Who here has bushies in the family? How do you deal with them?

[texpatriot2004]

Or if not in your family, your friends, neighbors? This is kind of a follow up question to my earlier one about talking politics with those around you. I am curious. I am thinking of putting together a questionnaire in the near future. Thanks for sharing your experiences here. As for my own experience, it has been mixed. Right after the "election" I didn't want to talk to any of them. I still kind of feel that way. I do talk to some when I have to. I have some in my family that I have been avoiding for months now. Plus, I live in Texas so they are everywhere. Although there are many here who think just like me. So, what's up? How do you deal with them? What helps you to cope with the great divide?

[Sanity Claws]

1. We keep all bushes firmly planted.

We toss manure on them every year or two and let them get all the rainwater they want. Other than that we ignore them.

[VADem11]

2. I try to reason with them

I was successful with 2 of my family members during the last election. Now, I still try to talk with my bushie family members and avoid too much politics but remembering that they are your family can help bridge the gap.

[BlueEyedSon]

3. Not since my wife got that waxing....

[bahrbearian]

13. I think that might be a sick or LOL post.

[BlueEyedSon]

17. (meant as a "LOL")

[LynnTheDem]

63. YOU OWE ME!!!

1 keyboard

1 dry-cleaning of silk business jacket & skirt

1 pain and trauma for an entire can of soda going up my nose

1 can soda.

:D

[renie408]

4. I live in SC and have family in GA and Wyoming

Yeah, I have Bushies in the family. I avoid them. We used to be able to be civil, but my sister's husband is getting weirder and weirder about it the older he gets. We have started avoiding family gatherings at their house. My mom's house is neutral territory, so he is better there. But on his own turf, he is an ass.

I have lots of Bushie friends. But they are event-specific friends, if you know what I mean. Like my horse show friends. We talk about horse show stuff. And my 'school Mommy' friends. We talk about school mommy stuff. The people who ride at the barn get dosed with my political views more, but again, mostly we talk about their horses and riding,etc.

I have a core of close all around friends and they are all Dems.

**edited to correct typo**

[texpatriot2004]

40. Nice that you have a "neutral" territory. Core of close friends who

are Dems - made me smile. Thanks for your post.

[DebJ]

5. We have one Bush bro in law who hates Bush and did b4 the

election, griped about him for four years. Then voted for him last year. My sister, his wife, thought Georgie was 'cute'.

She has asked us to avoid talking politics, so we don't do it around her....but the rest of the family does when she isn't there.

[texpatriot2004]

39. Wow, how do you make sense of that? Complain for 4 years then

vote for him? Makes no sense. I am certain he wasn't the only voter to do this but...really.

[driver8]

6. I have an aunt who is a shrubbie...as is her husband.

They are both retired and their big thing is tax increases -- "The dems are going to increase taxes, the dems are going to cut our social security..."

Someone recently posted how much this "war" is costing us per citizen...I e-mailed that to them and said, "So much for your tax cuts, huh?"

My aunt refuses to discuss politics with me because I bury her in facts. Her husband spouts the same right wing bullshit talking points we hear all the time.

[texpatriot2004]

41. Why screw up perfectly good fiction with the facts eh?

I am joking of course. They don't usually like facts that don't come from Fox. Huh?

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

7. I am the only left-winger in my whole family.

My dad is in his 80s; he's well-educated and still quite sharp mentally, and he swears by the rot that appears in the Wall Street Urinal. He's an economic conservative who can't or doesn't want to admit that the current crop of Republicans are not true conservatives. I think he's just too old and stubborn to want to reconsider his politics. The other day I remarked in passing that I thought Bush was a total dumbass and he got almost irrationally angry, so I dropped it. My brothers are your basic I-got-mine-to-hell-with-you Republicans who, when challenged about what a dickwad Bush is, fall back on the standard BS about how terrible Clinton was (everything bad is his fault) or how much worse Kerry would have been. We'd end up yelling each other, so now we all carefully avoid discussing politics. These are all smart, educated people (and are not religious nuts by any means), and it just kills me that they so readily accept the bilge they hear from the GOP and Pox News.

[texpatriot2004]

42. Hmm, that's hard when perfectly decent, smart people like

you describe are blinded by whatever this is; deceit, propaganda, brainwashing, etc.

I think you are right about the older generation. For some reason I think they are particularly ingrained in their politics, it goes to their core. I mean, my politics go to my core too but not when faced with facts that contradict my ideals. My problem is their kind doesn't know the facts and they try to come at me with "facts" that are just not true or even real. You know?

