Lieberman in trouble! Primary now near 10 points apart! 47-36 Lamont

[jsamuel]

More useful, in the crosstabs of this poll we see that amongst Democrats, the breakdown is as follows:

Lieberman 47
Lamont 36

http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2006/2/17/13253/8776


All those posts saying how Lieberman had no competition left out the fact that those polls were of Democrats AND REPUBLICANS. And seeing that 3/4 of Republicans and only 1/2 of Democrats approve of Lieberman's job performance (does that mean he isn't a Democrat?), that means that the Democratic primary is very close right now.

Just like some of the media reports trying to tell us that Feingold gave up on the Patriot Act, some are looking at only half the story to tell us Lieberman has no opposition.

[Wetzelbill]

1. sorry, I read Joe's name and I immediately fell asleep..

:)

[jsamuel]

2. :P

:silly:

[dicknbush]

5. Yeah me to but I also puked first...Lieberman is such a fraud....

Hey joe go to temple and stay there..Maybe god will forgive you but REAL Dems won't!

[Wetzelbill]

8. Evan Bayh......

I bet if him and Lieberman are in the same room together people start dropping like flies.

Oh, Joe is enough to make anybody sick. He's so frustrating.

[ayeshahaqqiqa]

3. What can you tell me about Lamont?

What are his positions on the war, domestic spying, etc?

[jsamuel]

4. here is his website

(I don't know much about him, but his statement is left of Joe.)

You've probably heard the buzz about Ned Lamont challenging Joe Lieberman in the Democratic primary this year.

Ned is considering running because, like most Connecticut Democrats, he is tired of being represented by a senator who is not willing to stand up to the President on the war — and on the rest of his extreme right wing agenda which is so harmful to our country.

Ned Lamont is a successful businessman who understands the importance of health care and education to our economy. He will fight for universal health care and to bring all of America's schools into the 21st Century. He believes the federal government should stay out of people's private lives and stop spying on its own citizens. He would push for energy conservation and bio fuels as better alternatives than the liquefied natural gas plant in Long Island Sound. And he would demand that corrupt public officials be held accountable for their actions.

The polls show that Democrats are ready for a change, but the entrenched interests behind Joe Lieberman are going to fight tooth and nail and pour millions of dollars into this race. To win, we'll need volunteers working hard in every city and town — and we'll need thousands more Americans pledging to contribute financially as well.

What's the next step? Ned has stated that he will not move beyond the exploratory phase of a campaign until at least 1,000 people in Connecticut have signed up to volunteer. So no matter where you live, this is a chance to make history. Please sign up today!

http://nedlamont.com/

[MrBenchley]

7. The Unknown Millionaire

By the way, he makes his dough off gated communities for the ultra-rch elite....

[jsamuel]

9. so, he steals from the rich?

but will he give to the poor?

[MrBenchley]

16. No, Lamont serves the ultra-rich....

but don't let any facts get in your way in your worship of this obscure goober.

[jsamuel]

18. and where did I "worship"?

Don't attack me because of your prejudices against liberals. I have neither endorsed or opposed Lamont.

You said that he makes all of his money from ultra-rich people buying property in gated communities. How does that condemn him? Would you rather he be poor? Would you rather he be not well off? Would you rather he makes his money by charging poor people instead of rich people?

I don't claim to know him, but you sure don't like him and you aren't giving any reasons.

[MrBenchley]

19. Yeah, you sure seem neutral. (snicker)...

"I don't claim to know him"
Don't you think you ought to go learn SOMETHING about the Unknown Millionaire before you start hoo-rawing for him?

[jsamuel]

20. I don't like Lieberman, that is why I posted this.

The only thing I did was say that there has been a poll and it shows that the race is closer than previously suggested here. I don't like Lieberman and I would like to know more about the other guy, Lamont.

Show me where I "worshiped" or "hoo-rawed" for him.

You won't be able to, because I didn't. You many now commence with your factless insults of me as you always do when you have nothing left to argue.

[MrBenchley]

21. Cheering for the Unknown Millionaire...

and again, if you don't know anything about who you're cheering for, don't come crying to me....

[Elidor]

39. No one would ever approach you looking for sympathy or compassion

You have none, except for your pet DINOs and your fellow true believers. You come to resemble Boudelang more with each passing day.

:hi:

[Irreverend IX]

52. Hey, Benchley...

If you're such a pragmatist that you're willing to embrace the biggest RINOs in the party because you think they have a better chance to win elections, why can't you admit that banning firearms is a loser issue that can only hurt Democrats?

[CTLawGuy]

30. I find

your Nazi-istic loyalty to anyone with a D next to his name to be both frightening and hilarious.

What if Stalin were a Dem incumbent, would you vote for him?

