Pick one:

[Guaranteed]

Yes, it's a simplistic poll. Don't want to hear it. I'm being as fair as I can- I think splitting it into three groups is fairly accurate.

But, pick the one that you affilliate yourself most closely with, as a Democrat/liberal.

[wli]

1. I sort of wish Chomsky were in there somewhere.

I'm closer to him than anyone in office or running for office.

[Guaranteed]

2. I thought about putting him in instead of Conyers,

but I think you can safely say that he's in that group and vote for them.

[wli]

3. that's what I ended up doing as a closest approximation

Thanks.

[rman]

19. not ever

he could be an advisor though.

[Guaranteed]

4. BTW, I probably could have put Kerry in there with Dean/Clark/Gore.

It's up to others to make that determination, though, as to where he would fall.

[LittleClarkie]

15. That was my next question

and that's where I put my vote.

I like what Gore has done with himself since his election. I would be happy if either he or Kerry pulled a Nixon and tried again.

[Cyrano]

5. Damn, that's a tough one. Unfortunately, my choices aren't there.

How about Roosevelt (Franklin), Truman, McGovern, Cuomo (Mario), Paul Wellstone, and, hold your breath on this one, Lyndon Johnson.

Both Truman and Johnson, IMHO, should both rot in whatever hell may or may not exist. Truman for his decision to drop atomic bombs on human beings, and Johnson for the Vietnam War.

These are horrific crimes for which they can never be forgiven. But if there's any balance in this screwed up universe, Truman believed he was saving lives by dropping the bomb and he initiated the Marshall Plan which rebuilt Germany and Japan -- countries that have become two of the world's most dependable/dedicated democracies.

Johnson's lies caused the death of 59,000 American service people and countless Vietnamese. Yet, his domestic policies brought an end to (overt) Jim Crow laws in this country. The voting rights act and the civil liberties acts are two magnificent pieces of legislation that would never have passed without Johnson's arm-twisting tactics.

Should they both be condemned? Yes. Should they both be praised? Yes. I guess that planet Earth is a really screwed up place to live. But, at present, we don't have any alternative.

[Bucky]

8. Truman and the Bomb

The truth about the bombing of Hiroshim and Nagasaki is misunderstood, miscontrued. and then used for propaganda points on both sides of the debate. Please look at this: http://brownbagblog.com/WordPress/?p=81

[Guaranteed]

10. While I might agree with much of it, much of that site is wrong.

The Japanese had from 9 to 11 divisions placed on the south of the island waiting for us. Since they were defending their turf, we would have taken casualties from 2-3 to 1. Using those numbers, and considering that we didn't have 20+ divisions there to invade with, using the best case scenario, there's a good chance that we would have even lost if we had tried to invade.

[Bucky]

12. Presumedly that's why they were waiting until November.

But they had a few more aces up their sleeves... they were discussing use of nerve agents (phosgene) and mustard gas. Fanatical as the homeland defense was, they really weren't up to full combat readiness.

[Cyrano]

13. Reply to Bucky and BullGooseLoony.

The fire bombings of Dresden, Tokyo, and so many other cities during the horror of WWII caused many more deaths than did the atomic bombs dropped on Hiroshima and Nagasaki.

My point was that the use of atomic bombs lowered the bar of what was permissible in human relations. What if tomorrow, George Bush had a weapon that could eradicate an entire country from the face of the earth? Would he use it? Given what we know about this horrible man, you bet your ass he would.

Truman could not have foreseen an American president such as Bush. But he was intelligent and understood human nature. Yeah, I know, hindsight is 20-20. But at some point, a line must be drawn on "man's inhumanity to man." Unlike our current president, Truman was not a reckless fool. I fault him for the "forbidden door" he kicked open, or the "invisible line" he crossed, when he decided to drop those two bombs. He gave those who came after him, implicit permission to do anything they wanted to do.

[Bucky]

6. I wish you'd put Conyers in with Dean/Clark/Gore. See, I'm sure it fits.

[Guaranteed]

7. He could be. Care to elaborate?

My edit time is running out.

