Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

Time to kill the RW noise! In fact, Kerry is one of the best speakers!

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion: Presidential (Through Nov 2009) Donate to DU
 
ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-19-06 02:58 PM
Original message
Time to kill the RW noise! In fact, Kerry is one of the best speakers!
Edited on Tue Dec-19-06 03:02 PM by ProSense
In his sophomore year Kerry became president of the Yale Political Union. His involvement with the Political Union gave him an opportunity to be involved with important issues of the day, such as the civil rights movement and president Kennedy's New Frontier program. Under the guidance of the speaking coach and history professor Rollin Osterweis, Kerry won dozens of debate contests against other college students from across the nation. In March 1965, as the Vietnam War escalated, he won the Ten Eyck prize as the best orator in the junior class for a speech that was critical of U.S. foreign policy. In the speech he said, "It is the specter of Western imperialism that causes more fear among Africans and Asians than communism, and thus it is self-defeating." Because of his public speaking skills, he was chosen to give the class oration at graduation. The speech was hastily rewritten at the last moment, and was a broad criticism of American foreign policy, including the war.


The pundits on Kerry: He nailed it

The same mainstream talking heads who trashed Gore give Kerry strong notices, and even right-wingers hold their tongues.
- - - - - - - - - - - -
By Eric Boehlert
July 29, 2004 | If Sen. John Kerry's acceptance speech were the opening night of a Broadway production, it would be doing robust box office business Friday morning. The same talking heads who seemed openly skeptical of the Democratic presidential nominee for much of this week gave his speech strongly positive notices.

On a scale of 1 to 10, ABC's George Stephanopoulos gave Kerry's speech an 8 "as written," and a "7.5 as delivered."

"Face the Nation" host Bob Schieffer said Kerry had "done about as well as he could do to set the stage for what's ahead."

NBC's Tim Russert credited Kerry for opening himself up during the address. "He gave more of himself than I've ever seen before." He added that Democratic delegates "have seen a candidate who's willing to take the battle to George Bush. Democrats heard what they needed to hear; it's on, full charge ahead."

Time magazine's Joe Klein told CNN Kerry "nailed it" and that he'd "never seen the man speak so well."

Meanwhile, Newsweek's Howard Fineman, appearing on MSNBC, said Kerry "has established the point he's a fighter, a war hero and a real guy. Now it's up to Bush to tear him down."

Some observers might suggest all those pundits have Democratic leanings to begin with, so their praise doesn't mean much. But they were precisely the type of commentators who routinely ridiculed Al Gore's campaign throughout the 2000 race, so the shift is worth noting.

The post-speech analysis got off to a comical start on CNN, when the news channel inadvertently broadcast frantic comments from a Democratic producer in a rage that more balloons were not dropping from the ceiling of the Fleet Center: ""More balloons! We need all of them coming down! All balloons! Balloons? What's happening, balloons? There's not enough coming down. All balloons! Where the hell -- there's nothing falling! What the fuck are you guys doing up there?"

No word yet if any FCC action will be taken against CNN.
Over at MSNBC, Republican pollster Frank Luntz conducted a focus group of 24 voters and found four who voted for Bush in 2000 and, after seeing Kerry, said they would vote for the Democrat in the fall. Luntz suggested Kerry would not see as big a post-convention bounce as Gore did in 2000, and thanks to the convention's relentless focus on military toughness, insisted that "national security is now a positive for this Democratic candidate." (Over on CNN, Washington Post reporter Terry Neal mentioned that a Zogby poll taken right before Kerry's speech indicated Kerry had already picked up a five-point bounce from the week's activities.)

Conservative pundits were notably restrained in critiquing Kerry's address. MSNBC host and former Republican congressman Joe Scarborough critiqued Kerry's style, saying his speech had the "best text" of the week, but not the best presentation. Scarborough suggested Kerry stepped on too many of his applause lines: "If John Kerry had delivered that 'Mission Accomplished' line and stepped away from the microphone the crowd would still be cheering. He blew through the best applause lines in a way Bill Clinton never would have."

The Weekly Standard's Fred Barnes weakly told Fox News viewers that Kerry's "salute wasn't very good." The magazine's editor, Bill Kristol, conceded that Kerry "gave a good speech," adding that it was a "bold and interesting" move to try to "retake patriotism for Democrats."

Some of the right's hesitation to trash Kerry's speech may have stemmed from the fact that immediately following Gore's 2000 convention speech, many conservatives denounced it as a failure. Robert Novak labeled the speech "a flop" and erroneously predicted Gore would come out of the convention facing a six-point deficit in the polls. And the Wall Street Journal's Peggy Noonan wrote, "Al Gore's acceptance speech was a rhetorical failure and, in my view, a strategic blunder of significant proportions."

The conservative pundits ended up with egg on their faces, as the public deemed it a hit and Gore enjoyed a robust and sustained post-convention bounce in the polls.

