I think we might be making a mistake in ignoring pop news and pop culture

[Stinky The Clown]

Pop news and pop culture are what they are. By definition they are reflections of popularity. The very descriptor - 'pop' - is a shorthand for the word 'popular'. Of the people. They reflect what's on people's minds.

In fact, I dare say that virtually everyone here knows most of the details - let alone the larger story - about what's going on right now in the Jonbenet Ramsey story. Most of you will feign some level of contempt for those who openly admit it, but you **know** you've taken some delicious pleasure in wallowing in the very same story or types of stories.

I'm not putting anyone down with that statement. So consider this: If you, as an informed political junkie and avid consumer of news that most Americans find boring or too difficult to understand fully, can find time to know what's going on in pop culture, imagine how much it is absorbed by those for whom it **is** the 'news'.

These stories are, in fact, a reflection of our national psyche. To the extent people agree with Nancy Grace's flared and flaming nostrils, so is our psyche breathing fire against miscreants. Consider not the facts so much as for what they might be seen as metaphor.

What about sports? So much metaphor there. What of the opinion of NASCAR drivers? Or Hollywood luminaries? Why was Mel Gibson such a story?

Michael Jackson may have hurt our side. How, you ask? Consider this. Michael's mannerisms, all that 'gentle' speech pattern, all his odd proclivities, make him much more like the caricature of the typical hippie lefty than the tough guy rightie. I know its a stretch ... but consider it. And maybe learn from it. There's absolutely NO direct correlation. There's aboslutely NO political issue at stake. But gauge the public perception and reaction and take a few notes.

Have a look at teevee. How far from some future-movie "Death Match' where contestents, literally, fight to the death, is "Survivor"? Yes, the real teevee show its mind candy and essentially harmless. But what does it say about us a nation and a culture that we cheer for someone to 'thrown off the island'?

I contend that pop culture is enormously valuable in gauging the state of our culture and therefor our electorate.

I further contend that we have a coarse and belicose society right now. Even further, the people who win at politics right now will be the ones who not only are willing to fight, but who are willing to pick fights. To 'bring it to the enemy'.

And right now ...... that woud be the Republicans.

To be sure, this is a short term phenomenon. It is already starting to pay smaller dividends. And our side is increasingly willing to pick that fight. Their side is is increasingly on the losing side.

But look to tomorrow, too. What will be the next popular cultural theme? Peace? More war? Blood in the streets? Cooperation on a grand scale?

I think the effective political consultants know this sort of thing instinctively if not as scholars.

Some discussion along these lines could well pay off in the future. How clear is your crystal ball?

[NVMojo]

1. Salon.com come has an interesting piece on The Battle of Blondes

today and wonders if it is a repuke plot.

[Tace]

2. You Sound Like A Media Professor

No kidding, that's the kind of thing I studied in Journalism school. : )

[skooooo]

8. Critical Thinking....

...the wonder drug.

[democracyindanger]

3. On a more personal level

it comes down to one-on-one communication. To change somebody's vote you have to change their mind. And if all you can converse with somebody about is politics, you risk being seen as a bore. And nobody likes a bore.

You stand a lot better chance connecting with someone if you can speak knowledgeably about sports or cooking or People Magazine silliness before getting into high crimes and misdemeanors.

[Stinky The Clown]

6. Yup .... those religious shows of a few years ago .....

.... that angel thing with Della Reese ... that other one where the young girl communicated with God ..... I can't remember the name of either one ..... weren't they harbingers of and carriers for, the rise of the religious right? No, they were not the root cause and they were not really cheerleaders for the movement. But they WERE leading indicators and, later, symptoms.

They would have formed a real basis for staring a discussion ......

[LiberalArkie]

4. You are correct. I go back to a statement by a "John Doe" Iraqi citizen

on the street in Baghdad at the start of the war.

Americans are the least educated, most highly entertained people on Earth.

[rodeodance]

5. i hear cable ratings are up with the JonBenet story.

[skooooo]

7. "Snakes on a Plane".....

The popularity of this movie, even before its release, has interested me. I haven't seen the film yet, but will today. Still I'm struck how the topic - chaos on a plane somehow ties into all the terrorism hysteria. I don't have any well thought-out analysis of
why people are attracted to this, but I have to think that it may be an outlet for facing and exorcising emotions around the "terror alerts," shoe bombers, hijacks, etc. etc. that seem to dominate the preoccupy us these days.