How about if the Dem incumbent slaughtered 5 babies would you still vote for him?

The Democratic party is a great party, but it is not a cult, and it is not God.

[MrBenchley]

37. And the second I care

what someobdy who wants to spout silliness like "If Stalin was a Democrat," has to say, I'll shoot off a flare.

[CTLawGuy]

38. hypotheticals aren't silly

I'm trying to figure out where your line is. Is there any line that if someone with a (D) crosses, you'd say, "I can't support him/her anymore?"

Cause if there isn't, then parties would not have any meaning. They would be a random group of people gathered under the same banner, deserving of complete loyalty for no other reason than they are in the same party.

[MrBenchley]

42. That's what you think (snicker)

[CTLawGuy]

43. Same old same old from you

high on the nastiness, low on the logic.

[MrBenchley]

53. LOL!

Whining about "nastiness" from the guy who compared Democrats (and by inference, Joe Lieberman) to Stalin.....

It doesn't get much funnier from that.

[CTLawGuy]

54. I never compared them to Stalin

you twist around what I say to make it look like I said something else.

That's dishonest, but I guess I shouldn't expect anything less from you.

[SOS]

58. Relax

Why do you even bother delivering your usual one-line insult?
Schumer will force Lamont out of the race by April.

[dsc]

32. Metzenbalm ran parking garages and was a terrific Senator

Selling gated communities to the rich is legal, and frankly I don't see a whole lot wrong with it. Bottom line, and since I don't live in CT I really won't be participating, I think the candidates should be judged by what kind of Senators they would be. Let the primary voters decide.

[saltpoint]

34. Just an aside here... I have grave misgivings about Holy Joe

and take every opportunity to slam him and slam him hard for his sell-out to BushCo on most of the major issues of the day.

LaMont? I'm no expert on Ned LaMont, but I like what I've heard and I appreciate the comments many DUers have made -- many from Connecticut who know more about this race than I do.

Hell, I'd definitely vote for Lowell Weicker over Joe Lieberman, no question about it.

But I want to post in support of Howard Metzenbaum. Not his parking garage scene, but his pro-labor stance, and his whiteknuckled soul. I loved the guy and by god I wish more states would send more Metzenbaums to the Senate and fewer Frists.

Ok, end of rant.

[BigYawn]

51. Parking garages are used by every one, gated communities are only

for the very affluent.....apples and oranges.

[Greeby]

6. Well, hes obviously against the war

I mean, if he was for it, why go to the trouble of trying to beat Joe-mentum? :think:

[IndianaGreen]

33. Lamont is running against Lieberman because of the war!

Lamont is against the war in Iraq. His position on the war mirrors John Murtha's.

[Larkspur]

44. Ned Lamont, the Political Entrepreneur by Matt Stoller of Mydd

http://www.mydd.com/story/2006/2/17/165938/836

...In all honesty, I did not expect to support Ned Lamont. When I wrote The Risks for the Blogosphere of Taking on Lieberman, I outlined the set of risks that we carry in going against someone who is well-entrenched and popular in their state. And I was expecting to go to Connecticut and find a guy eager to beat Joe Lieberman, but without a sense of what he wanted to do in the Senate and why he was in politics. All too often, that's what neophytes in the political process bring to the table, enthusiasm and energy without discipline. I know how bad Lieberman is. It's not just the war vote, it's how he introduced the Iraq war resolution and undercut all the other Democratic Senators who wanted to authorize force with more restrictions. It's not just the consistent Bush-kissing, it's how he grandstands against Alito and the Bankruptcy Bill and then votes for cloture, the only real vote that matters. It is, in short, how Lieberman has no principle, no vision, and no ability to lead this country in the right direction. He's with us when it doesn't matter, and he's against us when it does. Nevertheless, politics is about reality, longevity, and consistency, not just idealism, and I was scared that we'd throw a sacrificial lamb at a DLC giant.

After my time in Connecticut, I am 100% behind Ned Lamont. He is a serious, disciplined man who has the right temperament and a deep understanding of what it means to succeed and achieve in this world (he is also good-looking and photogenic). The downsides of his candidacy are clear. He has held only one elected office as a local politician, and he is starting his run with only seven months until the primary in August. He is down in the polls by 47-36, and his name ID is low. This is going to be a tough race. Lieberman is a ruthless campaigner with oodles of money and the support of DC insiders; indeed, the entire edifice of the 'sensible Democrat' is built on Lieberman's mixture of pandering-as-principle, and these people will fight viciously to maintain their veneer of respectability. Going into Connecticut means going into the belly of the beast.