Kerry's right-wing critics may be holding their tongues, not wanting to pan what could turn out to be another Democratic hit.


Frank Luntz Republican Playbook -- Searchable Text-Version:
PART IX "AN ENERGY POLICY FOR THE 2lst CENTURY"

By Tom Ball
03/06/05

1) Make it about Energy Self-Sufficiency and Independence. The energy debate is ripe for partisan picking and the Democrats were smart to use it during their convention. Americans want to hear about solutions to foreign energy dependency and are desperate for big ideas and bold solutions. Energy policy is now a public priority and Democrats put themselves on the side of the future. Americans loathe the idea of being reliant on the Middle East for our energy needs and they were waiting for someone to tell them so. This was John Kerry’s single best line at the convention, and it continues to resonate even today:

PAGE 133 ---

DEMOCRAT WORDS THAT WORK

I want an America that relies on its own ingenuity and innovation -- not the Saudi royal family. Our energy plan for a stronger America will invest in new technologies and alternative fuels and the cars of the future -- so that no young American in uniform will ever be held hostage to our dependence on oil from the Middle East.

Americans are evenly and bitterly divided about an assortment of political issues, but nearly all of them agree that our nation s’ current energy policy is behind-the-times and needs a new, 21st Century approach. Right now, the Democrats are exhibiting perfect pitch when it comes to their energy message. They understand that if you play on American fears towards OPEC, Saudi Arabia and the Middle East, while also appealing to American ideals of invention and innovation, they will have a compelling message. But fortunately for Republicans, the Democratic message does not match their policy. If the GOP wants to gain the advantage you need to match the optimism of the Democrats message -- and that begins with a clear statement that the status quo is unacceptable.


Kerry's acceptance address was widely compared by media pundits to the progressive-era speeches of President Theodore Roosevelt, who advocated the social welfare programs characteristic of American liberalism, but also supported strengthening American military power and nationalistic patriotism. The speech, analysts added, attempted to portray the Democratic Party as masculine, even macho — much like the Republicans have historically presented themselves. Kerry stressed his qualities as a warrior and his ability to wage war when needed, a need to expand and modernize the armed forces, and a need to increase the size of special forces divisions. Alluding to the Bush administration's having fired Army Chief of Staff Eric Shinseki for demanding a peacekeeping plan before going to war in Iraq, Kerry also stressed the need to heed the counsel of generals.

Media analysts also characterized Kerry's speech as closer in style to a sitting president's State of the Union Address than those historically given by candidates at nominating conventions. Kerry listed specific proposals for programs and legislation, and offered a way to pay for them. He promised to train 40,000 new active duty troops, to quickly implement all the recommendations of the 9/11 Commission, to cut the national deficit in half within four years, to cut middle class taxes while repealing the Bush administration's tax cuts for those making more than $200,000 per year, to stop privatization of Social Security, and to embrace science over religious dogma, especially with regards to stem cell research, which the Bush administration has constrained. He issued a promise to improve homeland security measures and quality of living: "We shouldn't be opening firehouses in Baghdad and closing them down in the United States of America." Although Kerry clarified the broad tenets of the Democratic platform, some liberals criticized the party's evasion of abortion rights and gay rights, while others found Kerry's plans too vague. On the whole, however, the address was well-received, and pundits found that Kerry's forceful delivery had made the normally dour candidate more appealing.


For Immediate Release:
Friday, July 30, 2004

HRC: SENATOR JOHN KERRY'S MESSAGE OF UNITY INSPIRES HOPE

WASHINGTON — Human Rights Campaign President Cheryl Jacques made the following statement lauding Sen. John Kerry’s acceptance speech at the Democratic National Convention:

“Last night, Senator Kerry used his primetime spotlight to urge our leaders to ‘never misuse for political purposes the most precious document in American history, the Constitution of the United States.’ Senator Kerry called for ‘building unity in the American family, not angry division.’ He called for honoring the ‘nation’s diversity.’

“Senator John Kerry and Senator John Edwards are leaders who will unite the country, including gay, lesbian, bisexual and transgender Americans. Americans are hungry for hope and Senator Kerry served a feast last night. He knows the value of bringing communities together. And he recognizes that we, too, are family.

“We want a leader who will stand up and fight everyday for hard-working, tax-paying Americans, including GLBT Americans. Senator Kerry last night proved once again he is that man.”


Kerry scored a clean win tonight, and ends the "series" 3-0. In all three debates, he looked more presidential than the president, and he calmly, methodically and forcefully dismantled every single element critical to Bush's reelection chances. The polls have been starting to move in Kerry's direction and it seems likely that this performance tonight will only accelerate that trend. As a Democrat, I am a happy camper tonight. Let's roll up our sleeves, do the the work that still needs to be done, and bring this baby home.