[badgerpup]

9. You gots a point there...

...don't have a TV now, so am out of the loop on a lot of pop culture.
But y'all remember Alan Alda, Phil Donohue, Bill Cosby and
the Rise Of The Sensitive, Caring Male (as opposed to the Marlborough Man)?
Seems there was a bit of sea change in the society as a whole, now that you mention it...

[zalinda]

10. I noticed that the TV line-up has changed with this

administration. With Clinton, sit coms were really popular. With Bush, it's CSI. Why? Because we were happy with Clinton, and with Bush, we want to know WHY?

zalinda

[Stinky The Clown]

12. " ..... with Bush, we want to know WHY?"

I hope that's the case. I fear it is because we want to 'get the bad guys' and that 'bad guys are everywhere and we need to be kept safe'.

But yeah ... a definite correlation.

[MindPilot]

11. Not pop-ular culture but "pop!" culture

My family and I were talking about this very thing just last night. I call it POP! culture because it seems to be happening and changing so fast. In my fifty years, I can't recall anytime when the catch phrase from a movie (Snakes on a Plane) was in widespread use even before the movie's release.

When two of the most popular "news" shows are parodies of other "news" shows that have become essentially parodies of themselves, it's a pretty clear sign that our national psyche is overwhelmed. Deep down I think even those who eschew real news and absorb only the POP! culture version know it's primarily fear-mongering bullshit. A perfect example is the recent pieces on CNN about the liquid bomb scare. What was once one of the most respected news-gathering organizations in the world have themselves become a parody that makes the Onion look like CBS in the days of Murrow.

[DeepModem Mom]

13. K&R

[calimary]

14. I know whatcha mean! My next column is called "Snakes on a Brain."

Tace may have it posted a little later...

Sorry, couldn't be helped!

:evilgrin:

[gulliver]

15. I agree, but "pop" isn't just metaphor...

... any more than play is just childish.

Pop culture is a fun set of games because it exercises fundamental ideas in actual use cases. The football player who shows self-sacrifice in throwing a key block is not engaging in metaphorical courage. It is actual courage. Paris Hilton has much to teach us. Our core "liberal" ideas are not an isolated section of human mental territory but a cross-section. Truth, courage, hard work, compassion, tolerance...all play roles in all walks of life whether at the symphony orchestra or in the mosh pit or at the NASCAR track.

The worst thing about pop culture is the temptation to live vicariously. This new age of interactive media (as opposed to broadcast/spectator) is a great development, though. It is participative. I see a canniness in my own kids that I know I never had at their age.

[Stinky The Clown]

16. You're correct, of course ......

... my point was that we ignore it for the barometer it is at our own peril.

'Ineractive' vs 'broadcast/spectator' ..... interesting take. Thanks!

[gulliver]

22. You make an excellent point...

... and an excellent thread BTW.

[skids]

17. I have no problem with pop news discussion IF...

...the point of the thread is how to turn it to political advantage, or some street politics jujitsu on how to use the inane conversations about it that will befall you to segque into some meaningful discourse.

But when presented simply as a topic of it's own, pop news results in nothing but flame wars. Go read the pop news threads. Read some of the threads next to them, sinking to the bottom of the list with 1/10th the replies. Evaluate the quality of discussion in each. Note the number of trolls and agitators in each. Tell me then if you think pop news is worth all the time DUers spend on it.

[Stinky The Clown]

18. The OP wasn't about anything to do with DU

It was abut the topic it was about.

Acting 'stupid' about pop culture and pop news is a bipartisan activity.

To the point you're making, there has been some chatter on DU, specifically, to have a pop news forum. I'd be just fine with that. That said, I suspect it would be a focused version of the Lounge. My posit was intended to be much more serious than that.

[skids]

19. A pop news "ghetto forum" sounds awesome to me. n/t

[calimary]

20. All kidding aside, this is a MOST valuable observation.

When I was on the air, we always had our antennas up to detect "water-cooler talk" and the most minute changes and adjustments in that. It's why Keith Olbermann finds himself admittedly dragged, kicking and screaming, to stories about "TomKat" and Britney etc. It's "What People Are Talking About."

When I worked at the AP, my supervisor burned incense to USA Today's "Life" section. He scoured that, first thing, EVERY morning. If there was something in there we ourselves hadn't covered on the wire on on broadcast, there was HELL to pay. And if, by chance, he heard Howard Stern or the local "Morning Zoo" crew on the radio talking about a story they got from the AP wire, he was walking on air for the rest of the day. I remember when Peewee Herman was the big story - and we got the directive from him to "keep this story alive!" We had to beat that damned thing to death, until he finally decided that yes, we HAD INDEED beaten that story to death. But if people were talking about it, he wanted in. And all over it like the proverbial cheap suit. That's because it's what the members (our affiliates) wanted. If we DIDN'T have whatever it was, the "IT" of the day, they'd call in and complain. If even ONE member did that, we'd all catch hell - again, because the perception was that if one member was pissed enough to call in about it, there might be 12 to 20 or more others who hadn't, but who still felt that same way.

In fact, I covered the Zsa Zsa Gabor cop-slapping trial - like that same proverbial cheap suit. I was there all day, every day it continued. Most of the time, while it was ongoing, that was pretty much all I covered, day in and day out. I didn't dare miss a nano-second. I mean, what if she came out and spoke in one of those impromptu gang-bangs - what we'd call those big press gaggles when you have maybe 20 or 30 different media people all crowding around the newsmaker-du-jour, sticking microphones and cameras in his or her face to get the soundbite of the day - the one that everybody would pick up on and be talking about, and I missed it? I didn't dare arrive late or leave early. Had to wring every last drop out of it. And when I'd call in from the courthouse at various times during the day, the supervisor on duty would always tease me about being on the stupid, ridiculous Zsa Zsa beat, but only begrudgingly. He would also invariably add something about how - the whole world could be falling apart with serious stuff happening everywhere, and all the members cared about was MORE ZSA ZSA!!! It wasn't his idea of momentous news coverage, but he had to acknowledge the reality, and did. Whenever I called in to feed, they'd shoot me straight in to a tape editor to get that Zsa Zsa stuff turned around and on the air ASAP. Because it was what the members were clamoring for. No matter what else was going on, or where, or who else might be involved - kings, prime ministers, or presidents; fires, floods, disasters, crimes, or wars. Zsa Zsa trumped everything, from beginning to end.

And I'll tell you what else - when I'd go off-duty for the day, if I'd chance to have a conversation with ANYBODY outside the newsroom or the news biz, guess what they'd ask me about? Yep, Zsa Zsa. All you had to say was "Zsa Zsa" and you had everybody's undivided attention. The entire nation - no, the world - was busy for weeks, clucking about Zsa Zsa, and they kept up on every detail. It was a real stunner, I tell ya!

[Stinky The Clown]

21. calimary, was your former boss interested in covering these stories ......

.... just to satisfy the 'members' or did he see real value in them (along the lines I suggest in the OP)?

[calimary]

23. I guess you could say it was half and half.

Mainly because we were on the ENTERTAINMENT end. So, by definition, such puffery and trifles as a Zsa Zsa Gabor trial WERE big news at our end of the room. So, as far as our beat was concerned, he did, by necessity, see whatever it was as big news. I imagine these days he'd be all over Lindsey Lohan and Paris Hilton and Mel Gibson and all those cultural giants. And, yes, TomKat and Britney and the Jessica-du-jour. He was "Entertainment Editor." So what we covered was our version of big news - the new movies, people on TV. Celebrities getting arrested, marrying, divorcing, gossip, Michael Jackson, Liz Taylor in the hospital again, celeb obits, births, cheating, rehab, working, getting fired, getting drunk, crashing their cars, all that stuff. We were our network's answer to USA Today's "Life" section.

