The Holy Trinity and the State

[cyberia]

A cautionary tale

Let’s think back to the early Fourth Century. Constantine was emperor of the Roman Empire. He was under military pressure from barbarian invaders. Christianity had captured the imagination of the rabble in the Eastern Empire, where rioting was frequent among sects spouting variant ideologies. Among the best know today were the Arians, the Donatists and the Sabellians. We know them as heretics.

Constantine needed to quell the internal troubles to more effectively deal with the barbarians. So, he came up with a brilliant idea. In 325 he called together the leading bishops of the day at the imperial palace in Nicaea, the famous Council of Nicaea. He charged them with the task of producing a common profession of faith to quell the internal troubles caused by the endemic theological disputes in the streets. When they faltered, Constantine imposed the solution – Trinitarian mysticism drawn from the work of the Neo-Platonic philosopher Plotinus. There was no scriptural or spiritual basis for this decision that created a dogma that is still current, but it served the interests of the imperial state in its desire to impose order.

Those bishops who accepted Constantine’s solution came under his patronage, receiving vast wealth from the state treasury. They accepted the responsibility of civil servants, responsible for maintaining order and sitting along side secular judges in the tribunals. The Christian Church became an organ of the state bureaucracy, serving the interests and conservatism of entrenched power and wealth. To this day, with rare exceptions, it continues to do so.

Our Founding Fathers recognized that private worship was a right to be protected, but that nothing good could come from religious institutions meddling in the affairs of government.

When our friends on the Religious Right call for greater integration of Church and State, let them remember the consequences of Constantine’s Council of Nicaea: Christianity is still beset by the theological flopdoodle he imposed in order to gain civil tranquility. Christ’s message of peace and hope for the poor was transformed into a message of war and power for the rich and privileged.

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[laruemtt]

1. oh those pesky Founding Fathers -

what did they know.... :sarcasm:

[cyberia]

2. Amen, brother!

Fortunately, they had enough Enlightenment wisdom to see through the lies and obscurantism that had piled up, obscuring Jesus' message for more than a millenium.

[laruemtt]

3. enlightenment - wouldn't it be nice

if our leaders had a tad of it? btw, i'm sister, not brother.... ;-)

[Jeffersons Ghost]

4. how do you read this as only protecting "private worship?"

Amendment I

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances.

NO LAW... free exercise means PUBLIC WORSHIP

you can't change the bill of rights, you're not Dur Fuhrer Bush!

Also the Trinitarian View was not complete at the Council of Nicea in 325 AD. It did not totally form until 500 AD, after Saint Augustine put forth the Trinity now reverered in most Christian Churches. The Trinity arose from doubt at the Council of Nicea in 325 CE. Historian and Christian Father Hermias Sozomen describes resolution of the Arian Heresy, addressed at the Council by writing, “The emperor punished Arius with exile, denouncing him and his adherents as ungodly, and commanding that their books should be destroyed.” According to Sozomen, in his text Ecclesiastical History, Arian doctrine offers that there was a period when Christ “existed not; that, as possessing free will, He was capable of vice and virtue.” Trinity is God, according to the teachings of most modern Christian churches. In mainstream doctrine, God is a single being, existing simultaneously as the Father, Son and Holy Spirit. The Nicene Creed represents formalization of an original doctrine that uses "homoousia" which in Greek means of same substance. Spelling differs by one letter in "homoiousia" a Greek term for: of similar substance. Historically, the Trinitarian view emerges as an article of faith at Nicea and then evolves into the Athanasian Creed. In 500 CE, to standardize the belief in the face of renewed disagreements, the more explicit Athanasian Creed, which brings “Holy Spirit” into Trinity, also became integral in the belief system. Affirmation by the Roman Catholic Church led most modern Protestant denominations to retain the creeds in some form.

Genesis shows Divine plurality, while not describing what plural references mean. Is it plausible that plural elements signify remnants of Gnostic influence? Sozomen mentions no Gnostic sect in attendance at Nicea but Arius had a vast female following. By defending Paulianist Doctrine, Arius gave excommunicated patriarch of Antioch, Paul of Samosata a position in history with Canon XIX. “With regard to Paulianists who take refuge in the Catholic Church, it has been decided that they definitely need to be baptized. If, however, some of them have previously functioned as priests, if they seem to be immaculate and irreprehensible, they need to be baptized and ordained by a bishop of the Catholic Church. In this way, one must also deal with deaconesses or with anyone in an ecclesiastical office. With regard to the deaconesses who hold this position we remind that they possess no ordination but are to be reckoned among the laity in every respect.” It appears women held rank in certain churches, as “deaconesses,” prior to 325 CE.

Where did you get the idea Plotinus originated the Trinity?