Counting all coverage, Kerry speech top draw

Peter Hartlaub

Saturday, July 31, 2004

When the network coverage of the Democratic convention is counted together, John Kerry's acceptance of the nomination Thursday night drew more viewers than the most popular shows on television.

CBS had the highest individual rating at 7 p.m. Thursday night with a 4.3, according to preliminary numbers from Web site www.Zap2it.com. But when the estimated ratings of ABC, NBC, CBS, the Public Broadcasting Service and the three largest cable news networks are combined, the rating was about a 20 -- equal to more than 21 million U.S. households watching Kerry's speech.


Kerry's Speech: Blogosphere Reaction

By Jeralyn, Section Democratic National Convention 2004
Posted on Thu Jul 29, 2004 at 08:52:37 PM EST
Tags: (all tags)
We're sitting in the bar at the Onyx Hotel near the Fleet Center. It's packed, and there's wi-fi. It's midnight Boston time, and all we hear is "great speech."
We've got an early flight home so we passed on the parties--and instead will bring you some reactions from the bloggers:

First, the Conmmand Post has the transcript up. Alan has been doing the difficult job of blogging objectively.

Ezra Klein at Pandagon:

I believe, truly, that this is the perfect speech for John Kerry. It addresses every slander against him and absorbs the vulnerable edges into positive portions of a great man. This is phenomenal.

Stunning. He did it. I didn't think he could, not after Obama and Clinton and Edwards and Cleland. But he did it. He gave the perfect speech for this moment, for this race, for this crowd. He couldn't rely on his charisma and so he instead told the country where it needed to go. He couldn't do flash so he did substance...and he did it. There's nothing I can say beyond that...I'm sorry...I just don't have the words for it. I'm inspired. I'd forgot what this felt like.

Snip...

Left Coaster:

Incredible. He nailed it. I don't know how it looked on TV, but I can tell you that John Kerry pulled it off inside the hall tonight. Amidst some incredible security outside the Fleet Center, Kerry gave the speech of his life tonight when the pressure was the greatest. He somehow managed to straddle the line perfectly between giving the base its red meat to deal with their anger (something that Bill Schneider of CNN said he wouldn't do) while providing a vision and positive agenda for the voters he was trying to reach tonight. All I can say, without overstatement, is that the atmosphere during the speech and most importantly after it was nothing short of elation and electricity.


The irony of the biggest speech in John Kerry’s life was that by the time he took the stage, words didn’t matter. Kerry, along with his swift boat comrades (wouldn’t it be nice if all vets could have this kind of week?) and the video biography pieces (the best political messaging I’ve ever seen), reframed the issue.

This was a night about deeds and behaviors. As Kerry said in a not too subtle swipe at Bush, “Strength is more than tough words.”

Up until now this election has been about George W Bush. And up until now, this week has been about whether or not Kerry could speak the lines.

By the time Kerry “reported for duty,” he had already successfully (and I’d say surprisingly) reframed both the former and the latter.

As I wrote above, for days if not weeks we’ve been questioning John Kerry’s charisma, television charm and speech-giving prowess. Tonight, John Kerry and his team set us straight by reminding us that we had the question wrong.


July 29, 2004

The Best Speech I've Ever Seen

By Jim Dallas
Kerry's acceptance speech - out of the park! Natural but idealistic, easy-going but serious, small and big.

You gotta believe!



The Message: Fifty nine million people heeded Senator Kerry’s message. This time around, Kerry will have to earn the nomination, but the other candidates also have their work cut out for them.

More Kerry speeches here.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
Taverner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-19-06 03:02 PM
Response to Original message
1. Kerry is a great speaker - Treudeau nailed him as "Lincolnesque"
However, my beef with Kerry is he fights too fair, and assumes the American public is smarter than it is.

Face it, the USA is made up of collective dumbasses - in any other country Kerry would be hailed as a great leader.

In fact, my French and German friends are convinced the 04 election was rigged, because they couldn't understand how someone as amazing as Kerry could not win with a landslide.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
StoryTeller Donating Member (768 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-19-06 03:13 PM
Response to Reply #1
6. You want someone who fights dirty?
"He fights too fair." I find that a very odd complaint. Actually, Kerry's basic human decency is one of his strongest assets. When I talk about why I support him with my conservative friends and family members, eyebrows go up and so does the respect in their voices when I start describing how honest and gentlemanly he is.

There are a LOT of us out there who are so very, very, VERY tired of slick, corrupt politicians. I don't want someone who can pull dirty tricks on their opponents. I don't want someone who feels no shame at stabbing even their own party colleagues in the back for their own gain.

Sheesh! Shouldn't we be searching for the candidate with the highest moral integrity, the best leadership skills, and the most inspiring vision for our nation?

