I just saw Syriana. Wow. So, this is what really runs the world.

[jazzjunkysue]

George really did himself proud. He can play it straight when he wants to. He didn't act the sex symbol at all.

I thought he made the suicide bomber (Another character)sympathetic. Just so I don't get any hate mail: He targeted the bad guys, not innocents on a bus.

I thought it was interesting that all the major players were being held on a razor's edge by their larger group, whether it was the bomber, the 2 princes, the oil execs or our government men, both of them. It was impossible to say whether our american oilmen were more trecherous than our govt men: One, from justice and one a CIA lifer (Clooney's character).

True to reality, there was no clear good guy or bad guy.

Most of the people leaving the theater had no idea what it was about.

[Obamarama]

1. Pretty chilling, ain't it?

Very heavy, very complex...had me thinking every second I was in the theater. I went back and saw it a second time just to make sure I didn't miss something the first time around.

And I agree with you...most of my fellow theater-goers also had no clue as to what they had just seen.

[JDPriestly]

2. Has anyone read the book?

Is it good? How does it compare to the movie?

[DoYouEverWonder]

19. I saw the fellow who wrote it on Charlie Rose one night

I don't recall his name, but if you want to have nightmares, listen to that interview. This fellow has been inside of this world for years.

[MountainLaurel]

21. A good corollary read

Is William Engdahl's "A Century of War," which lays out the history of U.S.-British involvement in the Middle East in economic and political terms that make it simple for the lay-person to comprehend. It might put Baer's book into the larger geopolitical context.

[Me.]

3. "Laws Made As The Words Are Spoken"

'Corruption is necessary"

[freethought]

4. I saw Syriana twice, once by myself, and again with my

older sister. She worked for an energy market consulting firm for nearly two years. She saw and learned ALOT! Not the kind stuff they teach you in college.

She filled in the gaps. Her review of Syriana was that "Syriana" was, for all intensive purposes, pretty accurate in portraying geopolitical games over petroleum.
Oil Industry PACs
Intelligence
Corruption
Terrorism
Economics, rather the lack thereof.

And a few lighter notes on the movie.

I hope this does something for Alexander Siddig, I would have like to have seen more of his charecter.

Once again, Matt Damon proves he is a better actor, chooses better roles
than his buddy Ben Afflek.

I am going to give a thumbs up to Jeffry Wright. It seems he can do roles that are total polar opposites. I saw him as a drug dealer in "Shaft" and then to the 'buttoned up' lawyer in this movie.

[CoffeeCat]

5. I just returned from Syriana as well...

I am blown away by the complexities and the depth of the story.

I was most struck by the way our relationship with the Middle East was laid out. We ARE robbing them blind. The United States is buying their oil and greedy, undemocratic Mid East leaders fitter away the money on themselves--and their countries are discombobulated, poor and they don't thrive. It appears that this is the way we want it. We want that part of the world discombobulated and with greedy, self-serving leaders. Otherwise, those countries are enriched, stand up for themselves and then America's access to oil dries up. How long until the Mid East leaders figure out that we are playing them and that we are destroying their part of the world to make them weak and to serve our own interests?

Also, the young man who eventually becomes a suicide bomber...I thought his journey was told so subtly and with such truth. Most suicide bombers aren't hate-filled psychotics. They are people who have lost hope and faith--due to repercussions from political and socioeconomic conditions that are created by the US and other countries. This young man simply lost his way. He lost his job. He was dealt a few blows and he was looking for an escape.

I also was fascinated by the prayers and the words of the religious leaders who inspired young Muslims. I hadn't ever organized all of this in my head, but the movie helped me to see that most Muslims--and the Muslims who will grow up to be suicide bombers--are an undercurrent running below the political and economic games played by the big boys. As one prayer leader said...this isn't about economics or oil, it's about the failures of the West and of Christianity and in the Wests' war on the Muslim religion (paraphrasing). Many Muslims believe this is about the US wiping out their religion. So, while the oil boys and the CIA and the corrupt politicians play their games, there is an unintended undercurrent of unrest and fear. They're creating a tidal wave that will wipe out many innocent people. That's exactly what's happening in Iraq.

What a mess.

[freethought]

6. One thing I keep having to tell people again and again is

when it comes to what they hear about terrorism, things are not always what they think.
One point in particular, If you ask anyone "How well educated was Mohammed Atta, the so-called "ring leader" of 9/11. Vast majority will say "I dunno." or "He probably never got passed the madrassa."
At this point I am usually pulling my hair out. "Look! This guy had a Master's degree from a very prestigous school in Europe!" At this point they try to call you cook or use the standard "You hate America!"

At times one tends to think that the Middle East does not need our presence. They need our absence.

