Reforming the Democrats -- Or a Third Party?

[im10ashus]

Reforming the Democrats -- Or a Third Party?
By Bernard Weiner, Co-Editor
The Crisis Papers
January 31, 2006


The Democratic Party, with its current cast of characters in charge, has refused time after time to stand up and fight for its underlying principles. Its recent incoherent or wimpy positions on the Iraq War, electoral fraud and the Alito nomination make clear that it's stuck in a self-destructive rut and isn't terribly eager (or can't figure out how) to climb out of it.

As I see it, we have two options in dealing with this deficient, bumbling, weak-kneed crew. 1) We get rid of them, work to take over the party from the grassroots up (similar to what the Republicans did after the Goldwater debacle of '64), and eventually bring some coherence and dynamic initiatives back into the party. Or, 2) We give up on the Democrats as an embarrassing joke, and begin thinking seriously about joining with others, similarly disenchanted with the political choices offered, and found a viable third party.

There is another option: doing nothing, just continuing on as a rag-tag, undisciplined, weak OINO -- that's "Opposition In Name Only." But I think we all know that simply makes no sense. Being rolled regularly by the Republicans, or refusing to fight them in ways other than symbolic, gets old real fast.


OPTION#1: REFORMING FROM WITHIN

The first option, in a sense, is already happening. Folks like Paul Hackett in Ohio and Bernie Saunders in Vermont, both running for Senate, Diane Lawrence in a Florida Congressional district -- plus Cindy Sheehan thinking about a Senate race in California -- are willing to put themselves out there. Good people, good Democrats, willing to step out and step up in an effort to try to change the face of party, and American, politics.

cont'd...

http://www.crisispapers.org/essays6w/third-party.htm

[samhsarah]

1. Our own NDP?

I love it!!!!!! K&R

[apple_ridge]

2. A new party is the answer.

After this latest capitulation, they have shown themselves to be lacking in the type of leadership that these times demand.

They won't stand up for us, so let's find people who will.

[im10ashus]

3. A new party or reform.

This is a fascinating article full of several viable options. I think we should discuss reform before we bail. IMHO.

[katsy]

4. I've spent 7 days slamming the dems...

7 days practicing calling myself an independant, socialist, green. I stated here that I'm leaving.

Then I found 25 Dems that at least stood up for what Democrats represent.

That's half a party intact as far as I'm concerned. We can build from scratch or ride 25 good people while adding other good people like Paul Hackett. I don't know but maybe we should build on the positives while cleaning house at the grassroots level.

One thing I want to see in my lifetime is the Dems bringing in the Greens and labor back to the fold. We can't beat the corrupt money machine being divided.

Some new event will make me shoot my loud mouth off about leaving the party... of that there is no doubt. At least I can express it here and then get on with business.

[mdmc]

12. both options take effort, energy, so God bless both camps!

I would like to see a merge of the left into the Dem party as well. I am working toward that end.

[katsy]

18. That is a cause we should all work for.

[Name removed]

44. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[savemefromdumbya]

5. Unless you have PR then a third party would not run well

The Dems should be run like a tight ship, it needs to communicate at a grass roots level with the electorate, that means more work door to door, delivering literature, working all year round not just at election time. Some Dems start creeping out a couple of weeks before the election?

It needs progressive policy coupled with strong fiscal policy, it needs to rid its image of being some muddle in the middle with its members of congress all over the place!

For a third party to succeed you need proportional represntation. The Repubs will have no opposition if it is split all ways (spoiling candidates etc.).

Dems need to be more fanatical and committed. You should see the Repubs around here - writing into the local papers every week, knocking on doors, stealing posters during the election. I think Howard Dean needs more support.

[samhsarah]

7. It's not all about third party, much more about reforming the current

Democratic Party.

[savemefromdumbya]

14. it has be done from within

We did this in the UK Labour Party in the 1980s some split off to form the SDP (a more center social democratic party) but it couldn't survive and linked up with the Liberals (what is now the Liberal Democrats). The new Labour Party is now like the SDP because it did it from within not from the SDP. (not that I like the way Labour is going).

[Adelante]

36. I'm for reforming AFTER 2006 and 2008

When we have some power to effect reform.

I am in no case, not even when it's Joe, in favor of candidates running against seated Democrats, until we take the Congress and the White House. Anybody who runs against a Democrat at this stage of the game, when they can be fighting Republicans, when the Repugs are on the way down, is on my personal shit list. I am very definitely in favor of reform the way Howard Dean is undertaking it in the DNC's 50-state policy. That's about winning elections. Winning elections is what we have to be doing for the next three years, not indulging our own agendas. Save it for when it can matter.

My two cents.

[samhsarah]

6. Why is nobody RECOMMENDING THIS THREAD????

These are some of the best ideas I have seen yet.

[Just Me]

46. Because the approach dooms all of us.

Use your head. If we FAIL to unite against the RWers, WE ALL LOSE. That's reality. Face it.

We can do all kinds of stuff once we bury the RW. We are NO WHERE NEAR that point. To the contrary, RW-freakin' talking points and myths are STILL being posted here on DU,...and some fall for that shit every damn time.

Our focus is to unseat the dictators, FIRST.

Don't you agree? If not, explain why.

[Javaman]

8. Call the new party...

The New Democratic Party or The Progressive Party.

If we don't win back something in november, we better be makeing plans now, because the Democratic party as we know it will effectively be dead.

[samhsarah]

13. It already is. I say we start now.

Maybe we can get rid of some of these traitors in November.

[FSogol]

9. Reform. If you start a 3rd party, you are fighting 2 parties.

If the Democratic party is reformed to function as it did in the past, then you only have to fight the repubs.

Dean has begun reforms. They will not happen overnight. Like a damaged finger nail the party needs to regrow from the bottom up. Eventually the entire nail will be whole again.

[savemefromdumbya]

16. yes but

we have a problem with our members of Congress so in time the 'dead wood' will have to go. Starting with Nelson!

[spindrifter]

10. A new party--

but it takes time to build the credibility it would need. After yesterday and other days when we have been betrayed by weak-kneed electeds I just don't see how the trust factor is going to return. We could defeat a lot of them, but not all at once in the clean sweep it would take to get this place back on the road to recovery.

In the meantime, vocal dissent is the byword.

[meganmonkey]

11. I say we need a 3rd, 4th, 5th, and 6th party

We need coalitions and proportional representation. We need corporations out of our elections. And it is gonna take a long time and a lot of risky voting to get there.

[savemefromdumbya]

17. I think PR and coalitions are a good thing

it take sthe sting out of something awful such as the right-wing Nazi style party we have in control of the 3 branches of government here.

[Matariki]

15. A good 3/4 of our Democratic Senators

voted FOR the filibuster yesterday. Why? In part because they were reponding to our calls, faxes and emails. I think this is A VERY GOOD START for reform within the party. To abandon those Senators now would be lame.

We need to work diligently not only on our representatives but also work to change the general apathy to politics that so much of the public has. I for one am surrounded by intellegent, educated people who couldn't care less about politics. They seem to think politics has no bearing on thier lives. We need to change these people as much as our reps.

[savemefromdumbya]

20. I don't think they know which way to go?

I agree, many of them did take note but not enough. There is a general apathy because nothing has been sparking it? Kerry did a good job and Reid took issue with the GOP a few months back. Nobody should abandon Senators, only keep them on their toes and perhaps we can clear out the dead wood.

[Greyhound]

32. Quick math tip; 25 out of 44 is not equal to 3/4 or 75% it is ~57%

and that is the best we could do on the most important stand in any of their careers. There comes a time when you just have to tear the house down and rebuild from the foundations up.

