What if a large contingent of Americans boycotted insurance for 12 months?

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

I tried to float this six months ago and got a resounding NO!


IMHO, mainly because too many have been brainwashed by the med manufacturers that they cannot survive without their wares.

We hear their adverts 24-7 and have little to no faith in nature today.

I'd do it.

[callady]

1. A Resounding Yes!

But call it for what it is. The mob.

[Aimah]

2. Medical Insurance?

Or all insurance?

[DemInDistress]

3. I as well as 45 million Americans

have no medical insurance anyway..I'm with though !!

[LSdemocrat]

4. Yeah dying from catastrophic illness would sure teach someone something

I can't quite figure out what.

[SouthernDem2004]

5. Just not a good idea. If you mean do not pay premiums that is really bad.

Most people do not plan sickness or injury. You never know when you will need medical care. Who would risk their families health?

[Name removed]

9. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[SouthernDem2004]

25. lol, spoken like someone without children. :) I already have

ER bills I am paying that my insurance did not cover. Who needs more... :)

[neebob]

6. Um, they'd all get their cars impounded and have to pay fines?

Oh, you mean health insurance. That doesn't seem like a very smart thing for people with dependents to do. Plus then you'd lose the pre-tax benefit on the premiums. For me that's another $400 a month I'd have to pay taxes on AND have that much more chance of losing everything due to a major illness.

[hfojvt]

23. what if a large contingent

parked their cars for a month, and then sold them when they found out they could do without them?

A halfway decent car costs at least $1000 a year. If you do not have to drive to work, you can rent and take taxis probably for less. Plus, I find that I can rent a much nicer car than I will ever be able to own.

[neebob]

32. A lot of people have already done that, I think,

but they live in cities and other places with adequate public transportation. I'd be willing to do it if I didn't live in the mountains, 12 miles from town, with no bus service and a monopolistic "taxi" service that caters to tourists and costs $20 a ride.

I know a guy who lives near me and rides his bike to and from town every day, at least in the summer. I'm not that much of an athlete. Neither is he, really. I always wonder why he still has a big gut.

I also know several frequent hitchhikers.

[Silverhair]

61. Most of us DON"T live in NYC, or other super city.

Try living in a semi-rural area without a car.

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

29. Sponge Bob.... We're having a little trouble thinking outside the box?

WHY THE FUCK DO YOU THINK THE INSURANCE INDUSTRY IS SO RICH?

And why do they have such great lobbyists?

[neebob]

38. Was I defending the insurance industry?

Did I say I like paying insurance or that I don't think it's a shitty racket? No, in fact I do think it's a shitty racket. Perhaps you're having trouble not reading too much into others' posts.

[proud2BlibKansan]

7. What about those of us with employer provided insurance?

I like your idea but it would be hard for me to do.

[callady]

8. Great Idea- Take Care of Each Other-Let's DEMAND Universal Healthcare

All Insurance Is A Scam!!!


Governmnent and Insurer Collusion Rampant: Documentation
http://www.public-i.org/50states_01_101100.htm
Featuring the Louisiana Senator from State Farm.


Wander here
Reasonable Drivers Unanimous
and read about scheming insurance companies in collusion with
equally scheming and thieving government.
Surely you had the suspicion, but maybe not the proof.
The best part?
Tips on how to beat them at their own crooked games.
Have no doubt, you ARE the enemy & the cash cow.



State Farm Exposed on NBC's Dateline - Paperchase (John Larsen) Top of State Farm in the News


On the other hand, see the results of the courageous Senator Martha Escutia of California in the outrageous Quackenbush scandal. National news doesn't seem to be paying attention here. Why, l just wonder why? :-)

http://graham.main.nc.us/~bhammel/ins.html

[Baconfoot]

10. Hi. My asthma medication helps me breath. I like breathing.

And yes, I have had an attack which would have been fatal if I hadn't been able to get to a doctor (meaning really oxygen and a nebulizer) in time DESPITE having taken my medication. I can only surmise what would have happened had I not had my rescue inhaler handy.

If not for medication I would be dead by now and would therefore have no brain to wash.

But it's not all about whether or not I would have been dead by now. It's also about quality of life. If I take my medication as directed, I breath better and can function better. Trust a person who rarely breaths normally - clear lungs are a blessing.

I prefer being able to walk up stairs thank you very much.