But bottom line, you ALWAYS did what you did to satisfy the members. And elsewhere in the room, there were other reporters, writers, editors, and anchors, all there covering their version of the news - the politics, disasters, big names, crimes, wars, international summits, storm coverage, anything Washington-specific, election night, bigtime sporting events like the World Series and the Olympics and the World Cup, etc. Someone in our department would never have the lead story in the hourly newscast unless it was on Oscar night or Emmy night, for example (when we'd not only lead the newscast, live, but we'd be supplying special reports and live inserts to air at other times around the hourly clock). Or, in the case of a Mel Gibson arrest or - yes, the dreaded Zsa Zsa conflagration - we'd be the lead alright, for as long as the story was fresh and there wasn't something else coming up to push us out of the lead. Often, at all-news affiliates, of course we'd be the "kicker" story in the hourly newscast most of the time. But news is news and it's what people are talking about.

We also had a feed filled with daily produced feature packages. There were many - there were several different format-specific music reports (rock, R&B, country), some sports stuff, money-matters stuff, "The Entertainment Report," and seasonal things like tax-time stuff and "Stocking Stuffers." Mine were "The Hollywood Report" and "Eye on TV." I later learned that "Eye on TV" was the most-cleared feature of any we fed - and all it was, basically, was a 60-second rundown of what was on TV that night, preferably with a soundbite from some relevant interview I'd done. Fluff sold then, and sells now. In fact, it's even crazier now, what with the explosion of entertainment-type coverage and TMZ.com and the paparrazzi who are even more nuts now than they were then. Everything's louder, pushier, riskier, more over-the-top. My beat, mainly, was prime time and feature film. But with what's mushroomed in TV and cable, I doubt I'd be able to keep up. They probably will further subdivide that beat, if they haven't already. I retired from that ten years ago, and even back then I was struggling to keep up with everything that happened - for which I was singlehandedly responsible. Damn near drove me nuts, but everybody loved asking me about my job. My husband used to joke that when people in any situation found out what I did for a living, that was the end of any other conversation in the room for the whole rest of the evening.

[Totally Committed]

24. Okay, so we had "Touched by an Angel"... and that foretold the

Fundies taking over. The "Jerry Springer Show" got us ready for the dignity of the Republicans controlling both Houses of Congress. Then, we had the books and movies of the "Left Behind" series, and now we have some serious Rapturists waiting with their bags packed. Then, we had "College Girls Gone Wild", and got Jenna Bush changing into her swimsuit on the beach with a camera up her wahoo the whole time.

So... what's going on now in pop culture that could be a clue to the future? There's "Project Runway" getting us ready for the burgening Obesity Epidemic (did you know on that show a size 8 or 10 is considered "Plus Size"??? I kid you not.) "The Sopranos" helps us relate to the Bush administration. Maybe Cheney is just a "conflicted" gangster that loosens his aggressions by shooting people in the face. Tony's boat, "The Stugats" provides us with a new nickname for W. (It is particularly appropos to our fearless leader... it means "Pr*ck" in Italian.) Britney Spears is pregnant for, what, the third year in a row? Maybe this posrtends a bunch of blone, bubble-headed nitwits staging their Fundie-inspired Preg-a-palooza for the next decade to stave off all the brown faces coming across our boarders and doing all those menial jobs the off-shored rocket scientists want so badly now. (We could say that "Bridget and Bernie", that shickseh-and-the-mensch comedy from the 60's that enraged Jews everywhere so much that it was only on for 6 weeks before being pulled because it depicted a marriage between a Jew and a Gentile got us ready for the troubles in the Middle East, but that would be a stretch... wouldn't it?) "West Wing" and "Commander-in-Chief" are both cancelled. Ooooh.... look out Republicans. We're done with the sublimation, and we're ready to rumble... please tell me that's what it means! "Brokeback Mountain" could portend Gay Marriage finally... if this were an alternate universe.

I dunno... did I miss anything? Tell me, Stinky, where the hell were you going with this????

TC

[Stinky The Clown]

25. Honestly ...... it was a lot more disconnected than what you posed ....

... I don't so much see a direct correlation between, say cancelling 'West Wing' and a change in adminstrations. Its MUCH more about tone and trends and attitudes. Father Knows Best 'says' something about its viewers that's very different from those who watch South Park.

[Totally Committed]

26. So, America is watching... what?

"Project Runway"

"The Sopranos"

"Desperate Housewives"

"American Idol"

and anything on The Food Channel

=

Bulimic models and fashionistas

Gangsters

Nyphomaniacs

People desperate for their 15 minutes of fame

and Food-a-holics

taking over??????

Am I missing the point? I know I am.

TC