Stop fricking worrying about who is running for pres in 2008

[LynneSin]

:grr:

Geez, if I see one more thread about '"So-n-So" democrat can kiss my ass before I vote for them thread' I'm going to have a fricking coronary.

We aren't going to win 2008 if we don't get our collective heads out of our asses and start focusing on NOW which is some important local/governor elections in 2005 and the extremely important midterm elections in 2006.

There are only 2 governor races in 2005 (NJ & VA), both are open seats previously held by democrats - we need to focus on those elections so we can keep democrats running those states. We also have plenty of states with local legislative elections in 2005 and we need to get control of some of those in order to prevent further degradation through redistricting.

I'm not trying to stifle talk about who we'd like to see run/not-run in 2008. But if we need to focus on now. We'll start worrying about 2008 after the 2006 elections are overwith!

[havocmom]

1. Ditto for 'impeach him' threads

Unless we kick some hiney in 06 AND ASSURE ACCURATE VOTE COUNTS, nothing good is gonna happen.

Job one and two(in no particular order): get some good DEM candidates known & funded for 06 and make sure the voting is legitiment.

[Totally Committed]

2. Ditto for the 2008 Polls!

I'm pretty up-to-here with them, too!

TC

[ElectroPrincess]

4. I will not, ...

vote a straight DEMOCRATIC ticket either.

We have some very disturbing "war mongers" in the Democratic Party. I sure as hell will vote for a moderate Republican over a DINO who loves to beat the war drums in the future. :-)

[SteppingRazor]

6. Nothing could be a bigger mistake, especially in the Senate.

We have a chance to take a Senate majority. But the only way we will do it is if a few DINOs get elected. I'm willing to put up with those DINOs if it means we get a Senate majority. Because if that happens, we can set the legislative agenda and put a stop to 90% of Bush's madness. Think about the big picture.

[ElectroPrincess]

7. Then tell "the boys and girls" to stop the bravado?

If you agree with their warmongering "stay the course" IMO you might as well be a Republican.

[SteppingRazor]

10. Well, that's where we differ.

My way, you get allow a few idiots into the Democratic Party in the Senate, but we take over the majority and get things done.

Your way, the Republicans stay in power and the Democrats continue the slide to irrelevance. Besides, you say I might as well be a Republican as if it were an insult, after you just said you'll be voting for Republicans.

You are aware that the majority party gets to put its members as the chairs of all the committees, thereby deciding what bills even get on the Senate floor, right? If having that power means a DINO or two, fine.

Besides, one thing you're not seeing is that, in races where a more-conservative Democrat is running, the Republican choice is usually SUPER rightwing. The upcoming Senate race in Tennessee is a perfect example, where you have Frist retiring and a bunch of complete loonies on the GOP side lining up to race against a mostly conservative Democrat, Harold Ford.

[LynneSin]

14. Your reply was amazing

People have PM'd me and insisted I do whatever it takes to get rid of Carper/Biden (I live in Delaware). Now why the fuck would I waste my time getting rid of democratic senators when I could drive 30 minutes north and help get rid of Santorum.

I will always vote for Tom Carper & Joe Biden for senate as long as they run (and no, I don't support Biden for Prez), but I will not be bothered with trying to get them out of office - we have bigger fish to fry and they are the repukes!

[ElectroPrincess]

19. OK, but this illegal and immoral war is #1 on my priority list ...

Also, these DINOS are corporate whores. Albeit I don't agree with a small government, I have more respect for the few moderate Republicans who aren't locked into the PNAC - Israel first mindset.

No, the continued death and maiming of our soldiers and SLAUGHTER of innocent Iraqis are #1 on my list.

You don't live close to Quantico Marine Corps Base. I have seen Marines visiting the Base Exchange here from Walter Reed Army Hospital. I have seen FIRST HAND, the brave, proud and beautifully young Marines who have to be led by the hand because of a hush hush new phenomenon "Traumatic Brain Injury" has ruined any hope of them living a normal life. Not to mention the seemingly endless amputees. It would make you cry, openly and without shame.

