Dean People - As Annoying as ABB Loyalty Oath Pledge Is ...

[NashVegas]

The next time you hear it, or hear someone try to get you to say it, smile instead of wanting to scream.

We really do have the power: right now, even with all the attacks, Howard Dean is averaging 15-20% of the Democratic primary & caucus votes out of a field of 6. Those are people who are holding steady no matter what.

Whomever the nominee is, even if it's Kerry or someone else who isn't Dean, they are gonna need that 15-20% BADLY in the general election.

My friends, we are one hellified focus group and we are united.

So smile the next time someone asks you to take the ABB pledge, say 'yes,' and ask your tormenters what their candidate is going to do about things like NCLB, FCC, GLBT, and the other issues that have cemented our support to this candidate.

[KaraokeKarlton]

Everytime I hear the stupid calls for loyalty oaths

I honestly feel like voting for Nader out of spite.

[NashVegas]

3. No no no don't!

Play them for all their worth. Use your power for good, not evil :)

ps - awesome sig!

[KaraokeKarlton]

6. Don't worry, I'm voting for Dean

even if I have to write him in. He's the only one I trust. I don't trust John Kerry as far as I can throw him and wouldn't vote for him if my life depended on it.

[BL_Zebub]

37. What's wrong with using your power for evil?

:evilfrown:

[EXE619K]

9. Don't just vote for Nader out of spite.

Vote for him because you want to.

Isn't that what democracy is all about?

Vote for someone because you truly believe in that person as the best representation of your views.

ABB is a fine choice, however, that includes other third party candidates as well.

There will be more....come November.

[kaitykaity]

1. Dean's support is solid.

You're absolutely right. I don't see us going anywhere.

I believed in the guy when I first heard him, and I believe in him now. Even if he isn't the eventual nominee, Democrats still need him in this race. Dean is the kick-in-the-ass that Kerry needs to keep him honest and on the right track, not slide back into his "finger-in-the-wind" ways.

[stuzzy]

2. Sounds good to me n/t

[sleipnir]

4. Kerry is going to have to prostrate himself to get Dean supporters

if he even gets the nod. We'll see, but if Kerry is the nominee, well, he's going to have to come to me on both knees, begging me to support him.

[mitchum]

5. Shouldn't this be composed of cut out letters...

from various newspapers and magazines glued to a sheet of paper? Isn't that the standard form for ransom notes?

ABB

[JVS]

7. Since when is expecting quality from politicians hostage taking?

It is a rejuvenation of Democracy!

[kaitykaity]

8. What a NASTY thing to say.

Real dialogue possible after this remark. /sarcasm off

:puke:

[mitchum]

11. Thanks! I pride myself on my nastiness

You have made my day (and that's not the Stockholm Syndrome talking)
ABB

[kaitykaity]

22. Strange thing to have 'pride' in, but

whatever floats your boat, dude.

:eyes:

[NashVegas]

12. Thanks So Much for Your Positive Contribution

Have a wonderful evening :)

[mitchum]

13. Oh, I will

celebrating and all, y'know...

[stuzzy]

10. I find the ABB pledge so annoying...

right up there with the "give it up and support Kerry" threads.

I hate the idea of giving my vote freely, without someone having to earn it. Howard Dean earned my vote, and my respect. The eventual nominee will have to do that also, unless he's Dean that is, because he already has it(Clark, and Kucinich also, to a lesser degree). I will vote ABB, but I still want to be wooed nonetheless. I don't want my support taken for granted.

[Old and In the Way]

14. None of our candidates can win unless we all stand together.

It is as simple as that. There can only be one nominee, that's a certitude, but we can't win without every Democrat. I've made the commitment to vote for whoever is our nominee, and happily support him.

But I question the intentions of anyone posting here, who is encouraging supporters of any candidate to vote 3rd Party. Is that really the answer? Or is it to work with your fellow Democrats to effect change in Washington? Because change can't happen if we can't get elected.

It is as simply as that.

[NashVegas]

15. Is This Directed @ Moi?

But I question the intentions of anyone posting here, who is encouraging supporters of any candidate to vote 3rd Party.

I don't recall suggesting that.

[MurikanDemocrat]

17. Your original post states that

the nominee is:

"gonna need that 15-20% BADLY in the general election."

This seems to imply your support for the Democratic Party is negotiable.

[NashVegas]

18. Is it Not True?

That up to 1/10th of the electorate can help pull an election?

I'm merely looking at the political reality. I was at a Dean really tonight and every person I spoke to there knew damn well our candidate got sandbagged. People are feeling very jaded. Ain't nothing wrong with using it to the advantage of the issues we care about.

Rather than pat Dean supporters on the head and otherwise patronize us by waxing rhapsodic about how great it is that our candidate lit up the season, those who are courting us for November would do better to, as Cameron Crowe put it, "show us the money."

[MurikanDemocrat]

32. So your status as a Democrat IS negotiable

In your previous post you said you never suggested it was. Just trying to get your story straight.

If you're asking me, I personally would not tolerate emotional extortion or blackmail to gain a few votes from a few sore losers who can't decide whether they are Democrats or not, or can't figure out that ANY of the candidates are a FAR sight better than Bush.

When Dean was the anointed front runner for most of last year, and got all of the media attention, on the front cover of a couple magazines, and it was assumed he was the Democratic nominee before a vote was ever cast, I wasn't happy about it. I thought it was a mistake.

But never once, NOT ONCE, did it EVER cross my mind that I wouldn't vote for him in the general election. Because despite my misgivings about Dr Dean, he too, is a FAR SIGHT better, than Bush. And I sure as hell would never consider emotional extortion or blackmail because the majority of voters didn't agree with my choice of candidate. That really goes beyond the pale with me.

