WaPo: Air Force Academy religious bias probe – FUNDIE INFILTRATION?

[Nothing Without Hope]

There was little response except “Good – they can send them all to Iraq” when I posted an earlier report of this situation here:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=132&topic_id=1755433
Thread title: “BE CONCERNED: Religious intolerance, evangelism pervades Air Force Academy”

I cannot understand this lack of response among progressives here at DU. If the neocons and their RW Fundie enablers succeed in turning the military academies (so far, only the Air Force one is being investigated) into production lines for Kool Aid drinking fundie officers, then this opens up some dangerous possibilities. With the military to back them, they could install their theocratic dictatorship in the full light of day and laugh at people who insist that they follow the Constitution. For those who insist "it can't happen here," just look at all the unthinkable things that already HAVE.

And just imagine the kind of atrocities such people could be capable of when sent to command troops in areas where their particular brand of religion is not followed. How hard would it be to convince them that their god wants them to kill and destroy to “save” non-Christians and foster “democracy”?

I have wondered whether the chosen location of “Focus on the Family” near the Air Force Academy was coincidence. Now I am wondering harder. I would also like to know if there are similar things going on at the other military academies.

Is anyone else here concerned about this development? Young people are very susceptible to propaganda - like the Hiter Youth.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/05/04/AR2005050400359.html?sub=AR

Religious Bias Probed Air Force Academy

By ROBERT WELLER
The Associated Press
Wednesday, May 4, 2005; 7:30 AM

DENVER -- The Pentagon will investigate complaints of widespread proselytizing and favoritism for Christians at the Air Force Academy, its second probe of the Colorado Springs campus in two years.

(snip)

Among the complaints: A professor who required cadets to pray before taking his test, a Protestant chaplain who warned anyone not proselytizing would "burn in the fires of hell," and a football coach who hung a locker room banner announcing: "I am a member of Team Jesus Christ."

(snip)

Focus on the Family, a conservative Christian group based near the academy, criticized the investigation.

"The Air Force trains the cadets to make the ultimate sacrifice if necessary, and even to imply that it is wrong to talk about the ultimate meaning of life, which is religious, is absurd," said Tom Minnery, director of public policy.

___

On the Net:

Air Force Academy: http://www.usafa.af.mil

Americans United for the Separation of Church and State: http://www.au.org

Focus on the Family: http://www.family.org/

[noamnety]

1. When I was in the army

This sort of thing was beyond common.

I enlisted in 1984, and even though I was raised an atheist, and still am an atheist, I got myself a good dose of religion within two weeks of joining. In basic training, if we didn't go to church on Sundays, we had to scrub toilets while everyone else was at church.

I "became" baptist in a hurry (I figured they probably had the best music).

I also "became" a smoker, meaning I learned to hold an unlit cigarette real casually as if I was about to light it any minute ... since the smokers got breaks and nonsmokers didn't.

[FreedomAngel82]

13. I think it's so wrong

What if you're Jewish for example? Would there not be any type of services for them? What about different branches of Christianity? I'm Church of Christ and would feel VERY weird being in a Catholic church service for example since it's not something I'm used to and don't follow. I'm not 100% sure but I THINK on Al Franken's show either earlier this year or late last year I heard him talking about how before going into battle they'd play Christian hymn music and if someone wanted to be bapitized they would be right there. I don't care if someone is baptized but as a spiritual Christian who was baptized and practices Christianity it's like, to me, they are just being baptized to be saved and on the safe side. That's not what gets you into heaven according to Christian mythology. If you read all of the Bible it shows you also have to have real faith and practice what you preach and as James says "faith without works is dead."

[noamnety]

25. Jewish? sorry, nope

I just looked up the Fort Dix website (where I went to basic). You have your choice of Protestant, Catholic, or Gospel services on Sundays. (or like I said, scrubbing toilets, unless things have changed.)

There is an Islamic prayer group that meets M-T, at noon, but that's not something that a person in basic training would be allowed to attend. Sunday is the sabbath, not any of those other days, according to the army.

http://www.dix.army.mil/Chapel/chapel.htm

[ewagner]

33. That's how I started smoking

I was a Dorm Chief and the troops accused me of not caring if they got a cigarette break or not (as a reward) becasue I didn't smoke...

I took it up to keep from becoming the guest of honor at a blanket party....