[TheDonkey]

8. we usually scream and scowl

at one another. My aunt and uncle are die-hard Republicans in the Rush Limbaugh mold, oh and African American. we also have a few family friends who are walking RNC talking point and it usually ends in chaos during family get-togethers.

[texpatriot2004]

43. Yeah, that happens eh. Wow. Rush fans & African American

interesting dynamic.

[newscott]

9. My wife is a distant cousin of the real Bushies

She hates everything they stand for.

[texpatriot2004]

44. Well, so glad to hear that. I remember before the last "election"

there was a website of bushies against bush.

[Imalittleteapot]

10. My Mother hasn't talked to me in 3 weeks. She won't return my calls.

She thought Bush did a fine job with Katrina. As I was pointing out his and FEMA's failures, she cut me off and told me she didn't want to hear my opinion. In Bush's World even my own Mother thinks my opinions are unpatriotic. Dysfunctional family. Dysfunctional nation. How do I handle it? I don't.

[texpatriot2004]

45. I am sorry to hear that. That sucks. Then again, for me Katrina

was the last straw for this evil regime. Something about the blatant disregard for American citizens in need...and the least among us too. In my opinion that lying lunatic * (that's what I call him) NOT only failed to act like a leader, a president, he failed to act like a HUMAN. Flying over the scene not stopping. Not making sure water and food was air dropped immediately. Not getting in there on Tuesday to get people out. Instead laughing and joking about drinking in NO and smiling and patting people on the back for "doing a heck of a job" while people were dying from lack of water.

So, Mother or not, something about Katrina was so heinous, so immoral, so criminal and wrong that in my opinion his actions are INDEFENSIBLE and INEXCUSABLE. PERIOD. Especially for Christians.

Still, I am sorry to hear that in Bush's world there is this level of division...good thing he's a uniter huh?

[bahrbearian]

11. My family is all Bushies , My brother has a photo of him shaking

hands with 41 in his office. I keep them all at a distance, they are very mean spirited.

[texpatriot2004]

46. A very good idea to keep them at a good distance. n/t

[BeatleBoot]

12. I Tried to "Make Nice", but

I can't because I'm staring into emptiness when I look at them.

I am now in wonderment.

There's nothing there - lights on, but no one is home.

Oh, they emote. They spew whatever talking points are given to them.

(They don't even realize that there is a structure there to give them their talking points - Limbaugh, Coulter, Hannity, Faux News, their place of worship)

It's like listening to people at the water cooler at work talking about sports - when they repeat what they heard on the radio on their morning commute. Just repeating shit without adding any value to the conversation.

They choose to be on another planet, so I let it be.

But I have noticed a little more "quietness" now that the pukes have begun to self-destruct.

[texpatriot2004]

47. Making nice, I try that sometimes, I suck at it - I am too informed

Yeah for this part:
"But I have noticed a little more "quietness" now that the pukes have begun to self-destruct."

[Maat]

14. Fortunately, the sister with whom I'm very close is a progressive.

My husband handles the 'chatting' with the inlaws. They all moved to Oklahoma, after living in California and Nevada for many, many years, and became crazy, rabid Religious Righties (of the hardcore Southern Baptist variety). They did this as I was getting more progressive by the day, and when I joined a very affirming and progressive religion (Religious Science).

I'm in a red pocket in a blue state (Temecula Valley) in SoCal. All my neighbors are Bushbots. Generally, we avoid politics, but I have gotten a few digs in lately.

It is tough. I avoided talking to Bushbots for a few weeks after the election.

Anyway, I relate.

Differences in politics never seemed to be a problem before. I have NEVER seen this country so divided (in my 47 years).

[texpatriot2004]

48. I am still avoiding talking to many of them. It's still very tense.

In all your years you've never seen it so divided as now...that says alot right there.

[MaggieSwanson]

15. It's sad...

I've only spoken to my little sister once in the past 4 years. The last time I heard her voice, she was telling me that she was pregnant with her 4th, and thinking of naming him George.

[renie408]

18. Ok, yeah, that is sad. n/t

[left is right]

21. I live for the day that George or Bush is considered foul

language, my dream is that they are considered so bad that to say either word in a public setting would get one admonished for using vile language in front of women or children.

Please tell me that this really will happen, even if you have to lie to me.

