Iraq: What is the Real Reason We Invaded?

[Pryderi]

If the Bush administration knew beforehand that there were no WMDs, then what was the true reason?

[snowbear]

1. He threatened Daddy for one...

:shrug:

[Catma]

2. One could make

a case that the Bush Administration is attempting to set up a base of operations for when Iran or another ME country steps out of line; so that America can strike quickly and from close by. Eventually to conquer the entire area in conjunction with Israel, of course this is my own crack pot theory.

[Melodybe]

12. The problem with oil being the justification

is that they aren't getting any oil out of Iraq now, oil production is at less than 40%.

[Catma]

13. ?

ummm yea I know that. I avoided the oil point. I really don't think oil was the reason only a nice bonus if you can call it that. Perhaps you meant someone else

[bejammin075]

16. But Oil company PROFITS are sky high

Some are making 8 BILLION dollars profit in ONE QUARTER. One Oil company has 25 billion in CASH because they can't spend it fast enough, and will have 40 billion in cash by the end of the year.

We did invade for oil, but not for the "common wisdom" that it's to lower prices. It works to Bush's backers benefit to DESTABILIZE the oil market. That's how they make their best money. It's the same thing with the electricity in California. The energy companies rigged it to have shortages.

Furthermore, the goal isn't to "win" in iraq. The longer it drags on, the more bombs are sold, and the more oil stays high and oil company profits are sky high.

[bejammin075]

17. Cheaper Oil = Lower Corporate Profits

[enid602]

3. lobbyists

Because there was a group of lobbyists (Chalabi among them) who had been lobbying every American president to invade Iraq, and had been doing so since the Reagan years.

[smoogatz]

4. 220,000,000,000 barrels of oil

worth 11 trillion dollars. Enough to supply all US consumption for thirty years. You had to ask?

[FloridaPat]

5. Oil. Oil Oil. We need to fuel those SUV's and keep the oil companies

happy. 2 - keep the dollar afloat by putting Iraq back on the dollar by taking it off the euro. The oil sales rather then the country.
3. Get a ton of money to the defense contractors. Billions have disappeared here and a lot is going into the administrations pockets.
4. Keep the country in perpetual war and you keep the citizens in perpetual fear and you run the country into the ground.
5. To force the return of Jesus by fullfilling Biblical prophesies.

[Smarmie Doofus]

6. Primarily political; Bush was un-reelectable in the absence of...

the social and political hysteria generated by a war against foreign bad guys. I'd call it "changing the subject", getting the debate away from domestic issues where they, Bush, et al, were vulnerable and on to flag-waving nonsense.


Secondary reasons: oil $$$,undermining prominent foe of Israel, profitable reconstruction contracts, and bolstering sagging stock market.

[tuvor]

7. Bush administration has used 27 rationales for war in Iraq, study says

Bush administration has used 27 rationales for war in Iraq, study says

CHAMPAIGN, Ill. — If it seems that there have been quite a few rationales for going to war in Iraq, that’s because there have been quite a few – 27, in fact, all floated between Sept. 12, 2001, and Oct. 11, 2002, according to a new study from the University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign. All but four of the rationales originated with the administration of President George W. Bush.

The study also finds that the Bush administration switched its focus from Osama bin Laden to Saddam Hussein early on – only five months after the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks in the United States.

In addition to what it says about the shifting sands of rationales and the unsteady path to war in Iraq, what is remarkable about the 212-page study is that its author is a student.

The study, “Uncovering the Rationales for the War on Iraq: The Words of the Bush Administration, Congress and the Media from September 12, 2001, to October 11, 2002,� is the senior honors thesis of Devon Largio. She and her professor, Scott Althaus, believe the study is the first of its kind.

Read the rest and find the link to the article at

http://www.news.uiuc.edu/news/04/0510war.html

[LunaC]

25. EXCELLENT reference - thanks!

Did you catch this part......?

.......it was the media that initiated discussions about Iraq, introducing ideas before the administration and congressional leaders did about the intentions of that country and its leader. The media also “brought the idea that Iraq may be connected to the 9-11 incident to the forefront, asking questions of the officials on the topic and printing articles about the possibility.”

The media “seemed to offer a lot of opinion and speculation, as there had been no formal indication that Iraq would be a target in the war on terror,” Largio wrote. Oddly, though, the media didn’t switch its focus to Iraq and Saddam until July of 2002.

Yet, “Overall, the media was in tune with the major arguments of the administration and Congress, but not with every detail that
emerged from the official sources.”


Man, that extent of the propaganda deserves a thread of its own.

[marylanddem]

8. blood & oil

* & his minions are both bloodthirsty and oilthirsty - the lies were a story intended to justify satisfying both appetites.

[rwenos]

9. Awl. Black Gold. Texas Tea.

Anyone who doesn't think this is -- and always WAS -- about oil profits for Bush family investor buddies. . . . would buy the Brooklyn Bridge to plant palm trees so they could sell them to real estate investors in Florida.

"It's incredibly obvious, isn't it, Mandrake?" (Gen.Jack D. Ripper, in "Dr. Strangelove").

