Does anyone else see the cycle occuring between the hispanic Boycott

[Flabbergasted]

and the bus boycott of the 60's?

[TriMetFan]

1. This should not only be a Hispanic

Boycott, but a Boycott about all of us Americans. Do you really want to continue on the path our Government has taken this Great Nation?

[Flabbergasted]

2. Thats actually what it it is already!

[TriMetFan]

3. really where?

Most of what I have read here in DU is about people that are scared that their jobs are being taken away. I don't see that many that are willing to boycott.

[Flabbergasted]

4. The Latinos are working for us as well my friend!

[TriMetFan]

7. Well I guess that mean I work for you since

I'm a American Latina and a Public Employee.

[Flabbergasted]

9. Thanks for your service!

[TriMetFan]

11. And you are welcome.

:)

[stillcool]

5. It certainly reminded me...

of all the 'issues' that were confronted in the 60's. I had a brother in Vietnam...who came home in 1970 when I was 12. It's kind of weird, reading thinking about those times now...but I was conflicted by the truth of racial inequality, the effects of war, and the denial of either's existence. The un-spoken ruled.

[Flabbergasted]

6. We really need you wisdom now!

[TriMetFan]

8. Yes you are right and you speak the truth but......

back then there were Great Leaders too like MLK.

[Flabbergasted]

10. There are other great leaders!

[TriMetFan]

12. Flabbergasted are you talking about now in days or

back in the old days?

[Flabbergasted]

13. I'm saying that we are not powerless. There are other miracles waiting to

happen god willing!

[TriMetFan]

14. I hope so!

I just don't think I can take this crap any more. But then again I know that I will have my oldest son going door to door helping getting people register to vote.

[Flabbergasted]

17. Ok, Evertime you get cynical I want yo yo consider the fact that Bush

Fucks everthing he attempts!

[TriMetFan]

18. Yes Bush does fucks everything up.

But how much longer can our Nation take it? Now that is the million dollar question.

[Flabbergasted]

19. Is it not better to die on our feet than our knees?

[TriMetFan]

20. oh yes it is.

If you die on your knee the you have given up.

[Flabbergasted]

21. Than we shall fight each step?

[TriMetFan]

27. Yes we do have to fight with each step.

I just can't let my Be Loved Nation fall to the evil of the Right wing wackos.

[stillcool]

15. the Black Panthers...Malcolm X...

Bobby Kennedy, and the Rosenberg's are what I recall as shattering my consciousness. Death seems to have been the learning tool.... that wakened me to their lives. I wonder who is entering kids consciousness today, requiring them to rethink their reality? Cindy Sheehan, Nick Berg, Sibel Edmonds, the Jersey girls....

[TriMetFan]

16. Who knows. I try speaking to the kids

and there are times i feel like all I get is this blank look.

I think that if there was a draft then thing wood be a little more different. What do you think?

[stillcool]

22. I think that what enters the mind, and sparks interest...

is as individual as we all are. Any one of the plethora of different voices speaking out today, are as likely as any to be the leaders admired by those coming up. What I mean to say, is that living in this time with all the uncertainty will look much different in the rear-view mirror. Influence is not always realized on impact, sometimes not at all.

[TriMetFan]

28. I hope you are right.

I remember something my father told me when I was 12 or 14, "That I would see a Revolution in my life time in our Nation" I think he might be right.

[The Traveler]

23. That parallel is really thin

The fundamental issue is: Do the people in America have the right to control their borders and retain their sovereignty as a nation? Or should that, too, become subordinate to corporatist interests? Do those who have lived here as American citizens have an obligation to provide social and health services to anyone who chooses to come here? Or do we have a right to say, "No." I myself ask these questions as I watch the schools and services of my community collapse under the weight of illegal immigrants.

This is quite distinct from the scenario of the civil rights movements of the sixties, and the comparison is quite offensive to many who lived through those days. In that case, the issue was "shall we assign rights and liberties based into what race an American is born?" For me, there was a clearly wrong answer to that question, and those who pronounced and tried to enforce that answer deserved opposition. By any means necessary.

The issue of illegal immigration is more subtle than that. I know many fine young people who had the guts and the luck to make it across the border. I really don't want them kicked out of this country. Still ... the sheer magnitude of the migration is itself the problem. The streets of the Atlanta suburns were busy today, but passable. Drivers were reasonably sane. My travel time to work was cut in half. Part of me quietly pleads, please, continue the boycott.

If the Mexican poor were unable to seek relief by hustling across the border, perhaps they would rise up against the corrupt corporatists masters of Mexico, by any means necessary. Maybe they need to kick some ass down there. Maybe we need to help them, by kicking some corporatist ass up here. I don't know. Just thinking out loud, here.

I have come to regard the matter thusly. Mexico is exporting its social and economic injustice to America, leaving it to guys like us to pay for the remedy. I resent the hell out of that. But the Hispanic guys I hang out with at AutoZone, they're not the problem. Their presence here is a symptom. I wish we were rich enough to absorb them and give them justice. But we aren't.

Maybe they need to go home and have their own civil rights struggle.

Maybe if they did, the net loss would be ours.

Just thinking out loud here. But this is not like the civil rights struggle. This is something different, and there may be no real good answers. But me, I would like to seal the borders (control the numbers) and keep all the ones who want to stay here and become, well, us.

[Flabbergasted]

24. Like i said cyclical parallel not rational parallel!

[The Traveler]

25. Perhaps I missed the whole point

What do you mean by "cyclical parallel"?

[Flabbergasted]

26. Same thing occuring repeatedly

[The Traveler]

29. There is the disagreement

I understand the temptation to regard this as "the same thing" ... but there are real differences between this problem and the issues of the civil rights movement, and between this war and the Vietnam war.

The problem of illegal immigrants is much more subtle morally and more complicated practically ...

And the strategic basis for the Vietnam War (thin at best) was far stronger than that for the Iraq war. (Frankly, we could have avoided the whole Vietnam mess by backing Ho Chi Minh ... our main man during WWII ... and telling the French to piss off, but I digress.) We basically invaded Iraq 'cause it felt good at the time. Lunacy.

Point is, I think we are not only facing different situations, but more difficult and in a real sense more dangerous ones. Nixon was ambitious and insecure ... but I have come to believe Bush is genuinely evil and (unlike Nixon) does not in his heart even believe his policies are what is best for the average American.

Nope. We face harder questions, and harder problems today.

It is unwise to seek too many references to the past. In a real sense, we are in uncharted territory. We must now use the best our brains and hearts have to offer to craft the best solutions to carry us forward.

** Edited for typos. **

** Edited again. When you let spell checker change "typos" to "types" it is time to hit the rack. G'nite, friend. **

[Flabbergasted]

30. I'm not regarding it as the same thing (Whatever that means) I'm saying

at its essence history repeats itself!

[The Traveler]

31. Does it?

How can it? We have never been in this situation before. We have only had a high energy technology based civilzation for about 80 years. We have never faced issues like global warming, peak oil, over population, crashing eco-systems ... you see my point.

No, friend, we are in uncharted territory.

On edit ... I just did a leap. I see a linkage between these issues, migration and the Iraq war.

[Flabbergasted]

32. Oh man It still stands despite the computers and crap!

[flaminbats]

33. we need a DU cloister bell to alert us whenever this happens..

http://www.mondas.org/soundmusic/critical_stop_clois.zip

[stillcool]

34. I do not believe this is an argument....

for or against the similarities of struggle, but more an issue of events that echo emotions of the past. That you see no parallels of your past to the events today, does not negate another's recall. It only suggests that you have experienced life differently. The cohesion in my mind of civil rights, war, womens issues, assassinations, drugs, and disdain for government can not be debated.