ABC: "Freedom Fries" Rep. now blames neocons for Iraq - (VIDEO)

[dzika]

June 12, 2005

Video - ABC: "Freedom Fries" Rep. now blames neocons for Iraq

A NC Republican Representative, Walter Jones, now believes that neocons within the Republican party are responsible for pushing the US into the Iraq war.

Based on the bad WMD intelligence given to Congress, Rep. Jones initially supported the Iraq war and even invented the name "Freedom Fries" as a way to protest France opposition to the war.

He now wants to see soldiers pulled out of Iraq as soon as possible. He will be introducing a bill on the house floor to that effect this week.



Video in Real Media format (9 minutes)

Video in Windows Media format (9 minutes)

[wtmusic]

1. So can we buy wine and cheese again? nt

[Pachamama]

67. I never stopped! I just bought more than I ever did!

PS: Does he want to go ahead and sign Conyer's Letter and go march to the White House on Thursday? Then I'd really believe he felt bad and he was backing his words with action.... :patriot:

[calimary]

76. Perhaps we ought to call his office (or email, or fax, or snail mail) and

STRONGLY suggest that very move. Encourage him to step further into The Light, and to do the best thing for his COUNTRY, not just his party. Tell him ALL of us Americans deserve answers from our leaders (who work for AND SERVE US) - ALL of us, both Republican AND Democrat.

[Kittycat]

81. I went on a buying spree....

And now I'm lactose intolerant :rofl

[fertilizeonarbusto]

2. Let the internal bloodletting begin!

:popcorn:

[ElectroPrincess]

13. Oh yes!

And as "Flounder" would put it: "THIS IS GOOD!"





Bluto: Holy shit!

D-Day: There were blanks in that gun!
Flounder: I didn't even point the gun at him!

Bluto: Holy shit!



D-Day: There WERE blanks in that gun!
Flounder: Maybe he had a heart attack.

Bluto: Holy shit!

[damntexdem]

3. Nothing like ODing on Freedom Fries.

Now maybe he'll go after our own domestic dictator tots.

[BattyDem]

4. "dictator tots"

:rofl:

I like that. :toast:

[movonne]

6. Let's hope

[Kingshakabobo]

7. LOL

Dictator Tots!

:rofl:

Seriously, are these guys trying to save their own 2006 political hides by distancing themselves from commander cocobanannas?

Is the ship really sinking? The rats sure seem to be jumping ship.

[CantGetFooledAgain]

30. God I hope so. (n/t)

[movonne]

8. yes

[marylanddem]

5. His Native American name would be

Bends With The Political Winds

(but I do think this is a HUGE bellweather sign! Yippee!)

[hatrack]

20. Or would it be Wavers With Trends?

Just asking . . .

[AceAlmighty82]

57. I can feel...

the wind blowing away from Leader With No Brains to Saving My Own Hide

[Kellanved]

9. So will he apologize to France

and Belgium, while he is at it?

Or is that just something he expects only from other people?

[progressoid]

24. Hell, is he going to apologoze to America?!

[DuaneBidoux]

48. ..and Germany, and Russia, and the dozens of other countries who had

the beneficial foresight of history to figure out what this idiot who apparently had no history couldn't figure out on his own?

[Sequoia]

82. You forgot Poland

Just kidding, I love it!!!

[DuaneBidoux]

90. But don't forget Poland: they were on "shrubs" side, as soon as the price

was right

[Generator]

10. Hey I give him a hand!

I happen to applaud anybody that says the truth. (don't know if he said he's wrong) It IS the neo-con CON job. We do need to bring the troops home. This is way more than you hear from the Dems on the hill. Hillary? Ha de fricking ha.

[CitrusLib]

11. I am having such a hard time cheering people like this

He's about 2 years behind the curve and his 'flip-flop' doesn't mean shit to the friends and families of over 1700 of our service men and women who gave the ultimate sacrifice to a pack of lies he signed on to support.

As a middle-class, suburban female residing in New Hampshire at the time GWB was dragging us into this mess, I could see what he was doing as plain as the nose on my face. For any politician to say they NOW have the info the should have had to make an informed decision is disingenious at best.

I'm glad he's blaming the neo-cons, but it's just a tad bit late, huh? He's just growing a spine and a brain now?????

:mad: :mad:

[mistertrickster]

40. Damn right. I never believed for a New York second any of

Bush's trumped up "facts."

Now this guy wants to have it both ways, "I was a war-monger but I was misled."

So you want to impeach Bush because he's an effing liar, right?

Sorry, Charlie, kiss your ass goodbye in 2008.