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Taverner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-19-06 03:16 PM
Response to Reply #6
7. I want someone who fights fair. You want someone who fights fair.
Edited on Tue Dec-19-06 03:19 PM by Taverner
But to get elected you have to be an asshole - sad but true.

Bill Clinton was a great president, a great campaigner and the ultimate boss. Having said that, all accounts describe him as an asshole who wouldn't think twice to load the dice.

IN a perfect world, Kerry would be looking at a second term in 08. Or he would be looking to follow President Gore in 08. But this is not a perfect world, and with the Karl Roves out there who aren't afraid to do evil things, we have to fight.



After the election, there was a report (in Rolling Stone I think) that described the Kerry Campaign trail. Something he did made me both respect him and lose faith in any chance of his winning. Democratic pundits and talking heads were calling the Kerry campaign, asking for sound bites and talking points, just like the Repubs have with Rove. He abruptly told them to say what they want. This is integrity. This also loses elections.

Beleive me, I like Kerry and would like nothing more than a Kerry presidency. But that isn't going to happen.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
karynnj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-19-06 05:38 PM
Response to Reply #7
19. Clinton and Kerry had different races to win
In 1992, GHWB had approval raring that went down to 29%, his son's straddled 50%. Perot was a very strong third party candidate who really really bashed Bush. At one point, Clinton ran third out of the three. Then Perot dropped out of the race with strange accusations against the President. (They sounded beyond bizzare then) Many of his supporters, having rejected Bush went to Clinton and many did not return to Perot when he won.

The "War Room" smoothed all though rough edges - but there were moments that were errors in that campaign - and many of the bumps came from baggage that Clinton really had. It is far easier to prepare defenses vs known flaws than to guess what would be made up. The Kerry people had "Going Up river" which very very nicely put his patriotic, intelligent protests into context. I would guess they assumed that was where they would be attacked.

In addition to having a far weaker opponent, the country was not at war and their was none of tha ability to play the fear card. The US was essentially an "abused spouse" of the W administration. The media was notr as consolidated and their were far more Democratic voices on TV in 1992. Clinton also got 9 hours of network coverage on TV for his convention - Kerry got 3 hours. Kerry was also handicapped by a flaw in McCain/Feingold that penalizes the party out of power. They have the earlier convention - so they need to stretch the money further.

Then we hear that some of the Clinton people who jumped on the bandwagon, seemed to drag their feet a bit. Lockhart very nearly got the decent honest Kerry in the Rather TANG mess when he returned the calls of the man who gave the documents - fortunely Cleland stopped him. Begala and Carville spent their air time bashing Bush and complaining about the Kerry campaign and speaking of ABB - which I never hear used in a general election before. Certainly they could have gone to his web site and found something - anything to like about him.

Anyone needs support to win the presidency - Kerry nearly won, in a year when winning was tough. It is very hard to get a message out when the media refuses to carry it.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Taverner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-19-06 06:22 PM
Response to Reply #19
21. But the key here is Clinton won the media
Kerry did not

This has less to do with speechwriting as it does how you send your message.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
politicasista Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-19-06 06:27 PM
Response to Reply #21
23. The media was really fair and balanced in 1992 compared to 2004 n/t
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
karynnj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-19-06 07:07 PM
Response to Reply #21
25. It also has to do with the telecommunications act of 1996
The media in 2004 was NOT the medai of 1992. The media of 1992, if it were around would have been far kinder in its coverage of John and Teresa. I have seen Teresa and John Kerry together at a small event and they are great. In some ways they are a more interesting, nicer couple than the Clintons.


Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Taverner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-19-06 09:18 PM
Response to Reply #25
40. I'm sure theyre nicer
And John Kerry would have been our smartest President ever

My argument is not that Kerry would make a bad prez. Hell, he would probably be one of our best, a Kennedy for our generation, a Lincoln for our century. He would have brought the country back together.

But he couldn't get elected - the Right Wing has had him in their sights since he rain in 04 and everything he said would be twisted - like his "botched joke" (it wasn't botched, it was taken out of context)
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
karynnj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-20-06 09:15 AM
Response to Reply #40
51. Actually the RW has been after him since 1971
He is attacked more severely than anyone at this point. It is valid to question if this is because he is Kerry or if it is because he is a thorn in their side. (Or both)

I think they will twist the words and actions of any Democrat who appears to have a chance. In the next year, we will likely get some hint of how each potential candidate will deal with this.

In 2004, Kerry did retain his dignity and integrity while fighting the toughest attack I've seen. McCain imploded after a much weaker attack in 2000. Only time will tell if Edwards or Obama will respond even this well. (Hillary and Gore have been attacked.)

From what you say, Kerry passes your test of a person who you find could be President. What he needs to prove to you is that he can be elected. This comes down to whether you believe that 2004 was easier or harder than 2008 is likely to be. The mood of the country is anti-war and the Bush terror card is broken.

