Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

Is Rep. Jefferson just a patsy? Why have we come down so hard on him?

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion: Presidential (Through Nov 2009) Donate to DU
 
keopeli Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-23-06 06:39 AM
Original message
Is Rep. Jefferson just a patsy? Why have we come down so hard on him?
I admit to knowing very little about Rep. Jefferson's legal woes. Like the vitriolic posts that seem to attach themselves to most every nugget of information that comes out about him here at DU, I too have no desire to tolerate a crook in Congress.

Fortunately for us, the information available is very limited, so we can look at it all right here in this post. Here's what Jefferson is accused of:

During a meeting last July at the Ritz-Carlton hotel in Arlington, Virginia, Jefferson was reportedly captured on video tape accepting $100,000 from an FBI informant.

The money, according to the feds, was to be used by Jefferson to bribe a high-ranking Nigerian official to ensure the success of a business venture there.

Four days later, all but $10,000 of that money is found in Jefferson's home, stashed inside a half-dozen food containers in Jefferson's freezer.
KLFY in Lafayette, LA

Now you know the basics. You'd think a video of him accepting a $100,000 bribe from an FBI informant would be enough, wouldn't you? But there are other facts to consider, and they're often more telling than newsprint. We can look at the who, what and when.

Recently, Attorney General Alberto Gonzales, hungry for power, stepped into history once again when he authorized and executed a search of the Congressman's office. Never before has the Executive encroached on the Legislative Branch...ever. By doing this, he gained access to ALL of the Congressman's files...ALL of them. All of his papers from meetings with Democrats, with constituents...ALL of them.

Now, lest we think that Gonzales was just being "gung-ho" in the pursuit of justice, he himself demonstrates that he knew full well that he was stepping into history with this comment:

Attorney General Alberto Gonzales says he understands the concerns raised about the raid on Jefferson's office.

But, Gonzales says special precautions were taken to make sure that all documents unrelated to the criminal investigation were left untouched, by what Gonzales called a filter team, a group of agents not connected with the Jefferson investigation.
also from Laffayette


That's right, AG Gonzales "filtered out" all of the other information not related to his deliberate fishing expedition by using anonymous sources. Let's call them "Sealed" and "sealed". And, when asked why he made this unprecedented move, rather than offer an explanation, he patronizes Congress by saying, "There, there, don't worry. I'm an honest guy."

Republicans and Democrats are both asking "why". With a precedent of separation of powers of over 200 years being broken, what was it that was worth this encroachment? Secretly, they no doubt are now very concerned about their own safety from the legal maneuvering of Gonzales.

It is difficult to understand what was so important to have that it was worth deliberately breaking the Separation of Powers for the first time in history. After all, it was an undercover FBI officer who originally taped the bribe happening last July. They also have a former staffer who plead guilty to having bribed the Congressman, and now a second guilty plea bargain from a second staffer. The details of what these former staffers have to offer and even their charges are not well understood.

Rep. Jefferson claims to this day he is innocent. When asked about his staffers who made plea bargains, he talks about succumbing to enormous pressure from the Attorney General (a pressure even Congress people are worried about today).

The real issue here lies in the muddy diatribe of the Washington Post article on the Front Page of the February 16, 2006 edition.

Jefferson's woes are unwelcome news for his party and have undercut the Democrats' election-year assertion that Republicans have created a "culture of corruption." If Jefferson is indicted and pleads guilty or is convicted, he will have to step down or face expulsion. But if he is indicted and decides to go to trial, he may remain in Congress and stand for reelection -- the course Rep. Tom DeLay (R-Tex.) has followed since being charged last year with violating Texas campaign law.
...
Republican groups frequently invoke the Jefferson case in defending their party from broad-brush charges of corruption. Even Public Citizen, a liberal consumer watchdog group, featured Jefferson on an "Ethics Hall of Shame" list recently.


Washington Post


So, in summary, with mountains of evidence against the Republicans and all of it absent one single Democrat, AG Gonzales has gone after a Democrat relentlessly, breaking historical precedent, and what do we have to show for it? We have to believe Gonzales really has good evidence from a sting setup against the Congressman, even though we have live video footage of the bribe (allegedly). Oh, and we have $90,000 in cold hard cash. You remember cash? It's popular among criminals because you can't trace it.