If you folks don't think that ENDING this occupation (and tone down the *war cry* on a concept named Terror) is not our number one priority, then perhaps, I'm not a good Democrat.

War is horrid and you can't fight the incidence of terrorism with the military. Every innocent Iraqi's house we bomb, we CREATE more want to be terrorists.

Our US Imperial War Machine must LEAVE The Middle East ... if we don't we'll go bankrupt chasing a dream. We'll be kicked out just like the Russians were in Afghanistan.

No, I will not vote for anyone who continues to support this immoral occupation - that's #1 on my list. Let your children go and risk death, maiming and brain damage when the Generals implore you for more volunteers. But count my family (proud military service back to the civil war) OUT!

[SteppingRazor]

20. Hey, that's great! Don't support warmongers...

But your initial post was that you'll vote for a moderate Republican over a warmongering Democrat. Now, I would almost be ready to agree with that proposition, except for this -- show me one national House or Senate race in which the Democrat is for the war and the Republican is against it.

[ElectroPrincess]

22. You make a good point ...

You're right, very unlikely.

What I'm trying to do is "shake some sense" into our Democratic Leaders.

A close friend of ours has lost significant amount of his hearing due to three tours in Iraq. Fortunately he is retiring with only that injury.

I love the military because I believe a strong military serves as a deterrent to our country being invaded. It's hard to explain but I'm feeling the same "sadness" as I did when in 1968 were were informed that my brother was wounded. You can't imagine the fear when it's someone close to you.

War should always be avoided. I am still trying to understand how our representatives would let this "disturbed man" lead us into an invasion? I've marched in anti-war rallies in D.C.

Forgive me because I value the military and was proud to serve in the Army. But this invasion and occupation is testing my resolve. This can only end bad - it's better IMO to let the chips fall now with a pull-out.

Clark is a highly intelligent man and an excellent General. But Iraq has smashed into thousands of pieces. The Middle East natives will NOT accept Imperial oversight in ANY, way, shape or form. If in doubt, check your history books?

Thanks for listening - and yeah, there's a big picture here. It's time to MAKE our leaders get on-board with the will of their constituents.

On Edit: No. 11 Poster - Please don't call me "sweetie" for we both know it was used in a condescending manner. Regards, EP

[LynneSin]

21. Yeah, living near Dover Air Force base is pretty uneventful.....

:eyes:

I'm sure if you took a poll you'd fine that many of us DUers live near military bases that have a significant importance to the war.

Remember - the republicans are the enemy. When we get the majority back then we can start worrying about the dinos

[FreedomAngel82]

36. I know how you feel

I'm right now torn between two canidates. I have one person who is Ford junior who is against Iraq and for a DSM investigation who I disagree with on a lot of issues. Then you have Rosalind Kurita who I agree with a lot of issues on the home front but she isn't for a DSM investigation. That is a big important issue with me so I'm willing to think some more on my choice and take Ford if it means he'll help support an investigation.

[bvar22]

39. ElectroPrincess has my understanding and support.

The Demoicratic Party can NO LONGER take my vote for granted as the Party moves ever rightward abandonning LABOR and The WORKING CLASS for Corporate MONEY.

[LynneSin]

11. Sweetie, there is more than just the war at stake

Choice, Stem Cell Research, Health Care, Environment, Taxes, Gas Price, Immigration, Veteran Benefits, Clean Air, Fundamentalist Judges, Gun Control, geez, I could spend the rest of the day covering the issues that our congress works on OTHER than the war.

Get your head out of your butt and stop being single issue. There is exactly one person who has the same political ideology as you and that is YOU! There is so much that we're fighting for that we need desparately to get the majority back in order to start making a dent in undoing the horrors that have been done. Voting for a republican including the most moderate liberal republican out there means you support Bush. If you really can't stand your democratic candidate, vote 3rd party or write in a name!!

[Adelante]

18. "There is exactly one person who has the same political ideology as you

and that is YOU!"


Bingo! :yourock:

[ElectroPrincess]

23. That single issue is MOST important when it's your family paying

the ultimate price. No, I won't do anything to push for a Republican control, but thank Heavens I don't live in Delaware because I could NOT force myself to vote for Biden.