The other candidates need to pass the could they be a good President test - some have passed this. In addition, we will need some sense that they can withstand the inevitable attacks.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Taverner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-20-06 12:17 PM
Response to Reply #51
52. Yep...VVAW...BCCI Investigations...
The RW has a long list against him, and why they will never let him become president.

Basically, we need another Gen. Smedley Butler
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-20-06 12:31 PM
Response to Reply #52
53. Actually the list is not all that long:
Swift Liars -- lies.
Anti-corruption efforts -- Not good for the RW, but good for the country.
Unlikeable -- easily countered.
Inarticulate -- morphed into gaffe prone.

Still, I don't think the RW should have a say in who the Democrats elect!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BlueIris Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-20-06 01:10 AM
Response to Reply #1
49. Treudeau actually said something nice about Kerry?
Wuh? I...musta missed that.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Taverner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-20-06 01:57 PM
Response to Reply #49
60. During the Primaries
Mike's daughter was campaigning for Dean, and was bemoaning how Kerry was hard to beat because he was so Lincolnesque.

Treudeau has had a love/hate thing with Kerry, but I think he understands how important he could have been.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
wisteria Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-19-06 03:04 PM
Response to Original message
2. This is the real Senator Kerry, The comments and reactions are real
not made up, like the lies about him not being able to give a good speech and not able to reach the people.
These prove that Senator Kerry can reach out and inspire people.
He is also one damn good debater too!

Thanks for posting.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
David Dunham Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-19-06 03:04 PM
Response to Original message
3. Gore's 2000 speech focused on domestic issues and gave him a huge bounce
Kerry got little convention bounce.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
MH1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-19-06 04:13 PM
Response to Reply #3
16. Well, there was this
in the second excerpt in the op:

(Over on CNN, Washington Post reporter Terry Neal mentioned that a Zogby poll taken right before Kerry's speech indicated Kerry had already picked up a five-point bounce from the week's activities.)


So, the "bounce" occurred too soon to be called a "post" convention bounce.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Blaukraut Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-19-06 03:09 PM
Response to Original message
4. thank you, Pro Sense
These are all objective voices comending Kerry's speeches and ability to connect with the audience. As a supporter, I am hardly objective, but every speech I have attended that the Senator has given moved me in different ways. His recent series of Faneuil Hall speeches, for example, were full of fire, passion, and emotion. There was nobody in the audience who was not touched by the subject of the speech, and its delivery.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Hav Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-19-06 03:12 PM
Response to Original message
5. .
I think he is only seen as a "bad" speaker when it is about making important points about complex issues to the "normal American" (no offense intended). At least I assume that's the case.
Besides that, I'd kill to be as articulate and intelligent as he is. He shouldn't be ashamed for being smart. He has everything what a President needs and I'm sure that if he had won in 2004 (or without cheating in Ohio of the Repubs), he could have been one of the finest Presidents ever.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
nebula Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-19-06 03:19 PM
Response to Original message
8. Kerry is an awfully dull speaker
Edited on Tue Dec-19-06 03:24 PM by nebula
The way he speaks reminds me of a college professor giving a lecture on rock science or something equally as dull. No charisma or enthusiasm.

Kerry has no ability to inspire whatsoever. The only reason people voted for him in 2004? He was the ABB candidate.



Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-19-06 03:21 PM
Response to Reply #8
9. Did you see
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
MH1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-19-06 04:17 PM
Response to Reply #8
17. Please watch this.
http://www.johnkerry.com/video/flash/042406_dissent_20min.html

John Kerry speaking on "Dissent" on Apr 22, 2006, at Boston's historic Faneuil Hall.

That's just one. There's a whole page here:

http://www.johnkerry.com/multimedia/

And a phenomenal speech to a conservative university (Pepperdine) here:

http://www.pepperdine.edu/pr/releases/2006/september/kerry.htm

where he speaks from the heart about values.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Nederland Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-19-06 07:11 PM
Response to Reply #17
27. Please
Must you prove the poster right? Man, he is B-O-R-I-N-G.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
MH1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-19-06 08:25 PM
Response to Reply #27
37. ???
I didn't think so. The people packed into Faneuil Hall, and standing outside listening to the audio, didn't think so.

It's a matter of taste, not an objective fact. Personally I don't know how in the world anyone who is interested in the future of this country can find Kerry boring. But, that's me.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
blm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-19-06 07:33 PM
Response to Reply #8
29. If that's the only reason people voted then that is sad - I voted for him to get the
books opened to the people because Kerry has always been the top lawmaker in DC on anti-corruption and open government issues.

I WANTED to vote for the first president who would respect voters as CITIZENS to be given MORE INFORMATION they need to make their decisions instead of the continuing secrecy from one GOP administration to a Dem administration to the next GOP administration....again.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
LittleClarkie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-19-06 07:41 PM
Response to Reply #8
31. He's fun as hell when he's pissed off though. We just have to figure a way to keep him that way
An aide with a sharp stick, perhaps.