[FourStarDemocrat]

69. He actually does believe it and is sincere.

I know, a rare thing for a Repub, but true. A few months ago at the House Armed Svcs hearings on Iraq, he read Perle the riot act for misleading and being wrong on the whole lead up to Iraq. I listened to most of it live on the radio and could hardly believe my ears. He is very , very angry at the administration- as much as anyone here is.

[progressiveBadger]

83. Don't cheer the person, cheer the message

This doesn't make up for his own part in the push for war, but never the less, this action is important. If Bush calls the troops home to try to save his own hide, we will be happy about the ACTION. He will always be a putz, but bringing the troops home is what we will celebrate.
I don't care who does it, US out of Iraq NOW.

[Felix Mala]

12. 'spose a few more will grow a conscience or turn to "real"

Christianity? Sooner or later you just gotta get sick of the killing and the torture...

[KansDem]

14. Yeah, you were told this was a bogus war before it even began...

But you refused to acknowledge that. Millions of people across this country and around the world shouted out to you that this Iraq invasion was immoral and illegal and involved yet another lie from the Bush Family. But instead you renamed French fries to "freedom fries" in a childish attempt to belittle the country that actually saw the folly of Bush's war...

Now you want it the other way? Too late, to paraphrase your own vice-president, "Go f*ck yourself!"

And George S: Do you really believe Jones is the only member of Congress who wrote letters to the families of the fallen? I believe John Kerry for one has been attending funerals. More than can be said for the Piece-of-Shit in Chief!

[mitchum]

15. So their waterboy finally discovered that he is drenched?

He's not noble. He's just an opportunist sniffing the wind.

[Coexist]

16. wow - if he can change his mind...

of course, he actually attends soldiers funerals and writes letters to the families. If you see the other side of war, it must get to you after awhile.

[pasto76]

17. As a vet, I applaud this man

signing those letters is something. Its giving a little time to the families, which is much more than any other republican gives.
Yeah, hindsight is 20/20 and us on this side were right all along. As much as I hated being in Iraq, as much as I hate the people who sent me and my friends over there, when we got there we took a deep breath, looked around and assessed where we were at that moment. This is what Rep Jones has done, and this is what more lawmakers and adminstration people need to do.
Shit is all kinds of broken, and we need to keep the pressure on them and make them fix it!


SGT PASTO

[bluesbassman]

56. Thanks Sarge!

From one newbie and vet to another, welcome to DU! I'm glad you made it through, and my sincerest thanks for your service.

I agree with your take on Rep Jones. I don't care where the challenges to this illegal war come from. We will never change the minds of die hard neocons, but they are only a small percentage. Who we need to be concerned with are our fellow Americans, the rank and file Republicans who have been led astray. When these people can see the truth then we have a shot at reversing the damage that has been done to our country by gwb and his band of thieves.

So to all of you who are pissed at Jones for his "Freedom Fries" and the fact that now he's trying to save his own political skin: Who cares where the message comes from? Jones will soon be gone, but if his new position causes some more Republicans to see the light then I say let him flip-flop!

[Oversea Visitor]

59. Right on

The objectives is to end the maddness. Anyone willing to step up and be counted is doing a badly needed task.

[calimary]

77. Hey, both of you! Welcome to DU!!!

Glad to have you here, and thank you for your service to our country!

And yes, let him flip-flop - over to OUR view for a change. Since he's going this far, he ought to be encouraged to come COMPLETELY clean on this. YES he was misled, as were many multitudes in this country who should have known better but chose to give the pResident the benefit of the doubt during a scary time. He shouldn't have. None of them should have done so, but they did. That he's pulling away from this, and he's of the Dark Side, is significant. Perhaps he should put his money where his outrage is, and sign John Conyers' letter. After all, isn't it patriotic to expect our leaders to tell us the truth? If they're held to it about private extramarital affairs between consenting adults, shouldn't they also be held to it when it comes to dragging America into a war under false pretences?

Okay, Congressman Jones. Let's see your outrage. How sincere and deeply-felt is it, really? How serious and essential do you regard truth-telling in our government to be?

[Cha]

100. Right! Let 'em

"flip-flop"! It's damn ironic that it's the freedom fries guy..will wonders ever cease?

Welcome to DU, bluesbassman and pasto!

[Oversea Visitor]

58. Hello there

People around the world dont hate the American soldiers just that dumb cuckoo sitting at the top. US is the most powerful nation in the world. When insanity strike it hell happened.

[Bread and Circus]

18. Maybe I am giving him too much credit, but I believe this dude...

actually had a bonafide change of heart.

He's obviously made mistakes but I think he is trying to save from further mistakes.

Watch the video.

Freedom Fries aside, even Kerry, HRC, and John Edwards voted for the IWR. Don't they have as much blood on their hands?

