IS THIS TRUE ABOUT CUBA--OR IS IT PROPAGANDA?

[jiffy]

Your average income is $15 a month. Your meat ration is 3.3 pounds a month.

Owning a car is forbidden unless you are among the ruling elite. Computers are illegal. So is Internet access.

The prices of the basics you need to live on are low. A decent-size urban apartment rents for $10 a month. But everything is also extremely scarce -- food and gasoline to bicycles and bank loans.
To get by, you must supplement your income by moonlighting, working in the black market or getting remittances from relatives abroad. Bath soap, shampoo and chicken are luxuries.

Welcome to the Republica de Cuba, the 1950s police state and time warp that Fidel Castro and his fellow goons have spent the last 47 years “perfecting” for the 11.3 million souls who’ve had the misfortune to be born there.

http://www.frontpagemag.com/Articles/ReadArticle.asp?ID=23839

[MADem]

1. It depends on what is important to you--they're poor, smart and healthy

http://www.sed.manchester.ac.uk/geography/undergraduate/fieldwork/cuba/living_economy.htm
Until relatively recently, the economy of Cuba was centrally planned whereby the State administered the economy according to policy guidelines laid down by the Communist Party of Cuba. All economic activities (except small scale farming) were controlled by the government and all employees worked for the state. The State guaranteed full employment and state enterprises were not required to make a profit (although this is beginning to change). Today, the state plays the primary role in the domestic economy and controls practically all foreign trade. .

Foreign investment and the legalisation of the US dollar established a dual-economy with stark differences in wealth between those with access to US dollars and those who continue to be paid by the Cuban peso. Living standards for the average (dollarless) Cuban remain at a depressed level compared with 1990. The growth of dollar economy and dollar only stores allows the government to access remittances sent to Cubans from relatives abroad (estimated to be $800-$1billion). Similarly, dollars allow Cubans to purchase food that is unavailable through the ration book as well as other products such as clothes, consumer durables and other household goods. Access to this dollar economy has resulted in the emergence of a new social class many of whom ‘display’ their wealth in the public spaces of Mirimar while peso shops remain under utilised or closed in parts of Centro Habana.
...

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/3284995.stm

Cuba's struggling economy has been boosted by the successful export of its medical technology abroad, and by health tourism within the country.

Cuba's position in the developing world has always been something of a paradox.

Its low material living standards and crisis-ridden economy leads to a low per capita income, but President Fidel Castro's Caribbean blend of socialism has developed a public health system that places Cuba in another league altogether on human development indexes.

Basic health indicators are comparable to the achievements of welfare systems in western Europe. ...

Let me put it this way--it's not the last place on earth I would want to live, right now, but it is WAY down there on the list. And my wants are simple. Of course, if I were sick as a dog and without health care, my perspective might be different.

[StClone]

4. Are you saying

That there is something wrong with being uniformed and unhealthy? :sarcasm:

[MADem]

10. I'm not saying anything; just providing a few references

We know the economy sucks, provisions are basic at best, the people are smart, the health care is good, the literacy is great.

The downside is, if you don't like it that way, you don't have much choice in the matter. You have NO personal freedom. None. You're owned by the state.

[jiffy]

5. 3 pounds of meat a month doesn't sound healthy

And if chickens are a luxury, then eggs are dear too.... I'd sure get tired of rice and beans to make a protein...

[MADem]

12. Don't forget your friends the snake, the rat, and the lizard

And the fish in the sea that surrounds the island nation. Neccessity being the mother of invention, and all that.

I don't eat much meat...it's a very rare event for me. Three pounds of meat a month for me would be a LOT, but I know there are people who can't go a day without it.

[zeemike]

2. I don't know how much of that is true but

I do know why they are so poor.
We have had a trade embargo against them for 50 years.
And I would think that no one could own a computer if they make only 15 a month.
And the part about car ownership may not be right because I do know that Cuba has the largest collection of vintage cars that are still running. They could not get new ones so they kept there 1950 cars running all this time.
And that education is for all, and so is health care.

[jiffy]

6. The trade embargo...

....hasn't kept chicken, soap, shampoo from them! Nor the other ordinary things of life.

[tocqueville]

3. obviously the car story is false

found on a vacation website

http://www.pacificwilderness.com/Dive%20Travel/Cuba/cuba.htm

or maybe everybody in the elite was out that day

[MADem]

13. Cars aren't readily available. Most car owners own 'antiques'

The elites get the odd Japanese or Korean compact; the older elites tool around in Russkie shit. The folks in 'good standing' but who are nothing special get to keep their ancient vehicle. If Cuba ever gets free, there will be swarms of people wanting to buy those old heaps for big money.

Those three wheeled things that look like yellow baseball carts (to take the pitcher to the mound) are in a line of taxis (those are government owned, fwiw). The trucks are likely doing business for the state, to say nothing of that military looking jeepish/hummery thing in one shot.

I see several older cars in that picture, but if you look closely at the images, there are very FEW cars in both shots, for the population....transportation IS an issue there, make no mistake. This is still the norm for the average soul looking to find their way around via private conveyance (as opposed to bus):

http://www.georgeandpaula.com.nyud.net:8090/photos/cuba/Cuba06.jpg
http://www.georgeandpaula.com.nyud.net:8090/photos/cuba/Cuba25.jpg
http://www.georgeandpaula.com.nyud.net:8090/photos/cuba/Cuba27.jpg
http://www.georgeandpaula.com.nyud.net:8090/photos/cuba/Cuba43.jpg
http://www.georgeandpaula.com.nyud.net:8090/photos/cuba/Cuba03.jpg

http://www.georgeandpaula.com/photos/cuba/cuba.htm

[tocqueville]

15. no argument about your description

but there is a big difference between it and "forbidden to own" and "only the elite". That's how propaganda works : you take a "nuisance" and amplify it in absurdum. Like saying "in capitalist America all blacks are poor and badly treated"...

[peacetalksforall]

7. Cuban-Americans, Cuban-Venzuelans, Cuban Spaniards, Cuban-

Canadians, etc. have been sending money to their relatives for years. Cuban-Americans sent about 5 billion a year until it was officially stopped by the George Walker Bush regime.

The figures in the paragraphs you quote don't add up. In addition, many countries decided to ignore our embargo and started trading and travelling - meaning a lot of money rolled in.

The amounts quoted sound like what they might have been when the USSR pulled out and they stopped supporting Cuba. They were in dire straits for awhile. Cuban-Americans were holding us hostage and making our legislators hold tighter on the embargo. All in an attempt to 'topple' Castro.

[theanarch]

8. propaganda...n/t

[bbinacan]

9. And if you get HIV

you are shipped off to a nice little concentration ( I mean isolation) camp.

[GeorgeGist]

11. Here's some facts from our very own CIA...

https://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/geos/cu.html#Econ

[LA lady]

14. I LOVES my Internet!

Boy, I'd be unhappy over this!

private citizens are prohibited from buying computers or accessing the Internet without special authorization; foreigners may access the Internet in large hotels but are subject to firewalls; some Cubans buy illegal passwords on the black market or take advantage of public outlets, to access limited email and the government-controlled "intranet"

[Vickers]

16. We should worry about poverty in our country.

And we have our own goons in power.

[primative1]

17. Sounds like Propoganda ...

These days I assume everything I read is propoganda. Take your post for instance.

[blonndee]

18. Consider the source. n/t