was there no Seattle bounce?

[Mass_Liberal]

what say you?

[redsoxliberal]

1. still 50 some delegates to be counted n/t

[Anwen]

14. Maybe I am missing something...

but why the heck is it taking so long to count the last delegates? I couldn't believe when I woke up this morning that the count wasn't 100% for Washington! Is there any reason why it's taking so incredibly long?

[markus]

2. Bounce is entirely an "earned media" thing

I only saw Bush and Dean and none of the blathering class. Dean's interview on FTN wasn't giving him any bounce.

I wish all the morning shows would reply like MTP sometime Sunday night.

Question: how many of the remaining counts are in urban, liberal strongholds (and likely to do well for Dean) and how many outstate? We make what I expected in urban Fargo and Grand Forks, but had our asses handed to us outstate and west (think over the Cascades).

[Mass_Liberal]

3. by bounce I meant

a lot more votes for us. By reports here, we crused Kerry in Seattle. But it appears theses votes, haven't been counted yet.

[Feanorcurufinwe]

5. Sorry, but Dean lost badly in Washington, just like every other state

pretending that he actually got more votes than he did, isn't going to help.

[progressivebydesign]

8. Wow.. the ghost of "Sore/Loserman"

Never thought I'd see that on DU. Every candidate has a right to have their votes counted fairly, regardless of whether or not you support them. Didn't the Democrats learn anything from November 2000?

[dsc]

10. not if they come at kerry's expense

see the rules are:

Stories about Kerry which are negative are evil satanic plots.

Stories about (anyone but Kerry) which are negative are justified.

Stories about Dean which are negative are cosmic justice.

Votes which may be Dean's but aren't counted are worthless and to be ignored.

Votes which may be Kerry's but aren't counted are special and should be counted twice.

Get with the program.

[mydawgmax]

12. Or is it anytime Dean loses

Its becuase of evil DNC plots to thwart Dean and nominate Kerry. Its pretty well publicized that the party leaders and apperatus has been supporting Dean for months. The Caucus attendees ( I was one) voted for Kerry in large number in my area (suburb adjacent to Seattle).

[dsc]

13. Kerry evidently won the caucus

but where are these delegates? As of an hour ago, there were still a number of places that haven't reported yet. Inquiring minds would like to know. They do have phones in WA, don't they?

[phunktify]

15. I luv these guys complaining about "lack of bounce"

Dean finished a weak second in a state he should have won. There is no mystery there. He also lost one of his most prized labor endorsmenets. Perhaps they forget all the free media Dean got for that and Gore and all the rest. Perhaps they have fogotten that despite all this and his huge war chest he got beaten badly. Perhaps they forgot that while the media had written of Kerry as an also ran he won Iowa in a landslide. Perhaps they have forgotten all this but the voters haven't and that's why Kerry si winning. His message is resonating at the same time as Dean's is sounding shrill.

[dsc]

16. I love people who misread posts

and then blame the writer. He meant where were the other precints from and had they reported yet. Given the difference between the percents of precints which had reported and the delegates which had been selected it was reasonable to think they were from Seatle which was a Dean stronghold.

[Feanorcurufinwe]

4. What do you mean? Kerry's getting a bounce from his big wins.

[mo_lurker]

6. Wondering the same thing

I kept looking at the results expecting the 49-30 number to change, because of what everyone here was saying about how Dean dominated Seattle. Never happened.

[progressivebydesign]

7. There's something wrong if they say there isn't..

I live near Seattle. Trust me on this.. I listened to the radio all afternoon.. EVERY single caller reporting from their caucus said that Dean won their caucus. Usually Kerry or Kucinich was second. There are virtually no Kerry bumper stickers to be seen around Western Washington.. It's Dean and Kucinich all the way.

In my caucus location, my precinct was the only one to have Kerry come out ahead. He either came in second or tied Dean in the other precincts. There were a few Kerry supporters in my precinct were argumentative, aggressive, and disparaging to Dean and Kucinich. Calling them both Naderites that are ruining the party now, by splitting the primary vote. There was a lot of pressue exerted on people, as I had heard from Iowa, to back the "only one that can beat Bush". They didn't win ANY Dean people, and only got the guy that said Kucinich or Kerry (odd combo) to join them. The Dean people recruited the 3 Edwards guys, because health care was their main issue.

This is what sucks about caucuses. You get obnoxious, loudmouth people supporting whomever, that take the thing over. There was a Dean guy that was that way in another precinct. Doesn't matter who they support, it's the weakness of the caucus system, because people have lost their ability to have polite political discourse...

[maxr4clark]

9. In my caucus precinct,

Dean got 2 delegates, Kerry got 1. Kerry had no support here, but got a lot of delegates at the caucusing location from "he's going to win anyway" voters. I live in area code 98115, which donated more to Dean's campaign (per capita, I think) than any other area code.

Dean did very well in Seattle, given how much momentum he lost in Iowa, New Hampshire, and for not having the money to compete more vigorously on Feb 3rd. But the number of delegates available does not depend on how many people come to vote in a precinct--it depends on how many voted Democratic in that area in 2000. Dean had a lot of support in precincts that did NOT support Gore in 2000. Thus, despite Dean having overwhelming support at heavily attended precincts in Seattle, he didn't earn very many delegates there compared to how many Kerry won throughout the rest of the state.
"Kerry will win anyway" voters live in every precinct, while Dean's support is very localized to certain precincts.

A friend of mine (a fellow Clark supporter) from a more rural area reported that at her caucus location, there were often fewer voters than delegates available. In my precinct, there were 28 voters for 3 delegates. The caucus system DOES NOT represent the number of voters that support a candidate; it puts much more emphasis on the opinions of rural voters and long-term party members, neither of which had strong support for Dean here, than it does on the groups that supported Dean: young people and other voters that are often voting for the first time. I posted a few days ago on this, before the caucus. Dean's loss here was predictable.

[dsc]

11. shit I forgot about that

Nader got us again. That bastard.