Fortunately I live within an ultra-conservative area of VA. It's often surreal to me how people can adore such authority figures.

To # 11 Post = U No Worry. I'll pull my head out of my ass when you folks attempt to get these war-mongering DINOS to get it straight, i.e., pull out of Iraq.

If it was your child coming home with brain damage and/or limbs amputated, you'd think this is a pretty damn sound one issue vote.

Yes, this single issue is ALL-IMPORTANT to me and will be to many other as this occupation continues to degrade.

I can't influence anything nationally, since VA is mostly a solid republican state.

[Theres-a]

37. Yes!

[LynneSin]

9. So then you're saying you'll support Frist, McConnell, Hassert, Delay, etc

I have a moderate republican as my representative (Mike Castle DE's only representative) and he's pretty moderate supporting choice, spearheading the stem cell legistlation, pro-environment, etc.

I'll vote for a bug squashed by my shoe provided said bug was on the democratic ticket before I vote for Mike Castle even if he's somewhat similiar to the ideologies I support.

The reason?

Because Castle will still continue to support Hasert & Delay for republican leadership and that republican leadership determines what bills get on the floor for vote (same thing for senate).

So sure - go ahead and support the repukes who, btw, support bush. Hell I'll get you a repeal the 22nd amendment Bush 2008 bumpersticker because voting for a moderate republican is voting for Bush and his regime!

[ElectroPrincess]

24. Then volunteer your kid for the OIL wars and I'll shut-up?

[LynneSin]

28. Only children I have are the feline type

But I saw your other thread about shaking up the party. I do support shaking up the party but not at the expense of voting for more republicans. I think you had even clarified that some from your original post of 'wanting to vote for moderate repukes over dinos'

I am strongly against the war but there are other issues that are just as important to me. I watch my 8 year old niece shoot up insulin everyday and I don't want her to live that life anymore and I know that stem cell research can make a difference. But I also worry her big brother, age 15, might be forced to fight a war if we don't resolve this issue first.

I appreciate why you won't vote for DINOs, but moderates are worse that DINOs. Consider this: When Jeffords defected the republican party and gave the dems a 1-vote majority, Zell Miller STILL stayed a democrat and voted for democratic leadership. Now I for one am NOT a Zell Miller fan nor was I keen on Tom Daschle (Reid is 200% better). But the point is, the the worst DINO out there will still add to the democratic majority. And with a Democratic Majority we should be able to take care of some if not all of the issue that are plaguing us now. The Majority Leaders define what bills will be introduced to the floor and what bills will be tabled, committeed or accidentally 'lost'. A majority in our judicial committee means that we would have never had to worry about voting for the likes of Janice Brown, Pricilla Owens, William Pryor et al because non of them would have made it out of committee (btw, that committee is very fussy to who the democrats will allow on it - Miller made a stink he wanted a seat but dems won't put anyone on there that could aid & abet repukes & their fanatical judges).

Basically our congress including both parties have failed us. We have such a fucking mess to clean up that it's going to take decades until we get back to some normalcy. I mean, RoeVWade was passed in 1973 and only now are the repukes close enough to replacing enough judges to have it overturned.

We (and I mean everyone at DU) will butt heads from time to time but I know we're all on the same page generally. We'll get there one politician at a time. For now let's get rid of the real enemy - Santorum and others like him and work our way from there!

[ElectroPrincess]

29. Now, the above points - I can support.

But this occupation will continue to loom ever larger. The "Dems" best get their positions clarified, and soon. :-)

Yes, A OK after "Can I call You Sweetie?" LynneSin! <tease!>

Best, EP

[LynneSin]

33. What the hell was I doing when I typed that?

I sound like some freaking ignorant trucker from the south wanting to order another cup of coffee

:eyes:

[ElectroPrincess]

34. It's cool! Plus you express yourself well. :-)

[Pirate Smile]

38. George Bush thanks you! That would help make sure there wont

be any investigations.

Susan Collins, Olympia Snowe, Lincoln Chafee, Arlen Spector are all a vote for Frist for Majority Leader and a rubber stamp for almost all other BushCo policies.