[psychopomp]

36. I am with you on that.. he has seen the light and I welcome that

Looks like the Iraq debacle may well be on its way to being history, thank goodness. I believe that the introduction of a resolution calling for a set date for withdrawl by Rep. Freedomfries will be the beginning of the end of this miserable chapter.

[mistertrickster]

41. As for Kerry, Hillary and Edwards, yes they do IMHO. And that's

what cost us the election IMHO. Bush just hammered Kerry with, "how can he be against the war when he voted FOR it? He's a flip-flopper."

It stuck because it was essentially true.

The Kerry-bots will argue that he didn't vote for the war, he voted to give the president the power to go to war, which he would have wanted himself had he been president.

Uhm, okay. Whatever you say.

If it had been me, I would have voted against Bush at every single opportunity. How can anyone look at the way Bush "won" Florida in 2000 believe anything this lying bastard says?

He already cheated America of its DEMOCRACY, our most important value, for God sake . . .

[Spiffarino]

98. I'm not buying him yet. He's the same idiot

...who put up a bill that would allow churches to become active in partisan political campaigns and still retain their tax-exempt status. It was in response to the Waynesville, NC church that expelled its Democratic members.

I'm glad he says he's against the war, but I think it's a reaction to its unpopularity in a state that is home to so many families of service men and women serving in Iraq. That includes members of my own family.

[hatrack]

19. How about some crow with your "Freedom Fries", DUMBASS?????

The dawn's early light has penetrated (apparently) some of the darkest recesses in DC, including this prosimian's skullcase. Congrats, Congressman. So glad you could join the "reality-based community". :puke:

[stevans_41902]

23. I think he deserves credit for speaking out against the war

even though I hated the whole "Freedom Fries" thing. I think getting letters back from the soldiers families and going to the funerals made the deaths real for him (he could have just as easily ignored the fact that thousands were dead/wounded and continued with the "they're dying to protect our freedoms so its worth the sacrifice" spiel) There are a lot of Dems who voted for the war as a previous post pointed out as well as a lot of Americans who believed the WMD lie who now know better and are vehemently against the war.

[chomskysright]

95. kick it: I don't think many understand how conservative Jones has been

[chomskysright]

96. KICK IT!: THANK JONES FOR GOD'S SAKE....

http://www.webslingerz.com/jhoffman/congress-email.html

Rep Jones:

And BOY are we proud to see you there---as associated with being citizens of NC.

THE CITIZENS DON'T WANT THIS WAR.

[chomskysright]

97. KICK IT!

[DuaneBidoux]

49. French crow, no less. I was recently in France watching the news and the

big story over there is how it's such a big story in the US that things are going so wrong. It's like "Why didn't they hear us? We said this would happen. Why are they surprised? Do these people understand any history at all?"

Apparently, that question is answered with a resounding "non"

[Postman]

21. Maybe the guilt is too much for him to sleep at night.

I give him credit for having the the balls to act on his concience

[liberaliraqvet26]

25. I agree 100%, I forgive him

for the freedom fries nonsense. If enough R's like him stand up, they can force the administration to formulate a REAL exit strategy and save lives. Right now they are just trying top sail along and pass their failures on to the next administration to deal with. The lack of a common sense exit strategy costs lives on both sides every day.

[Robin Hood]

44. I respectfully disagree.

What this man has partaken in is war crimes. He voted for an illegal war. He knew it and the world knew it. There were countless millions of people in the streets from all over the world, protesting Americas push for war.

You telling me that he didn't hear that? Him and all of the other war criminals in our government need to be brought to justice. Dems included.

[calimary]

79. Well, he hasn't gone quite far enough with those balls...

He needs to sign, and get fully behind, John Conyers' letter. Easy for you to say, Mr. Congressman. Talk is cheap. What do you actually intend to DO about it, then? Do you remain an enabler, or do you try to get some answers, hold your pResident accountable for the lies you now can recognize, and seek justice for the families who NEEDLESSLY lost loved ones in this war? Their blood IS on your hands if you don't do something to correct this.

BTW - I'm hoping to see MORE of our "illustrious" representatives doing this, and taking the face-saving "I was LIED TO" way out. Look, ANY way out that leads them away from the Dark Side, and has them finally-finally-finally admitting this whole war is completely bogus, is good. Sometimes you have to allow the opponent a face-saving way out, to end a conflict and bring about a satisfactory conclusion. Besides, a redeemed sinner can be an astoundingly strong and effective ally. This guy is "one of THEM." If he's even starting to see the light, this is a win. And if he's saying this stuff out loud, you can BET other people are thinking it, and some of those other people are colleagues of his in various House groupings. You can BET there's been BIGTIME discussion about this at the coffee bar or the news stand or in the men's room or the House dining room or whatever. You can BET he's coming forward with his own misgivings because he's hearing those same misgivings from so many others of his peers that he feels it's somewhat safe to stick his neck out like this.

Note also how cautiously he's doing so, though. Not ready to pin the blame at the top, where it belongs (with bush) - he's weaseling around with the neocons. Which is not incorrect, but is certainly incomplete. He's trying to tiptoe around this so bush doesn't get any mud or blood splattered on him now that this is getting a little hot here at home. For those of us who call his office - [phone] TOLL FREE - he should be relentlessly and gently-but-firmly steered toward the ultimate conclusion. It's not the neocons by themselves who gave the word for all this. He can blame the neocons, but it doesn't and cannot stop there. THEY didn't green-light this pig-fuck, after all. bush did. Eagerly so. It's HIS war that HE went out and sold and demanded and insisted on and threatened and bullied and arm-twisted for and lied all over the map to get. He HAS to share the accountability, and the blame. And the consequences.

[ronnykmarshall]

22. Can you say "The tide is turning?"

When will the freepers and Rush call this guy a "traitor"?

[ElectroPrincess]

27. Yes, don't if feel good? BTW time to indict Rush Bo on buying DOPE!

[ronnykmarshall]

28. THAT would be a great celb trial!

[pilgrimm]

26. Looks to me like Jones is positioning himself for 06 elections

I imagine that Jones' can serve as a reliable indication that the war in Iraq, like in the country as a whole, is not polling well in NC. Like most politicians he is probably just taking his cues from the polls and although I'm glad the public is starting to wise up' I can't help but be angry that no one paid attention to this before it all actually went down.

[DRoseDARs]

29. He's up for reelection in 2006, isn't he?

I want to give him the benefit of the doubt, that he's actually seen the light, but methinks this has more to do with sensing a change in the tide.

[Name removed]

31. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[The Backlash Cometh]

32. He deserves to have his face smeared in Freedom Fries.

He owes the French an apology.

[Stuckinthebush]

33. I'll forgive Mr. Jones when...

He co-sponsors articles of impeachment. Until then, all I see is a man who is keenly aware of the political dangers of being too closely aligned with Bush.

[katinmn]

34. This is wonderful. He's been speaking out for a couple

months now.

At least he has the guts to admit when he made a mistake, unlike about 90 percent of Congress.

[FighttheFuture]

35. Sounds like Mr. Fry is worried about his own ass boiling in oil...

I'm glad he is speaking out, and encourage others to do so, but the "Freedom Fry" thing makes me think of him as an brazen Repuglican opportunist, as such he is simply catching on that he needs cover for being a goosestepper.

Don't applaud him, simply use him until he is replaced by a populist, for the people, Democrat!! Perhaps his lesson will be a minder to all Fascists and their "Igor"s!!

If he can really change and become a human being, great, but understand if I do not hold my breath!

[Cyrano]

37. No more "Freedom Fries"?

And to think I went out of my way to ban the word "French" (as well as any references to Paris) from my vocabulary. For example:

American toast.

American kissing.

The American and Indian War.

American cleaners.

The luxury liner Ile de America.

The film "The American Connection."

The actress America Nugyen.

The musical "An American in Budapest."

The song "April in Pongyang."

Well, you get the idea. What I find incredible is how many assholes there are in this country that went along with the "Freedom Fries" insanity.

[Singular73]

38. Are you people insane?

He has seen the light? He has had a change of heart?

PLEASE.

This is a political move, and a damned obvious one at that.

For Gods sakes people.

[jbnow]

39. How do you know?

I don't know either, but am inclined to believe he is speaking from his heart.

I saw an interview with him talking about the families who actually wrote him back in the midst of their pain (he wrote to the families of soldiers who died). He also talked about funerals of the soldiers. He said his mind started to change some time ago at the funeral of a soldier with 3 young kids, including infant twins he never got to see or hold.

His emotion was real. He feels those deaths in a way bush doesn't and doesn't think they should be dying for false purposes.

I don't know the guy, but I assume his fervent emotions are the same reason he did the stupid freedom fries thing, he believed in the cause and felt betrayed by France. It was stupid. This move is not stupid.

[Singular73]

91. You are right...

I posted this before I watched the video...it was pretty convincing.

[pasto76]

46. cant say as I care right now

No one wants in charge wants to talk about changing how anything is done. Its either Stay or Go. We've been there long enough, some have been there 3 times now. Its time to bring them home.

Securitywise maybe not the best move, but "staying the course" only means getting more troops killed. A very successful military motto is "right or wrong, do something, but DO SOMETHING"


SGT PASTO

[Moxygirl]

42. I smell a rat...

running away from a stinking pile of SHIT.

