Your Guess: Who was the Other WH Source re: Plame?

[Sparkly]

The first source, whose identity has not been revealed, provided the outlines of the story and was described by Mr. Novak as "no partisan gunslinger."
http://www.nytimes.com/2005/07/15/politics/15rove.html?hp&ex=1121400000&en=15d2c0ff1133350b&ei=5094&partner=homepage

I believe Novak also referred to them both as "White House" sources.

So what's your guess as to who the first source is?

[longship]

1. Already named.

It's I. Lewis Libby. But where he got Plame's NOC status from, who knows. It could be Rice or Rice staffer, or it could be Crashcart himself. Either way, Bush is neck deep in a cover-up conspiracy. These are all people intimately connected to Bush. If they knew about it, Bush knew about it.

On Oct 7, 2003, when reporters asked him who the leaker was, Bush said:

I mean this is a town full of people who like to leak information. And I don't know if we're going to find out the senior administration official. Now, this is a large administration, and there's lots of senior officials. I don't have any idea.

You lying sack of shit! You knew because you were all wrapped up in keeping the whole affair wrapped up. That's obstruction of justice.

[Sparkly]

2. Is that a sure thing?

NY Times is still saying the source hasn't been identified.

[longship]

4. Jason Leopold.

He's probably not the best source. But he's got the whole scenerio layed out in great detail. He names Libby as second source.

Here's the link:

www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x1629014

[Sparkly]

8. Hmm...

Moreover, evidence suggests that President Bush was aware as early as October 2003 that Rove and I. Lewis “Scooter” Libby, Vice President Dick Cheney’s chief of staff, were the sources who leaked Plame’s undercover CIA status to reporters.

He's a likely candidate, but I don't think Leopold shows evidence that "suggests" it.

I'm interested in this:
Furthermore, a few aides to Condoleeza Rice, then head of the National Security Council, may have played a role as well by being the first officials to learn about Plame’s role as a CIA operative and giving that information to Rove, Libby and other senior administration officials.

When I read that Novak said the source was not a "partisan gunslinger," I thought of Condi.

[longship]

14. Would Condi be a party to something like this?

Novak might have been speaking of Scooter. Compared to Rove, Attila the Hun isn't a partisan gunslinger. Who knows how to interpret Novak's interpretation of "partisan gunslinger"? He might have just meant that it wasn't Rove.

[ProudDad]

3. Libby

same as Cheney...

[Stinky The Clown]

5. Crashcart

[longship]

6. He may be the source of the info

but he wouldn't have called the press. That was Libby, his underling.

[Stinky The Clown]

10. If your scenario is true, then it is still Crashcart

Crash would have done the actual outing ... to another administration offical. That offical woudl hten start yammering. But the **source** woudl still be Crashcart ... follow the trail to the actual outer.

[Sparkly]

11. Maybe it depends on what's meant by "source."

There were two "sources" for Novak, for example. But if those were people who wouldn't ordinarily know about Plame, somebody higher up would have leaked to the sources. Is that criminal, if they don't have that level of security clearance?

Maybe there are several layers here.

And, the criminality could involve perjury, obstruction, conspiracy to defraud, etc. even beyond the outing itself.

[longship]

13. Either Crashcart, or...

Rice. Both Crashcart and Rice were WHIG members, along with Libby, Hadley, Matalin, Hughes, Rove, and one or two others. Possibly Fleischer, as well. That may be the focus of the investigation.

Now here's where it gets interesting.

Clearly only Rice or Cheney would legitimately have the knowledge of Plame's NOC status. It's possible that Libby or Hadley (Rice's deputy) also might have known, but not likely "officially". The "source" of Plame's NOC status had to come from the CIA more or less directly. Only Cheney and Rice had that kind of access.

Follow the scenerio; connect the dots. We have the following people knowing about this:

Either Cheney, Libby, and Rove. Or, Rice, Libby, and Rove (and possibly Hadley.) The conjunction of these people places the conspiracy in the WHIG group. If so, this connects the Plame affair as part of the "fixing of intelligence" mentioned in the DSM.

We know that Libby and Rove talked to the grand jury. Did the grand jury also subpeona Hughes, Hadley, Matalin, or Fleischer? If so, they are on the track of WHIG. This means likely conspiracy charges.

Now, if WHIG knew about this, it's not a stretch to posit that CuckooBananas knew about it.

Well, we know that, too. On Oct 7, 2003, Bush said that he didn't think that they'd ever find the leaker because it's a big administration and there were a lot of senior officials. With such a scandal, which was covered prominently in the press, and with the Justice Dept involved to the extent that AssCraft named a special prosecutor, and with *all* the perpetrators literally under his nose, how conceivable is it that CuckooBananas didn't know who it was?

He lied. Furthermore, they covered it up. That's obstruction of justice and conspiracy to obstruct justice.

[i miss america]

22. I believe you are correct. It has been documented that crash

made multiple trips to the Langley spook house in his unofficial role as lobbyist for Halliburton.

:mad:

[pacalo]

12. I'm thinking that if Cheney would be the first VP in history to

stand over CIA desk clerks to obtain his desired results, in addition to being the first VP to visit the CIA headquarters, it wouldn't be beneath him to assist in making phone calls to journalists.

[longship]

15. I think he'd be more careful about that.

He would delegate an underling to do his bidding. That again brings us to Scooter Libby who has already been suggested by many as the second source.

[i miss america]

23. GMTA

[gumby]

7. Voted for Bolton

because it seems strange that he has disappeared off the chart of the Big Fight and the recess appointment. hmmmm?

[GumboYaYa]

19. I think it is Bolton as well, that would make his UN appointment

make sense. It sets up for the big us against them fight. Plame is just a way for Dems to attack Rove and Bolton, two people we have hated for a long time. Mark my word, Bolton will get a recess appointment. Then the argument will be that Dems are trying to do through the "liberal" press what they can't do through legitimate means.

Bolton was at State. We know State had a confidential memo that indicated that Plame was CIA and had recommended Wilson for the trip.

The dots connect too nicely here.

<<ON EDIT>> Actually, it could be Bolton to Scooter Libby, Libby or some underling to the press (Judy Miller). Miller to Novak and then back to Rove.

[Bluesplayer]

9. I still think

it's Tenet.

[ngGale]

16. Scooter Libby, but I do believe he got the info from ...

Bolton.

[underpants]

17. You forgot Elliot Abrams (and Ari too)

both will serve their master accordingly. They both are completely expendable.

[kentuck]

18. James Carville...?

Whose wife was working the inner circles for Cheney at that time. She might have carried some of that information home with her?

[formernaderite]

20. Powell?

He's certainly not seen as partisan by the media, although I'd argue otherwise.

[Tippy]

21. Rove....Scotter Libby....Cheney....throw in Condi for good measure