Dean calls latest email a "brilliant ploy"

[DJcairo]

Geez, if I were a Dean supporter this would make me sick. Is this all a joke to suck a few more dollars out of his loyal fan base just to pay of debts when he knows he can't win?

As the day went on, there was some confusion about precisely what Dr. Dean had intended to say with that e-mail message. Dr. Dean's campaign chief, Roy Neel, told reporters that they should not read the words from Dr. Dean saying that he would be "out of the race" if he lost Wisconsin to mean that he would be out of the race if he lost Wisconsin

"I don't think that e-mail says that if he loses Wisconsin, he will get out of the race," Mr. Neel said.

Asked about the confusion sowed by Mr. Neel's remarks, Dr. Dean merely referred to the words of his e-mail message, which he called "a brilliant ploy."

Asked what he meant, Dr. Dean said, "It depends what your definition of the word 'ploy' is," adding that he sees a ploy as a "strategy."

But he warned, do or die, he would be a no-show at the Democrats' Jefferson-Jackson Day dinner in Milwaukee this weekend

"My son's last hockey game as a senior is on the 14th of February," he said. "I promised myself no matter what happened in this campaign I would be there."

http://nytimes.com/2004/02/06/politics/campaign/06CAMP.html?pagewanted=2&hp

[blm]

1. No surprise.

.

[LuminousX]

2. Consider yourself lucky you aren't a Dean supporter

And if I may add... we don't need you concern.

Sleep well.

[Straight Shooter]

3. Here is the text of the email

The entire race has come down to this: we must win Wisconsin.

We must launch our new television advertisement on Monday in the major markets in Wisconsin. To do that, I need your help to raise $700,000 by Sunday. Please contribute $100 today so that we can reserve the air time:

http://www.deanforamerica.com/wisconsinad

We will get a boost this weekend in Washington, Michigan and Maine, but our true test will be the Wisconsin primary. A win there will carry us to the big states of March 2-and narrow the field to two candidates. Anything less will put us out of this race.

All that you have worked for these past months is on the line on a single day, in a single state. We have come so far to change our political process and restore our democracy-we can't stop now. Your $100 contribution will allow us to get out our message onto the airwaves, and win Wisconsin. Please contribute now.
---------------

And let me add, when you click to contribute, there's no pressure to give $100. That's part of a larger program to beat bush at his own game. You can contribute a dollar if you want.

I contribute when I want to contribute. Emails from the Dean campaign may spark my interest, but the decision is mine.

"Ploy" is probably not a good word, but neither was the word "gamble" when he referred to investing in Iowa and New Hampshire. I don't intend to take every word of Dean's and nitpick it when I understand what he's saying.

The NY Times just can't let anything go.

[joshcryer]

It *is* a good ploy. It invigorates the supporters.

The supporters need purpose. There's a reason the bat was only getting 7k an hour there for a few days; the people simply didn't know what direction we were heading.

Tell them, "Hey, we're taking it to this state," and suddenly they feel like, whoa, there you go.

The bat made more money in the last 12 hours, than it did in the 48 hours preceeding that.

[nonconformist]

41. My email asked for $50, not $100

It was sent at 3am ET. Odd that some say $100 and some say $50.

[krkaufman]

53. Should be based on previous contributions

I'd think that a well-organized, modern hi-tech campaign would know what past donations have been made by a given supporter and would tailor future requests accordingly.

[Clark Can WIN]

49. Thanks Straight Shooter

as USUAL it makes ALOT more sense in context.

This is look like just so much more MEDIA WHORE spin.

[krkaufman]

52. Election hyennas are a definite problem

No question. The hyennas that stalk each campaign's every word, attacking words and sentences separated from their context, are dogs.

[MercutioATC]

4. Well, be glad you're not a Dean supporter, then...although we're just fine

I love when people who habitually post anti-Dean posts act like they "care". Thanks for the concern, but we're fine.

The claim that he's raising money to "pay debts" is interesting. Care to provide a link showing that he isn't at least $3M-$4M in the black?

[nankerphelge]

5. It was brilliant

It worked for me; I sent him some more $. You should do the same if you want to beat W in November.

[DJcairo]

10. I'd rather give to the nominee - -

you don't go 0-9 and expect to win. Not least of all this year, with the compressed schedule.

C'mon guys...simple concepts.

[joshcryer]

12. This campaign isn't about expectations.

If it was there would be no donating and no one would care because they'd expect Dean to surf in like Kerry.

People aren't expecting anything, they are merely hoping that their dollar will have a say. And there are a shitload of indivudal supporters who feel this way, who vest their own pocket money, something far stronger than a popularity vote.

[LuminousX]

15. Thanks for the advice, but we are doing just fine, thanks.

[dansolo]

18. But what if the nominee isn't saying what I want to hear?

Part of the reason for continuing to contribute is so that Howard Dean will continue to be heard, and by extension, so will we.

[nankerphelge]

19. I'd rather give to someone who can beat Bush

Kerry will go down in the general election. A northeastern aloof Kennedy-esque liberal (which he will be portrayed as) who is afraid to take a position without holding his finger to the wind will not work against a pseudo-southern-good-old boy (which is how W will be portrayed) who takes positions regardless of what's popular. The democrats have no backbone; Dean is the only one to speak up for what's right. Why are we talking about beating Bush in November? He should be impeached today.

[EllieDem]

21. Ha Ha In serious times like these

people much prefer "aloof" than one with a bad temper

[MercutioATC]

23. Great. Let's see what "aloof" accomplishes over 4 years.....

answer: Nada.

[Duder]

26. Botox stock might go up

[MaineDem]

51. Even with the error that's not funny (nt)

[PAMod]

44. Good thing there aren't any candidates running who have a bad temper.

[DJcairo]

25. Dean can't even beat a dem, let a one a Repuke

[PassingFair]

34. Bullpoop, Clinton did

Clinton didn't begin winning until March. Look it up...

[DJcairo]

36. But he beat expectations, and the primary was not so compressed

[Skip Intro]

42. So, this cycle is even less predictable, yes? n/t

[LuminousX]

6. And let's face it

WE don't want him out of the race. WE want him to stay in.

[Name removed]

9. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

11. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Straight Shooter]

17. I've always got to come back to threads like this for a good laugh

Thanks, killbotfactory!

:bounce:

[virtualobserver]

14. I heard that the Bush people planned to lend Kerry an additional house....

so he could mortgage it.

[EllieDem]

20. I heard Dean fans were going to lend him a new wife

he needs some more props

[Straight Shooter]

40. I heard the Repubs were going to send more vets to Kerry rallies

He also needs more props

[LuminousX]

16. If this were true, why did they allow the Scream to reach out

like it did.


I think this is a bullshit claim and unless proof comes foreward, I'm hitting alert on each and every post that pushes this crap.

[joshcryer]

7. Hey, it worked.

Of course, he probably would've got the kind of support he has tonight just by simply asking for it.

[killbotfactory]

8. Wow, the NYtimes pissing on Dean...

I've never seen that before!

[mzmolly]

13. Cherry picking quotes again???

Note how they don't show the complete sentence. They cherry pluck one small bit ...

Asked about the confusion sowed by Mr. Neel's remarks, Dr. Dean merely referred to the words of his e-mail message, which he called "a brilliant ploy."

Asked what he meant, Dr. Dean said, "It depends what your definition of the word 'ploy' is," adding that he sees a ploy as a "strategy."

And the media smear will continue. They can't stand the fact that Dean and his supporters will not go down with out a fight!

I'll await a reputable source and quotes in context before passing judgement myself.

Meanwhile, I'm off to crack the bat!

[NewYorkerfromMass]

22. How's this for a ploy? After he loses Wisconsin, poll his supporters....

and ask if he should drop out or not. The money supply seems endless- why not?

[LuminousX]

24. Great idea

He polled us to see if he should stay in or opt out of matching funds, we deserve to have such a say in whether he continues or not since it is our money.

[Skip Intro]

35. Something about THE PEOPLE being in control bothers some

Its so, like, not electable.

[D G]

50. Something about THE PEOPLE voting for Kerry, Clark, Edwards

bothers others. It's so, like... actual.

[Skip Intro]

31. Or lets all just jump on the Kerry/Edwards bandwagon of ambiguity

Why not, the media says they're the "electable" ones. Who needs issues?

God knows, CNN wouldn't steer us wrong.

:eyes:

[mitchum]

27. 0 for 9

rock on

[janx]

28. Before you go leaping and hopping on the definition of the

word "ploy," I suggest you look it up.

It is a strategem, to be sure, but it has varied meanings. The journalist of the article may or may not have been aware of that.

[Duder]

29. The journalist...

Is ADAM NAGOURNEY, the guy Kerry supporters used to dislike. :)

[Anwen]

30. That's it, I'm switching to Kerry.

:eyes:

Please, you'll have to try harder than that.

[Skip Intro]

32. he he - n/t

[Duder]

33. Join the winning team...

[PAMod]

45. Oh God, where did you find that picture? I have a feeling...

we're gonna see that one again.

[LuminousX]

37. Wow, the beast has awoken

Maybe a new Stop Dean movement will have to be created. They thought he had imploded and he PEAKS yet again!

Of course, I'm still waiting for a win, but these small victories in the face of such hostility is fantastic!

[bitchkitty]

38. This is a $10 thread -

Go to Dean for America to contribute! :)

[Name removed]

39. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[TheDonkey]

43. I don't mind being part of a ploy

NOT.

What a cruel joke, all the pundits have been calling this a Wisconsin or BUST. If he loses, Dean is toast and will only lead his followers into a path of money loss and empty hope.

o~well

[janx]

46. Good for the pundits!

Damn! We should listen to them more often!

[Hoppin_Mad]

47. The "ploy" is we're not quitting and never said we were !

Dean is now even suggesting a Wisconsin loss might not end his campaign. "Then we'll go on to Utah, Idaho, Hawaii, to Super Tuesday," he told reporters.

Dean has said he would not seek to damage the party, although he has shown no signs of tempering his criticism of Kerry and "Washington Democrats" in general. He also said he will not back down until a candidate has a majority of delegates. "

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/4165115/

Like a football game where one team is ahead by 4 touchdowns with 5 minutes to go - the other team is 'out of the game' - but there is no quitting. Dean might be 'out of the race' if he doesn't win soon - but I doubt he will quit and never said he would.

Most of the media are too stupid to figure this out, and en masse said he was going to quit - He said no such thing.



Sorry to use a sports analogy !

[vision]

48. See I read it different than the some did

I never thought that it meant that Dean would conceed if he lost Wisconsin. This was of course how the right wing wanted it to mean, Paul Harvey mentioned it today on "The rest of the Story" so that is how "we" the voting public I think were meant to take it so that we would give up on Dean.

Instead I thought it meant that gaining the nomination outright would probably be out of the question and in essence Dean would be out of the the race. This would not mean that he would or should have to drop out as he could continue to the convention as Kucinich and Sharpton are obviously doing.

The use of the word "ploy" is just stupid no matter what was meant. It appears manipulative, even if not meant that way, he should have just used "strategy."