But I wonder, if Kerry has no ability to inspire whatsoever, then what are we Kerrycrats doing here? And though I may have started out ABB, I didn't stay that way. I do believe that was true of a good number of people, though certainly not all.

A bunch of us stood in the cold rain for two hours the day before the election to see him. I'm pretty sure we didn't do that because we were that enthusiastic to chant ABB! ABB!

I watched folks as we got closer to the election. They moved up a notch at various intervals. The debates bumped some folks from ABB to "proud to vote for him." Seeing "Going Upriver" seemed to bump some folks up from "proud to vote for him" to "would follow him off a cliff."

There as an after election let down as people were disappointed, that deflated some of that support. But several of us are still here. And he very much appreciates that fact.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=273&topic_id=116893&mesg_id=116893
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
StoryTeller Donating Member (768 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-19-06 03:25 PM
Response to Original message
10. Great info!
ProSense, you are the Queen of Fact-Finding, as far as I'm concerned! I'm in awe.

And you're right-- Kerry is a tremendously inspiring speaker. My favorite speeches so far are the http://www.pepperdine.edu/pr/releases/2006/september/kerry.htm">Pepperdine Speech(click on "watch online") and the http://www.johnkerry.com/multimedia/">LiveStrong Speech. (scroll down to "LiveStrong" and click)

I also know a lot of people like the "Dissent" speech and the other speeches he has given at Faneuil Hall. Those are all at the same link as the LiveStrong speech.

I would encourage anyone who thinks he's a poor speaker to go to his http://www.johnkerry.com/multimedia/">website and spend time watching the videos of his speeches and his interviews and judge for yourself. You'll learn a lot about not just the speaking style of a great leader, but also a lot about the issues we are facing today.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
LisaM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-19-06 03:31 PM
Response to Original message
11. I saw him speak in Seattle and he was great!
And very in touch with the audience. He gave an excellent speech, in which he'd clearly researched many local issues, a lot having to do with the environment. He spoke well and got a great reaction from the crowd. So what did the local news report? Not his speech. The fact that he took his wife to one of the most expensive restaurants in town for their wedding anniversary! They actually showed the cars pulling up to the restaurant and gave his speech short shrift.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
beachmom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-19-06 04:02 PM
Response to Reply #11
12. Thanks for that story, LisaM. You know, once in a while we
mere "middle class" people like to be taken out to expensive restaurants for our birthday, too. I really hate the media.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
LisaM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-19-06 04:10 PM
Response to Reply #12
15. I know! We've saved up for a special night out more than once
and enjoyed those outings very much.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
blm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-19-06 07:42 PM
Response to Reply #11
32. People need to wake up and smell the corporate media interfering in our elections.
.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
beachmom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-19-06 04:03 PM
Response to Original message
13. Awesome post, Prosense, just explaining what REALLY happened
not the selective amnesia going around these parts.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
GeorgeGist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-19-06 04:03 PM
Response to Original message
14. Just a suggestion...
I think citing Tim Russert, Bob Schieffer, George Stephanopoulos, Howard Fineman or Joe Klein does Kerry a disservice. They are not credible witnesses.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
JacksonWest Donating Member (561 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-19-06 04:29 PM
Response to Original message
18. Lincoln wouldn't have been able to win any election in the age of television.
Which is the only similarity between him and Kerry.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Bjorn Against Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-19-06 06:13 PM
Response to Original message
20. He is not one of the best, although he is certainly not a bad speaker
Kerry's speeches do not particularly move me, although they are not nearly as bad as some people make them out to be.

I personally know at least a few people who are far more charismatic than Kerry is, but I also have heard far far worse speakers on the national stage. Zell Miller anyone?

I think part of the reason Kerry is picked on so much is because comedians like Jon Stewart like the guy and want him to win, but at the same time it is their job to make fun of him. They pick an issue to tease him with which will not effect his chances too negatively in the election, and if you are a Kerry supporter that should make you happy.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-19-06 06:25 PM
Response to Reply #20
22. Who do you consider one of the best? n/t
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Bjorn Against Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-19-06 06:30 PM
Response to Reply #22
24. On the national stage...
I would say that Kucinich, Bill Clinton, Al Sharpton, and Obama all rate pretty high up there.

And that is going purely off speaking ability rather than their actual ideas, because some of those candidates I like far more than others.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Nederland Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-19-06 07:09 PM
Response to Reply #22
26. Obama
No doubt. The man is amazing on the stump.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
politicasista Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-19-06 07:22 PM
Response to Reply #26
28. You think the media will go easy on him?
Edited on Tue Dec-19-06 07:23 PM by politicasista
You think the GOP won't take one word or sentence out of context while on the campaign trail? Something to think about.