It also makes for a good way to plant evidence or raise suspicions.

Republicans are planning to win this election by all necessary means.

Admit it - Rove and Gonzales have got you going, don't they?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
ChairmanAgnostic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-23-06 06:49 AM
Response to Original message
1. I must be missing your basic premise
the fact that Gonzales' goons took over his office will have huge repurcussions for years to come. But that is not the issue.

If we have a video-taped congressman, taking money intended to bribe a foreign leader, and that money is found in his freezer, how should we react?

Let me put it bluntly. If we fail to support Nancy Pelosi on this, and her call for a complete ethics investigation of Jefferson, we do not deserve to win in November. If we do not hold ourselves to a higher moral, ethical standard than today's Neocons and GOPers, we should not hold office. Because to do so would be nothing more than changing labels on the same package of shit.
A true democrat does not take bribes, does not break ethics rules and does not lie to his constituancy. One problem I always had with Clinton was his lying under oath. I also had a MAJOR problem with the special persecutor and his witch hunt, but that is another matter. Had Bill told the truth, or said that he refuses to answer, the matter would have died then and there. INSTEAD, we empowered the GOP, angered law-abiding citizens, and left us with people sceptical about Al Gore. And see where it got us?

No, we have no choice but to call Jefferson precisely what he is. A law-breaking scum who does NOT deserve to sit in Congress. And we MUST be the ones to be pushing him out. In doing so, we will show the voters why we deserve to replace the criminal class known as the GOP in November.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
sendero Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-23-06 07:00 AM
Response to Reply #1
4. I agree..
.... and as much as I hate to judge a case based on one set of facts, if they have him accepting $100K and found $90K of it in his freezer, it takes an amazing amount of imagination to come up with an innocence scenario.

I'm sick of dirty politicians. Republicans, Democrats, Independents. People who sell their influence are SLIME and there is no punishment to severe for them IMHO. It is the most fundamental violation of the public trust, exceeded only by acts of official oppression.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
keopeli Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-23-06 07:39 AM
Response to Reply #4
11. I'm right there with you.
I've always hated dirty politicians. I'll also admit to having thought some politicians were good and learned they were dirty.

I'll even admit that I've thought some politicians were dirty and later learned they were good.

My point is that we don't know what's on the video or where the money came from. We don't know Jefferson's side of the story. We don't know much at all about the plea bargains.

What we do know is that the AG is being historically aggressive. And we know this is the only Democrat they have to chace.

If Jefferson's guilty, so be it and may he do hard time. But, in the tradition of presumption of innocence, and in light of the kniving manipulation, both legally and in the media, that this administration does, maybe we should focus on some of their questionable practices instead of beating this Democratic Representative who represents Katrina victims until we have some real hard evidence and not just Rovian spin on the news.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
keopeli Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-23-06 07:30 AM
Response to Reply #1
9. Let me try to clarify my premise.
I'm suggesting that the circumstances of this charge are suspect.

You said, "if we have a video-taped congressman..." which is exactly my point. First, you must believe this video tape not only exists but is really criminal activity. None of us know this, but let's give the FBI the benefit of the doubt.

Why is this not enough for their case? They even found cold, hard untraceable cash in his house 4 days later. Wouldn't you think that'd be enough?

They also have not one, but TWO staffers who have plead guilty to some sort of bribery charge (I know little about these charges, but would like to know more). Each negotiated a plea deal.

Yet, there's been no indictment. If I was on the grand jury, that'd be enough for me.

Now, we see this historically unprecedented breach of the Separations of Powers by Gonzales.

To me, this is a red flag and we should all carefully consider our position on this issue.

Finally, regarding calling Jefferson "scum", I'm not into retaliation, but if the guy is guilty or even indicted I'll allow some leeway. However, the presumption of innocence is a facet of the American ideal which I believe to be quite honorable and, in fact, is often considered the "high road".

Given the unlawful tactics of the current administration and the stakes they are up against, I don't put anything past them, including setting up a sitting Congressman.