Given all these factors, why am I behind Ned Lamont? Or rather, why did I shift from a lukewarm overly anxious state to what sounds like, but isn't, that of a Kool-Aid Kid? Well I have a test for politicians. I ask them who their political idols are, and why. And what Ned Lamont told me is the single most impressive answer I have ever gotten. His favorite politicians are Bill Clinton and Bill Bradley, and the reason is because he believes we need a more entrepreneurial style of politics. That is a remarkable answer. It is remarkable because it is absolutely forward-looking and systematic. What we face as a country is systemic corruption, not a few bad apples. And the way to shift that system is through a new crop of entrepreneurial leaders who seek to occupy and create new political space, not to swell on the legacy of the New Dealers. Ned Lamont is one of these leaders.

Why else do I find him impressive? Well, because he's accomplished. He built a company. That may not sound hard, but it is. Building a telecommunications company takes guts, bravado, perseverance, and savvy. It means calculated risk-taking, not blind recklessness or excessive caution. Yet even as he was building his business, he worked on policy with the Brookings Institute, fiscal policy and health care. Lamont is extremely progressive, for very solid pragmatic and moral reasons. Without a functional and universal health care system, businesses and workers are getting crushed. Being in Iraq is a diversion of resources away from critical domestic priorities, and away from catching Bin Laden. These are not poll-tested answers from a guy seeking to beat Lieberman; these are the instinctive positions of someone who has thought and done his civic duty for years as a business and community leader. That matters because it means he brings a level of seriousness to any endeavor he undertakes. He keeps his word, and he gets things done and built. And his business background and reputation in the state makes it very difficult to pigeonhole him as some unrealistic liberal.

The other reason I'm behind Ned Lamont is because he's done his politics the right way, and this means he can win. His campaign staff is superb. Tom Swan, his campaign manager, knows politics, and while I can't go into the specifics of the strategy, it is realistic and makes a great deal of sense given the landscape of Connecticut and the relatively small universe of primary voters. For instance, there were 125,000 in the uncontested Presidential primary in 2004 and with a volunteer list above 1000, that means that almost 2% of the total necessary primary vote is volunteering for Lamont. I would imagine my voter universe numbers are somewhat off, but not by orders of magnitude. Lamont is going to need money and has set an informal fundraising goal of $500,000 by the end of the month; McCain-Feingold means that he can't use more than $500,000 of his own money without triggering provisions that allow Lieberman to double his take from his maxed out donors. But Lamont will also spend this money efficiently; there are endless ways to waste money in a primary campaign, and Lamont, because he comes from private industry and is using people who have been around the block to run his campaign. Oh, and while we're talking about numbers, Moveon.org has 50,000 members in Connecticut. That's low-hanging fruit for Lamont.

SNIP

[ISUGRADIA]

46. This analysis is seriously flawed

"125,000 in the uncontested Presidential primary in 2004 ... I would imagine my voter universe numbers are somewhat off, but not by orders of magnitude"

There off by a hell of a lot. Primary for pres was 175,000 in 2000 and that ws with a weak Bill Bradley. In a mega race like this turnout could reach 200-225K.

"Moveon.org has 50,000 members in Connecticut."

People who sign up for the e-mail list. How many are active MoveOn members giving money and time?

[Smarmie Doofus]

10. This is a *phenomenal* turn of events....

if the polling is accurate. Lieberman was polling around 65-15 over early DEM challenger who has since dropped out. (Fairfield U prof... can't remember his name)

What's going on on the republican side. Are they fielding a candidate? One wonders why they would bother... except to make a stab at adding to their senate majority.

What if the GOP decides to nominate a no-name nonentity as a token opponent but makes it clear that they prefer L.

But then L loses the DEM primary. Whither L? Can the DEM Party exact a pledge from Lieberman NOT to run as a third party candidate if he loses the primary?

[jsamuel]

11. No candidate who loses a primary can run, period (even as an Ind.)

[Greeby]

12. But is Joe out of the Senate immediately if he loses the primary?

Or just at the start of the 110th Congress? :shrug:

[jsamuel]

13. at the start of the 110th Congress

[Solon]

14. No, he stays in the seat until the Senate is next in session...

The winner of the general election will then take the seat, also, whether he would run as an independent actually depends on state law on this. Its possible he can, but I'm not sure about Conn. law.

[Smarmie Doofus]

24. Why not? Wasn't Weicker elected Gov. as a third ....

party?

Is there some kind of stipulation in CT that a candidate may only run on one line? In NY, they collect ballot "lines" ( small party endorsements) with a crazed determination.

[ISUGRADIA]

40. weicker ran as an independent

he never ran for the republican nomination in 1990. NY is one of the few states that allow fusion candidates. CT does not. CT's primary is on 8/8, the filing deadline for Independents is 8/9

[cascadiance]

28. If it's obvious that he will lose the primary, he might pull out...

Then he likely could run as an independent, could he not?

