A progressive candidate DUers would love...

[MessiahRp]

Hey my DU friends, allow me a moment to shill for an important cause.....

As it turns out Senator Mark Dayton stepping down in Minnesota could give progressive DUers a chance to vote for someone who really represents their views...

The Washington Democrats had come out and supported Amy Klobuchar mainly because she was the AG and a female. The line of thinking is that she'd have a ton of built in support from her previous name value and the support of women's groups.

The problem is that Amy has been extremely vague on the issues, not a very strong speaker and has relied on those Washington insiders to help boost her campaign instead of connecting with voters.

Republican Mark Kennedy (who recently raised $1 million from a single Bush visit) would have a field day with her in a debate.

The surprise candidate is Ford Bell. Bell's been making up ground and connecting with voters and it's probably because he represents what people in Minnesota really want.

The press are starting to pick up on this as well but with Washington DLC types supporting Amy he's going to need all of us donating to his campaign.

This is what we always talk about. Electing progressives to change the tone of Washington. Bell is starting to make real noise and would provide a serious challenger to a rubber stamper like Kennedy in a debate.

Check out today's press: http://news.yahoo.com/s/usnw/20060121/pl_usnw/bell_proposes_series_of_debates_with_klobuchar__says_race_now_is__clear_choice_about__soul__of_dfl104_xml

and head over to Ford's site to help him out. We need to keep this seat and what better way to do it than to elect a progressive who supports the issues we do?

http://www.fordbell.com

Rp

[sandnsea]

1. Another Dem basher

How original.

[MessiahRp]

3. LOL that's a crazy assumption...

So not true...

I couldn't be more of a Democrat. I am suggesting though that here's a strong progressive candidate who actually knows the issues (his Washington establishment backed opponent does not), who can actually speak well and who actually stands firmly for Democratic ideals...

Would you rather have another Russ Feingold in there or another Dianne Feinstein?

This isn't about picking a Green over a Dem or something. This is about picking the best Dem for the job and the one that can win at the same time.

Ford is a strong speaker and has some terrific ideas. His opponent does not. Thus Ford represents the best chance of not losing the seat to Bush Rubber-stamper Mark Kennedy. And with midterms being as important as they are, the last thing we should want is a milquetoast candidate who loses a seat being vacated by a Democrat.

Rp

[sandnsea]

4. Not you, Ford Bell

Feingold manages to promote his views without bashing other Dems. I went to the web site and read, Bell is a basher. Fuck that. The last thing we need is more bashers in DC. Honorably stand on your views, like Feingold, or get out. That goes for the Lieberman types too.

[MessiahRp]

7. Bell's comments were directed at the fact

that many in Washington aren't even allowing for a primary to play out, they're just sticking their support behind Klobuchar just because she's a former AG. I do agree that it seems that they are picking the candidate and trying to circumvent a primary to some degree. Ford scored huge point by making the statement that the decision belongs to the people.

I personally think Dem party leaders and elected officials should wait until a primary has ended to officially endorse someone. Remember how silly Gore and the SEIU looked by endorsing Howard Dean so early in 2004?

Why damage that body's credibility for later in the election because you know we'll need their help and the last thing we need is the perception that they aren't wholeheartedly behind the candidate they now have to help.

Rp

[sandnsea]

9. It's more than that

It's his entire "wholly owned, top down, Chuck Schumer" bla bla bullshit. I really don't understand the need for the vitriol. He doesn't even provide any proof that the primary is being unfairly influenced. I'm seeing the results of these kinds of tactics in Oregon where our governor is being attacked by the same kinds of Democrats and his numbers are plummeting. They don't understand that even if they win the primary, they're going to have to rehabilitate people's perceptions of the Democratic Party as a whole, the perceptions that they're creating right now with their attacks.

[hippywife]

11. Actually, it's the party that needs

the rehabilitation. It the enabling centrists and DLCers that are showing the people that there is little distinctive choice for meaningful progress and change at the polls. It's the stagnating business as usual that discourages the populace from voting.

[sandnsea]

17. So keep reinforcing that idea

Don't talk about all the good Democrats who are proposing change and have fought for it for years. Nah, don't do that. Tear the party apart instead. Good strategy.

[hippywife]

18. I'm not saying that none of them

have redeeming values but having gone thru the process up close at the state level and being fully engaged at the national level, I don't see much hope in many of them. They have a huge stake in the status quo. They don't mind equivocating just to keep their seats. What you got was a whole lotta nothing:

1.) A candidate for president that couldn't make clear his views with a vp candidate who was fully behind the war in Iraq. Any election fraud aside, this election was theirs to lose.

2.) A bankruptcy bill that clearly isn't in the public interest.

3.) John Roberts as Cheif Justice of the USSC and soon the addition of Alito.

I'm sick of all the pandering and pussyfooting around. We need an oppostion party or we're sunk. It's time to take off the gloves and let them know it.

[sandnsea]

19. So run on the issues

How hard is that to grasp??? I have been saying for over a year now that the left needs to stop trying to transform the party by bashing everybody; and simply create a unified voice that speaks to what they stand FOR. All anybody can hear and see is temper tantrums and nobody is going to vote for that or rally behind it to make change.

[hippywife]

20. Progressives do run on the issues

and get drowned out and wholey unsupported by their fellow Dems in office. Sorry but I think the shoe is actually on the other foot.

[sandnsea]

21. There's shoes to go around

No doubt about it.

But you're not being drowned out, you're message is all over the place. It's just that the message that's out there is that you hate the Democratic establishment. Yeah, okay, we got that.

[hippywife]

23. And the message of the

centrist and DLC enablers is that they want to win even if they have to sell out every principle the party is supposed to stand for and the people still lose. Yeah, okay, we got that a long time ago.

[sandnsea]

25. That's your message

about them, not theirs. If you can't even articulat their message, how do you expect to defeat it.

[hippywife]

26. No, it's the message of

every single centrist and DLC enabler on this board and elsewhere when they try to shut the progressive message down. They aren't willing to address the needs of the populace head on without equivocation.

[sandnsea]

29. So the strategy is to bash them

Like I said in my very first post. As I said to katinmn below, good luck with that.

[katinmn]

22. If you look carefully at the campaigns, sandnsea, it is the progressives

that are articulating issues like health care, the economy and the war. The moderates are glossing over them because they want to appeal to conservative voters. They are not talking to the majority of people who are fed up with the war and the health care crisis.

[sandnsea]

24. Then STICK TO IT

And quit dragging the moderates or DLC or whatever other whining bullshit into it. The message on the issues is getting lost, I swear I don't know why you can't see that.

[katinmn]

27. We are. And you don't like it. Therein lies the controversy.

We are for transparency and being upfront with the voters. If we have to hold moderates to task for glossing over issues, and the DNC for supporting moderates that are too far right, we will.

One very practical complaint is that the DSCC and the DCCC, to which we ALL have contributed funds, are doling out cash exclusively to moderates. Then they say the progressives can't win because they aren't good fundraisers. :silly:

You have to admit a lot of the cash was raised through promises to stand up and speak out about the issues. Well, now we want to see that financial support going to the candidates that are standing up and speaking out.

If the party leaders don't want to be criticized they have to quit picking the favorites. Let the people decide.

[sandnsea]

28. Yeah, you're bashing the party

So when I say you're doing that, why do you deny it? That's what started this entire line, that Bell was running on anything except Dem bashing. And now it gets down to it, that's what you say you're doing. Good luck with that. It won't work.

[hippywife]

30. Good luck with maintaining the status quo.

That's already proven not to work. Not calling out the self-serving members of our own party is just continuing to enable their lack of accomplishment of anything but holding the line where they are comfortable regardless of what happens to the country.

[sandnsea]

31. Those who have been winning

Haven't been doing it by bashing DC Dems, in case you missed it.

[hippywife]

32. And what have they

really been worth to you? I'm stuck with a whole lot of DINO's here at the state level and one at the national level. They couldn't be anymore Republican if they ran as one.

[sandnsea]

33. Hmmm

Salazar bros, Schweitzer, Herseth, Kaine. I don't know, what are they worth.

Paul Hackett, pro gun, pro military, anti-immigration. In October, Lou Dobbs gave him a chance to support troop withdrawal and he laid out a mismanagement line instead. It doesn't matter to me whether Hackett or Brown wins, but it certainly isn't a race about progressive policies, or being stuck with "DINO's".

The DLC wants to win, the anti-DLC wants to win. That's all there is to it. I'm suggesting that there really isn't a hair's difference between the two, if they'd shut up and listen to each other and find the points of agreement. Because the points ARE there and there ARE a ton of them.

[MessiahRp]

12. Schumer came out endorsing Klobuchar

a couple days back without even looking at what Ford had to offer. Seems to me that Chuckie and the Washington boys really would rather have someone who's there to get along rather than someone that's there to fight.

And my own personal point is this...

The only way to bring our party back to the left so it represents us is to take out the centrist DLC types in every election possible. We need to make Washington's "Business as usual" an issue because that's exactly why we are losing these elections and why so many people feel disconnect with the Democratic party. The party doesn't represent true Dems much of the time because it spends too much of it's time appeasing the conservatives on the right.

The way to create a change in how the party works is to win elections with progressives and to work against those who are creating the environment that makes us look spineless to begin with.

Ford Bell represents a very clear opportunity to do that. To take a seat vacated by a moderate Democrat and take it from a Bush right winger and another moderate Dem by using the power of progressive politics as a drawing card.

The majority of Americans agree with the progressive agenda, they've just been told for too long that moderates are liberals and that liberals are bad. Hard to present an agenda that agrees with Americans when your credibility has been questioned before you even began because of spineless centrists in the party.

Ford said that this election is one for the soul of the party. He meant the Minnesota DFL party but it's a good way to view how we can change the national party as well.

Strong progressives need to come in and beat these centrists happy-to-be-there types with their ideas and if you have Washington Dems purposely supporting the moderate to try to screw state voters out of their primary then I say they are fair game.

Just as Senator Schumer was yesterday.

Rp

[sandnsea]

16. Here's what will happen

Ford keeps harping on DLC whores, and let's say he wins. All the general voter will here is the Democrats are corrupt and they won't believe Ford isn't just because he says he isn't. So, he'll have to rehabilitate an image that he helped to create. And it'll be even worse if Klobuhar wins. It's a terrible thing to do and the impression that all Democrats are corrupt is going to hurt all across the country. The Republicans aren't doing this, they're taking the few bad apples approach and we've already seen that work once.

[katinmn]

8. Excuse me? We Minnesotans want some choices!

The DSCC and the DCCC are drowning out progressive voices. They TRIED to pretend the Senate race was between the Repub and Klobuchar, the annointed Dem. Not true.

Bell has a lot of backers and every word he said is true. If you were concerned about issues rather than supporting "Ds" you would not be so quick to discourage a discussion of the issues.

Two DUers are on the state central committee. They agree so you can complain all you want about "bashing" but it won't do any good. We are here to stay.

edit: spelling

[sandnsea]

10. Then discuss the issues

If that's what people want, that's what they'll vote for. I'm sure Minnesota is perfectly capable of voting based on issues without the attacks.

[Douglas Carpenter]

2. his positions on issues are very impressive

Pro Choice Equal Rights Universal Health Care Iraq Withdrawl
Alternative Energy Pro Union Hunter/Sportsman Wildlife Habitat
link:

http://www.fordbell.com/issues/

[RebelOne]

5. I don't live in Minnesota, but I would have to disagree with him

on the hunter/sportsman issues. I am 100% anti-hunting. But I do know that Minnesota has many hunters, so he would probably come out on top on the environmental issues.

[MessiahRp]

6. I am anti-hunting as well

But I would have to assume that in Minnesota just as here in Wisconsin it would be suicide to promote that view.

Rp

[catmother]

13. delete

[MessiahRp]

14. Warner's running for President... this is a senatorial race

We're not talking about the White House in 2008...

Rp

[catmother]

15. delete