[DeepModem Mom]

16. Very good post, TwoSparkles. nt

[jazzjunkysue]

26. How long until the Mid East leaders figure out that we are playing them

Too late.

They're usually called insurgents on US TV.

You obviously got the point. I wish more americans did.

Also, I personally don't believe that the impoverishment of the third world is unintentional. It's the purpose of PNAC: Redistribute wealth to those who can play along, like, say, millions of oil dependent americans.

We have to get other sources of energy. And we can't do that until we stop the election rigging.

[catchnrelease]

7. Saw it on Thursday

Wow, with four stories running it was really a trick to keep it all straight. I was trying to keep track of everything and think in some parts I missed the forest for the trees. The friend I saw it with and I were still discussing it today. Definitely something Americans should see, but I agree most will have no idea what it's all about.

Spoilers ahead for anyone who hasn't seen it and will............

One thing I'm not clear on, when the Massawi character was torturing Bob, we couldn't hear very well what he said....Did he ask "Who else have you paid?" Meaning paid to kill Prince Nasir?

Wow, could discuss it for awhile. Absolutely plan to see it again and see what I might have missed. And also agree, most of the characters were complex, not just one dimensional. (Well, it was tough to work up any sympathy for the oil men, IMO)

Would also be interested in hearing how the book is, if anyone here has read it.

[tservo]

9. Why did Clooney's character

not stop Prince Nasir's car from being hit? He was flagging the caravan down but Bob didn't warn him.

[DeepModem Mom]

17. My husband thought there was ambiguity here, too --

which I never even thought of. I thought Bob's whole trip, his getting his passport back, was to warn the Prince.

[catchnrelease]

24. Wasn't he trying to?

I thought that's what he was doing, but just ran out of time before the missle hit them. And, since Bob is now dead, will Christopher Plummers character (Whiting ?) be killed as Bob warned him would happen should he or his family be harmed?

Fasinating and scary at the same time.

[HardWorkingDem]

8. If you get the chance watch Charlie Rose interview....

with the writer/director. It was fascinating.

I haven't seen the movie and will wait till it gets on DVD, but this interview was very interesting.

[killbotfactory]

20. I second watching the Charlie Rose interview

Some of the stuff he was exposed to while researching the movie was too far out for the script.

You can download it here:
http://www.chomskytorrents.org/TorrentDetails.php?TorrentID=667

[DeepModem Mom]

10. I also saw it last night, and came away with a sick feeling...

in the pit of my stomach. I saw it at a huge multiplex, and I was wondering if many in the theater thought it was totally fiction, similar to other thrillers they'd seen on the same screen.

I'm still thinking about it, and don't have anything of value to share. I'd really appreciate more discussion of this movie here, and hope others who've seen it will post their thoughts.

[leftchick]

12. I had the exact same thought

I wondered how many people in the theater thought it was fiction. Sadly I am afraid way too many.

[jazzjunkysue]

27. It said in the NYT today that Spielburg was going to promote it as a

thriller, just to sort of trick people into the theater, and that it would have given them a better chance for an oscar.

But I doubt if that was Spielburg's purpose: He doesn't need the accolades. I think he really wants to elevate the dialogue to the point, away from gay marriage and terrorism.

If it does help people consider the palestinian point of view, and the futility of war, then it was worth every penny and confused patron.

[CatholicEdHead]

11. I have yet to see it, I may wait for the DVD in early summer

[DeepModem Mom]

13. Go see it, Ed -- we want to know what you think!

Also, there are a lot of desert scenes that are worth seeing on the big screen.

[DeepModem Mom]

14. I'm nominating this thread. I'd like to encourage others to see this...

and to keep the discussion going.

On edit: Thanks, jjs, for posting!

[jazzjunkysue]

28. Thanks for contributing.

[UTUSN]

15. "all dressed in white sheets that say, 'It's hot and I don't have to work"

said as we see young rich sheiks in their white gowns and headdresses, wandering through a mall or a lobby. Speaks to the rotting class system, where the young people are too proud to take productive employment.

Favorities scenes: The chilling "cat's paw" scene where (Christopher PLUMMER?) sinks a verbal dagger into the wannabe emir. And the falconer scene, where the Matt DAMON character literally draws the big picture in the sand.

Betcha Bill O'LOOFAH would LOVE to torture George CLOONEY.

[DeepModem Mom]

18. Very powerful scenes, and also key to the film's message.

Similarly revealing -- the scene where Prince Nasir takes Matt Damon into a room alone, and spells out the situation for him, and scenes involving CIA officials.

And any scene Chris Cooper appeared in as the Texas oilman -- he is a great actor.