I remember when John Andersen ran as an independent for president, he was for a while running amongst the Republicans for the presidential race then. I'm trying to recall if he pulled out before their convention, etc. But that of course could be very different than Connecticut law too.

[ISUGRADIA]

41. What part of CT law precludes this? I can find no "sore loser"

law on the books. Lieberman has said he'd run as an Ind if he loses in Sept. The primary is 6-8, he can file as an Independent on that deadline, 8-9, the next day.

http://www.rep-am.com/story.php?id=1349

WATERBURY -- Sen. Joseph I. Lieberman said Tuesday he is ready to fight to retain his seat in the Senate even if it means running an independent campaign.

Political observers, however, say it's unlikely it'll ever get to that point.

Lieberman, during a stop in the city on Tuesday, said he doesn't believe his position opposite his party on the war in Iraq will cost him the Democratic party's endorsement to seek re-election this fall. In standing with President Bush in support of the war, Lieberman has rankled party members in the state and nationally.

[SteppingRazor]

22. Or will the GOP run a candidate perceived as a moderate...

like a McCain type -- a candidate, in other words, who would lose to an incumbent Lieberman but likely crush Lamont? That's what I would do.


Also, I wouldn't start patting backs yet. Anything in the double digits is still a large margin. But if Lamont has made huge gains over a brief period of time (which he appears to have done), then this is certainly, as you say, "phenomenal."

[Smarmie Doofus]

27. Timing may have a lot to do with it. The GOP....

may be locked into picking a nominee before the winner of the DEM primary is determined. In fact, I can't see another scenario. So if they pick a hard-right unelectable... and they may indeed... it will be Mr. Unelectable vs. Lamont.

That's *if* Lieberman can't run as third party.

[ieoeja]

25. On the Republican side ... they held a fundraiser last week ...

... for Senator Joe.

While Lamont has the backing of a former Dem Senator and members of the Kennedy clan.

[Smarmie Doofus]

29. Are there any declared GOP candidates?

Will they actually endorse and nominate Lieberman? Will L accept the GOP nomination?

[CTLawGuy]

31. there are only 2 republicans who could win the senate seat

One is Gov. Jodi Rell, who will not run, and the other is Rep. Nancy Johnson, who will be loath to leave her comfortable house seat. and if she did, the Dems have a good chance of getting it back.

Rep. Shays is in his party's doghouse and he will struggle to hold on to his seat. Same with Rep. Rob Simmons, whose seat would instantly lost to us if he ran for senate.

[Initech]

15. Good, get Lieberman out of office!

Any democrat that's endorsed by Sean Hannity needs to be voted out of office ASAP. :puke:

[otohara]

17. Will DLC & Others Swiftboat Lamont?

Will he be another Paul Hackett?

[windbreeze]

55. Now in my book......that IS the question..n/t

[ISUGRADIA]

23. And there is party registration in CT too meaning any Republican

or Independent who wants to vote for Lieberman in the primary will have to reregister.

[Mitt Chovick]

26. He's still close to fifty percent, but the Joementum has slowed

into slowmentum

:rofl:

[saltpoint]

49. Mitt Chovick, I like your word play there. Joementum/slowmentum.

I sense that also about Lieberman's chances. I read the polls & follow what folks on DU and elsewhere are saying about the race.

I'm for LaMont and I hope enough Connecticut primary voters will turn Lieberman out of office.

Go Ned.

[Arugula Latte]

60. I wish it would be No-mentum!

And then, and then, well, crap, I can't think of a rhyming word to use for "Negative"-mentum. But ...

Joe is a Repuke 'ho and he's got to go! It'll take dough to flush him out of Senate, though.

[usregimechange]

35. Think I will send him a donation... Will you join me?

[Doctor_J]

36. 3/4 of Repubs approve of Joe's performance

yipes.

[saltpoint]

45. Go Ned. Go Ned. Go Ned. / nt

[Crunchy Frog]

47. Okay, I just went ahead and donated to Ned.

I at least want to see Lieberman given a run for his money.

[saltpoint]

48. I'm with you on this, Crunchy Frog. LaMont is doing a good thing

in challenging Holy Joe. I'll send a donation also.

How fine it would be to have a much bluer Democrat in that seat.

[GetTheRightVote]

50. I hope he gets his a** kicked by the Dem Voters right out of office

I mean Joe "repub" Lieberman !!

:kick:

[leesa]

56. What's Lieberman doing running in a Democratic Primary?

[nadinbrzezinski]

57. They telll me he has a D behind his name

There are some who just should stop pretending and just go for the R, but hey who is counting?

[Arugula Latte]

59. Maybe if Joe shills against liberals on Fox some more, it'll help him!!

:sarcasm: