed on the poor, just like today. When everyone became poor that circumstances were considered as a reason for poverty, that time, sadly, will come again also.

The Democrats are concerned with obtaining and maintaining power. They will do what they need to when the time comes to exploit Republican failure.

[clovis29]

6. Don't be such a downer

We have the numbers, we just need to be heard.

[BillZBubb]

11. We don't have the numbers.

It is naive to think otherwise after the past two elections.

We do need to be heard, but good luck with that. My point is that we won't be heard until the audience is ready to hear--and that means until they personally are clearly hurt a lot by Repug policies. Until then, Repug spin and media cowardice (or complicity?) will kill any message we offer.

Sometimes reality sucks.

[spotbird]

19. Ramen noodles and cable TV.

I have a friend who believes that as long as people can afford those two things there will be no change. I agree with him.

[ErinGoBraghLess]

23. Ramen Noodles

I think your friend nailed it. I think we have become complacent as a society. As much as some people on here like to say our country is falling apart, the truth is that most people have it OK. Not rich, but comfortable -- especially compared to the extreme poverty that exists in the rest of the world. It sometimes takes extreme conditions to spur someone into action. So as long as most of the people have a moderately comfortable lifestyle, they won't be spurred into action.

Most of us have enough to eat. Most of us have A/C. Most of us have t.v. blaring 10 hours a day. Most of us get an occasional roll in the hay. We are dulled into thinking that life is OK.

I think about how in the early days of our country, political pamphlets would sell thousands of copies and be read out loud in the town square to hundred of people. Today, most folks wouldn't get through one page of such material before nodding off or turning on Wheel of Fortune. So we continue on paying high taxes and letting the government run our lives.

[moggie12]

25. Agreed and seconded

The full impact of Bush's actions won't be felt for years. Right now everybody's running around buying new cars with cheap credit, running up their credit card bills, etc., etc.

I think your last point is dead-on: Many people pay more attention to who wins American Idol than who wins the Presidency. Until they starting "feeling the pain" economically, I think that's the way it's going to stay.

Welcome to DU! :hi:

[ErinGoBraghLess]

29. addicted to shopping

Thanks for the welcome! I am amazed at how full the parking lots are at Target, WalMart, etc. Even at 10:00 a.m. on a Sunday the darned lots are almost full. I think people almost have an addiction to shopping, like they have to keep buying new stuff to keep them entertained. We need more focus on family, hobbies, books, art, etc. I don't want to live in a crass commercial society. My 5-year-old just had a b-day party and she ended up with about 30 new gifts. I made her take her 10 favorites (which is even too much probably) and we are donating the rest of them to charity. I don't want my kids growing up with hundred of toys and no appreciation for any of them.

Wasn't it one of Jimmy Carter's cabinet who said something like all black people wanted was a warm place to s**t?? He got fired for it I know. I think what he said is true, but not for blacks. It is true for most of society. Give us cheap foreign made products and the illusion that we are happy and we won't complain. How many of us would trade our freedoms for cable tv, pizza delivered to our door, and free porn on the Internet?

[moggie12]

36. You got that right

I actually think that if the Dems appealed to Americans' sense of responsibility, they might make headway. Like if if we said, "Hey, Americans, you're living high on the hog now, but what about your kids? Who do you think's going to be paying off this massive deficit Bush is racking up?" One of Kerry's missed opportunities (among many) was that he didn't go on the offensive about his $87 billion vote: I think he was voting back then to make the Iraq War "pay-as-you go" instead of giving the richest 10% massive tax cuts while burdening future generations with the debt.

[hatrack]

37. Ah, yes, the immortal Earl Butz!

He was actually Ford's Agriculture Secretary, not Carter's. His absolutely unbelievable quote (which sounds even more unbelievable today) was "All your average n****r wants is tight p***y, loose shoes and a warm place to take a shit."

Back in the 1970s it was enough to get him fired. Under George W. Bush, it would probably be enough to earn him the Presidential Medal of Freedom. :eyes:

[spotbird]

38. Naturally he'd apologize because he misspoke before

he'd be given the Medal of Freedom.

[spotbird]

31. Going without utilities is more commonplace

then you'd guess. The problem is that those people don't connect their poverty to voting. When a substantial number of people who haven't lived near the bottom realize the indignity of begging for heat things could change. Right now all that has happened is that the very poor have become destitute.

But we do agree, as a nation we are too comfortable to care.

[KittyWampus]

22. You Must Be Out Of The Loop Regarding Election Fraud

[spotbird]

7. I think we agree.

My position is that things are going to go to shit soon, you seem to believe it will take more time.

Your Israeli example is a good one, but the people of Spain saw through propaganda.

