Larouche Youth Movement claims credit for Ciro's win....says they teamed with Clinton.

[madfloridian]

I think I have heard just about everything on this issue, then I happened on this. The LYM is claiming credit for the win of Ciro Rodriguez in TX, and saying Howard Dean sabotaged it...implying their group teamed up with Bill Clinton, in almost as many words.

This is so far out of the realm of the real world that I wonder how they get away with it. A landslide defeat for the 50 state policy? This is so odd.

"The victory by Democrat Ciro Rodriguez in the runoff election for the 23rd Congressional District of Texas on Dec. 12 was accomplished despite the efforts of DNC Chairman Howard Dean to sabotage the race, said Lyndon LaRouche, after being briefed on the outcome

"This was a landslide defeat for Dean's policy," LaRouche said. "His so-called 50-state strategy went down the drain.:think: The electorate has spoken." LaRouche added that the LYM intervention—which focussed on mobilizing the youth vote at San Antonio-area campuses—may not have been sufficient in itself. However, with the visit by Clinton, the combined deployment ensured a level of mobilization which turned the election against Bonilla. This combination, of Clinton plus the LYM, is the most powerful force for the Democrats, LaRouche said. "The Democratic Party must learn this lesson, quickly."

"The LYM, instead, continued to build on the momentum of Nov. 7, with a strategy of organizing college students to mobilize a vote against Bonilla, whom they identified as one more "Bush-baby" who had to go. Clinton picked up on this in his appearance at Palo Alto College in San Antonio—where the LYM had established a strong presence—by pointing to the failure of Dean and the DNC to get an even bigger landslide on Nov. 7. Clinton said that there were 10 seats which the Republicans won by a "slim margin," an unmistakable reference to winnable races in which Dean and his allies failed to provide adequate backing. Clinton told the enthusiastic crowd which greeted him, "You have to decide whether this House seat is going to be with the 29 , or the 10."

Please note that Larouche never says Clinton said those things...just said it was a "reference to" it.

I would like to have it clarified just what Bill Clinton said, because in my wildest imagination I can not imagine his teaming up with them.

I would like to know how involved the LYM really was in the campaign. I know the DCCC went in there late on and pumped some money in it, telling Rodriguez to say on message, to get on the phone for money, etc. This was previously a grassroots effort in 04, with Ciro being strongly supported by DFA when he ran against Cuellar, but lost in the primary.

This is one of the weirdest claims I ever heard.

I don't know whether to laugh, giggle, snicker or :shrug:

:banghead: :think:

[The Magistrate]

1. As Dr. Gonzo Would Say, Ma'am: "Bad Craziness"

Some friends of my daughter were briefly involved with their 'youith group', and so my familiarity with their literature and lines has been recently refreshed....

[madfloridian]

2. In which reality do they reside, Sir?

Most certainly not ours. :hi:

[The Magistrate]

3. One Perpendicular To All The Rest, Ma'am

It is fortunate conditions are not apt, because LaRouche is actually a pretty skilled propagandist, and in genuinely revolutionary conditions might well be damned dangerous. As it is, he is a seed fallen upon stony ground, rather as if Hitler had been born in Anaheim in 1955....

[Monkeyman]

4. Oh Well I see the vets sent had nothing to do with it

[madfloridian]

5. This race in one in which everyone credits the DCCC for their efforts.

They really pumped some money in there. They sent a team there.

But we need to tell Bill Clinton about his new buddies. :think:

[Lithos]

6. They had no effect

No more than a fan at a game. They may have yelled, but so were 50,000 others. Either way, the real action was on the field by Ciro and those who were actively helping him out.

L-

[madfloridian]

9. They can have a bad effect by spreading stuff like this.

It is propaganda, bordering on very harmful.

[Lithos]

10. That I agree with

I was commenting purely on their claims about affecting the election. As noted above, Mr. LaRouche is a skilled propagandist and no friend to Democrats or Progressives.

L-

[davidinalameda]

7. what a nutcase

[madfloridian]

8. The only part of this that bothers me....or that I take seriously.

is the Democrats who do refer to our taking "only" 29 seats. Each part of the party has a job to do...they all did the best they could.

I have never in my life seen a party win 29 house seats, well now 30...and a certain group complain because it wasn't 10 or 20 more.

[Greeby]

25. I'm convinced, looking at the closeness of the numbers

That without election fraud the House pickup would have been 60

[NoPasaran]

11. LYM is full of crap

They have as much reason to claim credit for the sun coming up in the morning.

[madfloridian]

12. Great write-up at the DNC about Ciro...neat picture.

http://www.dnc.org/a/2006/12/tx-23_victory.php

San Antonio's local political columnist called it an "earthquake"
http://www.mysanantonio.com/news/metro/stories/MYSA121306.01B.Castillo_Metro.2fe5a08.html

The soundness with which Rep. Henry Bonilla, the one-time Hispanic poster boy of the Republican Party, was beaten Tuesday night was the equivalent of a political earthquake.

The seven-term incumbent, who as late as Tuesday harbored dreams of becoming a U.S. Senator, was essentially fired from office and replaced by Ciro Rodriguez, a former congressman known more for being a good man than a good campaigner.

Defying every political truism of Bexar County politics, Bonilla started the night by becoming the rare well-known Republican to not only lose early voting, but to lose it badly.

And the slide only continued. Without the benefit of voting analysis that will show exactly what happened in the coming days, the assumption has to be that Bonilla's Republican base either stayed home or strayed to Rodriguez, while more motivated Democrats went to the polls.

Yeh, they really undermined Ciro so badly they had to give him front page at the DNC. I was pulling for him, as we supported him last time as a DFA candidates.

[AlGore-08.com]

13. So does this mean Howard Dean is really the Queen of England in disguise?

;)

[David__77]

14. They deserve credit for sending dozens of volunteers.

But decisive, no. I personally am not bothered by them at this point. They're not nearly so bad as they were in the 80's.

[madfloridian]

15. It doesn't bother you they claim they are working with Clinton?

That they say Dean tried to sabotage the election there? That bothers me a whole lot. Of course that is not true.

[ISUGRADIA]

22. The People's Temple led by Jim Jones were known for putting

manpower into local elections in SF in the 1970s. It's not like the Democratic Party should have anything to do with the LaRouche cult.

[Infinite Hope]

16. LYM....what I know from experience...

First, their presence is meager and any effort they could have had, especially outside DC, would have been equally meager. One can embellish any effort and make it seem meaningful. Their efforts, at the most, made a difference in a few dozen votes but even that is an exaggeration. They're merely taking credit for what was already done. It was the redistricting and frustrations even among Republicans that won that election.

I'll refrain from the specifics of what's done to avoid them, but they are no friend of people in either party. They obsessively try to attach themselves to the Democratic Party for validation and credibility, but Democrats think no differently of them than Republicans and for good reason. While they're passionate people, they really are off the deep end and their tactics amount to harassment. The extent they're brainwashed is quite apparent. They believe what they believe, but they can't back any of it up when questioned. They turn to their magazine and search it for information.

That doesn't mean everything they say is wrong, because it's many times right, but the ones I've encountered (everyone I've talked to has had the same experience) they're virtual puppets. Their tactics are really deeply harassing at times...very disturbing, but I'll leave it at that, haha.

[madfloridian]

17. Thanks for the explanation. I am not that familiar with the group.

Though I am with their leader. The claims were just not sensible. Your comments gave me some insight.