[texpatriot2004]

50. I especially like this language proposal. I live in Houston Texas

and the cronies are gonna name the whole damn town after this criminal family. I keep wondering if we can get the names changed from * this and * that to something more respectable.

[texpatriot2004]

49. It is sad. I am sorry to hear that there is a rift. n/t

[getmeouttahere]

16. I don't see them as much, or talk to them as much...

it's unfortunate, but it can't be helped. It's too difficult to avoid the subject - even a conversation about gas prices can lead down the path of which I don't want to go with them.

[texpatriot2004]

51. This is true. I have this, I don't know what to call it so I'll call it a

rule for lack of a better word. If I want to shoot the breeze about things I can do that with any yahoo on the street I don't need people who are supposed to be the closest to me to do that. In other words, if we can't talk about substantive matters then what is the point. So, I understand what you mean.

[pro_blue_guy]

19. Well....

My uncle on my dad's side of the family voted for Bush (he married my dad's sister). He's kind of outnumbered in our family because me, my mom, my dad, my grandma, my aunt, my uncle, my two cousins (and my one cousins' boyfriend), and I believe my aunt who is married to my pro-Bush uncle, all voted for Kerry. We are from northern Ohio.

My mom's side of the family is another story. They are all in Indiana and southwest Ohio. As a matter of fact, my grandma on this of the family said that the 2004 election was the first time ever that she did not vote for president. She said she didn't like or relate to either candidate.

[texpatriot2004]

52. Wow, how lucky to have so many non-bushies around you...

for your Uncle - not so much luck eh. :) The other side of the family - well we all have one of those don't we.

[davikim]

20. my step-mom

is a wonderful kind giving lady, and the other day she said we should just nuke Iraq and get it over with. I think she's just confused and stressed (we're all stressed) and I'm really trying to not let that color my relationship with her..not having much luck.
The rest of my family is really really scary and I haven't been able to speak with them since Katrina.......
Uniter not a divider my ass.....

[Arugula Latte]

34. Welcome to DU, davikim!

:hi: :toast:

[Skittles]

38. could you please remind her that lots of children live in Iraq

*sheesh*

[texpatriot2004]

53. Katrina was the last straw for me (as if I wasn't already against

this evil regime) but something about the blatant disregard for American citizens in need...and the least among us too. In my opinion that lying lunatic * (that's what I call him) NOT only failed to act like a leader, a president, he failed to act like a HUMAN. Flying over the scene not stopping. Not making sure water and food was air dropped immediately. Not getting in there on Tuesday to get people out. Instead laughing and joking about drinking in NO and smiling and patting people on the back for "doing a heck of a job" while people were dying from lack of water.

Katrina was so heinous, so immoral, so criminal and wrong that in my opinion his actions are INDEFENSIBLE and INEXCUSABLE. PERIOD. Especially for Christians.

Still, I am sorry to hear that in Bush's world there is this level of division...good thing he's a uniter huh?

[lachattefolle]

22. I quit speaking to the one sister who still luvs * Not sure who's

more stupid, her or him.

[texpatriot2004]

54. I know what you mean it's like which came first the chicken or

the egg? Who is more ignorant that lying lunatic * or his followers?

I am not speaking to my familial bushies right now.

[Thirtieschild]

23. Politcis aren't allowed at family gatherings

My religious right sister & brother-in-law live in Texas, are pro-*. My 97-year-old mother, also a Texan, didn't like him as a governor, doesn't like him as president. Keeps quiet about it though, since she's the odd woman out at her retirement home. A niece (another Texan) spouts Limbaugh speak. I'd bet the ranch she thinks she's thinking for herself.

Husband voted for * in 2000 (because of fears Gore was going to take away all guns), causing TREMENDOUS dysfuncion in our marriage. Iraq brought him to his senses, now despises * as much as I do. Marriage back on track.

Our daughter is divorced; she & her ex have split custody of their teen-age daughters. Said daughters have been exposed to Republican speak from their millionaire dad and from classmates at their private school, and to Democratic speak from their barely-making-it mom. They despise * so much that the oldest demostrated at the GA state capitol on Inauguration Day.

[Boo_Radley]

32. We pretty much avoid it, too

My step mom told me before the election, "If Kerry wins, we're totally screwed with all his social spending," and I couldn't resist, "No one can spend more than Bush. It's not possible." My dad has said he'd like to see the Libertarians take over the Congress, but that's about the extent of it.

I don't even know if any of my aunts, uncles or cousins vote at all. I know my grandma used to give all her money to the GOP, and my brother's a Green party-guy in California, like an officer or something, but that's all I really know about them. Politics can be pretty divisive, and the family is probably close because we don't mix it up too much.

I'd hate to see my Republican step-mom, Libertarian dad, and Green brother all get into a big political hash.

[Arugula Latte]

35. Welcome to DU, Disorganized!

:hi: :toast:

[texpatriot2004]

55. I live in Texas and Gov * left our state in a shambles - big shock

He brings destruction and failure to everything he touches. Your Mother is RIGHT about him.

I am married to a life long Republican who is now an ex-Republican as of 2000 and thanks to that lying lunatic * - marriage on track :-) as I am a life long Democrat. Glad to hear your hubby came around.

Thrilled to hear that the grandaughter demonstrated in GA and that they are not being brainwashed by the "bushit."

[renate]

73. Hi, disorganized!

How fun to see your name here!

[Tarc]

24. bushies

Being in NH, I have a few, unfortunately. Whenever they start in with the typical boilerplate arguments (which is all they ever have) about liberal media or whatever, just casually drop something like "did you hear that Bill Clinton is going to apply when the UN Sec. General spot opens up?"

Sends em into a frothing, unintelligible fit, you won't hear from em for days.

[texpatriot2004]

25. That's a good strategy. n/t

[ladylibertee]

26. I've got one in ......TEXAS.......Let's just say, I pretty much win every

single argument.When I make a point or counter hers,she all of a sudden just remembered she has got to run an errand or the baby is awake.She's so predictable.I say, talk about the issues because most republicans really do not know anything about their party.They only voted for Bush because they fell for his War on Iraq and what they "thought" was his position on abortion.Now, it is so much easier because everything they voted for, is turning out to be a failure of a fraud, or a fake.It should be easy.Come to think of it, I haven't heard from my sister since, De Lay's second Indictment.I think I will give her a kick,I mean, call.:dem:

[texpatriot2004]

56. I like your approach and your spirit ladylibertee n/t

[mrcheerful]

27. I don't deal with Repukes period............

I found out regaurdless of facts the sheep will not admit any wrong doings from repuke ''leaders''. BTW, when did public employees become leaders anyhow? The religious rw and the complete lack of understanding of whats really going on in this country seems to allow these self rightious to accept the unaceptable.

I had stopped at a gas station one day to fill up my car, gas had just went up to $2.89 a gallon. There was an older person at the pump next to me and I commented on how out rageous that gas went up that high in that short of time ( I had been driving around looking for the cheapest gas, stations all over the city were 15 to 25 cents difference in prices )and how good old GW did nothing.

the old guy sat there for 5 minutes praising GW's job growth and how he done so much to protect us americans from the evil Sadam's WMD's. When I pointed out the fact that there has been job loss all over the state and how jobs were leaving like rats abandoning a sinking ship. He told me that there were more jobs today then ever before. When I pointed out the fact that how can america be safer when every mom and pop store all over the city had been taken over by muslims. Believe this, I have been in some of these muslim homes, they have shrines for Bin Laden, a few even carry a picture of him in their wallets.

We are not any safer, the terrorists are all around us, living next door to us, waiting. After I got my tank filled up, I got away from the old guy as fast as I could, hearing damn liberals anyhow as I pulled away. Lmao.

[SpiralHawk]

28. What planet do you live on Mr. 'cheerful'

Your post has the ring of BUSHCO PROPAGANDA

"every mom and pop store all over the city had been taken over by muslims. Believe this, I have been in some of these muslim homes, they have shrines for Bin Laden, a few even carry a picture of him in their wallets."

HUH?

PLEASE NAME THE CITY WHERE YOU LIVE AND HAVE SEEN THIS.

Because I'd like to see whether its the TRUTH, or just PROPAGANDA

[mrcheerful]

29. Saginaw mi..................

in fact one family owns pretty much every mom and pop store in the city. They send a nephew by plane to NY with $5,000 to $10,000 a month and 3 days later he comes back by bus. the family is Sunni muslims.

[texpatriot2004]

57. We aren't any safer you're right. They do defend their "leaders"

(good point about the public employees being leaders BTW) even when they are obviously wrong.

Where are all these jobs they say have been created? Are those the ones manufacturing the burgers? At what rate of pay are these jobs they speak of? With benefits?

[No Exit]

30. How I got my brother to get really, really, mad at a republican:

First let me say that we were raised in a conservative family. Our parents were not quite naive enough to sing the praises of, and be blind to the faults of, any particular party, but they definitely were conservative.

So when I now rant about the fraudulence of the "war on terror", the Bush administration, the republican leadership, etc., my brother ends up being an apologist for these evil entities.

So the other night I went to his house to see his new kitten. (Adorable little animal.) Then we sat down on the deck to relax. I said, "Well, it's been a banner week! DeLay indictment, Lawrence Franklin plea in AIPAC scandal (that one went right over his head), Plame affair heating up, and the SEC has now made its investigation of Frist formal." "Who?" said my brother. "Frist," said I. (My brother has indeed heard of Frist, but he certainly doesn't spend time watching him as I do.) "Hello? I'm talking about the REPUBLICAN senate majority leader," I said.

"And by the way, speaking of Frist, guess what he used to do when he was a medical student... um, it had to do with cats." (I then told him the wonderful story of how young Frist used to adopt cats from shelters, fooling the well-intentioned shelter workers into thinking they were sending a cat to a home where it would be loved and cared for, and how Frist would then summarily kill the cats and dissect them.)

When I was through... well, given that the laws are very draconian when it comes to protecting our VALUABLE senators, I better not repeat what my brother said about Frist...

[Arugula Latte]

37. Your brother likes cats -- he's a good guy at heart!

I'm serious. Men who like cats are the coolest men of all. They tend to be secure in their masculinity and do not need a fawning dog to "confirm" their "alpha" status. I think there's hope for him! Good luck.

[No Exit]

70. Thanks! He's a kind person... in fact, he's

too trusting. He has spent his life trusting things like, say, the leadership of this country. (Blech!)

[texpatriot2004]

58. LOL at your last sentence. So that's what Frist's nickname is

about. How sick is he?

[No Exit]

71. Oh, yeah--the cat killer. If I'm not mistaken,

Trent Lott has just come out with a book, and I could swear it's called "cat killer" or "killing cats" or something like that. The book is about Lott, though-not Frist. But the title (if I got it correctly) is a clear shot at Lott's enemy Frist. Heard this on NPR--but I wasn't listening carefully, so can't remember the book's full title.

I love it when those assholes fight.

[BewilderedCitizen]

31. I've got a few.

One sister, and a couple of in-laws. It's very frustrating. They have no idea what's happening in the news or politics in general, yet they'll argue that the things you're telling them aren't true.

I tell them I don't blame them for not believing what I say, but they should research it on their own and form their own opinion.

They must have zero intellectual curiosity, because the next time we talk they still have no facts, but still refuse to believe anything negative you say about their party.

With the state of the media, it's hard to blame people for not knowing what's really going on. People certainly aren't going to learn the truth by watching Fox or CNN. I just don't understand the people that have been told, but refuse to look into it for themselves and offer nothing but denial.

I'm finding it harder and harder to spend time with them.

[texpatriot2004]

59. The "if it were true I would have heard about it on TV" type. Hmm.

"Zero intellectual curiosity" - what's up with that? I do that too tell people look it up, investigate for yourself...then same as you, see them again and nothing has changed plus they don't even seem bothered by it. Bizarre.

This is extremely puzzling to me too.

"I just don't understand the people that have been told, but refuse to look into it for themselves and offer nothing but denial."

I liked Gore's recent speech about TV being the greatest threat to our Democracy.

[RebelOne]

33. I have two sisters who are rock-solid Bushies.

I do not even discuss him because I don't like arguments. But at least my son and daughter are Democrats and hate Bush. My son-in-law is a Democrat, but voted for Bush, so I consider him a Zell Miller Democrat.

[texpatriot2004]

60. Yeah, when you don't like arguments or conflict it's hard. n/t

[Skittles]

36. none in my family

but I have dumped some aquaintances because their continuing support of bush and their pathetic excuses for him quite simply make me sick.

[texpatriot2004]

61. Yes, this has certainly happened with me I cannot respect

people who support him. Their values are not my values.

[LynnTheDem]

62. My hubby's entire family (and they live in Wa State, yet) so I haven't

spoken to any of them for going on 2 years now. They call, I refuse to answer the phone; hubby speaks to them and tells them how and what I'm doing.

His dad asked him last week "Will she ever forgive us?" Hubby said "No, I don't think so."

Hubby is correct.

Thankfully they live in Wa State and we're in Texas. Distance is a good thing.

[XanaDUer]

64. I avoid them.

Sad, but I am tired of their baiting and snottiness, belligerence, etc. Easier to just avoid them.

[Sir Jeffrey]

65. I have lots and lots in my family...

I try to avoid diascussing the big three controversial topics:

politics
religion
sex

I have pretty good success with saying that "gentlemen don't discuss such matters out of respect for other's opinions and beliefs."

But my grandfather especially is a fundie with a third grade education (I'm serious, he dropped out before finishing fourth grade). He always brings up jeebus and how every non-Southern Baptist is definitely going to hell. You can't really explain anything to him since he is

old
dumb
argumentative
self-righteous

If you need something they have, do what I do. Manipulate them for money or favors...you're obviously smarter than them. It's easy and fun. :D

[Totally Committed]

66. My son, who now lives and works in a Red State is a Republican.

How do I deal with him? We talk. A lot. He is not a crazy-ass RW extremist or a Neo-con, thank goodness, just a real conservative. I don't know where he came from as this is a family of Liberals and Progressives, except for him.

It is possible, with enough conversation to coax family members across the aisle once in a while though... He actually supported Wes Clark, along with the me, his sisters, and their husbands, but when it came down to the GE, would not do what the rest of us did and vote ABB. He just wouldn't. He just refused to vote at all. He thinks the Bush policies and performance is a disgrace, but is a huge fan of John McCain. The only candidate I've ever seen him cross over to vote for was Wes. Wes was his primary vote. He told me that was the frst time he ever voted Democratic. So, it was possible, but I have to admit that the Bush policies, coupled with a palatable Democrat made it easier and more possible to flip him than ever before.

So, the key to harmony with family members on the other side is to keep communicating... unless they are so obnoxious, it becomes out of the question. I have to tell you, if my son was a Bushie, I would probably try and have him deprogrammed! LOL! I couldn't stand it. I don't know how the rest of you with hard-core Fascists in the family do it. I know what our holiday dinner political cinversations are like here, and we have one Republican and he's not the Neo-con variety, but there are still some very loud conversations, to be sure!

TC

[babylonsister]

67. I have 2 brothers I don't talk to much

because our views differ so greatly. I've lost 2 friends forever because of the same reason; we just cannot agree, so we no longer talk. It's sad, but so are their points of view IMO. There are other friends who choose not to discuss politics, and that's probably a good thing. At least we're still talking...

[WinkyDink]

68. A very good friend and relatives.

Relatives on my side are WWII vets/spouses; in-laws are Conservative "Christians". Friend was impressed after 9/11.

My approach to the topic: No discussion. But if in-laws (in HOUSTON) bring up the subject, Mr. WDink stops them and gives them fair warning that they will NOT like the ensuing conversation!

[Liberal Librarian]

69. All In the "Bush" Family

One of the best things you can do is equip yourself with knowledge so you can rebut them. Jot down some brief facts and statistics on topics they consider important. When they tout the war, calmly say you're surprised because doesn't everyone want peace? If they have children, I've found the draft conversation is highly effective. Also, forward articles to them via email. Generally I find most bushies are ill-informed because they rely on blow-monkeys like O'Reilly and Rush for their information.

[SoCalDemGrrl]

72. How did it come to this? B4 Bush I never had political arguments like this

Now every time I see my step father if the subject of politics comes up -whoa WATCH OUT!! Last night he insisted on calling Kerry a traitor... said he knows Bush has "made some mistakes" recently but if the election were held tomorrow, he'd still vote for the son-of-a-bitch!!

He mentioned something about "The Code of Military honor" and how Kerry spoke against his superiors during Vietnam. I told him that Kerry spoke up against atrocities that were being committed against civilians and that I admired him for doing so. Hell, I said the way you are thinking is just like the Nazis - they obeyed their superiors and no one spoke up and 6 million innocents died!!

He still didn't get it. In fact he said I was probably a traitor too since I marched against both wars - Vietnam and Iraq!!

What the hell is wrong with these people?? Bush has them brainwashed.

[renate]

74. during the first year or so of the regime

I could have understood and gotten along perfectly well with * supporters--you know, they know not what they do, etc.

Now, I honestly believe that actively supporting Bush and his cabal is a symptom of a personality disorder. Passive support, well, that's probably mainly due to fear of facing the horrible truth and all that it implies, and I can't blame people for being afraid to face it. Sometimes, when things are looking especially horrible and dire, I want to crawl into a burrow myself.