[Bucky]

9. Nah, you've already started the poll. Not fair to change now except in Fla

I just like Conyers' pluck is all. I'm a Clark man, but Conyers is a real take-no-bullshit hero to me.

[Guaranteed]

11. I like him, too.

I considered him an olive branch to the Kucinich/McKinney supporters.

[Hippo_Tron]

14. Wellstone

No other way to describe my politics.

[Stinky The Clown]

16. I find the results so far very predictable as a broad profile of DU's base

Most of us, it has always seemed to me, are solid lefties, not centrists or far lefties. Just good, solid, reasoned lefties.

[Guaranteed]

17. Oddly, though, it seems we have a shortage of candidates

that fit that description.

[Cyrano]

18. I, for one, object to the term "leftie."

I prefer to think of myself, and many others on this site, as sane, rational human beings.

The lunatic right has been so successful at defining us, that a normal, thinking person has become, in their terms, "an unpatriotic, flag-burning traitor, who blames America first and hates our troops."

What the dittoheads will never understand is that it is we, not they, who are the true patriots. Many on DU, unlike Limbaugh, Hannity, O'Reilly, et al, have served in the military. And unlike these cowardly turds, virtually all of us (vets or not) would do everything in our power to preserve our democracy and our freedoms.

They, on the other hand, have their fascism on full display through their support of the (so called) Patriot Act, and their backing of the most dictatorial presidential administration in the history of OUR COUNTRY.

And yes, I emphasize the term "OUR COUNTRY." These swine don't "own" it yet.

[Donna Zen]

22. Thanks for this clarification:

The discussion over the past few days keeps referring to the "left" as opposed to "centrists." I really hate labels! I'm just a member of a family with a dog, a few cats, a kid that just graduated from college, jobs, a house, and a respect for people who stand up and tell the truth. As Boxer said, when she stands up she is just doing her job. We are a stronger America with better education, health care, and an economic plan. If we let the corporations decide our policy and buy our politicians, then we are not following the mission of the founders to form a more perfect union.

And if we continue to pursue empire, then we will lose our democracy. I support those who who tell the truth and want this country to live its values not just talk about them.

Group #1: plastic politicians<----part of the problem
Group #2: get it<-----part of the solution
Group#3: voices we need to hear<----part of the solution

ps. I was checking out the books in the General's office and there is plenty of Chomsky there. Paper and hardback. Had been read. I'm just sayin'.

[Clark2008]

20. Look! The populists are winning!

Surprise, surprise, surprise. :sarcasm:

But, seriously, what do we do to ensure that milquetoast Dems actually VOTE for the populist in the primaries?

Populists are the only way to take the Party back. Dean says he won't run as head of the Dem Party, I'm pulling for Clark but I could support Gore (as my first ever political "crush").

How do we make other, non-active Dems, see that it's not the DLC hype of Hillary! but the the populist message that will carry over to victory (Diebold not included) into the general election?

That's our mission, folks. See to it that the populist wins the primary - not the overhyped candidate who won't flip one red state.

[CTLawGuy]

21. you should add

Bayh/Lieberman/Miller as a category

[Guaranteed]

23. I probably could have. A fourth category could have worked. nt

[AntiCoup2K4]

27. Pretty much the same as Biden (R - MBNA) and Fein$tein though

Actually with all of the DLCbots coming out of the closet in some of the other recent threads, I'm surprised they haven't spoken up in this poll.

[Guaranteed]

24. Kick nt

[Darranar]

25. Kucinich/McKinney/Conyers. n/t

[Eloriel]

26. You should've given a hint what this was about

It's not something I'm interested in -- and you conned me into looking at the thread. Not nice. Not nice at all.

[Guaranteed]

29. You're not interested in the demographics of our party?

Other people are.

Sorry I wasted your time.

[faithnotgreed]

28. im for conyers mckinney kucinich

if were going to really change things

but i largely support dean clark and gore and think some combinations of such would shake things up for the much better

[ihelpu2see]

30. I think it is a good poll and I wrote a paper way back when on how

our executive branch should be a triumvirate... one fiscal, Gore and his "Lock Box", Clark for his military / foreign policy and Dean for social issues and populist attitude.

It would be a great team!