Now you might say "well I'm not talking about asthma medication." To this my response is: please come up with a clear criterion for differentiating between medications people are "brainwashed" into taking and medication they are not "brainwashed" into taking.

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

11. Take how much you and your family have put into insurance....

I guarantee it would pay for your medicine....

It's NOT insurance that keeps you "healthy," it's the medical industry.

For 90% of Americans, they pay much more for med insurance than insurance pays the medical industry. That's why they have so much fucking money.

:hi:

[Chi-Town Exile]

14. But it wouldn't pay for hospitalization or major surgery ...

or the after care that someone might need after major surgery.

Theoretically, I see where you're coming from, but not all insurance is bogus.

Hospitalization costs can cripple families and send you directly to bankruptcy.

And, as we know, since we've been Gannoned up the Ass by the Republican congress' surgery on the bankruptcy laws, people would be in real bad shape if they had to declare bankruptcy because they let their health insurance lapse and they had a catastrophic illness/accident/injury etc.

The whole fucking health care system needs to be overhauled, but that will never happen because of the current make-up in Congress nor would we want it with those mfers in power.

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

15. Thanks, you just explained the reasons to do this.....

25% of America is in this position. Are we the party of IGMSFU (I got Mine So Fuck You)?

Change does not occur without sacrifice.

[Chi-Town Exile]

18. What are you talking about?

25% of what?

[lynne]

12. Great Idea ! Providing -

- that your cars and your house are all paid in full and don't require insurance coverage to protect the lien's interest. And providing you don't own a business where insurance is required to allow you to stay on the job.

Not willing to part with my health coverage as it's part of a retirement package that my spouse invested 25 years of his life to earn.

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

13. I don't know you, but....

If you are like the vast majority of Americans, you haven't spent that much time in the hospital this year.

With today's current laws, there's emergency medical laws.

I'm not rich and at one time lived for 15 years without medical insurance.... And I lived.

:hi:

[lynne]

20. Actually, this has been a banner year -

- with 3 ER trips in the family, 2 sets of xrays, 1 set of crutches, 1 cane, three ortheopedic braces, 1 doppler procedure and follow up office visits for all of the above.

I did without health insurance when I was young and single but I've made sure I had it since I had kids. Plus, it is part of my husband's retirement which he earned doing 25+ years of hard work. No way would I turn my back on it, especially with us not getting any younger.

[JanusAscending]

16. What if we didn't do that, but

all decided not to pay our FEDERAL INCOME TAXES that pay for bushes ILLEGAL WAR! If we ALL participated, this would be our way of Boycotting the Govmnt.!! If we all did it, it would take more years than he has left in office to catch up with us!! They don't have near enough auditors to investigate us all. Now I think you need to keep in mind that you should put the money you would legally have to pay in a bank deposit box, or under your mattress (whatever) because no one should go to jail over this, but wouldn't that really SPEAK TRUTH TO LIES ?? Can you imagine the Chaos this could cause? Just say "NO TAXATION WITHOUT REPRESENTATION" !! Period!!! :nuke: We the people will have our own "nuklear" option!!:bounce: :patriot:

[Silverhair]

62. Unless you are living outside the system, with NO paper trail...

the computers WILL catch you. And then your bank accounts get frozen, and all kinds of other bad stuff happens.

[katinmn]

17. Yes, I'd do it for the greater good of all and in solidarity with

the 45 million-plus uninsured and the 18 million with poor insurance.

I'm ready to do this. We should start a fund for those who become ill during the 12 months. We could put a portion of what we pay for premiums into the fund. It would be an insurance co-op.

Obviously those who are seriously ill would not be asked to do it.

I am tired of watching old and poor suffering needlessly when our tax dollars are used to benefit the wealthy and the powerful.

We get a lot of lip service from our elected leaders but no action. In fact, right now they are plotting to cut Medicare and Medicaide. We're going backwards fast.

[LostInAnomie]

19. In short, the premiums would raise for the other group.

They would raise and they would not be lowered after those 12 months.

Insurance companies know that they have us where they want us. They know that the general public is too frightened of sickness and death to ever give up voluntarily. They know that the majority of people cannot afford to take time from work to heal without aid of drugs. They know that people with children feel bound by responsibility to not let their insurance lapse no matter what the cost.

These people would bear the brunt of the insurance companies reaction. The raised cost would cause some to drop out but those costs can be passed on to other who can afford it because they have no other options.

[Chi-Town Exile]

21. You're Right.

I'm all for overhauling the health system, but there has got to be a better way to go about doing it.

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

24. God forbid we touch on the corrupt insurance industry.

[Chi-Town Exile]

26. That's a real jump in logic.

I'm protecting my FAMILY, not the insurance company.

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

33. Death is inevitable. Make an arrangement with your local MD...

They are human. A corporation is not.

Seriously. Add up the money you have paid in insurance and how much they have spent. Chances are you have paid 10x more than they have.

90% of americans would be better shoving the money in a mattress.

[Chi-Town Exile]

43. Considering my child was born premature and amassed

60 thousand dollars worth of medical bills before he was a month old and out of the hospital, the insurance company we had at the time got the short end of that deal.

[LostInAnomie]

27. God forbid we think rationally about a solution.

I think there are probably a lot more sane solutions like working to elects reformers, or changing campaign finance laws so insurance companies don't have undue influence.

[Chi-Town Exile]

35. I'm all for that.

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

22. You are too comfortable....

Yes, they know they have us by the balls.

It would take a massive act of selflessness to get them to change. Until they do, there are going to be at least 35% of Americans turned away from the Doctor's door.

Enjoy your Soma.

[Chi-Town Exile]

30. Yes, they do have us by the balls.

But I'm not about to go into a diabetic coma to prove a point.

My family has worked too long and too hard for our insurance benefits, and since I'm virtually un-insurable if I leave a large insurance group, I have to stick with what I've got.

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

34. "Worked too hard for our insurance benefits." Holy fucking Christ!

Is that what you are working for?

I feel for you.

[Chi-Town Exile]

40. Feel for me all you want ...

We actually work for a living and think that we have a responsibility to our child.

Just because you didn't have insurance coverage for 15 years doesn't give you the right to sit in judgment of those that choose to carry health insurance.

In our line of work we have seen way too many lives destroyed because of catastrophic illnesses.

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

47. Heh. Me? I don't work for a living. Living on the government dole here.

LOL... (not)

Yup, those who gots, gots.

What if you lost your job?

Or, in your case, your insurance?

What would you do?

Empathy is a good thing for many people.

[katinmn]

45. Actually, people stay in jobs they hate, make marital decisions

and plan their whole lives around their insurance coverage.

The benefits package prevents many people from testing their wings at something they like, leaving abad marraige, moving to a better climate or more interesting place because they are tethered to their jobs for their health insurance.

It kept me locked in a job I had grown to dislike until I realized that was BULLSHIT. What a sad way to live.

This thread is about pushing for health care reform but part of the problem is the mindset among most that you are powerless to change things. It's too hard. Give up before you try, or even give it a thorough discussion.

[Chi-Town Exile]

46. That's very true, I've seen that also.

People do stay in horrendous jobs because of their insurance coverage.

But I've seen those that have horrible lives because they are still trying to come back from illnesses or accidents that have decimated their families and their finances.

It's a choice we shouldn't have to make, I don't believe we are powerless to change things, but a good start would be getting politicians out of corporations' pockets.

[LostInAnomie]

37. Changing them isn't the solution.

Making them disappear is.

No matter how cheap our "massive act of selflessness" makes the price of insurance there will always be those who cannot afford it. It is absolutely abhorrent that there are those that reap ungodly profits from the misfortune of others. As a civilized society we should not allow it. As long as health care is a private enterprise this will always be the case.

This is why we should fight for universal health care. Everyone deserves health care not just those who can afford it, no matter how cheap.

[Deja Q]

54. Then we need to educate the public about being played for as chumps.

[BamaGirl]

28. In a word, no

Without insurance we'd pay more for my daughter's medication some months than we pay in monthly premiums. Actually we didn't have insurance when we had our last child--$15,000 and they have no interest in being reasonable about payment plans, ya know? As long as we have kids who can be covered and can pay the premiums, we'll have insurance.

[Chi-Town Exile]

31. Got that right.

It's real easy for those that don't have responsibilities to trash those of us that do.

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

Kid, You are advocating passing responsibilities to the Insurance agencies

You dont know me and I don't know you.