[Robin Hood]

43. "Because my heart aches"

UNFUCKINGBELIEVABLE!!!!!! What did you think was going to happen dumbass?!!!! I have no pity for you. Show repentance by eliminating yourself.

May god forgive you. I can not.

[Straight Shooter]

45. I watched the video and I believe the man speaks sincerely.

I don't think he was making it up when he said his father, a many-term NC senator, told him to always 1) vote your conscience, 2) vote your constituents, 3) vote your party.

I would prefer that "3" be vote for America and then "4" vote your party, but as much as I held in contempt the "freedom fries" nonsense, I think it just goes along with Senator Jones' political character. After all, he is from North Carolina, and they can get a little, well, hokey at times. (BTW, I love North Carolina, having lived there some years ago.)

Writing over 1300 letters to families is amazing. Whatever he's doing now, he's not lying about it and I don't think he's doing it to save his butt, either. I really truly don't. I believe in this interview he was speaking from his heart. Perhaps it will give others an opportunity to search their own hearts and conscience and come forward and have the courage to say, "I was wrong. Now I want the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the ugly truth."

[ItsTheMediaStupid]

47. He's a congressman

His father was also a congressman.

I used to live in this guy's district. He was first elected in 1994 as a Newt Gingrich clone.

I heard he was not the brightest tack in the bag and changed parties and became a cookie cutter conservative republican at least partly in response to Eva Clayton being given a majority-minority district due to redrawining Jones Sr's old district. The pugs grabbed him due to name recognition.

Having said that, I'm glad he came out against the war. He'll probably have a well-funded party hack run against him in the primary in 2006. Maybe he'll become an independent.

[DuaneBidoux]

50. Give him credit. Written 1,300 letters with blood as ink and dripping

from his hands. But he owes all those he insulted leading up to the war the following apology: "You were right...I was wrong. I'm sorry."

It's simple, an apology. When I hear that I will take him seriously.

[angryxyouth]

51. So does this mean that he will participate

into the Democratic hearings into the DSM starting on Thurs? He can bring the smiley face cookies.

[ElsewheresDaughter]

52. God HAS Bless this man!!! NC Republican Representative, Walter Jones

[McCamy Taylor]

53. Well done! He is going to get hell from the GOP, so send him support.

[ElsewheresDaughter]

54. everyone needs to recommend this for "greatest" or front page

[DirtyDawg]

55. Strikes me he's like...

the Robert Webber character - Juror #12 - in 12 Angry Men. Was more interested in making cute comments about serious issues and changed his mind every time somebody pushed him to a decision. Anybody that would have gone off on the French, who's only 'crime' was trying to keep us from following the idiocy of a nincompoop, the way this creep did ought to just be ignored, regardless of the number of changes of heart he has.

[marinemom2004]

63. I'm wary of his change of heart, but now he must truly act on it...

Last week I attended the memorial service for one of our local Marines. It was heartbreaking. What a loss of a wonderful young man. My Marine son has been deployed twice to Iraq. My husband and I were against going to this war before it started. I even wrote my Congressman and then spoke to him personally prior to the vote. (He voted to go to war.) We listened to Colin Powell when he spoke at the U.N. and thought there must be evidence because he wouldn't betray his fellow troops. We could not believe that the war would all be based on lies; and when our son crossed the border from Kuwait into Iraq on the first day of the war in 2003, we thought Bush had better be right in what he is doing. How could the U.S. ever start a preemptive war unless our country was in imminent danger?

I do not look down upon Kerry or most of the members of Congress who voted to go into Iraq based on what Bush was telling them. Who could possibly believe that any president would so willingly and eagerly start a war and risk so many lives unless he was absolutely, positively sure of the intelligence? I do believe that Bush and company had the correct intelligence and manipulated it to justify what they wanted to do. But now, I want a full investigation and nothing less. Bush, Cheney, et al should all be impeached. Perhaps if they attended one of these funerals like I did, they might possibly comprehend what they have done, but I honestly believe they do not care.

I belong to a support group for Marine families. Since April of 2004 I have saved the names of all the Marines who have died. The list goes on and on. I hope we never enter a war so easily again, but hey, we didn't seem to learn from Vietnam either.

Sorry to go on and on. But this war is very personal.

[DirtyDawg]

66. Thank you for what you do marinemom...

...and if this war were a little more personal to a lot more people, we wouldn't still be there and probably never would have gone.