Rove says, the check is in the mail.

[Imagevision]

51. I agree, impeachment should remain at the top of the list!

[SteppingRazor]

3. But both 2005 governor races are practically in the bag...

Democrat Corzine holds a double-digit lead over Forrester in New Jersey, while Republican Kilgore has a 10 point lead over Kaine in Virginia. Kaine apparently has a recent fundraising lead, but I don't think it's enough to overcome a 46-36 lead. I had initially hoped that the "Independent Republican" running in the race (What's his name? Potts or something?) would split the Republican vote, but it's not working out that way.

[LynneSin]

5. Great, what about local races

The most important thing about democratically controlled State House/Senates will be redistricting in 2010. Many states have their local elections on off-years. Do we want more of what we had in Texas, Pennsylvania, etc with gerrymandered districts created to make it even more difficult for us to win the US House back

:shrug:

[SteppingRazor]

8. I wholeheartedly agree in that respect...

State congressional races should always be taken deadly seriously, especially in states with a competitive margin for majority.

And, LynneSin, I must concur about one other thing -- EVERY thread needs more COWBELL!! :)

[liberalitch]

13. I'm hoping our soontobeformergov warner takes allen's sen. seat

Y'all know that when allen was a lawyer here in the old dominion he kept a knotted noose in his office?

[SteppingRazor]

15. I'd really like him to run for Senate from Virginia too, but...

I think Warner has his eye on the White House.

[liberalitch]

47. Senator then white house, other wise they'll say.....

he has no experience.... only being a one term gov.
Not to mention the fact that chimpy was a gov in a weak gov system

[SteppingRazor]

48. I agree that will be a serious knock against him....

That he has no experience. Of course, he can point to Bush and get them to shut up.
While I'm sympathetic (like I said, I'd much rather see him run for Senate, because he'd probably win and we'd get that much closer to a majority), I think it's out of our hands. Warner wants the Big Brass Ring.

[ElectroPrincess]

26. Oh gee, not the Senator Allen who co-sponsored the

Ant-Lynching legislation?!?

Of course it is. Yes, Allen has reached new lows with regard to hypocrisy. Do you think he has his eyes on the Presidency. Some body close to him should "make him smart" about this issue. He has NO chance ... maybe VP? Yuck! The country doesn't deserve him.

[liberalitch]

12. All the more reason to push to get kaine elected.....

I live here.... kilgore is a nut!

[kentuck]

16. I tend to agree with LynneSin....

It is not a healthy diversion... Fact is, it doesn't make a whole hell of difference what Democrat wins in 2008 if we don't win back the House or the Senate.

[LynneSin]

17. all shucks, I tend to agree with you too

but only because you're such a sweetie!

[ElectroPrincess]

25. I find very little "WE" in the Democratic Party ...

The big tent will fall unless you get these DINOS in line.

At this point I don't give a damn because both Democrats and Republicans are so tied to the corporate teat, it will take a massive campaign to get REAL and HONEST representatives.

On Both Sides of the Aisle, The American People are all being punked. :P

[cyberpj]

27. Whoops! I just posted the Biden PAC thread before I saw this.

Because theres a "contact us" link I thought maybe some DUers would like to give some input at the new site.

I do agree with you though that we waste A LOT of time scattering our energies and that's a huge problem. Focusing will be the only thing that saves us.

While I also agree that 2006 elections are WAY up there on the priorities list I wonder if Election Fraud should remain the top priority because I suspect that Republican forces will e-machine any close or important races and until we get VOTER VERIFIED PAPER BALLOTS, we may never be able to make changes no matter how many Dems voters we get out there.

My list would read:
VVPB
2006 Elections
Iraq Exit Strategy
DSM and Impeachment!

[politicasista]

30. I have been saying that, but only a few pay attention

I have been saying that we need to focus on 2006. At the rate that *, the war and the country are going that whoever runs in 2008 (and hopefully wins) is going to have a massive, I mean MASSIVE mess to clean up (here at home and abroad) once * is out of office period.

Think about it.