[w4rma]

12. We're in the midst of a major economic disaster. (nt)

[The Doctor.]

15. That economic disaster is right around the corner...

Especially if The Neo-Cons attempt to save the dollar as reserve currency fail. There is a very good chance of that.

If we lose control of Iraq (likely) and can't overthrow Iran's leaders (near-certainty) then we will lose the war with the Euro, Energy costs will skyrocket, and our Economy will make the Great Depression look like a picnic.

I'm sure there's more to it, but that's the thrust.

[spotbird]

17. I'm not all that sure they want to save the dollar.

They are playing chicken, but they are pretty convincing that whichever way it goes is fine with them.

[The Doctor.]

20. And the other way is....?

I understand we're the car in their game of chicken... with airbags and seatbelts all set up for the 'driver', but I'd like your thoughts on the impending 'collision'.

{typo}

[spotbird]

21. They herd.

It will be like the McCarthy era. One of them will smell the coming change and say, "At long last....., that guy will be recorded in history as the hero. After that they will all climb on board.

The trigger might be when the consequences of the falling dollar hit. The environment won't do it, no one cares anymore about that. Maybe the long overdue stock market correction will be the catalyst, that would get the attention of the middle class. It could be the surge in energy prices, which would be truly ironic since it was going to happen sooner or later (but we could prepare).

I think some sort of terrorist attack that everyone can see even a moron could have avoided could do it. The FBI still doesn't have effective computers, by now it will be hard to blame that on Clinton. Even today the Democrats could jump on a bandwagon about that, it isn't what I'd call a risky stand to scream bloody murder that 3+ years after 9/11 even the basics aren't covered. Then if the unthinkable happens the Dems can claim the high ground.

Who knows, there is so much potential something will hit.

[Nitrogenica]

18. I define my optimism here in Minnesota, it's easier here.

[yurbud]

13. not many democrats seem to be catching on

If January 6 was any indication.

[spotbird]

14. That's because they will be paralyzed by their fear.

Until Bush starts to feel the consequences of his failed policy the Democrats aren't going to stand for anything. Once reality strikes there won't be a Democrat anywhere who will remember supporting * on the day of the week. In other words, we have to wait until *'s failures impact Peoria, then we'll see Democrats fight. It isn't going to happen a minute sooner

[catbert836]

16. Thank you

We're not going anywhere, even in the face of such setbacks.

[PROGRESSIVE1]

24. I agree except for one thing.....

the media. What do we do about the anti-Democratic Party bias?

[Dr Fate]

28. Accept it and speak up anyway.

The media did not stop the majority of DEMS from protesting the voting irregularites on Jan 6.

The media does not stop DEMS from calling Bush a "liar", a "Criminal" or a "thief" and then listing examples when they are being interviewed...(But the GOP had NO problem calling Kerry a flip-flopper or a purple heart faker, and in a unified voice.)

The media does not stop, household name DEMS from leveling frank charges against Bush when they are on TV.

The media does not stop Kerry, Kennedy or Hillary from saying on TV: "Where are the hypocrite Republicans who impeached Clinton, where is there concern for honesty now?"

The media does not stop DEMS from being unified like the GOP is.

The media does not make the DEMS listen to their hack "strategists" and the media does not make them ignore their hard working base.

[Tigress DEM]

34. Maintream Media - Paid Political Republican Advertising

How much coverage in mainstream media did Jan 6 protests get and what was their thrust... let me guess? Whining Democrats? Get over it?

Well, the truth is the truth and Bush lied in fully recorded public.

But where is the support from the media when Bush is charged with all this? Nowhere. It's crickets in the background and on to the next Dem to bash.

Hypocrite Republicans are too busy keeping Tom Delay from flushing them down the toilet with his own scandals by changing the rules. The media is playing crickets on that one too.

Yeah, DEMS do fight among ourselves too much.

And how do you win an election when the truth isn't enough? When every vote isn't counted? When the loser wins and the winner loses and the winner is blamed for losing. Insanity or what?

[Dr Fate]

35. The media prevented Kerry from being interviewed about the Jan 6 vote?

The media prevented every single Democrat from being unified and taking a stand against voting fraud?

the media prevented every single DEM from standing on the steps of the capital and demanding that somthing be done about voting fraud?

As far as Bush lies that the media is ignoring, who is stopping household name Democrats from requesting live, TV interviews to discuss "Bush's lies" and listing them with dates & sources?

Sorry- but we cant blame the media for our own lack of guts & strategy.

[spotbird]

32. Behind the Iron Curtain there was strict media control,

people figured it out. For now we have the Internet, after that maybe it will be people's basements, the word will travel.

[TankLV]

26. Hahahahahahahaha! Good one!

Thanks, I needed a laugh.

