If erased information can be obtained from a computer why can't

[Maraya1969]

the voting computers be searched for the initial information that was put into them and then compared with the information that was given as the "result", especially if they can refine the search to the computers where the greatest fraud seems to have occurred?

[Canuckistanian]

1. Depends on your definition of "erased"

On a computer, when you "delete" a file you're not really wiping it out. You're just taking it off of an index, an internal list of valid files. Usually, all the data is still there where you left it. That's why data can be "recovered" from a seemingly empty disk.

It's unclear what sort of system voting machines use. If they are MS Windows based, then yes, the data could be recovered (if it had not been written over yet).

But there is a second method of deleting, usually called "wiping" which actually destroys any kind of digital data. What it does is set all the disk space to zeroes. In that case, there's nothing to recover.
No traces and no record that it ever existed.

If voting machines use the "wiping" method, then no data can be recovered.

But, the problem is, WE JUST DON'T KNOW because Diebold, ES&S et al won't let us see exactly how they do things.

[Karmakaze]

2. Not strictly true...

Even wiping data is not a garauntee of it being gone, but it takes extremely high tech equipment to get it back.

However, in the case of voting machines, this is irrelevent. They don't use disks to store data, they store data in flash memory, which is indeed completely eraseable.

[TexasProgresive]

4. My son has used some kind of recovery program to

retrieve photo files off of memory cards that are at least 5 erases back. I mean that the card has been filled 5 X downloaded and reused. This is not some super high tech FBI/NSA type thing so I think they could recover the data on the memory cards if they wished to. The only way I know to erase a hard disk is to use a high strength magnet, drill holes in the disk and beat it with a hammer (preferable Tom DeLay's head).

[Canuckistanian]

6. Well, then, my first example is being used here

That image data was never written over, so it sat there in place. Just the name of that file and it's entry in a small index were all that was deleted.

[TexasProgresive]

7. I guess that means that a gigabyte memory is

actually 5 gig as the memory can be filled and erased 5 X and yet all the data is still there.

[Canuckistanian]

5. "Disks" "Flash", theyre interchangeable to me

And are you saying that memory retains some sort of "trace" of it's former state? If so, then I've never heard of it.

These media are designed to make it totally unambiguous as to it's state. It's a one or it's a zero, period.

[roseBudd]

3. I do know they use Acess which is laughable n/t

[Maraya1969]

10. Can't someone get a warrant for some of their voting machines?

[skids]

8. Because access to the machines is denied.

The above posts are correct inthat most such information is stored in memory, not on disk, so it is not recoverable. As to those instances where such information "hit disk" recovering it would require destroying the hard disk... which shouldn't really be a consideration where there are serious questions as to fraud.

However, even where situations like that exist, the voting machine companies and their cronies in the BoEs won't allow the machines to be examined. Look at what happenned in NM, where we supposedly have "friendlies" in charge.

[Canuckistanian]

9. You mean "volatile" memory?

There's two kinds of memory - Volatile, meaning once you turn the machine off, the data goes with it. Usually referred to as "RAM" memory.

The other is "Non-volatile", which retains it's memory even when it's powered down. Which is what a hard disc, Flash or EPROM uses.

And I would doubt that the voting machines would use volatile memory to store voter records. Any power glitch could partially or completely destroy the data.

[skids]

11. RAM is random access, volatile or no.

So that's what I meant -- all forms of RAM, flash and these insane battery-backed CMOS cards they seem to be using included.