[Matariki]

38. you're correct about the math. however -

my point is that abandoning the whole democratic party over this is to ignore the fact that the MAJORITY of senators responded to our call for a filibuster. you want to 'tear' THEM down as well? we have 19 weasels to replace. i'm planning on donating time and money to Maria Cantwell's democratic opponent for the upcoming primary. What are you going to do?

[im10ashus]

39. I agree with you.

We start getting rid of the republican-lite democrats and get in liberal candidates who LISTEN to their constituents.

[Greyhound]

40. LOL!

I, unfortunately, live in the deepest of red areas in a very red state, so I'll keep banging my head against the wall.

[laruemtt]

19. we take conyers, feingold,

and the few other stalwarts with us to lead the NDP. no OINOs need apply and won't be accepted. no dead weight allowed! i'd love a NDP and it could be dynamic enough to get up to speed because of how many dems are disgusted with what we've got now.

[LSdemocrat]

21. Rebuild the Democratic Party from the ground up

That includes ordinary activists going to local ward/precinct/township meetings, running for party offices, and keep going up the chain, until we take back control of the party.

[FSogol]

22. This is exactly what Howard Dean has been doing.

Putting money generated into local areas rather than putting it into a national pot. This will reform the party from the ground up. It'll find and bring in new energetic candidates.

[im10ashus]

24. I think we've shown here on DU this past couple of weeks...

...that a grassroots movement is not only probable, it's happening. If we start to reform within our party at a local level, the trickle effect will reach the national level. We just need to keep the letters going and support candidates who want REAL change. Not the same old crap. :shrug:

[LSdemocrat]

26. Exactly. But people need to remember real reform takes time

People can't get discouraged if we don't get instant results. It took the conservative movement 30+ years to reach its present place of dominance. Hopefully it won't take us that long, but it takes time to change the mindsets of institutions and individuals.

[im10ashus]

28. A GREAT point!

It took them 30 years and we can do the same. I don't know if I can take 30 more years of THEM running all three branches, but I am willing to stay and fight for reform.

[Skidmore]

23. Can we get Minnesota's DFL to go national?

[im10ashus]

25. That's a good question.

For those of you who aren't familiar, here is a link to their website:

http://www.dfl.org/index.asp?Type=NONE&SEC={2D1BD3D8-9FD0-4D57-BCEE-E03CE1949CC7}

[Pryderi]

27. The Power of Fusion Politics

Please read the whole article

http://www.thenation.com/doc/20050912/katz

The Power of Fusion Politics

by ALYSSA KATZ



snip

The volunteers knocked on doors street by street; in the housing projects, hall by hall. The day John Kerry lost, the Working Families Party helped Soares take the job of Albany District Attorney away from a machine Democrat notorious for condemning drug offenders to extreme prison terms. With the rallying cry "Reform Rockefeller Drug Laws Now," the Soares campaign got voters to the polls by tapping into public outrage at seeing lives destroyed and billions wasted by the justice system. Soares had won the primary as a Democrat. In the general election he was still a Democrat, but on the ballot he was something else, too: the candidate of the Working Families Party.

A few months earlier, the WFP operation hit Westchester County. Volunteers trawled suburban streets delivering the message: "We're telling State Senator Nick Spano that New Yorkers need a raise in the minimum wage." A few residents cursed and slammed doors. But more often than not they agreed, and received a sheet of paper, a pen and a chance to handwrite a plea to the Senator. "It's about time!" exclaimed an expensively groomed woman as she took a clipboard.


snip

Fusion is powerful. Voting in the Working Families column is no wasted gesture--every ballot counts. It sidesteps the Nader Effect, since voters can show their support for a progressive party agenda without spoiling the chances of a candidate--usually a Democrat--who has a shot at winning. And if there's an opportunity to take out a bad Democrat, like former Albany DA Paul Clyne, Working Families can run its own candidate.


But the Working Families leadership was satisfied. In exchange for the endorsement of Spano and other Republicans in a tight race, state Republicans relented after years of opposition and hiked the minimum wage, which raised pay for hundreds of thousands of New Yorkers. By wielding the power to make or break one of its top leaders, Working Families pushed the Republican Party to take a progressive stance.