Your post particularly struck a chord with me. My wife and I were visiting some friends this past weekend in another state. We accompanied them to their church for Sunday AM service - first time I've darkened a church door for anything other than funerals or weddings since bushco pushed us into this thing. During the Minister's prayer he included 'and especially we pray for those that are fighting to protect our liberties'. I couldn't help but stop right then and think how much more appropriate it would be if he were to have said 'and we pray for those that have answered the call from 'the President' to go to war because he said so'. Indeed the only reason they should ever be asked to kill and risk being killed is to protect our liberties...not as a tool for some Machiavellian power play...and certainly not a pack of lies.

God bless you and I am praying for a safe return for your son and for all the rest of those wonderful young men and women who only ask that their leaders make damn sure that the reasons for going to war are real and not just what they choose to do.

[calimary]

87. What a lovely service you provide - I'll bet that support group is the

most important meeting on every member's agenda. That is so generous and compassionate and lovely of you to stand with these people. They sure do need it. Thanks! A true patriot you are.

HUGS!!!

[bejammin075]

60. Jones should be supported, not bashed,

OK, not everybody is a hardcore liberal who automatically knows Bush is 100% evil. I was a dead-center moderate at the time we invaded Iraq (although now I don't know what moderate means anymore). At the time, I belived a lot of lies and supported the invasion. I am now an anti-war activist, but it took 8 months of reading liberal blogs. Now imagine what it's like to be this guy, a Republican from NC.

Give him a fucking break!!

I believe he sounds sincere.
He keeps photos of the dead and wounded to remember them.
He attends funerals, while Bush has attended none.
He has written over 1,300 letters to the families of the deceased. I bet he even signed the letters himself, instead of using a stamp.
He is boldly speaking against the neo-cons - how many Repubs are doing that. Those of you who make cynical comments like "he's blowing with the wind, etc." NO! He is NOT "blowing with the wind". That's absurd. This guy is going to take hell for going against the neo-cons. The ENTIRE neo-con apparatus will now be aligned AGAINST him. That's hardly going to help him in NC. You know what the neo-cons do to repubs that get in the way of the war machine - McCain in 2000, remember that? This guy has courage. He's starting to see the light. Support him.

Those of you who dismiss this guy and want him to grovel on his knees before you and France: If you think you can end the war all by yourselves without the help of Republicans like this, good fucking luck. Would you spite this man, even if it hurts our soldiers chances of returning home? We have to reach outside our liberal bubble to people like this.

I will call his office and give him support. Will you?

[OKDem08]

61. I agree

Bejammin, well said!
I have to say that I was duped, as well, and admit to an error in judgment in initially supporting action against Iraq. I have come to realize that I was wrong. This is my 1st post.
Please don't crucify me.

[bejammin075]

62. Right, I was duped too, so I can understand

that a Republican would be duped.

And welcome to DU!

[liberaliraqvet26]

64. when i first went to Iraq with my reserve unit....

I forced myself to believe in the mission. I thought for sure there was something we didn't know. I didn't think our president would lie us into war. On those early days in March of '03 after crossing the border I swore we were going to get gassed with the WMD's. it took me almost six months to see what was really happening when I was loading and unloading boats for halliburton at the port of umm qasr and imprisioning taxi drivers and other poor souls who were in the wrong place at the wrong time at a terrible prison camp. I spent 14 long months in the hot and miserable desert with the infamous 800th mp brigade under gen. Karpinski.

The point is that it takes some people longer than others to see the truth. We need to welcome any and everyone to our side. Even if the were at one time on the wrong side of the aisle or the issue. Sometimes flip flopping is good, it shows that you can think for yourself. Support Rep. Jones and hope others follow.

[calimary]

86. Whoa - what a story! Thank you for your service and your sacrifice!

NOBODY should have to face that hell-hole. I'm glad you're out of there - you can STAY out of there now, I hope.

And I think you could not be more correct about the way human nature embraces denial. It takes a mighty strong backbone to be able to face such a deeply disturbing reality: that someone you love or someone another mom or dad or husband or wife or sister or brother loved - has died in a war we were LIED into. It takes a stiffer backbone than many people have. If it were me, I don't know how easily I could face that one. It's one helluva slap in the face of that monumental sacrifice. Could I look in my bathroom mirror every morning knowing my son or daughter or other loved one had been killed in a war that was COMPLETELY unnecessary, and trumped up? Could I live with myself? Could I stand to wake up every morning, to that most cold and harsh of realities? I can see how relatives of the missing, killed, and permanently maimed feel compelled to shut their eyes and plug their ears and try to avoid facing the facts. TOO painful. AWFUL. I hope none of us has to go through that horror, EVER. And I hope - for those who do, that soon enough, their anguish will find some resolution in the pursuit of justice - impeachment - removal from office - and indictments for international war crimes.