[Last Lemming]

2. Actually I given this a lot of thought

not that it means much to the world in general--but here's a few thoughts

I'm working periferally with marine recruits--training for life as cannon fodder--and I have not gotten a sense that fundamentalism is a big part of the education here. But these guys are pretty low on the food chain. The Air Force Academy is fully the opposite You get a good gig, you get to fly and you never once have to stare the wrong way down a gun in your career.

And this is where they want our wars to go--bloodless bombing--every soldier a white collar worker This is not good--really not good

[atreides1]

3. I'm concerned

But all we can do now is to let the investigation go forward. If it's proven that the command is violating the freedom to practice one's religion, then technically they can be charged with Article 134
of the UCMJ

Article 134: General Article
Though not specifically mentioned in this chapter, ALL DISORDERS AND
NEGLECTS TO THE PREJUDICE OF GOOD ORDER AND DISCIPLINE in the armed forces, all conduct of a nature to bring discredit upon the armed forces, and crimes and offenses not capital, of which persons subject
to this chapter may be guilty, shall be taken cognizance of by a general, special, or summary court-martial, according to the nature
and degree of the offense, and shall be punished at the discretion of
that court.

Like I said, technically.

As for Mr. Minnery, everyone has their own definition of what the ultimate meaning of life is. And no one can be trained to make the ultimate sacrifice, that only comes when the moment presents itself.
Men and women of the US military do what they do for diverse reasons,
some enlist for love of country, some for college, others because they are trying to find a direction, and others because there are no jobs at home.
And after spending 13 years on active duty in the US Army, I never met anyone who said that they enlisted because they wanted to die for God.

As a former soldier, I still take my oath of defending the Constituiton very seriously, and at this point in time, I look upon groups like Focus on the Family, and its leader James Dobson, as nothing more then a domestic enemy. Along with Pat Robertson, Jerry Falwell, Jimmy Swaggert, and the rest of that crew, along with their
kool-aid drinking followers, all are now my enemies. They would take my country and make it into shadow of Nazi Germany or Imperial Rome, I'm not sure which is worst.

But as long as there is breath in my body, I will do whatever is needed to protect my country from these poor false prophets and their
traitorous followers.

But that's just the way I am!!!!

[cookiebird]

7. This AF Brat

Thanks you for your service and your honor. Thank you for defending the Constitution and the freedom it preserves. Thank you for defending all of us. I wish our 'leaders' had this manner of personal strength.

[FreedomAngel82]

15. I'm with you

It's comforting to know there are still soliders out there who would die for their country and our Constiution and Bill of Rights and not for their leader. Especially in times like these in this dark time when these people are trying to convert everyone and their family unless you already believe.

[Nothing Without Hope]

8. Thank you for this post. I feel better having read it. n/t

[Mass]

4. This has been out for a few weeks now

What is a source of concern for me is how long it took before the MSM talks about it, and the fact that no Democrats condemned it either.

Apparently, there are stories of harassment as well.

[wakeme2008]

5. This was just posted over at Big-Boys

A strange place with new videos every day.

http://www.big-boys.com/articles/dancingroommate.html

While the "dancer" maybe could not dance well, what type of music was he dancing to and why did his roommate find that strange.

[Nothing Without Hope]

6. kick n/t

[Bozita]

9. Lotsa rapes of female cadets -- any link to religious fundamentalism?

Former UColorado football coach Bill McCartney's religious group, Promise Keepers, preaches male domination.

[Nothing Without Hope]

10. It's all related. Fascism/ female subjugation /rape/ bigotry/glorification

of violence - a society gone to the psychotic extreme of paternalism. More balance is needed desperately. Instead, the neocons and their RW fundie enablers keep pushing for more and more extremism.

[FreedomAngel82]

16. Speaking of female raping

in the military there was one girl who was raped and pressing charges against the military because it happened to her and nobody listened to her. All the rightwingers were saying horrible things about her (like she was a lesbian who hated the men and the military). Do you know what I'm talking about and remember her name? Did anything come out of that case?