It was in fact first outlined in the Chaldean Oracles, which was basic text for Neo-Platonists. Sources, including the adaptation by Stanley, attribute the oracles directly to Zoroaster but the translation suggests other potential authors. Very little consensus on the heavily fragmented oracles exists and some sources suggest the prophet Zoroaster wrote them as far back as 6,000 BCE. Remains of these oracles hint at ascension of the soul toward illumination, which is the essence of Neo-Platonism. According to Stanley, “Mirandula (Pico Mirandola) professeth to Ficinus (Ficino), that he had the Chaldee Original in his possession.” More importantly, the oracles show the original source of numeric progressions brought forth by Papus and other occult writers, stating, “Paternal Monad… is enlarged, which generates two. For the Duad sits by him, and glitters with Intellectual Sections. And to govern all Things, and to Order every thing not Ordered, For in the whole World shineth the Triad, over which the Monad Rules. This Order is the beginning of all Section. For the Mind of the Father said, that All things be cut into three, Whose Will assented, and then All things were divided. For the Mind of the Eternal Father said into three, governing all things by the Mind. And there appeared in it Virtue and wisdome, And Multiscient Verity. This Way floweth the shape of the Triad, being pre-existent. Not the first but where they are measured. For thou must conceive that all things serve these three Principles.“ In the next fragment not only Platonic ascension but also seven trinities of Waite take on significance: “"Stoop not down, for a precipice lies below on the Earth, Drawing through the Ladder which hath seven steps; beneath which is the Throne of Necessity." In The Republic, Plato offers dialog between Socrates and other philosophers. Conversations with Timaeus include an account of universal creation of the kosmos. While triadic evolution is obvious in Timaeus, the original model likely came from Pythagoras, who Porphyry reports spent three years learning from “Chaldeans” in the Persian Empire.

“Later Platonists,” appears often in translations of the Oracles, including a Westcott study and refers to Neo-Platonists. While Neo-Platonism strongly influences the Italian Renaissance, it represents a system that arose about 250 CE, with Plotinus founding the core philosophy. Taking his lead from Plato, Plotinus presents a complex spiritual ordering of the universe with three aspects as a basis: The One, The Intelligence and The Soul. Existence emanates from a productive union of the three elements. To Plotinus, higher and lower components compose the soul. With a certain aloofness from the low part, the upper element is constant and divine, while the low part holds the personality. Passions and vice lead to neglecting ethics, which facilitate ascent of a soul toward unification with the lofty aspect. The Enneads represent an attempt by his student Porphyry to preserve the philosophy of Plotinus. As Westcott states, hints of the Oracles occur in the writings of Plato, however, Porphyry, not Plato, mentions the Chaldean Oracles explicitly.

[cyberia]

5. The point of my thread

is not to reopen the theological debate about homoousia vs. homoiousia, which is akin to counting the angels on the head of a pin. In any case, Constantine bought the resolution to that debate.

The significance that I draw from a reading of history is that the concept of the trinity has nothing to do with Christianity and everything to do with state power and the willingness of a faction among the 4th century bishops to sell their souls to the emperor. Therein lies a powerful lesson for those of us who insist on a separation between private faith and public (government) civic life. That is the sense in which I use the term "private".

The jackasses who would have us, for example, exhibit the Ten Commandments in courthouses know full well that the first five of them impose allegiance to a particular tribal deity. From those commandments, it follows that the state impose that allegiance, should they be accepted as informing our laws.

[Jeffersons Ghost]

7. that jack-ass NAZI is running for Governor in MY state!

I wish they'd left his big Ten on the court-house lawn. Then, allowed Moslems to put up a Holy Icon right next to it! Hmmm in America Pagans have rights too... What about a big fine Pentagram next to Roy Nazi Moore's display, which he erected only for political gain.

Hey let's not forget Satanists... In America they have rights too! How about a nice Cross for them: UPSIDE DOWN.

At some point, no one can enter the courthouse to sue people who clutter up the lawn.

Hey did you catch this direct from Sozomen quote in my post: "With regard to the deaconesses who hold this position we remind that they possess no ordination but are to be reckoned among the laity in every respect.” It appears women held rank in certain churches, as “deaconesses,” prior to 325 CE."

check that little power play out DU women!

[cyberia]

8. "which he erected only for political gain"which he erected only for politi

He is in a long and honorable tradition stretching back to the Fourth Century.

[Jeffersons Ghost]

9. to suggest that moore is part of a Christian tradition is ludicrous

In fact, suggesting there is a tradition at all to the numerous threads that interweave throughout the history of Christianity is just as absurd... For example, what's the "tradition" of Gnostic Christians? Is it the same as the traditions of the Eastern Church... Lumping ALL Christians together is a typical Reich-Wing approach... Who next will you lump together? Do the Yoruba have the same "rich traditions" as the Ashanti?

Lumping people together says something about ANYONE who does it to ANY group.

[cyberia]

10. There's a lunch meat that describes your reply:

baloney!

The Christian Church is the church that Constantine bought. There have been schismatics, such as the Cathards, who were massacred, and the Lutherans, who served German, rather than Roman ruling class interests, and the Church of England, that served Henry VIII's interests, not to mention the Wholely British Empire, against which our Founding Fathers secularly revolted.

The essential point is that the message of Jesus became essentially irrelevant at the point that he was officially deified by the Roman state. From then on, the Christian Church became a function of state control whose special mission was and is mind control.

PS: The trinitarians did their best to suppress the gnostics, some of whose written records have only, by luck, been recovered at Nag Hamadi during the 20th Century. Elaine Pagels has some interesting things to say about who they were and what they represented in the early Church.

Moore, OTOH, is right in the mainstream of Christianity. He is an honest and upright theocrat. What moore could you ask of a true believer?

[cyberia]

6. Cool, sister