Thanks for engaging on the topic!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ChairmanAgnostic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-23-06 07:41 AM
Response to Reply #9
12. perhaps I am naive, but I still hope that some within
our government do take their oaths to heart and do try to protect our constitution.
I agree, though, and take my hat off to your understandable fears of wrongdoing within the FBI, Justice and elsewhere.

I also note that Ms. Pelosi has been calling for an investigation of Jefferson for quite some time, and that is not a step taken lightly. If (and we agree, it is a big step) the allegations are true, that he was videotaped with 100K in cash, and he hid 90K on ice, he should have the integrity and moral backbone with resign, to honor the institution and to do the right thing. Unfortunately, from friends within the bloatway, rumors have swirled around him for years and his ethics appear to have been for sale on many occasions.

it is just my thought, but if I had a viable, legal and ethical defense to the charges being discussed before an indictment, I would tell my attorneys to go pound sand and explain myself to the public. In fact, I would look at that action is necessary for our republic to function. There is too much legalistic posturing already. Just look at the Libby indictment and the pre-trial "trial" by news release being practiced by his defense team. Look at the word splitting offered by McClellon and now Snow. Look at the hiding behind legalistic defenses practiced by this administration each and every day. Even though I am a lawyer, I cannot stand much of what is going on.

Give me, instead, a good man or woman who stands for something, and if they screw up, someone who will step forward and be accountable for the error of their ways. Give me a person of integrity, of honor, of belief in our system, but without crass, craven gamesmanship. Give me an honest person to represent my interests and to work on my behalf. Give me someone who will make me proud of my country again.

(see how greedy I am? it is all about gimme gimme gimme!)
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
keopeli Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-23-06 08:04 AM
Response to Reply #12
18. It looks bad - a video, plea bargains, freezer money
I have no reason to defend his actions. He seems fairly normal from the outside, but I must demure to your more direct contact information. If he's scum, then let him fall...quickly!

To me, the case is strange. Plus, it's one of very few strong republican talking points right now, which also perks my senses.

I'm sorry to say I lost hope that anyone in power in our government was honest. I'm hopeful there are some and that they may come into the light some day.

Peace.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
wakeme2008 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-23-06 06:51 AM
Response to Original message
2. While this person may be guilty
something does smell about it.

You did a good post.

As far as I know, Jefferson has not given his side of the story. That may mean he is guilty or may not....

But I know for sure, if Tom DeLay was offered $100,000 to bribe somebody he would have ALSO taken it
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
keopeli Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-23-06 07:17 AM
Response to Reply #2
6. Something smells...
is a wonderful alternate subject line.

Jefferson has said very little. All I find is his response to his staffer Brett making a plea bargain:

In his only public statement on the case, Jefferson said he was "disappointed and in some ways perplexed" by former aide Brett Pfeffer's guilty plea on Jan. 11. Jefferson added that he has never "required, demanded or accepted . . . anything to perform a service for which I have been elected."

Still smells, don't it...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
babylonsister Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-23-06 06:52 AM
Response to Original message
3. Great post, keopeli. I've wondered why it took the spooks a year
to make this public myself. I think we are trying to be fair. ANYONE who appears to break laws should go to jail, bottom line, and I know there are far more repugs than Dems who fit that category.
But if it walks like a duck... $90,000 in a freezer doesn't bode well, nor does the tape.
I hope, when stuff starts hitting the fan with the repugs, their offices will be torn apart, too.
And I realize it's time to demonize the Dem; that's what they do so well, and the media is more than complicit!
I still wonder why the million dollar limo contract tied up with HOOKERgate hasn't made any waves.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Justice Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-23-06 07:06 AM
Response to Original message
5. Point is video should have been enough, why the need for the search
on the home and the office. Point is Republicans are dragging this out to make it seem as if there are multiple briberies, rather than the one, and that perhaps even there are multiple players, rather than the one bad apple.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Canuckistanian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-23-06 07:25 AM
Response to Original message
7. Here's the thing
Did they REALLY need to raid his office to get enough evidence on him?

Seems like they had plenty of smoking guns to use already.