[AuntiBush]

10. O.I.L. G.R.E.E.D. P.O.W.E.R. H.A.T.E. 4 F.D.R.

Payback for Grandpa Prescott Bush.

Must save the Bush family name. Screw Americans though.

[many a good man]

11. Afraid that sanctions would be lifted

Hear me out. Its the only logical reason (that is, if logic has anything to do with it!)

There was a growing intl movement to end sanctions for humanitarian reasons. SH was secretly complying with the UN resolutions but kept up the bluster because he was afraid that a sign of weakness would lead to internal revolt or attack from Israel or Iran. He wanted sanctions to end. As did China, Russia, France, and Germany.

He signed big fat billion dollar contracts with the four aforementioned countries to redevelop his oil infrastructure. US corporations (like Halliburton) were completely shut out. He was the first to sell his oil on the market in Euros instead of dollars. This was BEFORE the dollar tanked 40% and was not the reason for it.

Big Oil did not want war with Iraq. All they wanted was to see Iraq's oil back on the market. In fact they were scared that it would imperil the rest of their business in the region.

Big Dick wanted to invade so he could get the contracts for Halliburton, after costing the company billions in the asbestos disaster that he was responsible for. The PNAC eggheads wanted it for a long time for various reasons. Bush** the imbecile was talked into it to compensate for his small penis. The rest is history!

[AmBlue]

14. Like my then 6yo son told a Chicago Trib reporter...

"George Bush made a war because of dumb old money and stupid old oil!!!"

Ummm, needless to say, "George Bush" is a dirty word at my house.

[Lexingtonian]

15. Pappy Got Dissed by Saddam

accounts for Kinglet Dubya The Pissant Midget.

My Incredible Gloriousness At Press Conferences In '91 And Other Reasons For Feeling Marginally Superior To Wes Clark Which Will Otherwise Be Forgotten accounts for whatsizname...Colin Ferguso- oh wait, Powell.

We/I Lost Vietnam, Let's Play Again Against A Weaker Opponent accounts for Field Marshall Rumsfeld.

For Taxpayer & Oil Lootings 'R' Us Inc., aka The Dallas Mafia, War Is Good accounts for Richard "Crassus" Cheney.

+++

Those are roughly the individual reasons, slightly caricatured. The historical explanation is something like a low intensity semi-war, a Sitzkrieg, needed a resolution that Bill Clinton could not give it. It really was a dilemma between 1998 and 2000, if anyone remembers Operation Desert Fox.

For the ex-Nixon crowd (Papa Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld, and Powell) Iraq represented the kind of Stalinist regime their Party considers defeating its real, bottom line, raison d'etre. Post-Nixon Republicanism comes out of losing China and stalemating Korea and losing Cuba, and then failing in Vietnam. In a sense all the hoopla these people give Reagan and Bush Sr. is that the turnaround took place while they were in office. The Soviet Union collapsing makes up for China falling to Mao, in their logic, and beating Hussein out of Kuwait for the Korea dissatisfaction, and bludgeoning Afghanistan makes up for giving up Cuba. That left the crew with Vietnam as the great blemish/scar in their past they hadn't exorcised.

And we've refought Vietnam in Iraq. Interestingly enough, to a rather similar conclusion in the end, it's starting to appear.

[jobycom]

18. Part oil, part control of the ME, but part of it goes back to Reagan

Reagan repeated many times that America was at its best when we had a common enemy. Long after the Soviet Union had ceased to function, Reagan propped it up, both financially, and ficticiously, by claiming their military strength was increasing every year. At one of his summits with Gorbachev, the premier told him "We're done, you'll have to find another enemy."

During Reagan's second debate with Mondale, he went off on a speech about aliens attacking the Earth, and how that would draw the whole world together to fight the common threat. The speech was interrupted when Bonzo went over his time, and the world has no idea just how looney Space Cowboy would have gotten.

That was Reagan's underlying philosophy. It's why he attacked Grenada.

Bush Daddy attacked Panama to boost his poll numbers and shake the image of a wimp. It worked so well that he did the same thing on a massive scale to Iraq, and boosted his approval ratings through the ceiling.

W. saw both of these. W hates his father, who is a cold fish who never gave him daddy-love, and because of that W latched on to Reagan as an idol, since Daddy hated Reagan. So W believes in Reagan. The War on Terror, which we all know is fake, the constant terrorist threats, the duct tape warnings, and finally, the war on Iraq, were just attempts by Bush to unite America by creating a common enemy, as Reagan did, and, as his father did, to boost his image.

There is also a saying amongst the simple that war is good for the economy. No doubt Bush believed that, too.

[LittleClarkie]

19. Free pizza

Actually, I thought the suggestion that Saddam was about to go to euros was interesting.

So is the idea that Bush would lose his superpowers if he's not percieved as the wartime president that no one can question without seeming unpatriotic.

Then there's the profiteering.

Then there's the neocon plan for a free and democratic Middle East that will immediately spell a safe Israel.

I'm banking on the last one, myself. The rest was just gravy.

[berni_mccoy]

20. Because Saudi Arabia Wanted Bush To Invade Iraq

Think about it:

1. The Saudi Royal Family wants to be the dominate power in the M.E.
2. They ask BushCo to Take out Afghanistan/Iraq/Iran/Syria so they don't have to
3. They create 9/11 so Bush has 'reasons' for 'justification'
4. They realized after Afghanistan was done they didn't have enough 'justification'
5. Bush created a reason by bombing Iraq (with the help of G.B.) and fixed the intelligence.
6. Now who is the dominate arab oil power in the M.E. and they didn't have to lift a finger (except for 19 hi-jackers)

[tex-wyo-dem]

21. Oil is power....

The powers that be are worried about the long term status of the U.S. as a world power. They are scared as hell of China and the EU. Control of the world's oil resources is key to any one country continuing as the one and only true super power from an economic standpoint.

Such is the doctrine of the PNAC and the only real reason we are in the ME...terrorism is just a convenient excuse.

[drdtroit]

22. Operation Iraqi Liberation: OIL! n/t

Plus Iraq was going to begin trading oil in Euros.

[LunaC]

23. PNAC Game Plan, silly!

Take over Iraq one day, the entire Middle East the next. There's money in them thar hills and he who own the oil, owns the World.

The link in my sig line pretty well spells it out.

[yebrent]

24. Here is what I posted 2/04/03 at another site.

The Real Reason We Are Going To War


I have been sharing this with just about everyone I know. This is important information that as many people as possible need to hear.

Does the "threat of weapons of mass destruction" feel like an incomplete answer to you? Have you wondered why N. Korea doesn't seem to be as pressing of an issue with the government as Iraq? Do the US administration's answers seem lacking? They should, because they are not telling us their primary reasons for going to war. If the world was aware of these real reasons, we would have even less support than we have now...which isn't much.

There is a PBS radio show that some of you may have heard called, 'This American Life'. It is my favorite radio program, but that is beside the point. In an episode which first aired December 20, 2002 called 'Why We Fight', they presented the US administraton's real reason for going to war with Iraq. Nicholas Lemann, a reporter from the 'New Yorker' pieced this information together by researching what the "Hawks" in the US administration have said and written about Iraq, prior to and since 9/11, and by researching the foreign policy experts the "Hawks" in the administration are most fond of quoting. You can hear the episode at http://www.thisamericanlife.com It is episode #227. The whole program is good, but the section I am focusing on is in Act 3. While you are there, you might want to check out some other episodes. It is really quality programming.

Since some of you probably can't listen to the show, I want to share a summary with you.

Weapons of mass destruction is a ruse. The "Hawks" in the administration want to take out Sadam, not because he is a threat, but because he is easily defeatable. By establishing a pro-west government in Iraq, the "Hawks" in the US administration believe the following is possible:

1.) Many in the US administration are fond of mentioning how the Middle East is a different culture, and that a major show of force by the US will calm the area down, including the violent opposition to the US support of Israel.

2.) OIL. A pro-west govenment in Iraq will open up Iraq's much needed oil to the western oil companies. We currently aren't getting any oil from Venezuela due to the political issues going on there right now. The US, particularly the oil barrens in the administration, do not like relying on Saudi Arabia and other middle-east Muslim OPEC countries for our oil and oil prices. They do not like to feel beholdend to anyone, especially Saudi Arabia. Because of what is currently going on in Venezuela, the US administration is pushing hard to get into Iraq as soon as possible.

3.) A pro-west government in Iraq will allow the US to move it's primary middle eastern military base from Saudi Arabia to Iraq. This is key to their plan, as this will provide the US with more leverage in dealing with Saudi Arabia and Egypt among others. The US needs leverage to force these countries to crack down on the muslim fundamentalist who are currently getting a free ride in these countries (and creating Al Queda). Again, the US administration does not like to feel beholden to anyone, particularly Saudi Arabia.

4.) A pro-west governent in Iraq could influence the political environment's of Iraq's neighbors. (along with the CIA). The US administration would like nothing more than to see the anti-west governements of Iran and Seria fall to pro-western revolutionaries.

5.) Israel. The overall goal of invading Iraq is to get a larger long-term foothold in the middle east. The US administration views this as an opportunity to begin to change the political and cultural environment in the Middle East, to a pro-western, and Israel-tolerant political and cultural environment. And in the process make tons of $ on oil deals.

In short, the US, Britian, and our allies, are attempting to fundamentally change the way of life of millions of people in dozens of countries. It is just the continuation of the American Imperialistic dream of a McDonalds on every corner, a US car in every garage, and a cut of all the action lining US businessmen's pockets. It is pitiful to think that so many Americans are backing such a lie, and so many see absolutely nothing wrong with playing with the lives of millions of people half way around the world. I imagine that to some of these powerful "leaders", it isn't much different than playing a game of Risk, except that the board is a whole lot bigger. It makes me sick.


In case any of you are curious, the following is a link to a similar post I made on a different board. It started a pretty good discussion. Please don't sign up or post to the board though. That is unless you are a Phish fan. Thanks.

http://www.phantasytour.com/phish/boards_thread.cgi?threadID=89646&page=1