Grassroots vs. Corporate Owned Media

[drfemoe]

1992 - Ross Perot rides a wave of Grassroots support to the lead in the presidential race. Corporate owned media universally describes him as an angry little man who is mentally unstable. Grassroots, hearing this repeated, abandons their populist candidate and waits to fight another day.

2000 - John McCain rides a wave of Grassroots support to the lead in the presidential race. Corporate owned media universally describes him as an angry little man who is mentally unstable. Grassroots, hearing this repeated, abandons their populist candidate and waits to fight another day.

2004 - Howard Dean rides a wave of Grassroots support to the lead in the presidential race. Corporate owned media universally describes him as an angry little man who is mentally unstable. Grassroots, hearing this repeated, abandons their populist candidate and waits to fight another day?

[EXE619K]

1. Ross, John, Howard.....

They're all "vertically" Challenged!

I'm seeing a pattern here.

Discrimination!

[drfemoe]

2. Tom Cruise, Mel Gibson, Hugh Grant

Yes, those cameras really emphasize the handicap of the vertically challenged.

[cthrumatrix]

11. media/washington/special interests don't like this....go Dean

[vi5]

3. But if the "grassroots" are strong, wouldn't that be strong enough....

To somewhat overcome and get a nice chunk of votes? So if Dean wins New Hampshire it's a proof of the success of the grassroots campaign but if he loses then it's not a reflection on the lack of strength of those grassroots but an inditment of the media?

It's too early for a post-mortem on any campaign including and especially Dean. But it can't be both ways. You can't attribute his success to one thing (populist grassroots support) but then not be forced to take a look at that if he doesn't win and give its lack of strength some of the blame.

The root of populist implies "popular". And if there aren't enough votes cast for someone to qualify as more popular than others....it's that simple. None of the others have more money so you can't blame their rise and his fall on money. The media doesn't cast anyone's votes for them no matter how much people would like us to believe that. If someone's message is strong enough it will overcome the media barrage, as Clinton did through winning despite being an underdog and despite having the media hounding his every move. I'm sorry but if Clinton can overcome the media's relentless harping on him being the governer of a state with a horrible record, evidence of trying to get out of the draft, and hard accusations of affairs and other scandals then if Dean with a much better record and less baggage can't overcome some fairly hollow media attacks, maybe just maybe it's not the media and maybe it's people not feeling strongly he's the best candidate.

But I'm not expecting you or any other Dean supporters to admit this just might possibly be true so I won't hold my breath.

[drfemoe]

5. Um no

didn't you read? The Grassroots GIVE UP. We take full responsibility for everything. Just because the media's opinion of each example listed is identical, in the end it is the failure of the Grassroots. We can't beat the media. We aren't *Clinton*, we are *Grassroots*.

[Name removed]

10. Deleted message

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[cornermouse]

4. I guess that leaves us with the establishment's candidate.

[drfemoe]

6. I just hope he legalizes drugs

lots and lots of drugs .. Gawd knows *B* won't!

[Democrats unite]

7. Well at least they were right about Ross Perot.

eom

[drfemoe]

8. Ross Perot Angry?

Unstable? I don't think so. I wanted to vote for Perot but I was too afraid that ghwb would be re-elected, so I voted for Clinton. Now I wish I had voted for Ross. Live and learn.

[Democrats unite]

20. Flip flop Perot

Doesn't get any better than that!

[WhoCountsTheVotes]

17. Yeah, Perot said the Bush clan threatened his family

Of course, that's insane! The Bushs don't break the law or physically threaten people. What do you think they are, the WASP Corleones? :eyes:

[drfemoe]

18. I FORGOT ABOUT THAT

You are absolutely correct!! Now I'm gonna have to find a book or look that up! Thanks.

[NashVegas]

9. You Missed One

Jerry Brown. Although a lot of liberals hate him now for going paternal, in 1992 Brown had a populist message and a $100 limit for campaign contributions.

As he was building a challenge to Bill Clinton, he got pounced on. First a new organization (I heard the tape on CNN) taped a conversation between their reporter and a phone bank where donations were made via credit card. The reporter kept hitting up the operator for ideas on how he could get around the $100 limit. He wouldn't take no for an answer and refused to give up. I can't remember if she eventually said something like 'there are ways but I can't tell you' or if she did give him a hint. But either way, they found a way to make Brown look bad.

