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Doctor_J Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-25-06 08:21 PM
Original message
Scalito confirmation = GOP sweep in the mid-terms
THis capitulation pretty much is a signal from the Dems that * is in charge, and they really don't have any intention of opposing him on any serious issues. There will be a few indignant voices on picayune things like ANWR drilling, but in fact they will have admitted that they like having a dictator. I look for the * to have super-majorities in both houses a year from now. I haven't voted for a repub in my life, but frankly don't see any reason to vote Dem any more either.
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KingFlorez Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-25-06 08:23 PM
Response to Original message
1. No
Look at the mess they've made, why on earth would they get supermajorites in congress?
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Doctor_J Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-25-06 08:25 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. For the same reason they can confirm a lying, incompetent partisan
to the high court. There's no one to do anything to stop them.
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guidod Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-26-06 12:16 AM
Response to Reply #2
8. Quit being such a
fatalist. Everybody on DU is acting like our lives are over for good. WE'RE ALL DOOOOOMED!!
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Innocent Smith Donating Member (466 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-25-06 08:25 PM
Response to Original message
3. no filibuster from Salazar
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GOPNotForMe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-25-06 08:27 PM
Response to Original message
4. Dems are a MINORITY PARTY.
And Alito's confirmation is a signal that this is what the REPUBLICAN MAJORITY that you (Americans) voted into office is going to give you until you wake up and make some changes.
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Geoff R. Casavant Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-25-06 11:36 PM
Response to Reply #4
6. I've thought that myself
It's a pretty dangerous game to play, but suppose the Dems aren't filibustering so Alito will ultimately be confirmed, just in time to hear the abortion cases on the court docket, with rulings released end of June. Then, if Roe is overturned or seriously curtailed, the Repubs are screwed, and can't share blame with the Dems. Then, so the plan goes, Dems are elected in droves so we can get a Federal law saying there are no restrictions on abortion.

Could the Dems be this far-forward-looking?
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incapsulated Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-26-06 01:36 AM
Response to Reply #6
11. Maaaybe but I think it's more simple
The Dems don't want to risk looking like "obstructionists" in an election year. They figure they won't get anything for it but grief and that they have the "people" on their side now and don't want to blow it. They will campaign on Alito, which is why they voted nay, and <insert anything from Georgie's very bad horrible year>.
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bowens43 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-25-06 08:38 PM
Response to Original message
5. ridiculous.
The Alito appointment won't help the republicans in the midterms.

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Writer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-26-06 12:07 AM
Response to Original message
7. This is a slippery slope and very presumptive. n/t
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tinfoilinfor2005 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-26-06 12:20 AM
Response to Original message
9. bush will have a great celebration
and thank the Senate for their unity and wisdom, despite the fact that most of the dems will vote no. Then a year from now when the country starts to realize that their civil liberties have been sold down the river and a great scream goes up around the land, bush will be able to say, "But the Senate confirmed him. They had the same information I had."
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McCamy Taylor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-26-06 01:04 AM
Response to Original message
10. Strict party fillibuster+nuclear option+Scalito confirm+overturn Roe
equals BIG political trouble down the road for the GOP. It is their worst nightmare. The Dems will be able to say "See, the GOP broke the rules to put a reactionary judge on the SCOTUS who has unAmerican views (Roe v. Wade is popular with Americans), so now America better vote in lots of Democrats to fix the problem."

This scenerio is worse for the GOP than a sucessful Dem fillibuster( which only means that W. will select some other Scalito).
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Vektor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-26-06 02:56 AM
Response to Original message
12. Diebold = GOP sweep in the midterms...
The voters have very little to do with the outcome.
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Lexingtonian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-26-06 03:30 AM
Response to Original message
13. No.
Edited on Thu Jan-26-06 03:44 AM by Lexingtonian
Contrary to what you claim, this is IMHO representative democracy in action.

Putting Alito on the SC is the last major entitlement/charge Republicans got out of last year's federal elections. It's that simple. The elections were close to a stalemate- meaning: keep on going as before- but Republicans got some smallish gains in margins.

House margin change 11/04: +4 or +5 Republican (+1%). That micro-mandate/gain got expended on the Bankrupcy bill. It hasn't been there for getting more tax cuts through.

Presidency: Team Bush won swing voter support on 'values' and 'handling terrorism', was opposed by them on 'handling the economy' (+2.x% Republican over 2000). Consequently enough, the Bushies ran into a brick wall on Social Security 'reform'. Bush has expended the small entitlement/charge on 'handling terrorism' on shielding his own ass in the NSA FISA violation business. And he has expended a bunch of the mandate on 'values' on the three crappy appeals judge confirmations (the 'nuclear option' thing) and a little on getting Roberts through. The rest going into getting Alito through- but as the Miers thing showed, he doesn't have enough, or enough left, to get people on the SC on his own power anymore (if ever).