I like Obama, but I don't need to bash other candidates just to promote him. That makes him look bad.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
paulk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-19-06 07:36 PM
Response to Original message
30. why is it "right wing noise"?
Kerry connects with a lot of people. With some people - not so much. For those people he doesn't connect with - it's a legitimate criticism, whether you or I agree with it. That doesn't make it "right wing", and for you to set it up that way is going to alienate people, not get them to see Kerry the way you do.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-19-06 07:45 PM
Response to Reply #30
33. It was specific to the RW noise!
The RW is making noise! In fact, the media is making the same noise: Kerry is inarticulate!

Why would you claim that the RW isn't making noise, and my post was directed at someone other than the RW?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
paulk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-19-06 07:56 PM
Response to Reply #33
34. oh, you're still on the "Kerry is inarticulate" thing
from here:

http://www.boston.com/news/nation/washington/articles/2006/12/09/kerry_sees_vindication_in_iraq_report/

Where you claimed it was a Republican who said it when actually it was just some college professor.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-19-06 08:11 PM
Response to Reply #34
35. No, I was referencing Republicans
Before Kerry’s so-called botched joke, taken by many as an insult to American troops, he was a second-tier presidential contender, but the aftermath has knocked him out of the race for good, said Todd Domke, a Massachusetts GOP political strategist.

http://news.bostonherald.com/politics/view.bg?articleid=172628&format=text


They've been quite vocal about it!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
paulk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-19-06 08:37 PM
Response to Reply #35
38. One Republican, from a right wing rag.
Big deal.

You're the one being vocal about it.

You're setting up a strawman and using it to paint people who don't agree with your opinion on Kerry as "right wing".

It's a tactic that will backfire, and end up alienating more people from Kerry than it brings in, IMHO.



Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-19-06 09:05 PM
Response to Reply #38
39. Do you want me to collect all the RW articles and blog links?
What am I trying to prove to you? That the RW hasn't been attacking Kerry!

Are you afraid that this thread will alienate the RW?

So far you are one of the only posters in the thread offended by it, and trying desperately to distort it!

Ah, the old backfire argument! What exactly will backfire? Pointing out that the RW attacks?

I really don't get why this tread offends you so much!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
talk hard Donating Member (549 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-19-06 10:36 PM
Response to Reply #39
42. you really mean to attack people that don't support Kerry
with your "RW" reference
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-19-06 10:54 PM
Response to Reply #42
43. Are you disputing the RW attacks or the comments linked in the OP? n/t
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
talk hard Donating Member (549 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-19-06 11:15 PM
Response to Reply #43
44. what difference does that make ?
You attack people with the same ammuition. If they dont' agree with you you call them RW.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-19-06 11:48 PM
Response to Reply #44
46. The same difference that it makes in terms of the
relevance of this post to the OP! Calling someone RW and pointing out that a meme is a RW talking point are two different things. The claim that Kerry conceded without a fight, which I don't happen to agree with, isn't a RW meme! Saying he is inarticulate is!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
paulk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-20-06 01:44 PM
Response to Reply #39
59. this "trend" that you have defined - offends me because
I think it's nothing more than conspiracy mongering on your part.

The distortion is yours. You are taking what is a legitimate criticism of Kerry and turning it into, in your words, a "right wing meme". The obvious consequence of this is that any Democrat who also feels that this is a legitimate criticism will be offended by your attempts to push this as some kind of right wing attack.

It is possible to support Kerry and still acknowledge his faults.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-20-06 02:01 PM
Response to Reply #59
61. It's okay if you
consider labeling Kerry as inarticulate as a valid criticism and calling out the RW attacks on him as unjustified, but please refrain from calling me a conspiracy theorist because you harbor these feelings.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
paulk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-20-06 02:48 PM
Response to Reply #61
63. I will call you whatever I please
if I feel it is justified.

And I do not accept your characterization of my posts in this thread.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-20-06 02:52 PM
Response to Reply #63
64. Suit yourself! n/t
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-20-06 02:30 PM
Response to Reply #59
62. Here, from 2004,
Dick Meyer, Editorial Director for CBSNews.com, highlights and takes ownership of the narrative:

John Forbes Kerry, Orator?!

WASHINGTON, July 30, 2004

Much of what appealed to voters about John Kerry in the primaries was invisible to us civic voyeurs until he won Iowa and New Hampshire. And then we knew it along.

I have a sneaking suspicion that will happen with Kerry's acceptance speech.

The man we pegged as patrician, wooden and aloof made a skilled, smart, elegant and powerful speech. It was serious, but not pompous. He took positions and didn't pander. He did not reach for rhetorical heights he couldn't hit. I heard few false notes.

The careful man took risks. The heart of this speech was dead simple: I will be a better commander-in-chief than George W. Bush, who is not trustworthy.

Why is that a risk? Because Americans have no history of firing a president during war, even unconventional ones. And because we've become used to thinking Republicans are tougher. And because Kerry's record on this war is convoluted.

more...




Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
kerrygoddess Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-20-06 02:08 AM
Response to Reply #38
50. More than one right wing rag actually
Honestly there are a lot of right wing rags attacking Kerry right now and right wing bloggers as well. It's been pretty darn persistent for sometime now. I see this as them seeing him as a threat, which I wrote when I posted about the article that Prosense linked to in the Boston Herald.

Considering the claims by so many right wing bloggers that Kerry is irrelevant, they all spend an awful lot of time giving him coverage on the blogosphere. Which leaves open the interpretation that Kerry is, as we all know, a huge threat to BushCo apologists in the blogosphere and the BushCo shills and hacks like Jules Crittenden.

http://blog.thedemocraticdaily.com/?p=4972


Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
wisteria Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-19-06 11:18 PM
Response to Reply #34
45. RW or just a college professor suggesting it doesn't that much.
Kerry had a difficult job trying to simplify an important and complicated stance on the Iraq war. It was never a simple "for or against", it was shades of gray. I did not have difficulty in understanding his IWR vote or his position on the war at that time, but I can see how others who did not pay close attention might have. Bush's position was so simple, Senator Kerry's more detailed and involved. I don't see that as inarticulate though, and that is where I think the professor is wrong. I wonder how someone else might of been able to explain it any better and have people listen long enough to understand it.
So, I agree that a few other people- Democrats and Independents, might not have gotten his complete position presented to them, the media attention span being something like what three minutes they would have cut it off after that. And, I fully understand how it could be perceived by some that he was not articulate-even though that was not really the case. IMO, it had more to do with the position than the explanation.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ray of light Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-19-06 09:41 PM
Response to Reply #30
41. Paul, when you speak of a "connection" I think you're talking about
something inside a person that touches their hearts or emotions. Kerry could speak articulately and be spot-on perfect, but it doesn't describe the connection one feels to him. It's why the media attempts to portray him as a "Massachusetts's liberal" and an elitist because they know that those words will automatically build a wall between Kerry and the 'common man'.

Look at it like this:

I had a conversation with my hubby's coworker. (A Bush supporting, gun toten fundy.) Already you get the image.

Kerry could NEVER speak to this person because this person has already closed that door. Just like you couldn't convince me that Bush is articulate in any sense of the word.

So there we were in 04 discussing the candidates, Bush and Kerry and Joe says, "Yeh, but one of them can't even speak!" Well, I assumed he meant BUSH can't speak. BUT to my surprise he meant Kerry couldn't speak!


From my example you can see that it's fair to say you're both right on this subject. You're talking about the "have a beer thing" type of emotion that people feel towards the candidate of their choosing, while Prosense is talking about how the media has manipulated the emotions people have towards candidates.

Which came first? The chicken or the egg? This is the same conundrum.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
wisteria Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-19-06 08:14 PM
Response to Original message
36. I never fell for the Bull about him not being a good speaker.
Just one meeting with him, one speech and it disproves this RW lie.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
hijinx87 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-20-06 12:45 AM
Response to Original message
47. you are quite right!

and this looks like some very positive MSM coverage, by the
way.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BlueIris Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-20-06 01:09 AM
Response to Original message
48. Kick. nt
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
flpoljunkie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-20-06 12:51 PM
Response to Original message
54. Thanks for reminder. And what did the cable talking heads focus on--the effing balloons!
I do think that Fineman nailed it when he said this, below--altho he ought to have included the media, as well, if he were being truthful! Bush could not tear down Democrats without the media's eager participation.

Meanwhile, Newsweek's Howard Fineman, appearing on MSNBC, said Kerry "has established the point he's a fighter, a war hero and a real guy. Now it's up to Bush to tear him down."
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
mtnsnake Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-20-06 12:57 PM
Response to Original message
55. I suppose we're enabling right wing talking points if we disagree
Edited on Wed Dec-20-06 12:58 PM by mtnsnake
Kerry isn't only dull, he's often incomprehensible. I remember so many times wondering WTF his message was or which way he stood on something, only because that's what happens when someone tries to cover themselves from all angles like he did during his campaign.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
AtomicKitten Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-20-06 01:11 PM
Response to Reply #55
56. when that impression is parodied in comedy
it is most definitely a mainstream opinion. I would have paid to get a straight answer from him, about anything, without a 10-minute dissertation.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
mtnsnake Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-20-06 01:17 PM
Response to Reply #56
57. Remember Pat Paulsen, the double-talking comedian on the Smothers Brothers?
who also ran for President? Deja Vu anyone? :evilgrin:

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
AtomicKitten Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-20-06 01:35 PM
Response to Reply #57
58. I do believe
remembering that officially makes us both old farts!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Wed Apr 24th 2024, 07:36 AM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]
 Top

Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion: Presidential (Through Nov 2009) Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC