A Message to the Kerry Supporters at DU

[AtomicKitten]

This is a message to the Kerry supporters at DU.

I'd like to introduce myself. I think I need to after all the insults you hurled at me yesterday thinking that you know me. I voted for the first time in 1972. I won't bore you with the interim details. In 2002, I went to work as a political columnist for a Green paper. I remained true to my political proclivities as a Democrat. I lost my job at the end of 2004 when I refused to support the Green candidate and remained steadfast in my support for the Democratic candidate I did not vote for in the primary. I took out a second out on my home in Santa Cruz and moved to San Francisco where my son took off his first quarter of art school to accompany me to a swing state to work for the Democratic candidate I did not support in the primary.

I posted something yesterday asking John Kerry to give back some of the money he amassed for the 2004 election and did not use, asking him to give it to the midterm candidates that have a real shot at taking back Congress. There are 45-50 seats up for grabs and I want my country back. I want committee chairmanships. I want subpoena power. Rather than focusing on the commentary that was exploding across the internets, you chose to hammer the anonymous website that essentially took out an ad asking John Kerry to give back some of the money. In my opinion, you were chasing a red herring to avoid talking about the bigger issue.

The Kerry campaign has put forward truthiness but haven't been entirely truthful. They claim to have given the DSCC $1 million when in fact they have only given them $15K for this election cycle. The $1 million was given right after the 2004 election to retire the debt from the last election cycle. Now I know you're already poised at your keyboards waiting to let me have it so I'll throw you a bone. Hillary has given $2.5 million which is 1/10 of her war chest. It's something, but even that is not enough. That's the point. None of it is enough. I don't care about 2008. With election fraud rampant, the Democrats must win big. And finally after six long years, we have a real shot at that.

You seemed pleased as punch that you had the thread I started locked. Even though I ignored all the insults you hurled at me, know this: It doesn't matter who is behind the anonymous website. If I could afford it, I would proudly say it was me. Democrats are asking John Kerry to pony up some of our hard-earned dollars that we donated, money that really hurt most of is to give, because what matters is now and funding a real shot at taking our country back.

In the future, please feel free to express yourselves; that is what DU is all about. But have the common courtesy to stay in the vicinity of the topic and limit your posts to, let's say three. #1) Post your outrage and all John Kerry's stats, #2) Post your objection to whatever you object to including trashing the source, and #) Post your insults succinctly, give it your best shot. Knock yourself out. Continue your tag-team jihad against me. Insult my character, my intelligence, my life, not that you know anything about those things, but I give you permission to go nuts.

And then stop. Just stop. Leave some oxygen around here for the rest of us.

Regards,
AtomicKitten


http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=2893836&mesg_id=2893836
http://www.talkingpointsmemo.com/archives/010463.php
http://www.heyjohn.org/

[Catch22Dem]

1. Rule #1 for me

Don't let DUers piss me off. That's why I take VERY FREQUENT breaks from DU. That's why I've been here for over 4 years and still don't have 10K posts. I stay out of arguments, I don't take ANYONE here seriously enough to give a shit when they disagree with me, and when I get sick of the bullshit, I take off for a while.

Keep your chin up. :)

[wyldwolf]

2. Here's what concerns me

I don't want to see the ultimate pissing contest.

I don't want to see dumpster diving through every financial disclosure report of every Democrat so we can play "gotcha" with who has given the most money.

I'm sure if we look hard enough, we'll find a lot of folks who have money sitting around who haven't given any or who could give more. Then people would begin setting bars of how much people SHOULD give and why their favorite Democrat shouldn't have to give any more or at all.

I don't want to go down that road.

[hippiechick]

3. Coming from someone who calls other DU'ers "propagandists"

The self-righteous "woe is me"-ness is laughable.

Hypocrite much? :shrug:

[jonnyblitz]

6. I hear ya!

criticize Hillary Clinton and see how condescending and vicious Atomic Kitten can get. she once implied I was a freeper.

this post is completely HYSTERICAL considering who wrote it. I damn near fell out of my chair after reading it. :crazy:

[ClassWarrior]

9. This is a pattern with this poster...

...and it's not just about one particular candidate or another. He/she/it has a pattern of posting vicious but unfounded slams on Dems by questionable sources, and then defending them tooth and nail.

NGU.

[stellanoir]

4. no flamin' here

My mind is truly boggled by the degree to which we need campaign finance and election reform.

I may not be at real peace until some of the underbelly of our culture is represented in our legislature instead of a bunch of disingenuously corrupt elites.

Till then the masses have taxation without representation.

Oh well.

[mloutre]

5. I disagree with your core tenet, AK

Atomic Kitten,

While I appreciate the rationality with which you crafted this post, I simply can't agree with your basic precepts here.

I gave money to John Kerry in 2004. I also gave money to certain other Democratic candidates I chose to support in 2004, and to the national party organizations and action committees to use on behalf of Democratic candidates in general. That's fine. I had the money to give, and I put my money where my mouth (and my heart and my brain) was.

Point is, I gave some of my money to be used on behalf of non-specific party candidates who needed it; but I gave most of my money to specific candidates for specific reasons. When I gave money to John Kerry in 2004 I gave it to John Kerry in 2004, not to some unknown candidates-to-be-named-later in 2006.

That was my choice, and I don't regret it. I wanted John Kerry to run for president then. I want John Kerry to be an effective Senator on the national stage now. If John Kerry chooses to run for president again in 2008, then I want him to do that. And I want him to be able to use the money I gave him in support of those goals.

I gave my money *to* John Kerry, *for* John Kerry. I didn't give my money to whatever unknown candidates a bunch of random (and, all too frequently, shrill and shilling) bloggers think ought to get it from me two years down the road.

I gave money to specific candidates in 2004 for specific reasons. I gave money in 2006 to specific candidates for specific reasons. And I greatly resent other people who have no knowledge of me or my reasons for giving -- even other people as rational and reasonable as you seem to be -- trying to tell me or my chosen candidates what to do with my money after the fact.

It's not your money. It was mine, and now it's theirs. But it's not yours. So you have absolutely no right to demand that it be repurposed elsewhere to satisfy your whims or beliefs.

I put my money where my mouth is. So, in my opinion, has John Kerry. I assume you've done the same with your own candidates as well.

So I humbly suggest that you and the others who feel as you do put the energy you've been dumping into all this ill-advised and recursively-destructive Kerry-bashing into helping the candidates that you believe in raise their own money from their own supporters in turn.

respectfully,
M. Loutre

[cadmium]

8. I'm with you

Kerry is kicking ass in both TIME and money. When someone in the administration slanders a retired general or another Democrat he issues a statement at minimum in a day.

He has been consistently doing this since 2004.

It's too bad people who say they contributed in 2004 don't feel like they have gotten good return on investment. Since 1972 when I first was able to vote -- I have never seen more bang for the buck than Kerry is putting out there against the biggest and richest government in world history and likely the worst in USA modern history.

[blm]

7. Gadsden rules: Don't Tread on Me. Won't strike FIRST - will strike BACK

Show civility, you will get it returned in abundance.

Show intent to harmfully strike, and expect others will STRIKE BACK.

[zulchzulu]

10. I appreciate your work and ask you to respect others' advice/facts

The main bone of contention I have with posts about Kerry is that you tend to refuse to look at facts offered to you. It's as though you're on an anti-Kerry agenda at all costs.

I can how see people who are tunnel-visioned Republicans who might find Kerry as some kind of nemesis or enemy. There are still some people who want to sandbag Kerry due to the scars left from the 2004 Democratic primary season. And then, you get the Green Party folks that make the Green Party look bad with tinfoil conspiracies and stale, bong-inspired babble.

You've made up your mind.

You quote anonymous sources with faulty information from a web site where the owner of the site wants to hide like a coward. It's fitting perhaps to see such a hit site... the thoroughly debunked Swiftboaters had their sites registered with false information too. They knew they had to hide. That's their character...cowardice.

If the heyjohn.org owner wants to come on Democracy Now, that would be cool. It would be interesting to ask a couple questions regarding his/her agenda.

Perhaps someone could ask Russ Feingold about the million dollars he was given by Kerry. Perhaps John Conyers could be asked about how much he appreciates the Kerry team in finding out what happened in Ohio in 2004. Yes, those people did have to get paid. Perhaps the 200 candidates that Kerry has been campaigning for that raised over $11 million (towering over all other major Dems that have been helping as well) could be asked about Kerry's efforts.

Facts are good tools to use in an argument. Sources are more commendable when they are not anonymous. Homework is something that brings value in an opinion.

Spend some time and effort in trying to get the Democratic candidates that are running unchallenged to relinquish some of their extra money. That's where the lion's share of the money is.

[seabeyond]

11. you made your choices in 2004. it really has little to do with

with 2006. and kerry nor the democratic party, nor anyone else "owes" you for the choices you made. they were 100% you decisions. i am sorry things did not turn out different in 2004 that would have allowed you to feel good about those decisions.

even in your well laid out post, i do not see anything to knock kerry on. we disagree.

[BootinUp]

12. I kind of agree with ww above

I appreciate what you tried to do AK, I too gave money near the end of the campaign in 04 and then found out he had millions of dollars he wasn't spending. It did piss me off, but once it became clear he was going to bank it for his next campaign, I wrote it off. Not sure if there is much chance of an upside to having the war over it now. :)

[seabeyond]

13. are you sure you have your facts right in your post, per david wade

“The posting alleging Kerry has given only 15k to DSCC is 100% wrong. Beginning with the million dollars John Kerry gave to the DSCC at the beginning of this election cycle when the committee's coffers needed a boost to show a positive balance at year-end, John Kerry has provided hundreds of thousands of dollars, adding up to $3.5 million, to colleagues and challengers since December of 2004. The bottom line: combined, the Friends of John Kerry, Keeping America's Promise PAC and JohnKerry.com grassroots contributors have provided $3,540,553 in direct contributions, directed donations and online contributions to the DSCC and 22 Senate incumbents and candidates. To Attack John Kerry isn’t just cuckoo for cocoa puffs, it’s garbage, it’s wrong, it’s bullshit of the highest magnitude. You don’t take lies lying down, you fight back with the truth.” - David Wade

[SteppingRazor]

14. Locking

Please do not continue a locked, inflammatory thread in a new thread.


Flame On!