Senate margin change 11/04: +4 Republican (+4%). That's probably the largest chunk of Republican mandate yielded up by the '04 elections, and since it's not on economic policy or 'handling terrorism' or Iraq policy or ethics, it's in 'values'- social policy. And if you look at what the voters who got that 4 seat margin change wanted, it's principally about diminishing or ending legality of abortion and (lesser, and more nebulously) obstruction of gay marriage legalization. Serious changes in federal rights of gay people are not actually on the table, neither passage of the FMA nor a repeal of DOMA are realistic possibilities this session of Congress, so we can ignore that aspect for now. Ergo, the thing the 4 seat change in the Senate is about here and now is narrowing of abortion rights. An abortion banning amendment to the federal Constitution is unrealistic and unratifiable, so changing the margin in the Supreme Court on abortion rights is logically where the shift in power of the Senate is to be exerted.

IMHO the hard political question here is the exchange rate- how many changed votes on the Supreme Court on Roe are the 4 gained Senate seats constituting the political currency properly worth. I think, looking back over the Eighties and Nineties, the answer is very much closer to one than to two. And a one vote change of margin of the sort means a 5-4 upholding of Roe in practice, which is actually an remarkably accurate representation of where the country really is (56% broadly pro-choice, 35% anti-choice, 9% inclined to very highly restrict choice).

I can't talk you out of your hysteria about totalitarianism via words online, if at all. But even though Alito is a classical Right wing type, the spin the Administration is putting on Bush's Article II powers is beyond preposterous as a matter of jurisprudence. It's been tried before, and the 9-0 verdict in the lawsuit about Nixon's tapes is conclusive. This is a Court that is still on probation with The People from its bungled verdict in Bush v Gore- it really can't afford a second failure/violation of that order of political magnitude.

The real buttress to Bush's silly claims are the shills who play off the presently 49% of the electorate who see him as juxtaposed between The World Out There, which they fear for stupidity-based reasons, and their foolish little fragile domestic interests. Bloody attacks by Al Qaeda in Western countries tend to decrease that proportion of the electorate in pretty big chunks.

Don't be one of the Believers in Republican faux omnipotence. As for the failures of Democrats, I prefer a long term record of small successes and marginal significant failures and continuing war of attrition to short periods of total domination and destruction by one side and then the other. Social evolution is horrid to watch, the obsolete are eliminated rather thoroughly in due course- often after a period in which they become dominant. The realities to which they are inadequate remain unimpressed and crush them.

Take six months off. See what you think then.
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cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-26-06 05:48 AM
Response to Reply #13
14. Bingo.
Thank you. This is the best post I've read on DU in a dog's age. I wish you'd give it its own thread.
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Cessna Invesco Palin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-26-06 07:08 AM
Response to Reply #13
15. Who are you?
And what are you doing on DU?

:)
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Doctor_J Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-26-06 11:13 AM
Response to Reply #13
16. The Supreme Court doesn't GO on probation
when Scalito takes his seat on the court, he will be there for LIFE - more than 30 years, in all likelyhood. If there were a probatioary perios, Roberts wouldn't have been swept in as CJ. Given the other fascists on the SCOTUS, the ultra-right will the absolute final say over the interpretation of the Constitution for the next generation at least. And you are talking about four extreme partisan wingers (Scalia, Roberts, Thomas, Alito) vs. five responsible jurists. Please don't tell me that these will somehow balance out, or that there will be any recourse if they vote en bloc for every loony suit that James Dobson's group brings them.

Let's also remember that we (Dems) had more votes in the last three election cycles, and yet every Admin crime goes unpunished, every wacky proposal gets passed, every question goes unanswered. Your hypothesis that * has somehow used up his political capital seems logical, but I see no evidence that it's true. At 36% approval, we should be clubbing his every stupid idea into the ground with a sneer - ignoring him at times, openly laughing at him other times, and calling him an out-of-touch elitist at others. Instead, our Dem reps just roll over and go along with every step toward our march toward a monarchy. In fairness, with every media outlet campaigning for *, there isn't too much they can do, but it would be nice to at least get on the same page and start fighting back with some harsh words.

As for your comparison to Nixon, the principals are similar (though * is far more evil and dangerous than Nixon was), the situation has changed drastically. With the current SCOTUS and media, Nixon would've gotten away with his crimes, just as it seems * will.

In six months the results of this November's elections will be pretty much locked in. I don't think we want to wait that long.
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Lexingtonian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-26-06 06:21 PM
Response to Reply #16
17. I'll go with the glass being half full.
Given the other fascists on the SCOTUS, the ultra-right will the absolute final say over the interpretation of the Constitution for the next generation at least. And you are talking about four extreme partisan wingers (Scalia, Roberts, Thomas, Alito) vs. five responsible jurists. Please don't tell me that these will somehow balance out, or that there will be any recourse if they vote en bloc for every loony suit that James Dobson's group brings them.

Like I said, I don't believe Roberts is an ideologue. I don't believe he's minion of the Right either, strictly speaking. What he is, and I took two months of the summer to establish it to my satisfaction, is a clever man who is part of the Washington establishment. For the time being he votes the Scalia/Thomas/Rehnquist line to pay off his debt to Right for putting him in, which is to say that I believe he's fine with being the fourth vote on the losing side in cases where he personally thinks the liberal foursome and Tony Kennedy have it right and five votes. When the national winds shift liberal/Democratic and his debt feels paid, I think we'll see him be the essentially pragmatic/practical moderate.