[txaslftist]

29. Let's start a new party! We'll call it the "We always lose" Party!

or the WAL for short.

[Greyhound]

33. We already have one of those. n/t

[samhsarah]

34. Yup.

[mmonk]

30. Since there is an entrenched group looking to be conservative

and also derogatory towards the rest of the party, maybe the party can split into two official factions with their own apparatus. The candidates can face one another in the primaries and run different presidential candidates in the democratic primary. The two sides can have things they agree on and can compromise and other times they can't but have both competing plans and joint plans. That way, registered democrats out there won't be so bewildered and there could be truth in advertising.

[Lone_Wolf]

31. Hmmm.... working inside vs. outside????

The air is fresher outside.

[Greyhound]

35. The problem with reform, as I see it, is that the entire foundation

has become corrupt. Reform would require that those who would be hurt most by it are the one's that have to do it, not likely with this bunch.
Latching onto another existing party doesn't look much better as they tend to be single issue advocates, rather than complete political parties. I think Perot was on the right track, although I disagree with him on many of the stands he took, a clean break from the status quo struck a chord with the public and showed that even though he's bat-shit crazy he got more votes than any other 3rd party before.
Perhaps a coalition party? :kick:

[marions ghost]

48. we are going to have to consider both

--working for reform within the Dem party as far as it goes. But it may not be possible to effect any substantial changes. Remains to be seen. If our best efforts do not bring any more success than we've been seeing lately, then we should be ready to move. Personally I'd like to see a third party forming, so that when / if more progressives become convinced that the Dems are not responsive, there will be an immediate option. I'd like to see this have the potential to develop into a big picture, wide-net party, which would hopefully act as an additional party. This is assuming the Dems would go on being Repug-Lite.

[sandnsea]

37. Third Party

It is the only way for the left to have a voice because the way they view the world and the way Democrats view the world is not close enough to gel in one party. If the distinctions were clear, the Democrats would pick up the center from Snowe to Boxer, who would work along side the left from Conyers to McDermitt. Two distinct voices, one huge voting block, and PROGRESS.

[DarkTirade]

41. We can't afford to split the vote

by making a third party. Reform is the only way.

[iconoclastNYC]

42. Reform. Scalp the DINOS in the primaries.

Donate money directly to candidates in the primaries.

Spread the word about the DINOS, and the DLC....let everyone know why it is that Democrats don't have unity and don't stand and fight. Let everyone know that we have the take back the Democratic party from people who put Corporations first.

[Just Me]

43. Why are we even discussing this shit? Until WE defeat the RW,...

,...this conversation is not only futile but destructive.

It's common sense, people,...common fucking sense!!!

:yoiks:

[deflated]

45. wind up losing to win on principal

3rd parties prove their point. But lose elections for themselves and those they are more closely aligned with.

[jackpan1260]

47. Republicans would love to see us form a 3rd party

just like they loved Ralph Nader in 2000.

[Old and In the Way]

49. Wouldn't it be easier to move 5MM more people to the Democrats than

moving 50MM to a new party? As if we would be better off losing with a new brand name.

Fix the voting system and this issue goes away.

[farmboxer]

50. Take over the party, a 3rd party is what Republicans would love

It so appears as if "We The People" are already starting to take over the party, keep going in the right direction and it will happen. Repubs do not want the people to get involved, like with the filibuster. The movement has to grow, plus Dean is doing a good job. To go 3rd party would be a huge win for Republican at this time. I am angry, but I refuse to cut off my nose to spite my face. The party will change. We "can" win, but Repubs and the corporate media do not want us to believe it for very good reason. Taking over the party will take much less time, money, effort, etc. We must not forget to "good" Dems. If we can make the numbers, it will give the good Dems much more power to get things done. 3rd party is a last resort for me, but I do understand the frustration, anger, depression, afterall, I feel that way also.

[The Magistrate]

51. Locking

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