[Infinite Hope]

18. No problem. I tend to be cynical of LaRouche...

and think he saw a great business opportunity. The students he employers or solicits as volunteers (not sure how the organization functions, but I'm pretty sure they are volunteers) work to promote his magazine. They stand outside the subway station near the office buildings in DC and hand out the magazine to anyone who will take it (usually interns, new staffers, and tourists...people who don't know better, including myself at the time I began my past internship;). Later in the day they walk office-to-office handing out the magazines as well. When someone doesn't want to take the magazine, they try another staffer and will ask to meet with various people to talk to them about it. They ask by title and sort of go down the list: "Well, can I talk to the LA?" There are many LA's so it's obvious they're just taking a shot in the dark with random titles to act like the meeting is necessary rather than a solicitation. They'll start talking to you and take your name. They take notes about the reactions and the next time they come, they'll ask for a particular person by name and ask to speak with them. Naturally, they're told they're busy and so they ask to leave the magazine for them. And they repeat this every issue of the magazine. They won't leave either - they're stubborn. They've been known to harass offices for upwards of 30-60 minutes to get their magazines out and talk to staffers. They come in small groups usually of 2-5.

[madfloridian]

19. Anyone heard anymore about this Larouche thing?

A couple of people on my mailing lists have mentioned it, wondering what he means about saying Dean "sabotaged" the Rodriguez election in TX..saying Clinton said those things at the rally there.

People are noticing. It doesn't make sense. Are these the guys that disrupt rallies and debates and get kicked out and arrested? One of the debates for sure on C-Span, they were screaming and disrupting.

I think when we read stuff like this we need to stay on top of it. Saying Dean sabotaged the election there in Ciro's district it over the line...and frankly sounds like a Carville thing.

:think:

[Infinite Hope]

20. "Are these the guys"...Yes, that's them. --- Believe me, Larouche is far from Carville...

...and all Dems. Some Republicans are closer to Democrats than Larouche. They believe in many of the same things, but Larouche and his youngsters are WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAYYYYYYY out there. lol

[NoPasaran]

21. I read a few comments about it on one of the Texas blogs

Apparently the "sabotage" was someone in some Young Democrats suggesting the LYM Space Cadets hit the road when they showed up the "help". Of course, that only could have happened on the direct orders of Chairman Dean, whose fiendish sabotage resulted in Ciro winning by nine points.

[madfloridian]

28. Heh, just saw your post.

Yeh, we could take that kind of sabotage any day. :hi:

[madfloridian]

23. Amazed to see how much they disrupt, and how integrated they are in the Dem Party.

Dean has been one of their fav targets. I am looking for an article at their site where they attacked him. There have been several. So this is kind of weird. Here are some others I found.

http://unv.net/2004/ALLPOLITICS/01/27/elec04.prez.democrats.larouche/index.html

MANCHESTER, New Hampshire (CNN) -- "Followers of perennial presidential candidate Lyndon LaRouche interrupted a campaign event for former Vermont Gov. Howard Dean on Monday before being drowned out by Dean supporters and removed from the room with the assistance of comedian Al Franken.

As Dean was addressing a crowd in Manchester, the fans of LaRouche -- who is something of an outcast in the Democratic Party for his extremist views -- began screaming that Dean is "a liar" and not a Democrat. They said the only candidates telling the truth are LaRouche and Sen. John Kerry, the apparent front-runner in the race.

The crowd began cheering "Howard Dean, Howard Dean," drowning out the LaRouche supporters as they were removed from the room."

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
http://www.thetalentshow.org/archives/000425.html

"Poor Bob Graham. He was in the middle of a great response about 9/11 (where he got his one chance to show off his Chairmanship of the senate Intelligence Committee) when he received the first of the night's many heckles. Before the debate was over, both Graham and Lieberman were heckled twice and Kerry was heckled once, presumably by supporters of Lyndon LaRouche. Of the incidents, my favorite comeback was this one by Dean :

AUDIENCE MEMBER: (OFF-MIKE) "It sounded like "Where's LaRouche?"

DEAN: I suspect he's in jail."