Then there was the business where someone put together a smear job where a state trooper said he witnessed people using coke at parties at Brown's house back in the 1970s. Brown denied ever having witnessed such events. In a Nightline interview, Ted Koppel destroyed the credibility of the witnesses. Didn't matter, the script was written.

[drfemoe]

15. So his "problems" were

he was dishonest, unelectable and liked to party. Right?

[SeattleRob]

31. I remember this smear job...

The bottom line is the establishment will do everything in their
power to protect the staus quo.

[Eric J in MN]

12. Ross Perot was doing well when he dropped out, and later

Ross Perot was doing well when he dropped out, and later re-entered.

Don't blame the media. It was Perot's choice to drop out.

[tinanator]

13. Perot Systems engineered California's electricity crisis

So we should all be grateful the little fuck didnt get in.

[drfemoe]

14. Enron is Perot Systems?

nt

[tinanator]

21. no bud

The whole strategy of "gaming" the California deregulation scheme originated with Perot Systems. Glad I could help!

[tinanator]

23. info on enron and perot systems and all the other crooks at play

http://gning.org/enron/enron-20.html

[anti-NAFTA]

25. Perot wanted to protect our jobs when

Bush I, Clinton, and Gore were all whoring for Wall Street. Whether Perot had his own interests in mind is besides the point since, as we now know, he was 100% right.

[drfemoe]

16. He didn't do terrible in the GE

I haven't looked it up recently, but I bet he got more votes than Nader in 2000. Feel free to correct my understanding.

If a lot of people hadn't been so terrified of another four years of *B* the I, he would have done even better. He would have gotten my vote if I wasn't so terrified of the prospect of 'four more years'.

[WhoCountsTheVotes]

19. you are 100% correct, drfemoe

The corporate media does not like it when grassroots groups of people get behind a candidate. They expect us to watch their news coverage and vote for the one they decide is "moderate" and "electable".

Dean fans are screwing up the system, which is why they are doing their best to destroy him now, just like they did to Perot and McCain.

Their attacks on his Iowa speech have turned me into a huge Dean fan.

[drfemoe]

22. Hey, I'm glad to hear that ..

Their attacks on his Iowa speech have turned me into a huge Dean fan.

Thanks for the links in your sig!

[WhoCountsTheVotes]

24. kicking this

because it's the central issue in this primary

[Lydia Leftcoast]

26. We can be grateful that McCain didn't get in

He may be a war hero and have a few good ideas, but all in all, he's a hard right Republican. Most DUers would NOT like his ideas on personal behavior or the environment.

You can add Dennis Kucinich to your list. He was drafted in a grassroots campaign, but if one were to believe the New York Times, he doesn't exist at all.

[WhoCountsTheVotes]

27. can he be worse than Bush?

I can't see how?

[AP]

28. 2004 - Corporate owned media puts him on covers of newsweek and time,

plays up his campaign, gives out web site address, defines him as the anti-bush for all those people angry at Bush. Dean, meekly says, at first, "doesn't anyone want to talk about health care?" Nope. Ok, I'll ride this other wave.

What about his essential corporate-friendliness? Who cares, says his supporters.

I'm not sure that Perot and McCain were promising the populist promised land to voters. Perot ran because Bush I was so interested in promoting oil industries and ignoring the wealth redistributive and wealth-creating potential of new technologies ran against him. Perot wanted to redistribute more wealth away from oil, baniking and insurance and to himself more than he wanted it distributed to the people.

McCain just wanted to be TR, which has its virtues, but isn't exactly liberalism run riot.

It's interesting that Dean is being grouped with Perot and McCain rather than, say, Bobby Kennedy and Bill Clinton -- people who cared a great deal about the downward and outward redistribution of power, unlike Dean.

[John_H]

29. Dean's "movement" has little to do with "grassroots" organizing

If three thousand liberal arts majors with color coded hats caravaning to a state was the same as political organizing Dean would win every primary by ten.


Now, i've got nothing against Liberal Arts majors, especially those with color coded hats, but the fact is that Democratic political organizing involves mostly reaching out to blocks of voters (Labor, minorites, pro choice, etc) strongly influenced by their organizations' leadership, which relies on relationships built for years.

That's why Kerry is going to win tonight, my guy Clark is facing an uphill battle, and why Dean will be gone after next week.

[AP]

30. Exactly. As you note, Iowa's the proof.