[Nothing Without Hope]

19. Different case, but it shows how these cases can go:

The article says that two-thirds of sexual assualts go unreported. I'd guess that's an underestimate. IMO there needs to be some more thought given to appropriate punishment. If this cadet had been convicted of rape, the article indicated that the sentence would be (automatically?) life imprisonment. With punishment that draconian, there would be less likelihood to go for conviction. So he walks from the real charge and gets to claim that she wanted it and it was just because of the other investigations that the accusation was made at all.

http://www.recordonline.com/archive/2005/04/09/pointrap.htm
April 09, 2005

Cadet avoids rape charge in plea deal

By John Doherty
Times Herald-Record
[e-mail]

West Point – A West Point cadet will spend four years in prison for breaking into female cadets' rooms, but the most serious charge against him, rape, was dropped Thursday.

Tracey L. Rivers, a sophomore from Superior, Wis., pleaded guilty to six criminal charges at his court-martial, including entering three female cadets' rooms without permission.

(snip)

In a daylong hearing before a military judge, Rivers pleaded guilty to indecent assault, indecent acts with another, assault consummated by a battery, accessing pornographic material on the government computer network, leaving his room after taps and entering female cadets' barracks rooms without their permission on multiple occasions.

In an e-mail statement to the Times Herald-Record in December, Rivers claimed the sex with the female cadet was consensual and that the charge was a reaction to recent sexual assault scandals at the Air Force Academy.

(snip)

[paineinthearse]

11. "I cannot understand this lack of response among progressives "

I read your earlier post and was saddened that few others took the time to absorb its meaning. Don't give up, your posts are always quality material.

[Nothing Without Hope]

12. Thank you, Paine. That's good to hear - you know better than most

how frustrating it can be. I hope more people are reading this than seem to be from the number of responses. At least this time no one is laughing and saying to just send them all to Iraq, ha-ha.

[FreedomAngel82]

14. I also wanted to add

a thought about Focus on the Family. I wouldn't be surprised if they landed there for a reason. I'm sure it's especially useful in a time of war when people are struggling and want someone to talk to like that with spiritual matters. It's perfect for them to claw into their brain's and tell them they're going to hell unless they give their life over to God. I don't care if someone is a true believer and goes to these people and talks to them but it's like they can pray on innocent people who could go there one day to check it out and the service or something. I'm pretty sure you're onto something thinking they were there for a reason. Remember who runs the group.

[Nothing Without Hope]

17. Yes, it seems highly suspicious to me as well. Hitler's appeal was also

pseudo-religious and nationalistic, and the Hitler Youth responded enthusiastically. it is a deeply cynical twisting of the energy and idealism of the young. They very susceptible to appeals by clever demagogues, especially when they are backed by authority figures. I am wondering what is happening at the other military officer academies.

[rockymountaindem]

29. Focus on the Family came to Colorado Springs, my hometown

years ago (along with other similar organizations) because the city offered them cheap land and tax breaks. They felt that Focus et. al. would bring population and revenue without polluting the air or water. That's why Colorado Springs is home to over 100 evangelical organizations. And, there is a church for approx. every 1000 city residents, plus two (count 'em, two) synagogues and one mosque.

[Trillo]

18. There was a similar post in LBN

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x1443282

Haven't these discriminations been going on forever? At a military HS several decades ago I experienced religious zero-intolerance, and unfortunately, didn't recognize it as such until years later.

For all the good that some Christians claim to try to do and live their lives by, their other brethren have been inflicting old-testament pains for near two millennia. It is sad, especially considering the academic nature of the 'institution.'

Frankly, I have little hope these constitutional violations will be adequately addressed in our current governmental system. It could be Rome all over again for our multi-cultural dream. Voting tabulators have finally fixed tyranny in apparent perpetuity for all of us.

OTOH, perhaps it is a good sign that the evangelical oppressors who claim oppression are emerging into the light of public scrutiny. Still, so much damage has now been done...

[Nothing Without Hope]

20. kick - hoping for more interest n/t

[Nothing Without Hope]

21. This is the more recent thread on this general subject - I'll kick to put

it ahead of the older one that was based on an earlier report.

Hope this gets noticed. I think the positioning of the Focus on the Family so near the Air Force Academy and now this crazy RW fundie bias there are NOT a coincidence. We should be very, very conceerned and look into what is happening at our other military academies. The young, especially young men at the age of the cadets, are very susceptible to propaganda that is cynically crafted to appeal to their ideals and desire to do heroic things.

[ebayfool]

23. Kicking 'cause I answered to the older thread - this needs to be seen! n/t

[funflower]

22. Liberal freethinkers just don't join the military

in the numbers that conservative religious folk do. No need to the tin foil hats. This is just how military academies are.

[Nothing Without Hope]

24. From the reports, there is pressure from faculty and other students

to push evangelical Christian religion. It isn't just that they're coming in with it, they're also being pushed toward it after they are there.

[Pepperbelly]

26. that is a pretty broad brush you're painting with, funflower.

I was on active duty for 4 years and in the reserves for 4. I believe myself to be free thinking. Many of the people I knew were pretty free-thinking as well. Many were not but that doesn't eliminate those who were.

[funflower]

30. No doubt there are lots of non-Christians in the military

but the military is something like 75-80% republican. I'd guess that figure includes a fair number of evangelicals. Of course, I could be wrong....

[noamnety]

38. It's not quite that high

"While recent polls show that roughly one-third of the public considers itself Republican, 57 percent of the active-duty military identified themselves with that party – with two-thirds of officers, compared to 49 percent of enlisted personnel, checking the Republican box. "

http://www.lewrockwell.com/ips/lobe43.html


But yes, close enough that your point remains true - there is a corelation between being evangelical and wanting to be in the military (go figure).

[funflower]

39. I think Jesus said something about that, right?

Thou shalt join the army and beat the hell out of whomever * wants?

[Bridget Burke]

27. Where are the numbers?

Please note that "joining the military" is not synonymous with getting an appointment to a military academy. The academies offer fine educations--it troubles me that the selection process may be tainted by religous favoritism.

The older generation of my family (now mostly dead) included several career military, one who served & then went into the FBI, & one who died after being called back to active duty (my father). Mostly Air Force. However, they didn't just pick the military out of their many career choices--mostly, they stayed in after the War (WWII).

All these men were either (good but not exceptionally devout) Catholics or Agnostic Reprobates.

[paineinthearse]

28. Constitutional question

If the constitution mandates the government shall not form a state religion, is it not logical that the government shall not fund religion, meaning chaplains and facilities?

[paineinthearse]

34. Rephrase

http://www.archives.gov/national_archives_experience/charters/print_friendly.html?page=bill_of_rights_transcript_content.html&title=NARA%20%7C%20The%20Bill%20of%20Rights%3A%20A%20Transcription

Amendment I

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.


I trust there are laws that allow the House to draft a budget that pays for clergy who are federal employees. Wouldn't such a law be contrary to the establishment provision?

[Nothing Without Hope]

31. kick n/t

[Nothing Without Hope]

32. kick n/t

[Nothing Without Hope]

35. See this comment by a veteran on this situation at the AF Academy:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=1764309&mesg_id=1764904

[MountainLaurel]

36. Was a lengthy thread last week

As well.

But considering that access to the service academies is based on who you know (don't you have to get a senator to "recommend" you), is it surprising that cadets today are right-wing bigots, since a majority of Congress is?

And, as someone phrased it on the other threads: "Religious extremists flying airplanes, sounds familiar."

[Nothing Without Hope]

37. Related thread on the constitutional implications of the AF Academy

religious bias and pressure:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=104&topic_id=3603063#3603940
Thread title: Federal chaplains, churches & the First Amendment

[Nothing Without Hope]

40. kick n/t

[paineinthearse]

41. NPR: Non-Christians Claim Bias at Air Force Academy

Religion
Non-Christians Claim Bias at Air Force Academy
by Jeff Brady

Day to Day, May 4, 2005 · Jeff Brady reports from Denver, Colo., about recent allegations of religious intolerance in the U.S. Air Force Academy. Some non-Christian cadets and staff members are claiming they are being discriminated against because of their religious beliefs.


- http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=4630490

[Nothing Without Hope]

42. kick n/t

[Nothing Without Hope]

43. kick - I believe this is significant and we should be concerned. n/t

[FrenchieCat]

44. Please, please, please refer to Fundies as the religious Wrong

Fundies is "too cute" a name. Their names must match their deeds!

[Nothing Without Hope]

45. I like "Fristians" too - a perversion. I also like this Nietzsche quote

Which is all too relevant to what is happening to the young people in this country in general and the Air Force Academy in particular:

The surest way to corrupt a youth is to instruct him to hold in higher esteem those who think alike than those who think differently. –Friedrich Nietzsche, philosopher (1844-1900)

[bobbieinok]

46. kick because this is of major concern