Personally, I like Dean's comments. He gave us some balance

[mtnsnake]

to the constant onslaught of personal attacks from the right; he showed some balls & toughness (very unusual for Democrats to do that these days); & what he said made me LMAO!

Hey, that's just me, but ya gotta admit that Howard got more attention from the media in a fleeting few seconds by showing some balls for what he was man enough to say, than what all other Democrats combined have gotten in the last few weeks for what they are too afraid to say.

Sure, Howard needs to be careful of what he says (according to most other people), but his Democratic comrades better learn to shut the fuck up or skirt the issue when approached by the string-pulling media about his comments. If Howard's Democratic peers have anything to say about it, they should say it in private. It's called LOYALTY, a very simple and important concept that the less than ballsy need to learn about.

I also wonder if the "moveable middle" is turned on by comments like Dean made. I'll bet they are. I say let Howard do his thing.

[catmandu57]

1. We're democrats we're supposed

to roll over and take whatever bones we're thrown. Well, fuck that, Dr.Dean has the right idea we sure as hell haven't gotten anywhere but in the loss collumn doing it the old way.

[Larkspur]

2. Dean's comment was taken out of context by the Media, so it's time

to hold the Media accountable for exploiting comments for ratings gimmicks. The best attack Dems should give, when the Media comes to them with a Dean quote is one of the two below --
1) if the Dem has not heard or seen Dean's speech, "I did not personally hear Dean's speech, but we both agree that the Republican leadership, from President Bush to the Republican leaders in Congress are hurting America and hard working, tax paying American citizens."
2) if the Dem has seen Dean's speech, then that Dem should smack the irresponsible Media with this, "That quote was taken out of context. Everyone knows that when Dean was criticizing 'Republicans' he was referring to Republican leadership, not Republican voters. Mr. Dean and I agree that the Republican leadership, from President Bush to the Republican leaders in Congress are hurting America and hard working, tax paying American citizens."

[paineinthearse]

3. Have you read the DNC's press release on the matter?

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x1834118

[TheFarseer]

4. Here's the thing

Dean is kind of our rah rah, horray for Democrats guy. The republicans have a rah rah, horray for republicans guy. I'd bet you he says the same kind of things Dean says, but no one knows about it because the media has been targeting Howard. This is the kind of thing your rah rah guy SHOULD be saying and the other party members should be saying, "well that's his opinion and and he's entitled to it." and if pushed they should say, "I can see where he's coming from" Party infighting hurts us more than we know.

[mtnsnake]

5. Exactly. And on top of that, if Dean doesn't say these things,

then who the heck will?

Yes, Howard perhaps may not be the right person to say this stuff, but someone has to, and no one else has come forward or gotten noticed. All along we've been hoping for someone to blast the other side like they've blasted us, and now that we have that guy doing it for us, his own people are questioning him.

Personally, I think Howard is saying these things becasue he's fed up with the constant barrage of personal attacks that have been coming at us for years from rightwing hate radio and rightwing nutjob politicians, who have been way more out of line over the years than Howard ever was.

Sometimes the only way to get the massive onslaught of rightwing lies and personal attacks to stop is to take matters into you own hands and give them back the same.....until someday everyone on both sides finally says, hey, let's put a stop to all of this.

Howard Dean doesn't deserve criticism from his Democratic peers; he deserves a medal.

[Tom Rinaldo]

6. Howard is the right person to be saying these things. God bless him

And Howard is our rah rah guy, exactly as stated above. Republicans are constantly putting out shit about Democrats backing a culture of death, or Democrats wanting to ban the bible, or that Democrats don't want to protect America from terrorists etc. Many of their extreme statements are found in fund raising appeals going out under official Republican Party letterheads. When they get caught at that game MAYBE there is a brief blip of embarrassment and/or contrition and then they go right back to it. The Republicans know exactly what they are doing. They are firing up their base, and that brings them big payoffs over the long run, well worth the occasional hand caught in cookie jar moment when some over the top rhetoric gets held up to a spot light.

The only reason why this "story" grew legs is because a few National Democrats took the bait and were too dramatic in how they distanced themselves from Dean's comments. There are always ways for any Democrat to skillfully disassociate from the apparent implications of a statement made by another Democrat, if they feel that they must, without throwing fuel onto a false fire. But I don't see a need to blast Edwards or Biden over this now either. Dealing with the media is a constant tight rope walk, even the most skilled artisans fall off it sometimes. But god damn it we need to draw the right lessons from moments like these, and the right lesson is NOT to muzzle Dean.

There is no surgical implant available that can preserve all of the firery inspirational language of a partisan political leader, while also filtering out only those few phrases that might sting us if taken out of context and put under a microscope. Dean is doing his job very well. Actually Democrats from "red states" who are afraid of voters thinking that they are too liberal can actually skillfully use Dean to their advantage. That is the political art I referred to above. They can respectfully let their voters know that they don't agree with everything that Dean says which can give them the aura of "independence from the National Party that they think that they need in order to get elected from Texas or whatever. That is how the game is played. It is not the same as grandstanding against or directly undermining Party leadership.

I would have loved to see some leading Democrat point out, while acknowledging all the millions of hard working Republican voters out there, that it is the Republicans who have worked tirelessly to abolish ALL estate taxes so that a permanent moneyed non working class can be established in this country.

[mtnsnake]

7. "firing up their base"

Great post in its entirety, Tom!

Yup, Democrats have to learn how to play or we're going to lose more elections. When one of our head spokesmen is trying to add balance or trying to fire up a NEW base of voters, it's not time to fall prey to the media.

[KittyWampus]

8. His Comments Were Rather Clumsy. Could Have Been Phrased Much Better

[mtnsnake]

9. Yeah, like the right wing hate mob was real tactful with Kerry, eh.

and look where it got them.