When will Hillary make her hard move to the left?

[win_in_06]

Will the Roberts vote be her first move in that direction? She has spent the last couple of years trying to define herself as a centrist but as the primaries approach she will no doubt observe the rule:

Run to the base during the primaries and to the center during the general election.

[applegrove]

1. One thing for sure. The Repukes are terrified of her. n/t

[speedoo]

22. Why do you say that?

My view is that they would love to see her as the Dem. candidate in 2008. I see no evidence that any rethug is scared of her.

[applegrove]

23. Because she can raise money like Big Oil. She has that type of

clout. Because she speaks to moderates - when Bush cannot do so without a forked tongue. Cause she will win.

[speedoo]

28. Sorry, but that is not convincing at all.

I remain convinced that she would be dream candidate for the rethugs.

[applegrove]

33. Oh - no. She is their worst enemy. They cringed the whole time

her husband was in power. And spent $75 Million to find him guilty in a three year probe - of lying at the end of year three.

Now that is scared.

[speedoo]

34. You are obviously a big Hillary fan.

But you have little understanding of how much she is disliked by many moderates, hated by rethugs and how little respect progressive dems have for her because of her IWR vote.

She will never be elected to higher office.

[applegrove]

46. Funny - she keeps polling as a winner. And that was before Bush

was at 37% in the polls.

[speedoo]

49. She would not be running against Bush.

And she trails the leading rethug candidates currently. The rethugs can't wait to campaign against her..... she is their favorite candidate, partly because of her IWR vote (which was Kerry's jugular), partly because of Monicagate.

[applegrove]

50. By currently you mean..

[speedoo]

51. You know how to google, don't you?

Try this:

http://www.davidwissing.com/index.php/category/election-2008/election-2008-polls/

Scroll down to June something, and you will find that New Yorkers seem to like her as a Senator, but not as President.

The only people she polls well against are other dems, unfortunately. But I think people like Gore and Clark, who are not burdened by IWR votes, will come on strong as the Iraq war continues to become a bigger issue.

[applegrove]

52. So June. When Bush was at 45% or so. I imagine it has changed.

I hope they poll that soon.

[speedoo]

54. You asked me for a reference. I gave you one.

Did you read all of it? Not a pretty picture for Hillary.

But this seems pointless. You don't even acknowledge something unless it favors your candidate.

[applegrove]

55. She's not my candidate. I'm just telling the truth. I don't deny she

goes up and down. But she is way out ahead.

[formernaderite]

37. the repubs want her to run so that they can raise even more money

she is their bet fundraiser. Moderates? Please...they're people who can't be bothered to listen to the issues and decide. Hillary also has incredibly high negatives amongst "moderates". If we're dumb enough to nominate her for Pres or VP...we deserve the outcome.

[applegrove]

42. Repukes are afraid of her because she has a battle-tested image

they cannot "remake" in an election. How are you going to swiftboat her? We all know who she is. Any spin will look like spin. GOP politicos will have to stick pretty close to the truth when they attack her. And she has stuck pretty close to them.

So they are scarred.

[Ken Burch]

59. Are they "scarred", or "scared"?

Just checking.

[Ken Burch]

60. In any case, nominating Hillary means another Democratic ticket

led by someone who despises everyone in the Democratic Party.

We don't need to be self-denying masochists to win. We can win by speaking truth to power.

A more boring repeat of Slick just can't be worth the effort.

[Why Syzygy]

2. Um.

You mean like left of the decimal? As in $1,000,000.00?

Are you kidding me? She is all about money. Not a winner. Move the decimal left = $100,000.00. = Loser .

Ever been to a casino?

[Yupster]

3. I don't think she will

The thinking would be that she would go left to win the primaries, but my thinking is there really won't be any primaries.

She will announce and run her campaign like a general election right from the start. She will ignore her primary opponents and so will the press, and she will skate to the nomination.

That's just my guess anyway. My thinking is that when she announces, the press will start a months long 24-hour Hillary watch and her primary opponents won't be able to get a lick of coverage or money to run competitive campaigns.

[patricia92243]

11. The 24 hour Hillary watch woul be negative in the neo-con owned press. So

it would not be a help to her. Other opponents will be able to run competitive campaigns by default -Hillary will be so bashed that othere will look like a ray of sunshine compared to her. Not the truth about her, of course, but the press will sure be out for blood.

[ladylibertee]

14. Nope Patty I gotta disagree with ya.I think she's got it and the

primaries will really be a search for her running mate lol.:P

[Ken Burch]

40. Which, goddess help us, will be a Southern white man whose to her right/

Thus guaranteeing that the 2008 election will be as meaningless as 1996.

[Yupster]

43. My guess for the ticket is

Clinton/ Richardson

[Ken Burch]

44. That means New Mexico's a lock. 266 to go.

[ladylibertee]

13. Yup Yup I agree.Sorry so late, but yeah I agree.

I think Hillary has got the Primaries.She may be a woman, but she is the only Democrat that I see lately, that has a BACKBONE !!!!

[papau]

4. January 22,2009 at 8 am.

:-)

[AtomicKitten]

6. I agree.

And that's okay with me.

[ladylibertee]

15. WHATEVER You...LOL

[Hieronymus]

5. When? I hope very soon.

If John Kerry had found his tongue a year ago, instead of this week, he'd be in the White House.:yoiks:

[Name removed]

7. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[newyawker99]

18. Hi Patriot714!!

Welcome to DU!! :toast:

[comsymp]

19. Ya think?

Since '92, I've seen her as pretty darn centrist. What particular issues do you see her as having had a serious leftward approach to?

(and for extra credit, which did you prefer: It Takes a Village or Living History?)

[Bernardo de La Paz]

8. 2006! Republicans Out! 2006! Forget these distracting 2008 posts!

[win_in_06]

9. Prepping for '06 and '08 are not mutually exclusive.

We can walk and chew gum at the same time, can't we?

[Bernardo de La Paz]

16. Bill Clintion wisely counsels to focus on one election at a time.

Not a question of walking and chewing gum at the same time. You would want us to try to chew two brands of bubble gum at the same time and keep them separate. Don't bother.

Follow Bill Clinton's advice to focus on one election at a time. Flood the Republicans with votes in 2006 so that there will be the power to ensure that the votes in 2008 are related.

Posting stuff about one potential 2008 candidate or another turning left at some future time is counter productive, fractious, and divisive now!

Unite against Republicans for 2006!

[win_in_06]

20. ...and waiting until '07 to plan for '08 is political suicide

[howmad1]

26. Yea, I see how Bill Clinton really focused on the 2000 election.

[rman]

10. Will she ever?

I'd say voting against Roberts is the *moderate* thing to do, not so much Leftist.

[ladylibertee]

12. I think she will.She is very smart.She knows when to be outspoken,

and when to shut up.I am looking forward to an aggressive campaign this time around.It will be fun.:popcorn:

[Totally Committed]

17. A Hard Move to the Left?

From the DLC "Leadership" position she now holds? Get real. When pigs fly, maybe....

Okay, say she does, at some point go Left, who the hell would be able to trust her? I wouldn't. "I'm a Liberal", no, wait... "I'm a DLC Leader", no, wait... "I'm a Liberal again now." Please... Nuh-uh. We do not need another mealy-mouthed Shape-Shifter candidate changing to suit the polls and focus groups. I am fed up to dead with that! We need real... authentic.

She's made her bed with the "neo-Centrists" of the New-Way-or-the-Highway DLC. She can just rot there for all I care. I don't care where her cynical ambition lands her "eventually". She lost me.

TC

[radio4progressives]

31. Hear! Hear! Full Agreement! n/t

[leetrisck]

21. Hillary nor Bill Clinton have never been hard left

The republicans have always portrayed Bill as "liberal" when he was running and they do it to Hillary. Nothing in Bill Clinton's history ever indicated he was hard left and I doubt that there is anything in Hillary's. I like them both. I would vote for Hillary if she runs.

[greenbriar]

24. wow, that was rushy limpballs point a couple of days ago

he always makes "predictions" and that is almost word for word his prediction from a couple of days ago.

now tell me...

you listen to rush and believe??? or do you listen to rush to see what the enemy is doing???

[win_in_06]

45. Neither, but I'm not surprised he said that.

I don't think he is alone in making this observation.

Like I said, it is an old political adage about running to the base during the primaries.

[mmonk]

25. When it's popular?

[nickshepDEM]

27. She's already finished.

Her pandering to the left and moving to the center simultaneously could be picked off from a mile away. Flip-Flop.