[NashVegas]

33. Newsflash

I'm not a Democrat, I'm an independent who left the Democratic Party when it became obvious the party was putting corporations above the public interest.

For the sake of the primary, however, I can declare 'Dem for a day' and I have.

The DNC has done just about everything it can to marginalize this campaign, yet it wants our votes in November oh so badly. And at least one person in this forum has gone so far as to tell us it's our duty not just to vote for the pre-crowned nominee, but we're also supposed to lend all the muscle we have to the campaign of our candidate of preference.

*thumbs nose*

Two days ago, I believed that if Dean doesn't get the nomination, I'd hold my nose come November and do my duty as a liberal.

Today, with 3,000 WA delegates still to be awarded and the Seattle recount going on, with 1/2 of Maine's votes still to be counted, I see no reason why I should give the DNC lamers any assurance I'll vote for their golden boy.


*smiles*

So tell me, what does John Forbes Kerry propose to do about media consolidation?

What does John Forbes Kerry propose to do about Americans being pressured to view our own countrymen who we disagree with as enemies?

What does John Forbes Kerry propose to do about NCLB?

What does John Forbes Kerry propose to do about Social Security?

What does John Forbes Kerry propose to do about the drive towards Civil Unions/Gay Marriage and help his countrymen accept it?

Hmmm?

[Old and In the Way]

20. Not moi

That was a general statement for an observation that I'm seeing in greater frequency, on the board.

Your post was is quite to the point.

[DannyRed]

29. I will try and put this as

politely as I can manage given my feelings at the moment in regard to a particular group of Kerry supporters.

You say: None of our candidates can win unless we all stand together.

Correct, and the difficulty of transitioning from primaries, when we are opponents to the general, when we must be allies (fall in love and fall in line) is large, and can be magnified unnecessarily.

However, there are lines that should not be crossed.

They have been crossed and recrossed, repeatedly.

Supporters of Dean (among others) have been called names, insulted, and worse.

In response, several of those Dean supporters have replied, intemperately and unfortunately.

Also in response, a large number have grown even more dejected, jaded, and cynical about the party and the people who trash them one month, and then expect them to toe the line, throw over their support, and shut-up/sit down.

No, sir, no way, no how.


Our leverage, I hope, will be applied, forcefully to both the eventual candidate AND, more importantly, to the party as a whole.

Watch your backs.

[Old and In the Way]

31. I agree there should be lines not crossed.

And I agree that they have been crossed and recrossed repeatedly.

I agree that all camps have crossed the lines, too.

And I appreciate that you agree none us of can win if we can't come together in the GE and work to beat this administration.

Very interesting, talking in the Kerry caucus tonight, we all want a strong push to the left on progressive issues. I really don't think that any of us disagree on the core issues, maybe shades of application.

The big disagreement is in the instrument that we prefer in effecting the change.

:-)

[joshcryer]

16. I ignore "ABB" during the primaries. It's simply nonsense.

It's nonsense until after the primaries. That's the point of it. Uniting after the nominee is selected. Not 'before.'

[Larkspur]

19. My General Election vote is ABB, should Dean not win the nomination but

if non-Dean Dem wins nomination, my enthusiasm and money go back to MoveOn.org. At least they are consistantly anti-Bush.

If Kerry wins the nomination, my advice to him and his supporters is -- sell everything you own to fund your general election campaign. Don't come to me begging for dollars.

[Old and In the Way]

21. Are you Bill Gates?

Man, if you have that kind of money that would take everything every Kerry supporter has, well, I am impressed!

:-)

[Larkspur]

36. Nope, not Bill Gates or a John Kerry

but the DNC still wants my money and they are under the illusion that Dean's supporters will automatically transfer their funds to the GE campaign war chest. Some will but some, like me, gave to Dean because he stood up for us, whereas, Kerry et al would sell us into slavery if it served their political ambitions.

I don't have to donate to the Dem GE fund. Unlike Kerry, MoveOn.org has consistantly attacked Bush for the last 3 plus years.

[NoPasaran]

23. Woo away

Dinner and a movie minimum. No dollar shows. And don't even think about getting fresh until I've had a couple of drinks.

[stuzzy]

24. hehehe

that's funny NoPasaran...still giggling

[killbotfactory]

25. If Kerry is going to lose my state...

I'll write in Dean.

And running a typical liberal waffling senator with a record more liberal than Kennedy is a sure-fire way to lose my state.

[RetroLounge]

26. ABB includes voting for someone Other Than Kerry

EOM

[Bucky]

27. You're not a hellified "focus group," you're an "interest group."

albeit hellified nonetheless

[mitchum]

28. LOL!

[Eloriel]

30. You're damn right we're hellified

And just wait to see how STRONG an interest group we are.

[molly]

34. I thought ABB was a Dean people invention?

:shrug:

[lulu]

35. Yesterday's Evan Bayh (sp?) for VP thread

terrified me. I know the VP rumor was put out by some right-wing pundit. But, because of Kerry's IWR vote, I know he waffles, I know he puts his finger to the wind, and it disgusts me. If he picks some anti-choice, anti-gay rights, anti-environment DINO as his VP, I'm staying home in November. I'm tired of this rollover crap these inside-the-beltway politicos do. I'm tired of my rights as a woman being thrown to the wind whenever the wind is not blowing my way. I don't care if Bush stays in office. Tell me, really, what's the difference?

Kerry has to prove to me that he will work for the people. He has to prove that his co-opted "power to the people" chant is real. A good liberal or even liberal/centrist VP choice would go a long way in proving to me that he is sincere.