[CoffeeCat]

32. Another scene involving Matt Damon that chilled me...

...was when Damon was drawing his diagrams in the sand while talking with the Prince.

Damon demonstrated how the Middle East could flourish, by piping the oil to European
countries--and then investing the profits in the country's infrastructure and people.

Instead, the leaders of these Middle East countries sell the oil to America, and spend
the money on themselves. America pays for access and a few gluttonous Mid East leaders
reap all of the benefits.

I felt so awful for the Middle East. What a sick cycle. Greedy Americans who want access
to oil and elitist Middle East princes who stockpile the money for themselves, while their
citizens live in huts in the sand. It takes only a handful of corrupt thugs to perpetuate this
unfortunate, sad cycle.

[DeepModem Mom]

33. Yes. I think I knew, or suspected, a lot of what I saw in the film...

but it kind of put it all together for me.

[CoffeeCat]

35. That's totally it, DeepModemMom...

Before Syriana, I didn't have any in-depth knowledge about the oil industry or how
Middle-East leaders did business with America.

I only had little bits. I knew that we are tight with the Saudi royals. I knew that Bush Sr
and his ilk are always working the Saudi royals. I knew about corruption in general. I knew
the oil companies are full of corrupt SOBs. I also knew just a tad about Middle East religion
and how our policies, politics and money affect that region.

However, I never put all of the pieces together.

It's so awful to know all of this, and to have the pieces together.

It's an emotional burden to understand these realities, isn't it?

[DeepModem Mom]

36. As in my first post in this thread, I left with a sick feelng. nt

[Pithy Cherub]

23. The "corruption speech" was breathtaking

because at first it seems over the top and then the realization that it may have been way underplayed.

[MamaBear]

31. Coruption Keeps Us Save and Warm

The powers that be made the little weasle pay for that one, made him the patsy who would be indicted.

I also found fascinating the scene in the Mosque where the young man is being introduced to radical Islam. There was much in that sermon that I have heard very similar claims made by various religious people and self-help gurus. The message is simple, the delivery hypnotic. That was a wonderful performance, the one by the young imam.

The line between fundamentalism and fanaticism can be a thin one in hard times.

[jazzjunkysue]

29. Does Bill have a long enough attention span? No way. He'll never

see it. No sex, no abused women. No fun.

[killbotfactory]

22. kick

:kick:

[Bushwick Bill]

25. Check out this interview with Stephen Gaghan.

It’s astonishing how good war is for oil companies and oil traders. Anyone in the energy business (will tell you): Chaos is good for the energy business. And that’s the first thing they’ll tell you. They don’t feel good about it; but it’s true. I think we will hit a tipping point ... but I also think we’re so industrious, so creative … that there really will be a Manhattan Project-style ... I mean, we’re very close to having the writing on the wall for global warming, I believe; we’ve passed a tipping point and shit is going to start going haywire, and I think we’ll start talking in terms of carbon wedges and changing our lifestyles is going to happen very quickly. I don’t know if it’s going to be five years, 10 years 15 years … It’s definitely in our lifetime; our children are going to have very different lives. The carbon economy is going to shift; I don’t know if it’s a hydrogen economy, a sunlight economy; you’re not going to be flying around on jet planes the way you are now, probably; there are going to be changes. ... I don’t know; I’m not a futurist. But I did enough research into human nature, figuring out this one, that I’m absolutely certain that until it’s really dire, nothing’s going to change.

(The energy crisis of the '70s comes up; specifically, how we didn't seem to learn anything from that.)

It’s the same fuckers, man! It’s all the same Nixon guys; they got tossed out of office for a while with Carter. They came back with Reagan; they had a bad couple years under Poppy (George H. W. Bush), who wasn’t really hip to these guys, and then Clinton … and they’re all back! Just look at them! They’re all like a hundred and ten years old, they cut their teeth under the first Nixon administration ... they hang upside down like vampire bats when they’re out of power and they wait around. It’s the same guys: ‘Hey, don’t conserve energy! There’s no problem! Party on!’
http://www.cinematical.com/2005/12/02/interview-stephen-gaghan-director-and-writer-of-syriana/

Great movie, but it definitely needs a couple of viewings. I didn't understand the whole exchange between Clooney and Plummer. How did they know each other in the past? Also, why was that pool wired/booby trapped?

[jazzjunkysue]

30. Incredible. Really frightening. Let's hope amurikka starts building

railroads all across amurikka, or else we won't get to leave home for college. We need mass transit that can be powered w/o oil, and we need it fast.

I hope my house isn't along a major corridor.....

[Doctor_J]

34. Between that and F/911, and House of Bush House of Saud

you need to be pretty tough not to be thoroughly depressed about the path we're on.