I heard on the radio that there was a very lengthy search warrant. I'd like to know what was in it.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
boobooday Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-23-06 07:28 AM
Response to Original message
8. This is well argued, and raises interesting questions
It is quite possible that this IS a power game, with so many top GOP implicated in defense industry corruption, this could well be a pre-emptive attack.

The problem is that there is NOTHING too skeezy for this bunch, there is nothing you can put past them. They have taken their old saw of "moral relativism" to new heights of hypocrisy. Now, to find a Democrat with 90k in his freezer, in their rhetoric, will nullify the millions of dollars of corrupt defense contracts that are being passed around like bowls of peanuts at a cocktail party amongst them and their friends.

The end result is something like the store accountant cracking down on shoplifting while he is embezzling half the day's sales receipts at the same time. THAT is the GOP way.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
acmavm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-23-06 07:38 AM
Response to Original message
10. Frigging simply amazing. We have people here calling other
DUers names and telling them how they shame everyone here because the believe/believed the 'Rove has been indicted' story by Jason Leopold. And then along comes a democrat filmed joking about bribery and taking money, actually filmed taking $100,000. And $90,000 is found in his FUCKING FREEZER. And lo and behold there are people here who can actually find reasons to defend the guy. Everything from he's being framed to look at how bad the republicans are.

Hey, you people who are so ashamed of DUers who believed in Truth Out's story about KKKarl being indicted. Where's your shame and outrage for this hypocritical bullshit. This is the kind of crap that REALLY makes us look bad.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Ashamed_American Donating Member (141 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-23-06 07:43 AM
Response to Reply #10
13. I'm with you acmavm.
What have we been talking about here for years? How many times have we used the label CULTURE OF CORRUPTION? Are they only corrupt if they are Republican? If we are against corruption in government only because we are the minority, then something is wrong with US as well. A crook is a crook is a crook. I don't care what side you are on. Take a huge bribe and stock $90k in your freezer and you no longer have my support.


www.BlackEyedSundays.com
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
keopeli Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-23-06 07:55 AM
Response to Reply #13
17. If he took a bribe, then he should do hard time.
Edited on Tue May-23-06 07:56 AM by keopeli
Jefferson is an upstanding Congressman by all respect. It's not like Delay who avoided the law for years and years. I'm very tempted to wait a bit before pronouncing him guilty.

My point is that there is a lot of other strange stuff going on as well and we should be seriously alert so as not to be mislead by Rovian politics.

Thanks for your input, and welcome to DU!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
wakeme2008 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-23-06 07:46 AM
Response to Reply #10
14. While he is probably guilty and I have no problem with
him and DeLay spending time together, I still would like to hear his side and not just what the MSM has put out....

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
keopeli Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-23-06 07:49 AM
Response to Reply #10
15. Thanks for the comments.
I don't believe everything I hear.

I'm supporting the Democrats this year, and I hope you will, too.

Rove and the Republicans have all the cards - justice, executive, legistlative, media, phone taps, military...all of them. So, forgive me for being skeptical when I hear really bizarre stories in the news and point them out.

$90,000 in his freezer is just bizarre, even if it's true.
Gonzolez deliberately forcing his way into a Congressman's office for the first time in history - bizarre.
Needing more evidence when you have actual video footage of the bribery so much so that you break the Separation of Powers - bizarre.

When I see bizarre things like this, I think of Rove and the Republicans and I turn to my friends here at DU to help me understand what in the world is going on.

Thanks for your comments. I don't mind them at all. In fact, I welcome difference and debate and I welcome you here and all of your comments.

Peace.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
acmavm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-23-06 08:22 AM
Response to Reply #15
19. I'll support dems that act and vote like dems, haven't been
caught on tape laughing and joking about bribery, and doesn't keep $90,000 in illegally obtained money in the refrigerator.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
godai Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-23-06 07:54 AM
Response to Reply #10
16. Agree...$90K in freezer has no possible valid explanation
I don't subscribe to Dems good, repubs bad. This guy is a crook and I believe that he will resign soon. Good riddance.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Fri Apr 26th 2024, 12:22 AM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]
 Top

Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion: Presidential (Through Nov 2009) Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC