Anybody Have Feel of What the Hamas Win Will Mean?

[leftyladyfrommo]

Does this really bode bad things to come?

Like there isn't enough trouble in Palestine as it is.

But it was an election and Hamas won. And we should deal with them. We probably are going to have to listen to what they have to say.

[atreides1]

1. Wait and See

They were always screaming about being in charge, let's see how they handle it.

If they stay the course, then the Palestinian people are in for even a rougher ride then they've been on.

[Nimrod2005]

2. Yes, see my post here....

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x2393086

[ixion]

3. good post

albeit tragic. :-(

[enough already]

4. Be careful what you wish for.

We won't deal with them under the current circumstances, and reality is that Israel can wipe them out in 15 minutes. If they don't change, they are literally finished.

[SteppingRazor]

6. Hamas has been around for at least 20 years now...

I don't think they can be wiped out so easily. It's like our own folly in Iraq -- every "terrorist" killed is a "martyr" on the other side, which results in another dozen terrorist/martyrs signing up for the cause.

[enough already]

10. Actually, it is much easier now

They aren't a few guys hiding in the shadows any longer. They have been given political legitimacy by thousands. All Palestinians are now going to be legitimate targets in the minds of some.

[SteppingRazor]

5. A Hamas win is much different than, say, a Sinn Fein win in Ireland...

Hamas continues to take credit for suicide bombings, whereas the only other comparison I can think of where a terrorist group became a political party -- in Ireland -- the IRA got involved in politics because it had become convinced that it couldn't succeed through violence. Hamas, on the other hand, still advocates violence, and still believes -- even officially -- in the destruction of Israel. There's really nothing else to say. When people draw such a hard line in the sand, there is no negotiating. Unless more-moderate elements of Fatah can influence the Hamas leadership, peaceful negotiations between Israel and Palestine are doomed for the time being, until the Palestinians elect a reasonable, sane government. You can't negotiate with psychotics.

The real shame of it all is that even a warmonger like Sharon had really begun to think along more-peaceful lines. His leaving Likud to form his own party, even more than his pullout from Gaza, was evidence of that. So, on the Israeli side, up until Sharon's stroke, it seemed like peace was at hand.

Now, with Sharon gone, Hamas in power and Netanyahu likely to take over in Israel, both sides are in for a long, bloody conflict.

[Stockholm]

7. I reject the premise

that everyone in Hamas is a psychotic. Further, I don´t believe Hamas in Gaza, is the same thing as Hamas in the West Bank, or in Damascus. An analogy to IRA could work but your example is a bit flawed since it assumes that everyone in the IRA had lost faith in armed conflict.

There will probably be a power struggle within the organisation which might lead to violence (I hope not). As to claiming that Sharon was thinking along more peaceful lines is perhaps a bit far fetched. The wall looks an awful lot like a new border to me.

We will probably see a lot of "doom and gloom" articles in the next couple of weeks but maybe this is one of those occasion when "wait and see what happens" is the prudent thing to do.

One thing I am certain about is that the absolute majority of the "doom and gloom" reports will originate from the other side claiming all sorts of crazy things.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=102&topic_id=2066276&mesg_id=2066403

[SteppingRazor]

8. Right. Because people who blow themselves up are perfectly sane...

However, I do agree that, certainly, Hamas are not all psychotics. I tend to exaggerate for effect. If you want serious debate on this -- well, first off, you're talking to the wrong person -- but second, the fact remains that Hamas, as an official plank of its party, calls for the destruction of Israel. One cannot negotiate with someone who wants your complete destruction it makes no sense.

And the idea that Hamas in Gaza is somehow entirely different than Hamas everywhere else in the world seems to me to be a fallacy as well, particularly in light of the fact that Hamas' leader in Gaza, Mahmoud Zahar, has a well-documented history of calling for increased attacks on Israel. Granted, Dr. Zahar is not as violence-obsessed as Ismail (sp?) Hanya, the other major Hamas figure in Gaza, but he's hardly a dove.

And you didn't address at all the prospect that Israel maky take a more-hardline stance in the future, particularly if Netanyahu comes to power -- that guy's just as crazed as any Hamas leader.

I think, for a while, Hamas may try to look after Gaza internal policy. But given the leadership now in Gaza, and the likely future leadership in Israel, how soon until someone decides to blow someone else up? Call it gloom and doom if you want. I call it reality with, admittedly, a healthy dose of cynicism.

[mrgorth]

9. Please see my LTTE post

esp. regarding parallels between Hamas and the IRA.

[murdoch]

11. Israel used to support Hamas

Israel used to send a lot of money to Hamas because they felt it would undermine Arafat. Whenever I see an Israeli on television complaining about Hamas, this is the first thing I think of. Of course, it is rarely mentioned on TV, I wonder how many people know this?

"Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap." -- Galatians 6: 7