[tokenlib]

31. I agree..the GOP dictatorship must be neutralized next year..

..but I have found the Biden delusions to be of humorous relief...

Imagine a Democratic controlled Senate... perhaps able to focus on the crimes of Bushco...

[puppet_show]

32. I agree focus on now n/t

[FreedomAngel82]

35. I agree

2006 is more important. Nobody in DC is saying if they're running or not in public even if they are gearing up already. 2006 is first and the most important. We have to gain as many seats as possible and work on other fronts. Worry about 2008 when the primaries and all that begins.

[BreweryYardRat]

40. Thank you!

My feelings exactly.

[election_2004]

41. We can't afford to wait....

We'll start worrying about 2008 after the 2006 elections are overwith!

If we don't start planning for the 2008 presidential race until November 2006, too much time will have passed. The party elitists will have already pulled too many strings behind-the-scenes, and guaranteed all the major endorsements for Hillary.

The only way to change the way '08 is headed is to act NOW!!!

[SteppingRazor]

42. This assumes the "party elitists" want anything to do with..

a Hillary campaign. A tenuous assumption at best.

[election_2004]

44. If they didn't....

...then why would all of these party insiders and elected officials be regurgitating the mantra of "Hillary's the 800-pound gorilla in the room...the one to beat in 2008"...?

No, the Democratic Party establishment appears to be doing the same thing that the right-wing Talking Heads and the corporate-owned mainstream media are...pushing Hillary for 2008. Just for different reasons.

The pro-Hillary Democrats are doing it because they want *revenge*. The Republicans are doing it because they want Hillary as a pinata to distract the public's attention away from the REAL issues. And the media whores are doing it to perpetuate sensationalism and make $$$$.

It's really quite disgusting, all around - - regardless of whether it's coming from DNC, DLC, RNC, or MSM.

[SteppingRazor]

46. Still don't buy it.

That "800-pound gorilla" quote is from Jeff Link out of Iowa. Greg Haas, another consultant from Ohio, has said about the same thing. But as far as the party elites are concerned, I don't think anyone's all that interested in Hillary. The Beltway seems interested in Biden right now (that will change, IMO), while the actual DNC apparatus, a.k.a. The Howard Dean Show, has remained pretty neutral. I haven't heard much mention of Hillary out of Dean, have you? And he, after all, speaks for the DNC.

[election_2004]

52. I agree that Dean will remain neutral....

But how long before the Beltway insiders shift their collective support from Biden to Hillary (once it becomes obvious that Biden isn't going anywhere).

[Lydia Leftcoast]

43. Thank you, Lynne Sin!

I suspect that some of these threads are started by disruptors, either freepers or, operatives hired by "conservative" Democrats to help keep the grassroots activists busy fighting over nonsense.

I suspect that the 2008 candidates will include people who aren't even on the radar now. Let's see how everyone does in the 2006 elections.

[election_2004]

45. Some of them might be...

Sure, some of the threads could be created by Freeper disruptors or whoever else wants to create infighting.

But speaking for myself, I keep posting on the topic of 2008 because I want to see the Democrats nominate the best possible candidate. I want to see them nominate someone who will help the Democrats retake the U.S. Senate majority and give momentum to progressive candidates all the way down the ticket.

I'm not disregarding the importance of fighting Diebold and winning in 2006. Just the opposite, in fact.

But if everyone completely brushes 2008 out of their minds, I'm afraid that the Democratic Party establishment will simply hijack the process ahead of time, in order to coronate the wrong person for the wrong reasons.

And if that happens, they will not receive one iota of support from me in '08.

[Cha]

49. AGREE!

Wholeheartedly!

We need to exert our collective energy to the DMS and to 2006!! :patriot:

[Pirate Smile]

50. You are correct. This is for you.

[paineinthearse]

53. here here

If Dems do not win back at least the House in 2006, the fascist take-over will be complete.

[snot]

54. One GOOD reason to think about who's running . . .

is that THOSE may be the folks who feel the need to care about the issues we think are important, if we pound on them.

This esp. works for me, since my state senators are Kay Bailey Hutchison and John Cornyn--I write them, but with very little effect.