[Ken Burch]

39. Give me a break, Hillary has NEVER pandered to the left.

This is the same woman who used to say "There's no left wing to the Clinton Administration."

Hillary is just Slick without the charisma or the sex.

If she thought it would gain her five points in the polls, she'd call for everyone at the demo today to be teargassed.

[Zhade]

29. She has to move back to the center first.

NT!

[AX10]

30. Hillary is a petty opportunist.

She is pro-Iraq war.

[GRLMGC]

32. Uhh

she's so bipolar. I don't even know what to expect from her ever.

[Silverhair]

35. She won't. NT

[Armstead]

36. When there are air conditioners in Hell

[Ken Burch]

38. Never. No candidate who moves right ever moves left again afterwards.

Hillary is a politician whose whole career has been about saying "fuck you" to progressives, unions, and the poor. She's never been on our side, and all we've gotten from her is flack from the right for her mistakes.

[Ken Burch]

41. Given that that rule has almost always led the Democrats to defeat

why continue to obey it?

We could turn Clinton's maxim about people preferring leaders who are "strong but wrong" to those who are "right but weak" to our advantage by trying, for once, to be "strong AND right"(or strong and left, in our case.)

Just once, we need to run a fall campaign where we don't respond to liberal bashing by being less liberal. And don't bring up 1972. 1972 WASN'T being "strong and left". 1972 was being disorganized and confused. 1972 was about NOT having a coherent theme in the fall and about letting Nixon control the debate, as our candidates have almost always allowed the Republican incumbents to control the debate.

For once, when they scream "liberal, liberal, liberal", we need to say, loudly and proudly "hell yes, hell yes, HELL YES AND HERE'S WHY, WHY WHY!!!!"

They wouldn't know how to respond to that.

[applegrove]

47. Nobody wins without a big tent. Nobody.

[Ken Burch]

58. The way to expand our tent is to look confident in our views

and exude leadership. Not act like most of our party's most loyal supporters are too disgraceful to associate with.

We never needed, for example, to "end welfare as we know it" by doing so on REPUBLICAN terms. We should have been fighting to replace it with jobs programs.

And we should have been fighting to lower crime to creating a full-employment economy, not expanding the friggin' death penalty.

There are positive ways to build our support, and we have to try them for a change.

[Cocoa]

48. her Roberts vote wasn't "moving to the left"

she has to know that anyone that wants someone on the "left" would never vote for her in the primaries, so "moving to the left" would do her absolutely no good.

[AmericanDream]

53. WHO CARES? Nothing she does is going to make me vote for her in primaries

She has bigger issues than just "making the move to the left"....

[WA98296]

56. Too late, send her packing

[xkenx]

57. Doesn't That Title Tell You

everything you need to know about HRC? Just another pandering politician who would come across to the electorate just that way. And we thought those were big flip flops that the Repugs put on Kerry. Look no further than Wes Clark for the true consistent progressive who always speaks truth to power and who will put the General Smackdown to anyone trying to smear him. That man is steel.

[Pepperbelly]

61. If Hillary is an opportunist ...

where has she attempted this "run to left."

That would have to be defined as taking positions to the left of her record. So where has this happened?

[win_in_06]

64. Were you sure which way she was going to go on Roberts?

Would you have been surprised if she had voted Yes? Many thought she might have, so voting No might be interpreted as a move left.

[ChiciB1]

62. All I Can Say Is... I'm Not Holding My Breath!

And I don't like the "game playing" IF that is what it is!

Sorry, polls or not, Hillary doesn't do it for me, nor do I think it will do it for many of us here. But then we here are MUCH more well informed!

[bearfan454]

63. I will vote for Hillary if she takes on Diebold.

Otherwise we are all wasting our money.

[bee]

65. right about the time my cat starts pooping gold nuggets. n/t

[Ken Burch]

66. Hear, Hear!

(BTW, you will invite us all over when that happens, won't you?)

[bee]

67. lol! you have my word on it. ;-) n/t

[TankLV]

68. Hahahahahaha hahahahahahahahaha hahahahahahahahahaha!

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

Whew!

Thanks for the laugh!:rofl:

[LittleClarkie]

69. I got the feeling she's assuming the primaries and already running center

It would be stupid to run left now. It could be argued that a more unknown politican could get away with it. But EVERYBODY, left and right, can see her and what she's doing. How much of a pander monkey will she look like THEN?