I mean, you COULDN'T be SERIOUS, right?!?!?!

[Dr Fate]

27. You operate under the assumption that actual Democrats hold power.

By "Actual Democrats"- I mean the kind you meet here at DU, at local meetings, or even in the grocery line- you know, those passionate folks that are not afraid to call Karl Rove and the media "liars," "thieves" and "crooks" and then back it up and not apologize for it. The kind of people who think the GOP/media should be FOUGHT rather than placated. Sure, there are 10 or 20 of them in Congress- but thats not enough.

Problem is, most of these DEMS at the top dont know what the fuck they are doing and never listen to the base- no matter how many times we have been right.

If the same type of DEMS that are in the base were at the top, then your analysis would be correct.

[spotbird]

33. I don't think the Democrats have power,

that's the point. Today the thought of a spam attack is more frightening than the bankruptcy of the nation or even a police state to the Democrats. The power will shift back to them when catastrophe strikes, some folks will be able to read the beginning of the end for the Republicans earlier than others, those who speak out at that point will be considered courageous, a little later they will all jump on board.

They won't have taken power or won with ideas, the times will shift to them and they will convince themselves things changed because of them.

[Hidden Stillness]

39. A New World, Kind Of

Democrats will come back as the true majority party as soon as the official hierarchy gets with it, and can learn to feel which way the wind is blowing. There is real change going on out here, but of course it is generally censored by their media, so you have to have real contact with the thing itself. Then you have to articulate it so that people are inspired that "there is a new day," so the whole thing will not be thwarted again.

Sometimes you need a great opposition to have a great cause, and a reason to struggle. The issues are now so clear, so urgent, that all you need to do is line them all up as a complaint, and if you are skillful with words at all, it becomes a powerful protest, because you have all the material you need, and don't need to dress it up at all. If you can't rouse people with an explanation of all the crime and corruption of this Administration, then there need to be new people brought in.

There has been a generation now of people made stupid by unchallenged corporate propaganda over the "entertainment" media--"politically correct," "government can't do anything right," "getting rid of regulations helps business," "taxes are bad," etc., etc.--and so now you have to get people to understand things on an even more fundamental level first, because they aren't necessarily educated at all any more. Many people have been coerced into being so completely alienated from politics, and can't even think of politicians as anything but crooks, ever--never having had any political heroes--by a corporate media deliberately pushing us out of the system so they could then take it over, that, again, things have to be explained with even more care.

People can only act like whatever was the standard, accepted parameter of things, if it means they will be attacked and forced to pay an actual price for stepping out of the norm, so of course the pressure to act has to come from just a certain place on the political spectrum, so they will respond to our felt opinion, and know it was popular. Easier to get people to conform to an opinion, than to step out alone and proclaim the same, with no feedback first. Unfortunately, you always have to wait years for these things to develop, every single time.

[ldf]

30. so the ones who will live through this

are the ones already in there (the "controlling democrat politician").

so we will be left with a slimmed down number of the very same people who are there now, and have gotten us in this position to start with.

NOT ACCEPTABLE.

:grr:

[Rockerdem]

41. Undoubtably, sometime the Democrats will rise again

Its just that under the current conditions, the "when" is uncertain. But it will happen.

[spotbird]

42. The Republicans have so many balls in the air

that logic says it won't be too long, but who thought they'd be able to hold off disaster this long?

[tom_paine]

43. Sorry, spotbird, I disagree. The System, the Old Republic, is too far gon

Bush's poll numbers will NEVER drop below 40%, no more than Hitler's would drop below 90%.

The combination of corruption and time-tested Goebbelsian propaganda will combine to make sure that cannot happen.

Even if it could happen, it could NEVER happen, you understand?

Sorry to rain on your parade. It would be lovely if your dream of the Old Republic could and would come true.

But it cannot, IMHO. Caeser has crossed the Rubicon and the Old Republic is dead and starting to stink (which won't prevent the Busheviks from playing "Weekend at Bernie's" with it for the benefit of the Imperial Subjects).

And, I am dreaduflly sorry to say, Goebbels v2.0 has created such sea changes in the National Psyche, that we are fully aligned in the "German mindset" of weak obedience that would and WILL make LIHOP #2 wildly successful when the Busheviks decide it should go forwards.

(personally I don't think they are going to wait as long as September this time)

People will queue up for their microchip implants and to be told which "other" to hate (and to keep an eye on should one be in YOUR neighborhood).

Naturally, the exact details of the future are impossible to predict but the trends are blinking neon and pointing to a handful of ends which history has seen before in one form or another.

I say again: I would be so happy if I wa wrong and you were right, spotbird.

But I wouldn't bet the farm on it.