Let's also remember that we (Dems) had more votes in the last three election cycles,

None of these elections achieved a proper national majority. And let's not ignore that 1-2 million Gore voters, and maybe as many as 5 million, withdrew their support from him right the day after Election Day- and essentially none of Bush's voters left him during late 2000.

and yet every Admin crime goes unpunished, every wacky proposal gets passed, every question goes unanswered.

You might want to consider that, as a historical pattern, The People ignores fairly major ethical and law violations until the officials have fulfilled the agenda The People has put them in power for. That agenda is generally not identical to what the officials and their Parties selfimportantly imagine and pledge themselves to, but there's enough overlap that The People tolerates their continuing in power. When the limits are reached, when the officials or Party refuse or are unable to do what The People demands next, that's when incumbents are toppled on the slightest of ethics violations.

Politicians exploit The People greatly. The People is an insensitive beast that is ruthless about using up politicians to do what it considers important and necessary.

Activists are only a subset of The People. I'm as offended by the present state of affairs as you are, but I accept the sovereignty of The People at large and that the elected leaders are accountable to it rather than me personally or any particular subgroup.

Your hypothesis that * has somehow used up his political capital seems logical, but I see no evidence that it's true. At 36% approval,

You don't see a contradiction here?

'Political capital' you could think of as a kind of respectability or toleration for misdeeds earned by previous achievement or inherent worth.
'Approval' you could think of as agreement level at the moment.

Sensible people keep the two things distinct in their minds about their friends and enemies. I don't know why you convolute them as you do.

we should be clubbing his every stupid idea into the ground with a sneer - ignoring him at times, openly laughing at him other times, and calling him an out-of-touch elitist at others.

What do you think Republicans view Democrats and 'the liberal media' as doing every day? Have a look at Democrats and the media from their point of view for a change (absurd as that may be).

Instead, our Dem reps just roll over and go along with every step toward our march toward a monarchy. In fairness, with every media outlet campaigning for *, there isn't too much they can do, but it would be nice to at least get on the same page and start fighting back with some harsh words.

You might consider that only Republican leaders can destroy the credibility of Republican policies with their voters, and that Democrats offering themselves up as foils for attack in essence simply prolong the time it takes for Republican decline.

As for your comparison to Nixon, the principals are similar (though * is far more evil and dangerous than Nixon was), the situation has changed drastically. With the current SCOTUS and media, Nixon would've gotten away with his crimes, just as it seems * will.

Like I said, I can't treat paranoia from afar. Yes, Bush is a second coming of the Nixon crowd and all Right wing detritus of that era. But the reality is that the Bush people are killing far fewer people than the Nixon people did, are afraid of violating laws like FISA, their Big War is with 200 middle class Arab men hiding out all over the Middle East and a few thousand militants who use homemade bombs rather than dictator-run empires with hundreds of millions of people and thousands of nuclear weapons and millions of soldiers. The Nixon crowd essentially wanted to achieve material domination of the world. The Bush crowd essentially wants to steal massive amounts of wealth and achieve total psychological control of their own country. I'd say the Bush people are far less dangerous to life and limb than Nixon people. But the Bush people are the more historically out of step of the two, champions of an ideal of society and the world in a time in which that vision is definitely obsolete, and for that reason they far more vehemently rejected, unbearable, on a psychological level.

In six months the results of this November's elections will be pretty much locked in. I don't think we want to wait that long.

I'm evidently betting on things tipping in the utterly opposite direction you are. I see the ice getting very thin under Republican majorities and upper tier Republicans viewing their situation likewise.

I read this forum and think of the demoralization and sense of failure of a lot of the common soldiers of the Union Army besieging Petersburg in the late winter and early spring of 1865. After four years of frustration they came up with a belief system that Bobby Lee was undefeatable, etc. The Union generals thought otherwise but couldn't talk the pessimism and fatalism out of the lot. Even the great, decisive, victories took a long time to sink in for them. There's a famous letter from early April 1865 from an infantry soldier right after the Union crashed through the Petersburg defenses and was pursuing Lee's fleeing and collapsing army, two or three days before Lee surrendered at Appomattox. The soldier writes something like "Even the croakers now admit that Lee was beaten at Petersburg and the war might end in Union victory after all." This on April 6 or April 7 of 1865.

That's how I feel about all these Gloom & Doom, Inevitable Disaster posts. The weaknesses of the losing side mattered, the weaknesses of the winning side didn't matter in retrospect at Petersburg and Appomattox. Indeed, too many Confederate soldiers clung to trust in victory in the long run there, far beyond what reality warranted, and too many Union soldiers were emotionally attached to prospects of defeat at the time. Reality was the arbiter, ultimately, and Morale was not. The croakers made for problems, not for solutions.


 
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