Discuss the topic and not the person if you want to talk here,

[Chi-Town Exile]

42. Hey, Einstein, you're the one that started trashing me

and making judgments about everyone that isn't enthralled with your hair-brained schemes!

People have a right to disagree with you, just as you have the right to your opinion!

But if you check the posts, you're the one that started PERSONALIZING every thing.

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

44. Could you give me an example of my "trashing" you? Or is a disagreement

tantamount to "trashing" you?

I'm waiting.

[Name removed]

48. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

52. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

36. Where do you think those prices come from?

[BamaGirl]

53. I know where they come from

that doesn't mean I'm going to jeopardize my daughter's health, and not having regular access to her doctor would do that. Access I can't afford without insurance, I might add. We're just over the assistance levels, so would have to cough up everything on a salary that definitely won't stretch for it.

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

55. I can certainly believe you are from Alabama...

Because I live here and I see that thought process every day.

Believe it or not, people have lived without the benefit of Dr, Welby for centuries.

The VAST majority of people do not need pharmaceuticals.

How much have you paid in insurance for the last ten years versus expenditures?

If you are in the average level, you have paid a lot more. That's why the insurance industry is only behind the energy industry in profits and influence.

Peace.

[BlackVelvet04]

57. There's an awful lot of judgmentalism going

on here.

I abhor the medical system but I had to have back surgery that ended up costing over $80,000 and that was on top of having 3 surgeries for endometriosis that cost over $100,000. If I hadn't had insurance I would have been bankrupt.

Yes, insurance companies suck, but going bankrupt or being crippled because you can't afford back surgery suck more.

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

60. If you look at the actual costs of those operations you would find that

they were far less than what were charged and that the profits to pay those who had nothing to do with the actual costs and actions related to the activity were pornographic at best.

Peace and I;m glad you're her typing with us!

:hi:

[BamaGirl]

63. Yes, exactly

Yes, insurance companies suck, but going bankrupt or being crippled because you can't afford back surgery suck more.

Hope you're doing well!

[BamaGirl]

58. Actually I'm not from

Alabama, not that that's relevant. Believe it or not some people really do need doctors and medications to stay healthy. Our insurance has paid a helluva lot more than we have over the last few years.

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

64. If all people were in the same shoes as you,

there would e no medical insurance.

They are in it for the money. They are not a social service. They are there to make a profit.

A profit should not be first and formost in the health industry IMHO.

Peace.

[BamaGirl]

66. Now that I completely agree with.

They definitely suck, but for some us they are a necessary evil.

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

68. And there lies the crux of the arguement... They are NOT a necessary evil!

[BamaGirl]

70. Until there's a better system in place, yeah they are.

[Silverhair]

67. LOL ! That really funny. Would you care to look up life expectancies...

for any of the previous centuries prior to the twentieth century. You know. The ones where you claim that people lived so well without doctors.

If it were not for modern medicine, I personally would already be dead several times.

[WildEyedLiberal]

80. Amen.

I've had three open heart surgeries. If it weren't for that "newfangled" crap like EKGs, echocardiograms, and other tests, my heart problem would never have even been diagnosed, and I would've died. Also, each one of my surgeries cost about 4x what my parents, at the time, made in a year. One year my dad was on strike and insurance was up in the air, and that was before my third surgery. If he'd lost his insurance because of his company's greed, my parents would have gone bankrupt paying for my third surgery.

I mean, I guess I could die to prove a point, but on second thought... no thanks.

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

81. Damn... Unfortunately, we are living in a day of modern medicine.

[dogman]

39. We can't even pull of a 24 hour general strike!

Welcome to the ME generation.

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

41. It is soooooo painfully obvious in this thread....

:toast:

[callady]

50. What is that sound?

"Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter." ~ Martin
Luther King, jr.

Can you hear it too? What is that sound? The sound that has the ability to drive a man
nuts. The sound of electricity buzzing in the lights. Yes, that is the sound of silence. A
sound that has spread across this nation like a disease. It's like sitting in a church when
everyone takes a moment to pray and suddenly you hear a baby start to cry. That’s what
we hear, the sound of helpless tears from mothers who hoped that their children would
outlive them. Yet, nobody runs to comfort her. The sound of nothing and an absence of
action to go with it. Silence, a sound foreign to America. A sound that is pleasing to kings
and crippling to peasants. For the rest of the world, this is America's real shock and awe,
its silence. The days are gone when all nations would look to see what American's were
saying. No longer do they look to America, simply because there is nothing to hear or see
here. America sits silent while lady Justice is raped. Just when did America lose it's voice?

Silence is the sound of surrender. The sound of fear. Creating fear is the quickest way to
achieve silence. Who benefits from the silence? Who would want to mute the mouths of
Americans? You ask yourself that question; don't run around asking everyone else until
you can answer it. It is not a trick question. It is a very simple question and has been
answered by generations of the past. Rome, Germany, Russia, France, and China are
prime examples of a people that were silent. As the past will prove, it is not an imaginary
organization that benefits from a nations silence. Indeed, it is the leaders of that nation’s
government which benefits from the silence.

<snip>

If all of the trucks shut down on the side of the road, and all of the factory workers didn't
show up to work, it would only take one day for government to take notice. One day! That
is fact. What is your issue? High fuel prices? You will not get lower fuel prices by buying
fuel! You can't just wait for an elected official to decide it is enough. That's not going to
happen. Are we waiting for somebody honest to be elected president? Listen, it is not
going to happen!! We have to make them be honest. If we want results, it will take action
on our part. We have to take to the streets with our grievances. Petitions will not get us
anywhere. Apologies will not fix anything. We have to take action, the time is Now!

http://www.americauncensored.net/articles/october2005/SoundOfSilence.html

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

51. God love you, Callady...

Thanks so much for posting that.

It fits so well.

[PowerToThePeople]

49. I have been uninsured for years... n/t

[Ksec]

56. Its the LAW in Nazi Ohio

If you dont carry insurance you go to jail. Needles to say the GOP runs Ohio and were bankrupt because of it. But Insurance companies and their whores are raking it in. Id imagine most of these whores go to work for these companies they whored for after they retire.

[Cleita]

59. What if we form our own insurance company, an employee

owned one at that, and undersell the for-profits? That would break the monopoly. But, you'd better brace yourself for the dirty playback they will dish out. That means we'd better have experienced insurance execs, accountants and lawyers working for us.

[Silverhair]

69. This has been done before. They are owned by the policyholders.

They still have much of the same problems the rest of the insurance industry has.

[Cleita]

71. I would assume it's because they are trying to run it for profit.

I would appreciate it, when you drop in my posts, that you would have some place I could check that has done this, a history book, a court case, a bankruptcy, anything?

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

72. (NRA associate) Voice of God.

Don't disagree, they know all.



:sarcasm:

[Silverhair]

78. I was in one for decades.

USAA - owned by the policyholders. When you take out a policy, you aquire a share of the company. Prices were lower than all other companies for a long time, but I left them when I got lower prices.

They don't do health insurance - PC lines only.

[BamaGirl]

73. We have one of those

Our cars/house insurer is member owned, and it's a helluva lot cheaper than any other company would cost us. Not available for medical unfortunately.

[Cleita]

76. Medical is a bit dicey, but it shouldn't be run by insurance

anyway. Perhaps establishing free clinics on the Haight-Ashbury model would work for you guys until we can get National Health Care.

[purji]

65. We haven't had insurance for about 10 months

And now I owe over 7000 in medical debt.Thats almost three times more than I paid for insurance for a year.Just because I don't have insurance doesn't mean I don't have to pay the medical bills.
I cant see how it will hurt the insurance company,only the people who don't have it will be hurt.

[Ksec]

74. Who can afford it now?

They took all the jobs to China and gave us MacDonalds . Who can afford insurance with the New American Jobs?

They (insurance induustry) wonder why theyre having problems now? Duh, you took away your customers ,idiots. Thats why most of American companies are hurting. A vanishing middle class brought to you by the GOP.

[Gusto md]

75. I looked at getting Health Insurance the other day but declined

It was cheaper for me and my partner to have no insurance and get medical help than to have insurance and get medical help. Confused? It's called the public health system in Australia.

To have a baby with no insurnace costs $0 in hospital fees. To have a baby with insurance costs around $2000 in hospital fees, plus the monthly insurance payment of $300.

You can probably guess which decision we made....

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

77. Unfortunately, many here have drank the kool aide

and believe that any socialized health care is tantampunt to either Dr. Kavorkian or being bled by leeches.

*sigh*

[DanCa]

79. Yes complaceny is not the answer any more.