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
http://www.answers.com/topic/larouche-movement

LaRouche-affiliated political parties have nominated many hundreds of candidates for national and regional offices in the U.S., Canada, Sweden, Denmark, Germany, Australia and France, for almost thirty years without electoral success. In countries outside the U.S., the LaRouche movement maintains its own minor parties. In the U.S., however, they are active in the Democratic Party, and individuals associated with the movement have successfully sought party office in local elections, particulary Democratic County Central Committee posts. In 2006, LaRouche Youth Movement activist Cody Jones was honored as "Democrat of the Year" for the 43rd Assembly District of California, by the Los Angeles County Democratic Party. <2>. The LaRouche movement has been successful on occasion in securing Democratic party nomination for office.

The LaRouche supporters have employed direct action to circumvent blocked channels. In 2004 there were reports, from the Kerry, Dean, and Nader campaigns, of disruptions by LaRouche supporters of other candidates' meetings.<3>. A Congressional Black Caucus-sponsored debate in Baltimore amongst Democratic candidates for president was repeatedly interrupted.<4> A county Democratic chairman (in central California) reported that LaRouche followers regularly tried to get on county party committees. There are other reports of gangs of youths gathering for pickets of Washington offices. Candidates for federal office in South Dakota were arrested for disorderly conduct at a Democratic fundraiser.<5>"

[europegirl4jfk]

24. LaRouche and the Democratic Party in California

"A county Democratic chairman (in central California) reported that LaRouche followers regularly tried to get on county party committees."


And if the LaRouchie's claim on their different websites is right, they succeeded in California.

http://www.larouchepac.com/pages/otherartic_files/2006/060410_fdr_legacy.htm

On March 14, the Los Angeles County Democratic Party Central Committee voted to authorize the charter of the Franklin Roosevelt Legacy Club. The initiators of the Club—Quincy O'Neal and Cody Jones—are elected members of the Central Committee, and have been involved in leading the day-to-day organizing in California against the fascist policies of George Shultz's leading operatives, Vice President Dick Cheney and California Governor Arnold Schwarzenegger.

O'Neal and Jones are also leaders of the LaRouche Youth Movement (LYM), the nationwide youth organization of American statesman and former candidate for the Democratic Party Presidential nomination, Lyndon LaRouche.

http://www.fdrlegacy.org/meetings.htm

November 9, 2006
Reginald Byron Jones-Sawyer Sr.
-Secretary of The California State Democratic Party

When Reginald Jones-Sawyer spoke, he told us that our members’ intelligence and commitment to a cause impressed him, something he said he hasn’t seen in many (and then admitted, any), democratic groups on campuses or anywhere else.

I see it this way: The LaRouche movement is a cult, not even a political cult but a personal cult for Lyndon LaRouche. They use politics to lure young people in their organization to exploit them. Since Bush came to power they had more and more young people, unhappy with the war and Bush in general, joining the LaRouche Youth Movement. These kids often don't realize that LaRouche is not a true Democrat and they are purely and simply abused, financially and morally.

I'm studying this movement since a few years and if you want to get an idea how the movement works, you should have a look at the Factnet message board: http://www.factnet.org/cgi-bin/discus/discus.cgi?pg=prev&topic=4&page=358. You'll find there some real great accounts by several ex-members of the cult.

[star_power]

26. Lyndon's (small) traveling circus...should be shut down

The key thing to remember here is that Larouche & Co. stole $34 million in the 1980s by refusing to pay back loans from people they duped over the phone, specially by elderly people. ($34 million!) They have never expressed remorse about it, and have instead rewritten their organizational history to make it appear they were in fact the victims of a right wing/left wing conspiracy. Compare the testimony of ex-members on "factnet.org" and the organization's accounts of it's history. These people lie, a lot.

[madfloridian]

27. I notice they are still putting out articles saying Dean sabotaged the election..

I am checking some more now about the author, a woman. I do hope they are NOT being used by any of our Democrats in doing this.

I doubt it, but I don't take anything off the table. Nothing surprises me anymore.

[Cha]

29. Sounds like they're taking their

cue from mr matalin(james carville). Politics really do make Strange Bedfellows.