[FourStarDemocrat]

68. I agree with you. Jones has a conscience and is acting on it.

Jones has become very regretful and outspoken for a few months now, and it's building because he is seeing all the bullshit at the end of the great white light. It does take courage to be one of them and go up against the administration, and hopefully lead others on his side of the aisle. I would encourage every member here from his district or state to call his office and thank him for spurring this on.

[SunDrop23]

101. I have no beef with the guy

He's sincere and I have already called his office and offered thanks support.

[autorank]

65. Great thread dzika! Thought provoking and allowed for a quiet gloat!

I say, this guy needs to leave Sith Lord Cheney and hang with the "light workers!" All the more votes for Speaker Pelosi.

I also wanted to compliment you on that extraordinary thread with TruthIsAll...when he did the numbers and you the graphs. That was simply the best real-time collaboration I've seen on any public forum! You two did amazing stuff and made it look easy. Truly a sight to see.

:hi:

[LiberalinNC]

70. Jones probably had a poll taken of his area...

that stated that majority of people belived that Georgie was lying about Iraq!

I don't believe any garbage that comes out of this guys mouth! JMO

[calimary]

85. Hey, if that's so, so much the better! It would prove that these folks

can finally read handwriting on the wall when it's dripping blood down to the floor.

If this is so, then that hopefully will answer those who hesitate to call their reps and demand impeachment proceedings - because it'll do no good, it's no use, the republi-CONS own the whole place, why try... Well, if THIS guy's starting to turn, MANY MORE are probably directly on heels.

I'm guessing he wouldn't have stuck his neck out - even to this extent - if he hadn't heard a LOT of the same kind of talk in a LOT of other places, from the Capitol Hill coatroom, dining room, and barber shop to Beltway watering holes and other gathering places, and VERY likely also from his constituents. If he's saying it, other people are thinking it. A guy like this, especially a card-carrying inhabitant of the Dark Side, doesn't speak or act in a vacuum. Clearly, he feels it's safe enough, and reasonable enough, to dare to speak of such things in public. THAT tells you the tide is, indeed, turning.

And that's a good sign. Soon enough, SOME of them will likely feel emboldened enough to speak up, for themselves.

This guy needs calls, too. This guy is one of the folks who NEEDS to hear the invocation of the "I" word. He NEEDS to start hearing that "Impeachment IS an option." He obviously thinks it's okay to talk this far off the reservation. He could be one of many on the brink of being forced to face the big facts: that his pResident is guilty of high crimes and should be removed from office.

[OneTwentyoNine]

71. Hey Walter....stay the HELL out of small aircraft in the coming months.n/t

[Lasher]

72. Where's the Customary White House Slander Campaign?

The White House always launches a slander campaign against anyone who dares criticize them. Where's the personal attacks against Walter Jones? I haven't seen that yet.

[DirtyDawg]

73. I think they've gotten....

...to the point that they feel they don't even have to bother. Our crack MSM will simply tire of it and move on. Of course they also know that there will be an endless array of Michael Jacksons/Runaway Brides/Arubas/etc to distract just long enough. The negative numbers are probably down to the hard core partisans and fools and you're never gonna get them to change their minds. This is what they wanted and now that they've gotten it what makes us think that they're gonna give it up? If someone were to conduct a poll today I doubt if 2% would even know who Walter Jones even is...in two weeks even less.

[truth_is_extreme]

74. ROT IN HELL JONES

because of criminals like you so many Iraqis died, not to mention the 1,700 Americans.

Now you want the troops out? It's not going to happen, the Bush Crime Family wants them right where they are. They need the military bases to keep stealing the oil from the Iraqi people.

[Ikonoklast]

75. Running scared now

Do you think the fact that NC has a lot of military bases, families, and casualties have anything to do with it? Saving his own political ass, he doesn't give a crap about the war. Hypocrite.

[meow2u3]

78. Freedom Fries Jones admits Bushco conned him?

A repuke who admits to being bamboozled? A con who admits having been wrong? I don't believe what I've seen! :eyes:

Has hell frozen over? Has the Devil strapped on his skates and take to the ice? Did pigs grow wings and take off flying? OMG! :wow:

[kitkat65]

80. DU anger is understandable but as the saying goes "don't cut your nose

off to spite your face."

We need Republican support to stop this madness and from a non-emotional and calculated standpoint, we need more of these "changed-minds" politicians.

Soldiers have been killed and maimed from all over the country, not just in red or blue states. These pols know they're going to have to answer to their constituents eventually regarding their approval for war and the best way for them to do this is pass the buck to the Bush administration.

We've also seen how the neocon machine deals with those that voice dissent so the moderate Republicans are going to need non-partisan support from American citizens to get the courage up to demand answers.

Our best game plan is to send letters, calls and e-mails giving him support and also encourage other Republicans to do the same.

Save your well-deserved anger for later.

[maxsolomon]

84. switch parties & then we'll talk

idiot.

[Demrock6]

88. Well done Rep Walter Jones Jr. Get the truth out!

[MojoXN]

89. Fuck you, Walter Jones.

You should have had the balls to stand up for what is right in the goddamn first place. Now that you think it's politically expedient, you call for the war's end. I said it beofre, and I'll say it again. Fuck you, Walter Jones, ya fuckin' Francophobe. And I'm not even of French ancestry. I just hate closed-minded, xenophobic Rightists who care about nothing but themselves.

Hey Walter, I got an idea! Why don't you call for Bush's impeachment on the floor of the House? Oh, right, the lack of balls...

MojoXN

[lollipop]

92. Remember when guys like Walter Jones

told people who didn't support the 'republican way' that they were anti-American, and that they should move to Canada. Now what does he have to say to those of us who were right all along?

[libertarianseeker]

93. It's a trial balloon

The hard core Bushista's always needed a Plan B for when their crap got unpopular. The plan is to blame and abandon the "Neocons." I've read that the Neocons are just "Jewish Conservatives" and "Israeli mouthpieces." The war was all their idea and Bush was mislead. I hope W won't have to go after all of us Jews, but the apple doesn't fall far from the tree as my mother used to say. I hope I'm nuts.

[chomskysright]

94. this is fucking BIG: he wanted to propose that churches be....

able to speak partisan politics w/o IRS being up their ass.



http://www.govtrack.us/congress/billtext.xpd?bill=h109-235


109TH CONGRESS H. R. 235 1ST SESSION To amend the Internal Revenue Code of 1986 to protect the religious free exercise and free speech rights of churches and other houses of worship. IN THE HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES JANUARY 4, 2005 Mr. JONES of North Carolina introduced the following bill; which was referred to the Committee on Ways and Means A BILL To amend the Internal Revenue Code of 1986 to protect the religious free exercise and free speech rights of churches and other houses of worship. 1 Be it enacted by the Senate and House of Representa- 2 tives of the United States of America in Congress assembled, 3 SECTION 1. SHORT TITLE. 4 This Act may be cited as the ``Houses of Worship 5 Free Speech Restoration Act of 2005''. 6 SEC. 2. HOUSES OF WORSHIP PERMITTED TO ENGAGE IN 7 RELIGIOUS FREE EXERCISE AND FREE 8 SPEECH ACTIVITIES, ETC. 9 (a) IN GENERAL.--Section 501 of the Internal Rev- 10 enue Code of 1986 is amended by redesignating subsection 2 1 (q) as subsection (r) and by inserting after subsection (p) 2 the following new subsection: 3 ``(q) An organization described in section 4 170(b)(1)(a)(1) or section 508(c)(1)(A) shall not fail to 5 be treated as organized and operated exclusively for a reli- 6 gious purpose, nor shall it be deemed to have participated 7 in, or intervened in any political campaign on behalf of 8 (or in opposition to) any candidate for public office, for 9 purposes of subsection (c)(3) or section 170(c)(2), 2055, 10 2106, 2522, or 4955 because of the content, preparation, 11 or presentation of any homily, sermon, teaching, dialectic, 12 or other presentation made during religious services or 13 gatherings.''. 14 (b) EFFECTIVE DATE.--The amendment made by 15 subsection (a) shall apply to taxable years ending after 16 the date of enactment of this Act. 17 SEC. 3. CAMPAIGN FINANCE LAWS UNAFFECTED. 18 No member or leader of an organization described in 19 section 501(q) of the Internal Revenue Code of 1986 (as 20 added by section 2) shall be prohibited from expressing 21 personal views on political matters or elections for public 22 office during regular religious services, so long as these 23 views are not disseminated beyond the members and 24 guests assembled together at the service. For purposes of 25 the preceding sentence, dissemination beyond the members HR 235 IH 3 1 and guests assembled together at a service includes a mail- 2 ing that results in more than an incremental cost to the 3 organization and any electioneering communication under 4 section 304(f) of the Federal Election Campaign Act of 5 1971 (2 U.S.C. 434(f)). Nothing in the amendment made 6 by section 2 shall be construed to permit any disburse- 7 ments for electioneering communications or political ex- 8 penditures prohibited by the Federal Election Campaign 9 Act of 1971.

[Cha]

99. This guy better stay out of

small airplanes..wonder what bushreich think of Walter Jones and what kind of an epiphany he musta had!

I don't think yo mama cheney wants the "troops out of Iraq".

[johnlal]

102. Not much of a spine on this one.

He seems to be taken wherever the wind blows him.